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KP system is why raids are dead ( I use fake LI/KP now)


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Been playing at 80 for a while

Sure it's totally healthy for the game to be entirely reliant veterans who might be tired of teaching newbies

Not 2%, it's 5 and equates to way more than that when you factor in stat synergies

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/30517/ascended-vs-exotic-not-5

Heaven forbid someone want to play a class that's their main, guess i just suck for picking that, right? Or wanting to learn something? This community os way more toxic than i thought..

Also hate to break it to you, anything is puggable in any game once you know your class well enough and have a properly prepared group who understands mechanics + a form of voice comms. And i've actually never pugged. I've always been in guild. We've filled sure but it wasn't a complete pug. And why did we fill? Not enough vets wanted to do it. There's plenty of geared people in my guild.

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@"Firebeard.1746" said:Not 2%, it's 5 and equates to way more than that when you factor in stat synergies

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/30517/ascended-vs-exotic-not-5

This is a better analysis of Exotic vs Ascended:https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/31wbip/ascended_vs_exotic_gear_comparison_spreedsheet/

A full ascended berserker set gives you a 12.5% increase in damage over a full exotic berserker gear set with power omni infusions. This is the maximum increase in damage obtainable with ascended gear. The ascended weapon gives the biggest increase for an individual item at 5.9%. Ascended armor only increases damage by 1.8% over exotic if you already have ascended back, trinkets and weapon.

As you can see Armor does give 1.8% (less than 2%) damage boost. And this is using Infusions too

Heaven forbid someone want to play a class that's their main, guess i just suck for picking that, right? Or learn something?

For support Raid chrono you don't need full diviner: https://snowcrows.com/raids/builds/mesmer/chronomancer/power%20boon/Power Chrono: https://snowcrows.com/raids/builds/mesmer/chronomancer/power/ is also available as a much cheaper alternative if you want to use Chrono in Raids and not tank.

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@Firebeard.1746 said:Been playing at 80 for a while

Sure it's totally healthy for the game to be entirely reliant veterans who might be tired of teaching newbies

It is when playing crucial roles like supports.

Miss a few rotation steps as dps, your raid loses some dps (any where between 3-4 and maybe 15k when you die). Miss or make mistakes as a chrono, and your raid loses a ton of dps (starts at 4-6k and goes up to 15k+ and above with lack of quickness/alacrity). A bad chrono can be a reason why a raid group has difficulties clearing content, just as a good chrono can make things a lot easier (just not as before when chronos could carry raids).

Not 2%, it's 5 and equates to way more than that when you factor in stat synergies

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/30517/ascended-vs-exotic-not-5

That calculation factors in ALL the stats. Suffice to say, the vast minority of offensive stats come from armor and the vast majority from weapons as well as trinkets. Kind of why the common recommendation is always: get trinkets and weapons. Almost as though people knew what they were talking about.

@Firebeard.1746 said:Heaven forbid someone want to play a class that's their main, guess i just suck for picking that, right? Or wanting to learn something? This community os way more toxic than i thought..

No one is denying you to play your main. Given your recent question thread in the mesmer forums dealing with boon uptime, you seem very inexperiened at it though (and haven't bothered to check any rotation videos or do some golem practice).

People are explaining which roles are easiest for new players who come into raids. If you want to start with a support class (and some people do, due to the constant demand of chronos), put in the work to not be a burden to your raid group.

@Firebeard.1746 said:Also hate to break it to you, anything is puggable in any game once you know your class well enough and have a properly prepared group who understands mechanics + a form of voice comms. And i've actually never pugged. I've always been in guild. We've filled sure but it wasn't a complete pug. And why did we fill? Not enough vets wanted to do it. There's plenty of geared people in my guild.

Result and intent do not have to match. In this case they do not. That does not mean that the intent has to change.

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There is no actual "raid experience system" in place and that is the real problem here. The only thing we have is this arbitrary way of assuming someone's experience by counting their KPs. We are pretty much judging a person's driving ability by checking the miles they have clocked on their first car. A terrible method but it is the only thing we have.There may possibly be this one tiny diamond in every ton of coal who is left behind and locked out by high KP requirements even if they would far outshine everyone else on a similar level of experience when given the chance but those people are rare, very rare. People would ask for titles like Voice in the Void and most likely come up with even more far-fetched ways of proving your experience if they could no longer use KPs.

Making raids harder would lock out a big number of players who are already raiding but only just able to reach a decent level of success. Those who are new would have an even harder time getting in raids if they now had to force their ways into semi-hardcore/hardcore guilds because those would be the only people left raiding.

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To reiterate what i have already said - KPs are not the reason why raids are not as popular as some might want. They are at best a sideeffect of one of the reasons behind that low popularity - namely, a sideeffect of content difficulty.

As @"Henry.5713" mentioned above, KPs are just a stand-in for "raid experience system". That "system" is needed because raiders want to to raids with other experienced people. They want to do that because they fear that otherwise they might either not be able to kill the boss, or that the run will be more painful and annoying (and definitely way longer). They fear that, because they have ample reasons to think that a vast majority of players are not on the level needed to make the kill smooth. And the majority of players are not on the level to make the kill smooth, because the content is difficult.

So, removing KPs won't change nothing, because it doesn't do anything about the reason why KPs are used. They'd simply be replaced by something else.Obviously, increasing difficulty won't help either, because it's the high difficulty that is the root of the whole situation.

Notice though, that there are other reasons behind why the raid population is decreasing (reward level, release schedule, general population decrease in the whole game). Those other reasons, though have nothing to do with KPs.

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@maddoctor.2738 said:

@"Firebeard.1746" said:Not 2%, it's 5 and equates to way more than that when you factor in stat synergies

This is a better analysis of Exotic vs Ascended:

A full ascended berserker set gives you a 12.5% increase in damage over a full exotic berserker gear set with power omni infusions. This is the maximum increase in damage obtainable with ascended gear. The ascended weapon gives the biggest increase for an individual item at 5.9%. Ascended armor only increases damage by 1.8% over exotic if you already have ascended back, trinkets and weapon.

As you can see Armor does give 1.8% (less than 2%) damage boost. And this is using Infusions too

Heaven forbid someone want to play a class that's their main, guess i just suck for picking that, right? Or learn something?

For support Raid chrono you don't need full diviner:
Power Chrono:
is also available as a much cheaper alternative if you want to use Chrono in Raids and not tank.

My issue with the snow crows build is that it doesn't communicate how reliant you are on the other chrono and how you both have to coordinate your soi at a point in time when both your groups are covered by the buffs you just gave. There's actually incredibly high margins or error. Self sustaining your buffs is only possible at 77% bd, i've done the math. You also have to get a certain number of clones weaved in between to maintain 100% self alacrity because of the self alacrity duration penalty chronos suffer from. And the numbers I worked with were based on that up time. And note this means the chronos both must have baseline conc in order to maintain buffs, if one of the chronos is missing the right amount of concentration, it's very easy for their sois to fall out of sync.

I actually think crows may be damaging the incoming community for this reason. I also think it needs to do a better job of explaining why certain builds are sub par in certain situations. Is it dps? Or does the quickbrand lose the ability to pull of their rotation? If i was building a raid for the first time, I wouldn't take bs chronos because of the coordination required between them on top of the other mechanics. Snow crows assumes a lot of things.

I don't have to respond to everyone, and i won't. But silence does not necessarily give consent. I don't have the energy to disprove every point others disagree with me on.

Editted for accuracy.

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@Astralporing.1957 said:To reiterate what i have already said - KPs are not the reason why raids are not as popular as some might want. They are at best a sideeffect of one of the reasons behind that low popularity - namely, a sideeffect of content difficulty.

As @"Henry.5713" mentioned above, KPs are just a stand-in for "raid experience system". That "system" is needed because raiders want to to raids with other experienced people. They want to do that because they fear that otherwise they might either not be able to kill the boss, or that the run will be more painful and annoying (and definitely way longer). They fear that, because they have ample reasons to think that a vast majority of players are not on the level needed to make the kill smooth. And the majority of players are not on the level to make the kill smooth, because the content is difficult.

So, removing KPs won't change nothing, because it doesn't do anything about the reason why KPs are used. They'd simply be replaced by something else.Obviously, increasing difficulty won't help either, because it's the high difficulty that is the root of the whole situation.

Notice though, that there are other reasons behind why the raid population is decreasing (reward level, release schedule, general population decrease in the whole game). Those other reasons, though have nothing to do with KPs.

I actually think stale content is a big problem for this game. They need to add seasonal mechanics and rewards to everything: fractals, raids, dungeons, pvp, wvw. I think if they could manage that it would keep more players engaged in those game modes.

The mechanics should probably add both a favorable mechanic (to balance the unfavorable one) and unfavorable mechanic that fundamentally changes the way the meta operates.

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@Firebeard.1746 said:

@Firebeard.1746 said:Not 2%, it's 5 and equates to way more than that when you factor in stat synergies

This is a better analysis of Exotic vs Ascended:

A full ascended berserker set gives you a 12.5% increase in damage over a full exotic berserker gear set with power omni infusions. This is the maximum increase in damage obtainable with ascended gear. The ascended weapon gives the biggest increase for an individual item at 5.9%. Ascended armor only increases damage by 1.8% over exotic if you already have ascended back, trinkets and weapon.

As you can see Armor does give 1.8% (less than 2%) damage boost. And this is using Infusions too

Heaven forbid someone want to play a class that's their main, guess i just suck for picking that, right? Or learn something?

For support Raid chrono you don't need full diviner:
Power Chrono:
is also available as a much cheaper alternative if you want to use Chrono in Raids and not tank.

My issue with the snow crows build is that it doesn't communicate how reliant you are on the other chrono and how you both have to coordinate your soi at a point in time when both your groups are covered by the buffs you just gave. There's actually incredibly high margins or error. Self sustaining your buffs is only possible at 100% bd, i've done the math. You also have to get a certain number of clones weaved in between to maintain 100% self alacrity because of the self alacrity duration penalty chronos suffer from. And the numbers I worked with were based on that up time. And note this means the chronos both must have baseline conc in order to maintain buffs, if one of the chronos is missing the right amount of concentration, it's very easy for their sois to fall out of sync.

I actually think crows may be damaging the incoming community for this reason. I also think it needs to do a better job of explaining why certain builds are sub par in certain situations. Is it dps? Or does the quickbrand lose the ability to pull of their rotation? If i was building a raid for the first time, I wouldn't take bs chronos because of the coordination required between them on top of the other mechanics. Snow crows assumes a lot of things.

I don't have to respond to everyone, and i won't. But silence does not necessarily give consent. I don't have the energy to disprove every point others disagree with me on.

https://snowcrows.com/raids/guides/mesmer/chronomancer/power%20boon/

They have a page that explains the general mechanics of the class as well as for each boss. A lot of this also comes down to the player simply knowing the class which is why this typically isn’t the best for someone new to play as.

I don’t believe SC intended their website to hold player’s hand but I can’t speak for them. There are things players will have to learn which comes from experience with the class and raids.

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@Firebeard.1746 said:My issue with the snow crows build is that it doesn't communicate how reliant you are on the other chrono and how you both have to coordinate your soi at a point in time when both your groups are covered by the buffs you just gave. There's actually incredibly high margins or error. Self sustaining your buffs is only possible at 100% bd, i've done the math. You also have to get a certain number of clones weaved in between to maintain 100% self alacrity because of the self alacrity duration penalty chronos suffer from. And the numbers I worked with were based on that up time. And note this means the chronos both must have baseline conc in order to maintain buffs, if one of the chronos is missing the right amount of concentration, it's very easy for their sois to fall out of sync.

Your math is wrong and you have definately not tried a basic rotation on the golem either solo or with a second chrono.

The required bd is about 50% for permanent boons with 2 chronos with good play. Hence why SC go for less bd, since permanent boons are not needed in top performance groups (but definately recommended for new chronos).

There is no necessity for shatters for alacrity at 100% bd even with trait which increases self alacrity effect at penatly of time.

I'm just going to file this under one more thing which you did not actually test and which you made mistakes on in theory which could have been easily disproved ingame.

I did a duo chrono rotation while training a new chrono player 3 weeks ago, without buff food and both of us at around 75% bd. We both hit above 1 minute on boons, both alacrity and quickness.

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@Cyninja.2954 said:

@"Firebeard.1746" said:My issue with the snow crows build is that it doesn't communicate how reliant you are on the other chrono and how you both have to coordinate your soi at a point in time when both your groups are covered by the buffs you just gave. There's actually incredibly high margins or error. Self sustaining your buffs is only possible at 100% bd, i've done the math. You also have to get a certain number of clones weaved in between to maintain 100% self alacrity because of the self alacrity duration penalty chronos suffer from. And the numbers I worked with were based on that up time. And note this means the chronos both must have baseline conc in order to maintain buffs, if one of the chronos is missing the right amount of concentration, it's very easy for their sois to fall out of sync.

Your math is wrong and you have definately not tried a basic rotation on the golem either solo or with a second chrono.

The required bd is about 50% for permanent boons with 2 chronos with good play. Hence why SC go for less bd, since permanent boons are not needed in top performance groups (but definately recommended for new chronos).

There is no necessity for shatters for alacrity at 100% bd even with trait which increases self alacrity effect at penatly of time.

I'm just going to file this under one more thing which you did not actually test and which you made mistakes on in theory which could have been easily disproved ingame.

I did a duo chrono rotation while training a new chrono player 3 weeks ago, without buff food and both of us at around 75% bd. We both hit above 1 minute on boons, both alacrity and quickness.

What is it with you and making up bs? I said "self sustain" on group, meaning no outside help.

If i'm wrong, then great, show me the numbers, and show the rotation step by step. I also can't trust what the chrono sees on their own boons, because shatters self buff and it throws off what you're actually giving the group. Soi doesn't share any more. If i'm wrong i'm guessing 80-90%

Edit: did more theory reasoning about the boon times a different way, theoretical min is 77% as far as i can tell. This is without cast times/player reaction times taken into account. Previously i thought you would take your 6th well before cs came off cd, but this is wrong, it's possible to build enough bd before the next cs that it's better to just save it.

That being said, my feelings about snow crows remain and these numbers don't include weaving clones for your own alacrity.

Love the likes on your comment by the way, just shows how toxic and unable to follow a conversation this community is.

Me: one chrono can only do it in this circumstanceYou: but two did it in this one!Me: Wtf?

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@Firebeard.1746 said:

@Firebeard.1746 said:My issue with the snow crows build is that it doesn't communicate how reliant you are on the other chrono and how you both have to coordinate your soi at a point in time when both your groups are covered by the buffs you just gave. There's actually incredibly high margins or error. Self sustaining your buffs is only possible at 100% bd, i've done the math. You also have to get a certain number of clones weaved in between to maintain 100% self alacrity because of the self alacrity duration penalty chronos suffer from. And the numbers I worked with were based on that up time. And note this means the chronos both must have baseline conc in order to maintain buffs, if one of the chronos is missing the right amount of concentration, it's very easy for their sois to fall out of sync.

Your math is wrong and you have definately not tried a basic rotation on the golem either solo or with a second chrono.

The required bd is about 50% for permanent boons with 2 chronos with good play. Hence why SC go for less bd, since permanent boons are not needed in top performance groups (but definately recommended for new chronos).

There is no necessity for shatters for alacrity at 100% bd even with trait which increases self alacrity effect at penatly of time.

I'm just going to file this under one more thing which you did not actually test and which you made mistakes on in theory which could have been easily disproved ingame.

I did a duo chrono rotation while training a new chrono player 3 weeks ago, without buff food and both of us at around 75% bd. We both hit above 1 minute on boons, both alacrity and quickness.

What is it with you and making up bs? I said "self sustain" on group, meaning no outside help.

If i'm wrong, then great, show me the numbers, and show the rotation step by step. I also can't trust what the chrono sees on their own boons, because shatters self buff and it throws off what you're actually giving the group. Soi doesn't share any more. If i'm wrong i'm guessing 80-90%

Love the likes on your comment by the way, just shows how toxic and unable to follow a conversation this community is.

Me: one chrono can only do it in this circumstanceYou: but two did it in this one!Me: kitten?

Do you even know why people run double chrono? Do you know in which situations that people run just one chrono?

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@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@Firebeard.1746 said:My issue with the snow crows build is that it doesn't communicate how reliant you are on the other chrono and how you both have to coordinate your soi at a point in time when both your groups are covered by the buffs you just gave. There's actually incredibly high margins or error. Self sustaining your buffs is only possible at 100% bd, i've done the math. You also have to get a certain number of clones weaved in between to maintain 100% self alacrity because of the self alacrity duration penalty chronos suffer from. And the numbers I worked with were based on that up time. And note this means the chronos both must have baseline conc in order to maintain buffs, if one of the chronos is missing the right amount of concentration, it's very easy for their sois to fall out of sync.

Your math is wrong and you have definately not tried a basic rotation on the golem either solo or with a second chrono.

The required bd is about 50% for permanent boons with 2 chronos with good play. Hence why SC go for less bd, since permanent boons are not needed in top performance groups (but definately recommended for new chronos).

There is no necessity for shatters for alacrity at 100% bd even with trait which increases self alacrity effect at penatly of time.

I'm just going to file this under one more thing which you did not actually test and which you made mistakes on in theory which could have been easily disproved ingame.

I did a duo chrono rotation while training a new chrono player 3 weeks ago, without buff food and both of us at around 75% bd. We both hit above 1 minute on boons, both alacrity and quickness.

What is it with you and making up bs? I said "self sustain" on group, meaning no outside help.

If i'm wrong, then great, show me the numbers, and show the rotation step by step. I also can't trust what the chrono sees on their own boons, because shatters self buff and it throws off what you're actually giving the group. Soi doesn't share any more. If i'm wrong i'm guessing 80-90%

Love the likes on your comment by the way, just shows how toxic and unable to follow a conversation this community is.

Me: one chrono can only do it in this circumstanceYou: but two did it in this one!Me: kitten?

Do you even know why people run double chrono? Do you know in which situations that people run just one chrono?

I do. But is it better to create more interdependencies between players or have them be able to perform their role in a box? Mechanics are no joke. I guess it's personal preference and in my case i would want each person to be able to fulfill their role on their own.

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@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@Naustis.8510 said:I understand people who wants KP, but I don't understand why GW2 community is so much into 'you have to complete X content 50 times to know what to do'. WoW raids and m+ dungeons are far harder, and if you killed a boss 5 times you know perfectly what to do... There is no need to kill it 50 times.

Because players want consistent and smooth runs in the groups that they create. If you did raids, you’d understand where this is coming from. There are some mechanics where a single player can cause the raid to fail.

So it is in WoW. I killed few bosses in GW2, and for most part is targrt dummy simulator with some short fazes of activity.

It’s not as dumbed down as you make it for those that are not experienced enough at the bosses. This is evident if you ever pug them or try to bring in pugs to your statics.

Well yeah, different teams approaches bosses differently so new player in team may need 2-3 wipes to see how you do it. I don't see a problen here though. But I maybe GW2 people are too used to one shotting everything, and because of that they concider a wipe as natural disaster.

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@"CETheLucid.3964" said:They should just add public mode from strike missions. Boom, KP problem solved. Everyone can play. Raid population instantly revived. Why not?

Assuming this isn't a sarcastic post, imagine if you go fight Vale Guardian in "public mode" and you get nobody that can strip boons, or no healer, or not enough players that can deal condition damage. Public Raids will never work.

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@Naustis.8510 said:

@Naustis.8510 said:I understand people who wants KP, but I don't understand why GW2 community is so much into 'you have to complete X content 50 times to know what to do'. WoW raids and m+ dungeons are far harder, and if you killed a boss 5 times you know perfectly what to do... There is no need to kill it 50 times.

Because players want consistent and smooth runs in the groups that they create. If you did raids, you’d understand where this is coming from. There are some mechanics where a single player can cause the raid to fail.

So it is in WoW. I killed few bosses in GW2, and for most part is targrt dummy simulator with some short fazes of activity.

It’s not as dumbed down as you make it for those that are not experienced enough at the bosses. This is evident if you ever pug them or try to bring in pugs to your statics.

Well yeah, different teams approaches bosses differently so new player in team may need 2-3 wipes to see how you do it. I don't see a problen here though. But I maybe GW2 people are too used to one shotting everything, and because of that they concider a wipe as natural disaster.

That’s assuming the player is capable of learning that quickly. That’s also assuming that you have just that one player. This gets significantly worse the more new players you add and just increases the time raids unnecessarily take along with annoying everyone else. People’s time has value and should not be shrugged off as meaningless in order to carry/train others.

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@maddoctor.2738 said:

@"CETheLucid.3964" said:They should just add public mode from strike missions. Boom, KP problem solved. Everyone can play. Raid population instantly revived. Why not?

Assuming this isn't a sarcastic post, imagine if you go fight Vale Guardian in "public mode" and you get nobody that can strip boons, or no healer, or not enough players that can deal condition damage. Public Raids will never work.

50/50. In the interests of getting something done and getting that sweet sweet raid loot, you'd think out of 10 people trying to do the raid at least one could provide boon stripping.

Don't we pride ourselves on our community? Doesn't the player want the shiny? Collaborate.

If not well, it's public mode after all. Could always try doing things in a static. But having the option there removes a lot of the 'I'm locked out of this content' feeling.

It wouldn't eliminate KP faking because there will always be that guy who feels entitled to being carried, but having a public option would greatly reduce that I'd think and if nothing else bring new blood to end game content that's lacking population.

It's kind of sad you have more people buying raids as opposed to doing them, though I guess practically speaking the people selling them probably want it this way.

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@CETheLucid.3964 said:

@CETheLucid.3964 said:They should just add public mode from strike missions. Boom, KP problem solved. Everyone can play. Raid population instantly revived. Why not?

Assuming this isn't a sarcastic post, imagine if you go fight Vale Guardian in "public mode" and you get nobody that can strip boons, or no healer, or not enough players that can deal condition damage. Public Raids will never work.

50/50. In the interests of getting something done and getting that sweet sweet raid loot, you'd think out of 10 people trying to do the raid at least one could provide boon stripping.

Don't we pride ourselves on our community? Doesn't the player want the shiny? Collaborate.

If not well, it's public mode after all. Could always try doing things in a static. But having the option there removes a lot of the 'I'm locked out of this content' feeling.It won't, because it will not work. You can't assign roles in strike mission-type public mode. When that role is important (and many are), the system won't be able to make certain you'll get one. And if you won't get one, the very same system gives you no way to correct that problem.No boon strip is a minor problem here. No healer, no tank (or too many of those), no kiter at deimos... how are you going to deal with that?
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@Firebeard.1746 said:

@Firebeard.1746 said:My issue with the snow crows build is that it doesn't communicate how reliant you are on the other chrono and how you both have to coordinate your soi at a point in time when both your groups are covered by the buffs you just gave. There's actually incredibly high margins or error. Self sustaining your buffs is only possible at 100% bd, i've done the math. You also have to get a certain number of clones weaved in between to maintain 100% self alacrity because of the self alacrity duration penalty chronos suffer from. And the numbers I worked with were based on that up time. And note this means the chronos both must have baseline conc in order to maintain buffs, if one of the chronos is missing the right amount of concentration, it's very easy for their sois to fall out of sync.

Your math is wrong and you have definately not tried a basic rotation on the golem either solo or with a second chrono.

The required bd is about 50% for permanent boons with 2 chronos with good play. Hence why SC go for less bd, since permanent boons are not needed in top performance groups (but definately recommended for new chronos).

There is no necessity for shatters for alacrity at 100% bd even with trait which increases self alacrity effect at penatly of time.

I'm just going to file this under one more thing which you did not actually test and which you made mistakes on in theory which could have been easily disproved ingame.

I did a duo chrono rotation while training a new chrono player 3 weeks ago, without buff food and both of us at around 75% bd. We both hit above 1 minute on boons, both alacrity and quickness.

What is it with you and making up bs? I said "self sustain" on group, meaning no outside help.

That's why you have 2 chronos in raids, or Firebrigade with chrono and Druid.

Your main issue as solo chrono is quickness uptime, not alacrity. A second chrono fixes this issue with his SoI, a renegade takes over the entire raids alacrity need allowing for the well to get swapped out.

Again, 50% is needed for permanent boons with 2 good chronos, more bd for less damage but better guaranteed boon uptime on weaker stacking, groups or chronos.

@Firebeard.1746 said:If i'm wrong, then great, show me the numbers, and show the rotation step by step. I also can't trust what the chrono sees on their own boons, because shatters self buff and it throws off what you're actually giving the group. Soi doesn't share any more. If i'm wrong i'm guessing 80-90%

SoI extends all other players duration on boons. Given your boons are mirrored and your alacrity will expire faster, if you have boons, so will your group.

Or finally get arcdps and make sure your group has boons. Either approach works.

@Firebeard.1746 said:Edit: did more theory reasoning about the boon times a different way, theoretical min is 77% as far as i can tell. This is without cast times/player reaction times taken into account. Previously i thought you would take your 6th well before cs came off cd, but this is wrong, it's possible to build enough bd before the next cs that it's better to just save it.

That being said, my feelings about snow crows remain and these numbers don't include weaving clones for your own alacrity.

Love the likes on your comment by the way, just shows how toxic and unable to follow a conversation this community is.

Yes yes yes, established chronos playing the class for 4 years are toxic and clueless while the new genious guy who just discovered the class is being treated unfaire. Give me a break.

@Firebeard.1746 said:Me: one chrono can only do it in this circumstanceYou: but two did it in this one!Me: kitten?

Your not a solo chrono. I mentioned the 50% bd is with 2 chronos which are the standard raid composition. In the thread in the mesmer forums I told you how far a chrono will manage to solo provide both boons, which is around 45-50 seconds before running into issues. This does not apply for raids. Both of these things can easily be replicated at the golem.

Losing a chrono or having a bad chrono is far worse than having 1 or 2 bad dps or losing dps.

What I find more shocking is that in this day and age, at this stage of the game, with this amount of guides and rotation videos and explenations. People can still try to reinvent the wheel.

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@Cyninja.2954 said:

Losing a chrono or having a bad chrono is far worse than having 1 or 2 bad dps or losing dps.

What I find more shocking is that in this day and age, at this stage of the game, with this amount of guides and rotation videos and explenations. People can still try to reinvent the wheel.

Ha. Well if the dps reqs are only 40-50k on normal bosses, having the boons only up based on 2 people playing the most complex class is probably far more fragile when mechanics come into play than having each of those players sustain their role, because technically one group, if played really well could finish the boss. This is my case and point about snow crows and elitists: they aren't teaching people fault tolerant strategies, they're hyperfocused on hyper optimal strategies.

Also does firebrand hit anyone outside 5 players? Those values are still relevant for quickness when paired with firebrigade.

Do you just do as your told without asking questions or figuring out why?

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The kp system in gw2 is a joke. Doesnt mean or prove anything at all. The way i look at it is that if you dont have a static and you use pugs, you have no right to complain about pugs ruining your game. After all it's your buffoonery that let them in it in the 1st place or decided to stay. Perhaps you should complain to yourself for making a bad decision on the person you choose to roll with. So i dont feel bad for raiders, fractalers, pvper or any other game mode player that ends in er. Instead of putting someone down it would be in your best interest to pick them up and help them get better. You dont have to be exceptional just good enough. Gw2 raids aren't that hard.

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@Firebeard.1746 said:

Losing a chrono or having a bad chrono is far worse than having 1 or 2 bad dps or losing dps.

What I find more shocking is that in this day and age, at this stage of the game, with this amount of guides and rotation videos and explenations. People can still try to reinvent the wheel.

Ha. Well if the dps reqs are only 40-50k on normal bosses, having the boons only up based on 2 people playing the most complex class is probably far more fragile when mechanics come into play than having each of those players sustain their role, because technically one group, if played really well could finish the boss. This is my case and point about snow crows and elitists: they aren't teaching people fault tolerant strategies, they're hyperfocused on hyper optimal strategies.

Chrono is not the most complex class. It hasn't been in a while. Even less so for support chrono who has arguably one of the easiest roles in raids currently. The difficulty for chronos comes from the many different boss mechanics the tank needs to know and the vast amount of mechanics unloaded onto the class. It doesn't make the class difficult, it makes the role in the squad complicated. That's different. As far as rotation, chrono has become rather simple.

and yes, it is sufficient if 5 people are competent. Usually those 5 take on the support roles, hence why the usual recommendation is that new players take on dps roles. It's not efficient to have 1 full subgroup

@Firebeard.1746 said:Also does firebrand hit anyone outside 5 players? Those values are still relevant for quickness when paired with firebrigade.

No they are not. A firebrigade setup automatically means the chrono has 1 free utility slot which he can dedicate to mimic, which in turn means more SoI uptime.

@Firebeard.1746 said:Do you just do as your told without asking questions or figuring out why?

There is a difference between questioning others and being obtuse. If you were critically questioning things, you'd familiarize yourself as much as possible with the material first, then start poking holes in established ideas. Not start from scratch and base all ideas on incorrect assumptions which could have been easily researched or ruled out with simple testing.

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