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Kralkatorrik's domains, Jormag's domains, possibly Primordus' domains are revealed now.


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https://www.guildwars2.com/en/the-game/releases/september-04-2019/In this issue, in the article on the Bound By Blood, of the Dragons we know (excluding Steve), we now have almost all the domains.Zhaitan was Shadow and Death (revealed earlier), Mordremoth Plant and Mind, Kralkatorrik were Crystal (and here is the new info) and Fury.Jormag has Ice and Persuasion (Jormag will be quite the villain I think).Primordus has Fire and Conflagration, but that almost means the same thing, so I do not think this counts as a second domain.

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@"DoggySpew.4529" said:https://www.guildwars2.com/en/the-game/releases/september-04-2019/In this issue, in the article on the Bound By Blood, of the Dragons we know (excluding Steve), we now have almost all the domains.Zhaitan was Shadow and Death (revealed earlier), Mordremoth Plant and Mind, Kralkatorrik were Crystal (and here is the new info) and Fury.Jormag has Ice and Persuasion (Jormag will be quite the villain I think).Primordus has Fire and Conflagration, but that almost means the same thing, so I do not think this counts as a second domain.

This is kinda neat that they put this together, but what is exactly is fury per say and how did Kralkatorrik show this domain. How could other Elder Dragons show it as well like hypothetically Jormag.

Same with Shadow for Zhaitan. Are we simply talking shadowy magic or something else.

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The new domains are rather disappointing to me, tbh. I mean, what even is "Fury magic"? And how is Persuasion any different than Mordremoth's Mind which he used to persuade sylvari to join him. Meanwhile, "Fire and Conflagration" are pretty much synonyms.

It feels like the only Elder Dragon who's second domain was given any significant thought for showcasing was Mordremoth's Mind (and that, itself, was unnecessary given the way it was used), and the rest are just there because they backed themselves into a corner, and rather than exploring the potential of additional domains that they don't predominantly use, they just made something that reflects their personality instead of their powers.

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@"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:The new domains are rather disappointing to me, tbh. I mean, what even is "Fury magic"? And how is Persuasion any different than Mordremoth's Mind which he used to persuade sylvari to join him. Meanwhile, "Fire and Conflagration" are pretty much synonyms.

It feels like the only Elder Dragon who's second domain was given any significant thought for showcasing was Mordremoth's Mind (and that, itself, was unnecessary given the way it was used), and the rest are just there because they backed themselves into a corner, and rather than exploring the potential of additional domains that they don't predominantly use, they just made something that reflects their personality instead of their powers.

That was my question too. What if Primordus gained persuasion domain and the mind domain how would it look any different. Would there be destroyers that we’re now more intelligent have speech and would now persuade people?

What does fury magic look like? Were the branded more furious then the other dragon minions, will any other Elder Dragon who absorbs this spectrum now have minions that berserk?

It’s all a bit strange.

Also please for the love of Dwayna, what is the shadow domain?

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Did anyone also notice Aurene is the crystal/prismatic dragon of light? Kind of seems like they are trying to incorporate more aspect elements. Lighting, fire, ice/water, light, shadow, earth/plant. Most of these elements have a corresponding aura, also forgot chaos. Fury could be in a messed up way augmented reality or a twisted emotion? As for Jormag, persuasion or manipulation eh not sure.

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Fury is an... interesting choice of moniker. Based on the characterisation we'd seen of Kralkatorrik before, I'd probably categorise that as "the fury of the storm", covering air magic, possibly chaos magic, and maybe some forms of magic that instill fury in others.

Aurene becoming the "Elder Dragon of Light" rather than simply co-opting Kralkatorrik's domains is unexpected, but perhaps this GW2's equivalent of Secrets versus Truth: it might essentially be the same domain, but Aurene embodies a more serene and benign form of the domain. Where Kralkatorrik embodied a storm's fury and the sharp edges of shattered crystal, Aurene instead focuses on the gentle refraction of light inside a crystal and the nourishing glow of a clear sky. Same underlying power, but taken in an entirely different direction.

Nevertheless, one thing I do find interesting is that "Light" encompasses a field of mortal magic that until now has seemed to be unrepresented among the dragons. Necromancy is obviously similar to Zhaitan's power, while various mesmeric and elemental magics seems to be spread among the dragons, Preservation seemed to be pretty much unrepresented outside of Glint's Facet of Light. Aurene's new moniker, therefore, could imply that this is a branch of magic that falls within her domain... and might always have been in Kralkatorrik's, but his insanity prevented it from manifesting.

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according to Cambridge Dictionary (Online) https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/conflagration

conflagrationnoun [ C ]formal uk ​ /ˌkɒn.fləˈɡreɪ.ʃən/ us ​ /ˌkɑːn.fləˈɡreɪ.ʃən/

1: a large fire that causes a lot of damage​2: a large and violent event, such as a war, involving a lot of people:The government has turned a minor local problem into a full-blown regional conflagration.

other dictionaries simplify the second meaning into " a large conflict "

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@"Forgotten Legend.9281" said:according to Cambridge Dictionary (Online) https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/conflagration

conflagrationnoun [ C ]formal uk ​ /ˌkɒn.fləˈɡreɪ.ʃən/ us ​ /ˌkɑːn.fləˈɡreɪ.ʃən/

1: a large fire that causes a lot of damage​2: a large and violent event, such as a war, involving a lot of people:The government has turned a minor local problem into a full-blown regional conflagration.

other dictionaries simplify the second meaning into " a large conflict "

So Primordus could be described possible as the dragon of "Fire and conflict." or "Fire and war"

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Did Mordy's mind magic actually work on anyone else than the sylvari?Also the difference could be that Mordy was more... let's say directly overtaking the mind in question by forcefully messing it, while Jormag could be "making offers one just can't refuse". So it would be mainly a matter of style.(Does it make any sense?)

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@"anninke.7469" said:Did Mordy's mind magic actually work on anyone else than the sylvari?Also the difference could be that Mordy was more... let's say directly overtaking the mind in question by forcefully messing it, while Jormag could be "making offers one just can't refuse". So it would be mainly a matter of style.(Does it make any sense?)

The other races could hear Mordremoth once in close proximity, such as the Mouth of Mordremoth as well as once you are in the Dream for the final encounter. So he could speak with you with telepathy. I suppose Mordremoth should have the ability to read minds as well other then his minions and the Sylvari.

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@"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:The new domains are rather disappointing to me, tbh. I mean, what even is "Fury magic"? And how is Persuasion any different than Mordremoth's Mind which he used to persuade sylvari to join him. Meanwhile, "Fire and Conflagration" are pretty much synonyms.

It feels like the only Elder Dragon who's second domain was given any significant thought for showcasing was Mordremoth's Mind (and that, itself, was unnecessary given the way it was used), and the rest are just there because they backed themselves into a corner, and rather than exploring the potential of additional domains that they don't predominantly use, they just made something that reflects their personality instead of their powers.

i did noticed this redundacy too, most domains can be wrapped on "mind".

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Conflagration can also mean a large war, which could be taken to mean that primordus is a military genius and knows exactly how to use his destroyers and exactly who he’s fighting. Zhaitan and kralkatorrik have different ways of completely taking you over, Mordremoth invaded you mind first, jormag convinces you to go willingly, and primordus is so many steps ahead of you and your army it doesn’t matter if you want to join him. He’ll already have a plan to wipe you out.

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@Kalavier.1097 said:

@"Forgotten Legend.9281" said:according to Cambridge Dictionary (Online)

conflagrationnoun [ C ]formal uk ​ /ˌkɒn.fləˈɡreɪ.ʃən/ us ​ /ˌkɑːn.fləˈɡreɪ.ʃən/

1: a large fire that causes a lot of damage​2: a large and violent event, such as a war, involving a lot of people:The government has turned a minor local problem into a full-blown regional conflagration.

other dictionaries simplify the second meaning into " a large conflict "

So Primordus could be described possible as the dragon of "Fire and conflict." or "Fire and war"

@"Fenom.9457" said:Conflagration can also mean a large war, which could be taken to mean that primordus is a military genius and knows exactly how to use his destroyers and exactly who he’s fighting. Zhaitan and kralkatorrik have different ways of completely taking you over, Mordremoth invaded you mind first, jormag convinces you to go willingly, and primordus is so many steps ahead of you and your army it doesn’t matter if you want to join him. He’ll already have a plan to wipe you out.

Conflagration being used instead of "war" feels even worse. We don't need even more parallels between the Six Gods and six Elder Dragons after being repeatedly told there's no connection.

That said, we've seen nothing warlike from Primordus or the Destroyers, and they're definitely not "so many steps ahead that he already has a plan to wipe you out", especially so in Eye of the North; so I'd think that it's meant to be more a volcanic eruption styled conflagration.

@Tyson.5160 said:

@"anninke.7469" said:Did Mordy's mind magic actually work on anyone else than the sylvari?Also the difference could be that Mordy was more... let's say directly overtaking the mind in question by forcefully messing it, while Jormag could be "making offers one just can't refuse". So it would be mainly a matter of style.(Does it make any sense?)

The other races could hear Mordremoth once in close proximity, such as the Mouth of Mordremoth as well as once you are in the Dream for the final encounter. So he could speak with you with telepathy. I suppose Mordremoth should have the ability to read minds as well other then his minions and the Sylvari.

I think the Mouth is actually speaking, and not being in one's mind. Same with while in the Dream. That said, those standing in/near the Heart of Thorns do hear Mordremoth (e.g., while fighting Faolain). And Rytlock seemed more sensitive than other non-sylvari.

@"Tanith.5264" said:Is all this coming from the "study" by Gorrik and Taimi in the magazine? Not to be a bookah, but sometimes Asuran research doesn't quite turn out as planned... ;)

Taimi's very frequently used as an exposition and truth-revealer, especially in Season 3. And since then she's only been repeatedly labeled as the leading scholar in Elder Dragon studies (thanks to learning from Zojja (who in turn learned from Snaff and Kudu's research) and Rata Novus).

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The use of conflagration was also strange to me, I do kinda hope it is being used more as "conflict" or "war" though that does make it draw parallels to the Human Gods like someone already mentioned. But the use of the word made me wonder if it was suppose to somehow be an antonym of persuasion since Jormag and Primordus are suppose to counteract each other. The word just...doesn't seem to fit in that context though.

As for Jormag being about persuasion, I do think it is genuinely different from Mordremoth. Mordy didn't really seem to be persuading people imo, it was more that his voice came as a command, an order, to sylvari when they could finally hear him. He made them, so it makes sense to me that he could assert some control over them just like Kralk with its Branded or Zhaitan with its Risen, etc. Jormag on the other hand seems to actually like...try and genuinely convince someone to join its side through persuasion, promising you power or safety or whatever you want to hear in exchange for allying with it; you choose to follow and be "corrupted" of your own volition, not through force. Mordy also couldn't really do anything to the minds of non-sylvari, his mind aspect seems to more reflect that he doesn't really have a body. He's just...the "mind" of the jungle.

Edit: also I just remembered in the magazine, the page before Taimi's notes, isn't the last line something along the lines of the Elder Dragons not being what we thought they were? Then the next page is mainly what we think they are. Hmmm...

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@"Ototo.3214" said:As for Jormag being about persuasion, I do think it is genuinely different from Mordremoth. Mordy didn't really seem to be persuading people imo, it was more that his voice came as a command, an order, to sylvari when they could finally hear him.

I would disagree. Mordremoth influenced sylvari in different ways, and he did use coercion and persuasion as well as trickery.

With Caithe, for example, he made his influence feel like a Wyld Hunt. But with Scarlet and Occam, he made his influence feel like their own thoughts. Canach felt it like a buzzing (which Occam also describes), and the Pact Commander (that everyone's more exposed to) was just blaring threats and commands (which Canach describes later on in the story).

And in the final trailer (and through Faolain), he also made persuasions of his own kind - not promises of power, but promises of purpose that so many sylvari had been searching for. Which I always took as being "the Call" that Laranthir refers to.

Edit: also I just remembered in the magazine, the page before Taimi's notes, isn't the last line something along the lines of the Elder Dragons not being what we thought they were? Then the next page is mainly what we think they are. Hmmm...

That bit of "they may not be what we thought they were" is tying back to an earlier statement that "they may have their own agendas". Basically, ArenaNet is really, really late on confirming what they've hinted to, and that I've been saying, for the past 5 years: they're not forces of nature, but have personalities and goals each to their own.

Gorrik's notes also allude to this a bit, with how he writes that perhaps Aurene could elaborate on how Zhaitan and Mordremoth identified themselves gender-wise, since until the end of Season 4, Tyrians viewed them as that "forces of nature" despite it being increasingly glaringly obviously not so as of Forging the Pact.

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I think I'm inclined to more or less agree with @Ototo.3214

Mordremoth's strategy with the Sylvari was generally a matter of bombarding them with thoughts and ideas and commands so that the sylvari in question found it hard to distinguish between what the dragon wanted and what they wanted. Essentially, it's a kind of brainwashing, or instilling a kind of multiple personality disorder. It's essentially a brute force attack - he's trying to overwhelm the sylvari's original personality and replace it with a Mordrem Guard.

Jormag doesn't seem to have this brute force approach. Instead of, effectively, driving his target insane and then giving them a direction, Jormag seems to be trying to make prospective new followers join him of their own free will, purely through the temptation of what he offers. He doesn't try to drown your thoughts out, he wants you to genuinely think that accepting his power is the best way to get what you want.

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But in the end, both are "Mind attacks". Whether it's argued to be brute force or soft touch. You're still using your hand whether you're punching someone or pushing them. You're using "Mind" whether your bombarding with thoughts, or subtly whispering thoughts.

It seems to be an odd overlap that doesn't exist elsewhere. Even when Kralkatorrik took the Mind domain, he used it to instill shared spatial cognition into his minions - that didn't become a new domain, it was still Mind being used in a new manner.

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@Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

@"Ototo.3214" said:As for Jormag being about persuasion, I do think it is genuinely different from Mordremoth. Mordy didn't really seem to be persuading people imo, it was more that his voice came as a command, an order, to sylvari when they could finally hear him.

I would disagree. Mordremoth influenced sylvari in different ways, and he did use coercion and persuasion as well as trickery.

With Caithe, for example, he made his influence feel like a Wyld Hunt. But with Scarlet and Occam, he made his influence feel like their own thoughts. Canach felt it like a buzzing (which Occam also describes), and the Pact Commander (that everyone's more exposed to) was just blaring threats and commands (which Canach describes later on in the story).

And in the final trailer (and through Faolain), he also made persuasions of his own kind - not promises of power, but promises of
purpose
that so many sylvari had been searching for. Which I always took as being "the Call" that Laranthir refers to.

Edit: also I just remembered in the magazine, the page before Taimi's notes, isn't the last line something along the lines of the Elder Dragons not being what we thought they were? Then the next page is mainly what we think they are. Hmmm...

That bit of "they may not be what we thought they were" is tying back to an earlier statement that "they may have their own agendas". Basically, ArenaNet is
really,
really
late on confirming what they've hinted to, and that I've been saying, for the past 5 years: they're not forces of nature, but have personalities and goals each to their own.

Gorrik's notes also allude to this a bit, with how he writes that perhaps Aurene could elaborate on how Zhaitan and Mordremoth identified themselves gender-wise, since until the end of Season 4, Tyrians viewed them as that "forces of nature" despite it being increasingly glaringly obviously not so as of Forging the Pact.

That still doesn't really convince me that it's the same thing as Jormag. Many of those come across as him actually getting into someone's mind, which is his domain, and all of those examples are sylvari. His minions. Jormag on the other hand can be seen corrupting just about anything and I don't really see it as him/her literally getting into someone's mind but him/her actually making a convincing offer that some willingly accept. At least to me, manipulative mind control is different than actual persuasion.

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