My GW 2: Expansion 3 - We must explore the ocean!!!

[ovinnik.9216]

Question, for those actually knowledgeable about these things: As I understand it, underwater mechanics are tied to land levels. Meaning, once a character moves below a certain point on the y-axis, they start "swimming" and so on. Do correct me if this is nonsense. But if it's not, wouldn't new and expansive underwater content be severely limited from a programming standpoint? There could be no domed cities to walk around in, no sea floor to move about on. I've seen many such suggestions, and they sound interesting but, perhaps, impossible. Which might in turn make the whole potential expansion less attractive, at least for some current proponents.

[BrokenGlass.9356]

Folks are upset about UW combat and movement. But OP suggests an overhaul of the systems as part of the deal.

This could include, but wouldn't be limited to:

• up and down movement keys
• masteries for walking on the sea floor, and treating it as on-land
• having a build unique to underwater
• making the aquabreather have stats like a pvp amulet that the game uses instead of gear. (because some underwater weapons don't cooperate with certain playstyles. Lookin at you condi builds for every class)
• new underwater weapons.
• cross overs of underwater and land weapons.

I mean, it could be amazingly cool.

There could be cities like the Gungans have in Star Wars. Large air filled sections of architecture, only accessible from underwater.

The options here are astounding.

Hell, I'd love to see conditions have synergy with underwater combat.

Burning becomes steam, and applies break bar damage also.Bleeding adds 'blood in the water' which buffs certain enemies.Poisoned enemies trail corruption through the waters.Tormented enemies take normal damage standing still and swimming down, but swimming up amplifies damage greatly.

You could have debuffs for decompression from coming up too quickly. Unless of course you get the mastery.

Kodan as a playable race....

I'm just saying.

[Solvar.7953]

I've played some other games where underwater play seemed reasonable. But in GW2, it is not - there would need to be major updates to make it playable. While I'm not adverse to that, I think they would need to expend the effort to do that before serious work on the expansion to see if it works out on the existing maps (maybe throw in some new underwater event that get people to show up). Otherwise, such an expansion could end up being a big flop. As things are now, I would not buy an expansion based largely on underwater mechanics.

[Edelweiss.4261]

If they can do underwater gameplay like Donkey Kong Country, I'm in.

I'm not completely opposed to underwater content, but I can't imagine how they'd make underwater combat actually work. I don't mind underwater movement as much as movement while in combat. Maybe "transformation" masteries, but then it's just too detached from the normal game that it feels pointless. Fighting on warships sounds cool, but then you fall in water and remember why this was a bad idea.

[Celsith.2753]

Absolutely no to an underwater expansion. As it is it's the worst part of the game and I loathe it. Everything takes far too long to kill, uw skills on some classes are awful.I guess I admire the optimism of the people saying it would come with a complete overhaul but... be realistic. It wont.

[Cyrin.1035]

Necroed for possible ideas.

[Talindra.4958]

Oh wow!!!!!!!Cantha .. my dream come true!!!!The zaishen ... follower of balthazarThe battle isles... My home

[Tyson.5160]

@Talindra.4958 said:Oh wow!!!!!!!Cantha .. my dream come true!!!!The zaishen ... follower of balthazarThe battle isles... My home

Well with the small blog about an update to underwater combat, they could be paving the way.

[Sapphiria.5643]

I never really understood why people don't like underwater combat in MMORPGs. Vashj'ir is one of my favorite zones in WoW. That setting is so relaxing.

I also think the underwater combat in GW2 is much better than other MMOs I've played. It's just a bit disappointing that many skills can't be used underwater. Deadeye is pretty fun with harpoon though.

[Dralor.3701]

Didn’t read the whole thread so maybe someone else mentioned this but I am still traumatized from Trials of Atlantis.

[Samnang.1879]

the ppl hath spoketh... we hate underwater combat!!! dont release expansion for that! rip.com

[Laila Lightness.8742]

My suggestion remove all water in lakes and ocean

[maddoctor.2738]

I think underwater is one of the unique features of the game and expanding on it is a good thing. Making underwater combat/movement better will only benefit the game.Plus https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/3/3c/Super_Adventure_Box_map.jpg that second "zone" in the clouds looks like it's underwater.

[Curunen.8729]

I'd rather see the Blood Legion homelands with a charr focused theme for Expansion 3. Save the deep sea dragon for Expansion 4.

Also as much as I love underwater combat, and as much as asura magic"science"/handwave can be used to support the idea of many land based player character species suddenly being able to swim about under hundreds of meters (or even several kilometres) of ocean with nothing but an aquabreather on their face in the unending ocean, it still seems a bit difficult to digest unless Taimi comes up with something that protects them from the pressure. Part of the mystery is how inaccessable the ocean is (also for us IRL) which is what makes it even more fascinating.

[LucianDK.8615]

Revenants doesnt need the overused greatsword for third elite spec. Dont cater to all the twilight fetishists, give us a more interesting an underused weapon.

[Pifil.5193]

Yeah, I don't really want an underwater expansion, I doubt that many do. I'd imagine the kind of discontent seen over both HoT and PoF will be nothing compared to what we'd see with an underwater expansion especially of they were so foolish as to give predominantly underwater elite specs.

My personal hope for the underwater revamp next week is to allow us to use our terrestrial weapons underwater, and maybe our underwater weapons on land, but I'm not that hopeful.

[Ashantara.8731]

@Cyrin.1035 said:For expansion 3, more than anything else, I want the underwater environment to be explored. [...]

Likely. I also see Cantha, the sea dragon, so there (hopefully) will be enough underwater content to justify the effort of an underwater combat skill overhaul. :)

@kurfu.5623 said:I would not buy an expansion that focused on underwater combat.

I would. :+1: I doubt the whole expansion would be underwater, though, but see previous paragraph: there might be a massive portion of it taking place underwater, which is <3 in my book. =)

[XenesisII.1540]

Generally I don't like underwater content.Part of that comes down to the combat, I think maybe if they just removed melee weapons for underwater(move the spear to land weapons) and just kept to ranged weapons it may be better.Movement is also a problem, slowing down character speed always feels like a negative, we have cripple chill immobilize, swimming feels like you have cripple on all the time. Sure it may be more realistic, but it's a game does it have to be?It also messes with a lot of utility skills especially ground targeting skills, some have been tweaked over the years like engineer grenades and necromancer wells, but all would have to be fixed and made usable underwater.

Releasing an expansion with mostly underwater content would be a mistake.

[Fenom.9457]

@"Curunen.8729" said:I'd rather see the Blood Legion homelands with a charr focused theme for Expansion 3. Save the deep sea dragon for Expansion 4.

Also as much as I love underwater combat, and as much as asura magic"science"/handwave can be used to support the idea of many land based player character species suddenly being able to swim about under hundreds of meters (or even several kilometres) of ocean with nothing but an aquabreather on their face in the unending ocean, it still seems a bit difficult to digest unless Taimi comes up with something that protects them from the pressure. Part of the mystery is how inaccessable the ocean is (also for us IRL) which is what makes it even more fascinating.

I too think the ocean would be better as the fourth pack, but it still may very well be. Yes they’re starting improvements now but given how much they could change it up they may release another HoT like expansion (basically no water)

[Dami.5046]

Having struggled with the FOV on this game for years and now only getting used to playing without a headache ( and not being sick), in two words, no. It's bad enough jumping on the bunny at times with out the limitations a total water area would do for my playing.

[Trise.2865]

@"ovinnik.9216" said:Question, for those actually knowledgeable about these things: As I understand it, underwater mechanics are tied to land levels. Meaning, once a character moves below a certain point on the y-axis, they start "swimming" and so on. Do correct me if this is nonsense. But if it's not, wouldn't new and expansive underwater content be severely limited from a programming standpoint? There could be no domed cities to walk around in, no sea floor to move about on. I've seen many such suggestions, and they sound interesting but, perhaps, impossible. Which might in turn make the whole potential expansion less attractive, at least for some current proponents.

Partially, but not exactly. From my understanding, they designate certain areas as "water" (just like the no-fly and no-mount zones), and while in those zones, the character transitions into swimming mode (with special "surface" conditions on the maximum Y coordinate of that zone). There are instances of underwater caves (and sunken boats) with air pockets below sea level and underwater passages with different "surface" heights at each end, most obviously in the Font of Rhand mini-dungeon and Personal Story step, Temple of the Forgotten. We can safely assume the "shape of water" is as malleable as anything else in-game.

To explain the "sea level" illusion: I would theorize that designating "water" areas is much simpler in large, rectangular blocks rather than carefully sculpted zones, which would make the water zones' "surface" levels the same everywhere within those maps.

[Albadaran.1283]

It would be nice if underwater combat is improved. That being said, no I will never favor it above exploring continents (land maps). Simply a matter of taste I suppose. I hope for some real new land content (not the old gw1 stuff re designed).

[Elothar.4382]

I'm with some of the others here. No objection to refinement of the skills and even adding some more UW content. But a singular focus on underwater, either in the form of a LW segment or expac, would likely be a deal breaker for me. I agree that the combat, as now designed, leaves much to be desired. But even beyond that, the fighting and movement in three axes is not something I find enjoyable. A matter of taste, to be sure. So having some for those that like it would be great. Forcing it on everyone...not so much.

[perilisk.1874]

@"Trise.2865" said:

Partially, but not exactly. From my understanding, they designate certain areas as "water" (just like the no-fly and no-mount zones), and while in those zones, the character transitions into swimming mode (with special "surface" conditions on the maximum Y coordinate of that zone). There are instances of underwater caves (and sunken boats) with air pockets below sea level and underwater passages with different "surface" heights at each end, most obviously in the Font of Rhand mini-dungeon and Personal Story step, Temple of the Forgotten. We can safely assume the "shape of water" is as malleable as anything else in-game.

Hmmm... so, maybe they could have the occasional, Final Fantasy X style, giant floating sphere of water?

[Cassador.7034]

An underwater expansion could work well if the map(s) experienced high and low tide to the extreme of the whole map being covered versus not. So all of those players who hate on underwater combat could still enjoy the map during the low tide time frame.