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KP system is why raids are dead ( I use fake LI/KP now)


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@Cyninja.2954 said:

Chrono is not the most complex class. It hasn't been in a while. Even less so for support chrono who has arguably one of the easiest roles in raids currently. The difficulty for chronos comes from the many different boss mechanics the tank needs to know and the vast amount of mechanics unloaded onto the class. It doesn't make the class difficult, it makes the role in the squad complicated. That's different. As far as rotation, chrono has become rather simple.

Yeah as opposed to just having to drop a well in the right spot every 16 seconds, Squeezing 3 skills in a tight window to double them up is just an absolute piece of cake. Not to mention the number of different skills that all play into both generating your boons as well as sustaining them. I am curious though, what's worse?

No they are not. A firebrigade setup automatically means the chrono has 1 free utility slot which he can dedicate to mimic, which in turn means more SoI uptime.

I thought of this, depends on how many shatters you want to be forced to do. And oddly enough you didn't give a new bd number with this. You'd still need a threshold.

How's that for obtuse? What would be so bad about more stat selectable exotics in the economy allowing players to more easily access different builds?

I would also say obtuse is feeling like you have to shove your opinion down someone's throat despite evidence to the contrary in one thread and then feeling like you have to stalk someone's every move after, to the point of even ignoring what the person was talking about in the first place in the new thread.

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@Firebeard.1746 said:

@"Cyninja.2954" said:

Chrono is not the most complex class. It hasn't been in a while. Even less so for support chrono who has arguably one of the easiest roles in raids currently. The difficulty for chronos comes from the many different boss mechanics the tank needs to know and the vast amount of mechanics unloaded onto the class. It doesn't make the class difficult, it makes the role in the squad complicated. That's different. As far as rotation, chrono has become rather simple.

Yeah as opposed to just having to drop a well in the right spot every 16 seconds, Squeezing 3 skills in a tight window to double them up is just an absolute piece of cake. Not to mention the number of different skills that all play into both generating your boons as well as sustaining them. I am curious though, what's worse?

No they are not. A firebrigade setup automatically means the chrono has 1 free utility slot which he can dedicate to mimic, which in turn means more SoI uptime.

I thought of this, depends on how many shatters you want to be forced to do. And oddly enough you didn't give a new bd number with this. You'd still need a threshold.

How's that for obtuse? What would be so bad about more stat selectable exotics in the economy allowing players to more easily access different builds?

I would also say obtuse is feeling like you have to shove your opinion down someone's throat despite evidence to the contrary in one thread and then feeling like you have to stalk someone's every move after, to the point of even ignoring what the person was talking about in the first place in the new thread.

What's your raiding experience in this game?

I only ask because in another one of your threads you stated that Salvation Pass was the only raid that you've done and you had only done it twice. This was five days ago.

Second go at Salvation pass yesterday (the only raid I've done), and I laugh in the face of anyone saying GW2 raids are heroic level for WoW. Nope did multiple heroic tiers, and just nope. That one is definitely mythic (if WoW even has mechanics difficult enough to compare).

If you've only done a single raid boss twice (1st in mid July and 2nd on the 20th), how can you possibly comment on how things are in raids? There are people on here with a ton more raid experience than you and yet you're saying they're wrong based on the two times you raided.

And of those two times that you raided, were they training runs? How experienced were the other players in your squad?

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@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@"Cyninja.2954" said:

Chrono is not the most complex class. It hasn't been in a while. Even less so for support chrono who has arguably one of the easiest roles in raids currently. The difficulty for chronos comes from the many different boss mechanics the tank needs to know and the vast amount of mechanics unloaded onto the class. It doesn't make the class difficult, it makes the role in the squad complicated. That's different. As far as rotation, chrono has become rather simple.

Yeah as opposed to just having to drop a well in the right spot every 16 seconds, Squeezing 3 skills in a tight window to double them up is just an absolute piece of cake. Not to mention the number of different skills that all play into both generating your boons as well as sustaining them. I am curious though, what's worse?

No they are not. A firebrigade setup automatically means the chrono has 1 free utility slot which he can dedicate to mimic, which in turn means more SoI uptime.

I thought of this, depends on how many shatters you want to be forced to do. And oddly enough you didn't give a new bd number with this. You'd still need a threshold.

How's that for obtuse? What would be so bad about more stat selectable exotics in the economy allowing players to more easily access different builds?

I would also say obtuse is feeling like you have to shove your opinion down someone's throat despite evidence to the contrary in one thread and then feeling like you have to stalk someone's every move after, to the point of even ignoring what the person was talking about in the first place in the new thread.

What's your raiding experience in this game?

I only ask because in another one of
you stated that Salvation Pass was the only raid that you've done and you had only done it twice. This was five days ago.

Second go at Salvation pass yesterday (the only raid I've done), and I laugh in the face of anyone saying GW2 raids are heroic level for WoW. Nope did multiple heroic tiers, and just nope. That one is definitely mythic (if WoW even has mechanics difficult enough to compare).

If you've only done a single raid boss twice (1st in mid July and 2nd on the 20th), how can you possibly comment on how things are in raids? There are people on here with a ton more raid experience than you and yet you're saying they're wrong based on the two times you raided.

And of those two times that you raided, were they training runs? How experienced were the other players in your squad?

1) there is nothing wrong with theorycraft. And i'm not saying they're wrong, i'm just saying what's right for experienced players is different, and i'm specifically pointing out that optimizing the same way as experienced players for new players is more error prone/less fault tolerant. I'm also kind of shocked at how little technical detail i'm getting from "experienced" raiders on their profession, just memorized rotations and metas. I guess they're all tied up in metas pooped out by snow crows. A good example of this is I actually had high enough concentration in the presence of another mesmer to sustain my rotation but couldn't because the other one sucked. So yeah i feel completely justified going to gear values that allow me to contribute to the group without someone else's help.

2) yeah alot of them didn't have experience and i think i actually ousted our current raid leader because someone else is in charge now it seems. Our raid leader had experience but imo was too focused on metas as opposed to strategy and didn't take our runs seriously based on some of his behavior. I've called him out on it multiple times, and it seems someone else has stepped up to the plate. I've raided enough in other games to know the barrier here is gear and poorly designed mechanics. But i think the gear is the bigger issue. Telling people go grind x for n number of months/weeks before you can do y activity encourages them to do z that's more enjoyable low hanging fruit. Funny story our training runs were our only ones but couldn't seem to actually keep people. I would know because i went once, figured I needed better gear and waited before trying again.

3) it's entirely appropriate for people new players to comment on a thread that discusses the barriers into raiding. Keeping them out is the choir preaching to itself.

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About KPs, does players actually Ask other KPs than dhuum/qadim1/qadim2? I usually raid with guild but whenever i pug o usually see only squads asking for 250LI, squads asking low amount of LI or squads asking zero LI. Its pretty rare to see those 3 KPs asked unless its monday, after that every now and then there is a KP Squad in LFG but usually only LI squads.And LI is a lot easier to get than harder boss KPs.

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@Firebeard.1746 said:

Chrono is not the most complex class. It hasn't been in a while. Even less so for support chrono who has arguably one of the easiest roles in raids currently. The difficulty for chronos comes from the many different boss mechanics the tank needs to know and the vast amount of mechanics unloaded onto the class. It doesn't make the class difficult, it makes the role in the squad complicated. That's different. As far as rotation, chrono has become rather simple.

Yeah as opposed to just having to drop a well in the right spot every 16 seconds, Squeezing 3 skills in a tight window to double them up is just an absolute piece of cake. Not to mention the number of different skills that all play into both generating your boons as well as sustaining them. I am curious though, what's worse?

Yes, pressing 3 skills is hard... especially in a 3 second window, 4.5 seconds with 2 clones. News flash, it is not. It's called muscle memory and most chronos who have practiced and played have.

Try some of the more complex dps rotations like weaver or renegade, maybe mirage. Then get a 90% benchmark or above. It is far easier to get boons right than be a good dps rotation wise. The leeway for errors and the possibility to overstack bd both make chrobo far easier.

@Firebeard.1746 said:

@Cyninja.2954 said:No they are not. A firebrigade setup automatically means the chrono has 1 free utility slot which he can dedicate to mimic, which in turn means more SoI uptime.

I thought of this, depends on how many shatters you want to be forced to do. And oddly enough you didn't give a new bd number with this. You'd still need a threshold.

In your case, as much as you can.

@Firebeard.1746 said:How's that for obtuse? What would be so bad about more stat selectable exotics in the economy allowing players to more easily access different builds?

I would also say obtuse is feeling like you have to shove your opinion down someone's throat despite evidence to the contrary in one thread and then feeling like you have to stalk someone's every move after, to the point of even ignoring what the person was talking about in the first place in the new thread.

Which evidence? I see no theorycrafting in this thread. I see someone throw out random numbers which are clearly based on incorrect rotation and/or bad gameplay which can easily be disproved at the golem.

You are right in one point. There is no reason to once continue this conversation. I'm not the one having issues with raids in this game. Far be it for me to help or lecture someone who wants to figure everything else by themselves. Hopefully said person doesn't come complaining again about how hard raids in this game are.

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And you ignore the other parts of your rotation and fail to compare it to other classes doing similar things, while also failing to answer my question about which class is harder, overall you're failing to convince me of anything.

@"Cyninja.2954" said:Which evidence? I see no theorycrafting in this thread. I see someone throw out random numbers which are clearly based on incorrect rotation and/or bad gameplay which can easily be disproved at the golem.

You are right in one point. There is no reason to once continue this conversation. I'm not the one having issues with raids in this game. Far be it for me to help or lecture someone who wants to figure everything else by themselves. Hopefully said person doesn't come complaining again about how hard raids in this game are.

Lol and you have no evidence for anything you say. Here it is.

was going to use the snow crows rotation but it looks incomplete. It doesn't actually cover 70s from CS to CS

assuming the rotation is 70s from CS to CS (that's what 50% alacrity turns it into if maintained), keeping full quickness/alacrity on party members focusing on just shared boons:x = boon duration multiplier (it's 1 + BD %)

3 (number of casts) 2 (duration) x(tides of time) + 5 (number of casts in 70s window) 5 (base duration) x (WoR/WoA) + 3s * 5 (SOI, doesn't scale with BD) = 70s6x + 25x + 15 = 7031x + 15 = 7031x = 55x = 1.774...

BD = 77.4%

Hilarious snow crows can't be bothered to give a full rotation and in their video showing it off on the dummy it's a hand-wavy "The other chrono will make up the difference, we're showing this with all the buffs in place already", what if the other chrono sucks? Note also this isn't accounting for mechanics causing lag in rotation, or even cast times.

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@Firebeard.1746 said:And you ignore the other parts of your rotation and fail to compare it to other classes doing similar things, while also failing to answer my question about which class is harder

I do not. If you consider pressing phantasms on cd, pressing F1 or F3, occasionally delaying Shield 4, Sword 2 or delaying a signet for aegis share hard, you and I have different definitions of hard.

I told you, expand your class roster and get some 90% benchmarks on some of the meta dps. Mirage should be right along your main, weaver (or even DH) are excellent power dps, renegade is meta condi. All of them will be significabtly harder than chrono.

@Firebeard.1746 said:

@Cyninja.2954 said:Which evidence? I see no theorycrafting in this thread. I see someone throw out random numbers which are clearly based on incorrect rotation and/or bad gameplay which can easily be disproved at the golem.

You are right in one point. There is no reason to once continue this conversation. I'm not the one having issues with raids in this game. Far be it for me to help or lecture someone who wants to figure everything else by themselves. Hopefully said person doesn't come complaining again about how hard raids in this game are.

Lol and you have no evidence for anything you say. Here it is.

was going to use the snow crows rotation but it looks incomplete. It doesn't actually cover 70s from CS to CS

assuming the rotation is 70s from CS to CS (that's what 50% alacrity turns it into), keeping full quickness/alacrity on party members focusing on just shared boons:x = boon duration multiplier (it's 1 + BD %)

3 (number of casts)
2 (duration) x(tides of time) + 5 (number of casts in 70s window)
5 (base duration) x (WoR/WoA) + 3s * 5 (SOI, doesn't scale with BD) = 70s6x + 25x + 15 = 7031x + 15 = 7031x = 55x = 1.774...

BD = 77.4%

and for the bazillionth time, SC is for an optimal setup with 2 chronos. Now add 5 more SoI from the other chrono and your 15 seconds SoI duration go to 30. Now assume that there is nearly no boss with damage phases of above 1 minute for pro groups, and you can drop even below the 50% bd for more damage on chronos.

Inexperienced groups and chronos should be taking as much bd as possible to cover for mistakes and longer damage phases. tim has a calculator up on the mesmer forums which does the exact math too btw.

I'm really not sure what you are trying to prove. Except that you are able to work basic functions and solve for x.

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@Cyninja.2954 said:

@Firebeard.1746 said:And you ignore the other parts of your rotation and fail to compare it to other classes doing similar things, while also failing to answer my question about which class is harder

I do not. If you consider pressing phantasms on cd, pressing F1 or F3, occasionally delaying Shield 4, Sword 2 or delaying a signet for aegis share hard, you and I have different definitions of hard.

@Cyninja.2954 said:Which evidence? I see no theorycrafting in this thread. I see someone throw out random numbers which are clearly based on incorrect rotation and/or bad gameplay which can easily be disproved at the golem.

You are right in one point. There is no reason to once continue this conversation. I'm not the one having issues with raids in this game. Far be it for me to help or lecture someone who wants to figure everything else by themselves. Hopefully said person doesn't come complaining again about how hard raids in this game are.

Lol and you have no evidence for anything you say. Here it is.

was going to use the snow crows rotation but it looks incomplete. It doesn't actually cover 70s from CS to CS

assuming the rotation is 70s from CS to CS (that's what 50% alacrity turns it into), keeping full quickness/alacrity on party members focusing on just shared boons:x = boon duration multiplier (it's 1 + BD %)

3 (number of casts)
2 (duration) x(tides of time) + 5 (number of casts in 70s window)
5 (base duration) x (WoR/WoA) + 3s * 5 (SOI, doesn't scale with BD) = 70s6x + 25x + 15 = 7031x + 15 = 7031x = 55x = 1.774...

BD = 77.4%

and for the bazillionth time, SC is for an optimal setup with 2 chronos. Now add 5 more SoI from the other chrono and your 15 seconds SoI duration go to 30. Now assume that there is nearly no boss with damage phases of above 1 minute for pro groups, and you can drop even below the 50% bd for more damage on chronos.

Inexperienced groups and chronos should be taking as much bd as possible to cover for mistakes and longer damage phases. tim has a calculator up on the mesmer forums which does the exact math too btw.

I'm really not sure what you are trying to prove. Except that you are able to work basic functions and solve for x.

Wow we're in circles again. Looks like you missed the memo about the chronos I've worked with sucking that I mentioned earlier (to someone else) (in addition to me flat out telling you I don't want to rely on someone else). Hahahahaha you seriously don't listen do you? There seriously needs to be a forum "block" function where you can't read someone posts if they block you and they can't read yours.

And you're still off topic? why don't you respond to OP about how to increase raid involvement instead of picking on someone who's justifying their choice in stats when building a raid set? That's how this started O and I'm glad you're finally agreeing with me that learners should be stacking more BD because everyone was looking at me like I was crazy before.

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@Firebeard.1746 said:

@Firebeard.1746 said:And you ignore the other parts of your rotation and fail to compare it to other classes doing similar things, while also failing to answer my question about which class is harder

I do not. If you consider pressing phantasms on cd, pressing F1 or F3, occasionally delaying Shield 4, Sword 2 or delaying a signet for aegis share hard, you and I have different definitions of hard.

@Cyninja.2954 said:Which evidence? I see no theorycrafting in this thread. I see someone throw out random numbers which are clearly based on incorrect rotation and/or bad gameplay which can easily be disproved at the golem.

You are right in one point. There is no reason to once continue this conversation. I'm not the one having issues with raids in this game. Far be it for me to help or lecture someone who wants to figure everything else by themselves. Hopefully said person doesn't come complaining again about how hard raids in this game are.

Lol and you have no evidence for anything you say. Here it is.

was going to use the snow crows rotation but it looks incomplete. It doesn't actually cover 70s from CS to CS

assuming the rotation is 70s from CS to CS (that's what 50% alacrity turns it into), keeping full quickness/alacrity on party members focusing on just shared boons:x = boon duration multiplier (it's 1 + BD %)

3 (number of casts)
2 (duration) x(tides of time) + 5 (number of casts in 70s window)
5 (base duration) x (WoR/WoA) + 3s * 5 (SOI, doesn't scale with BD) = 70s6x + 25x + 15 = 7031x + 15 = 7031x = 55x = 1.774...

BD = 77.4%

and for the bazillionth time, SC is for an optimal setup with 2 chronos. Now add 5 more SoI from the other chrono and your 15 seconds SoI duration go to 30. Now assume that there is nearly no boss with damage phases of above 1 minute for pro groups, and you can drop even below the 50% bd for more damage on chronos.

Inexperienced groups and chronos should be taking as much bd as possible to cover for mistakes and longer damage phases. tim has a calculator up on the mesmer forums which does the exact math too btw.

I'm really not sure what you are trying to prove. Except that you are able to work basic functions and solve for x.

Wow we're in circles again. Looks like you missed the memo about the chronos I've worked with sucking that I mentioned earlier (to someone else) (in addition to me flat out telling you I don't want to rely on someone else). Hahahahaha you seriously don't listen do you? There seriously needs to be a forum "block" function where you can't read someone posts if they block you and they can't read yours.

So take as much bd as possible, what have I been stating over and over this thread?

It's not only for you, it's for the group and covers potetmntially a bad offchrono or players not standing in wells.

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@Cyninja.2954 said:

@Firebeard.1746 said:And you ignore the other parts of your rotation and fail to compare it to other classes doing similar things, while also failing to answer my question about which class is harder

I do not. If you consider pressing phantasms on cd, pressing F1 or F3, occasionally delaying Shield 4, Sword 2 or delaying a signet for aegis share hard, you and I have different definitions of hard.

@Cyninja.2954 said:Which evidence? I see no theorycrafting in this thread. I see someone throw out random numbers which are clearly based on incorrect rotation and/or bad gameplay which can easily be disproved at the golem.

You are right in one point. There is no reason to once continue this conversation. I'm not the one having issues with raids in this game. Far be it for me to help or lecture someone who wants to figure everything else by themselves. Hopefully said person doesn't come complaining again about how hard raids in this game are.

Lol and you have no evidence for anything you say. Here it is.

was going to use the snow crows rotation but it looks incomplete. It doesn't actually cover 70s from CS to CS

assuming the rotation is 70s from CS to CS (that's what 50% alacrity turns it into), keeping full quickness/alacrity on party members focusing on just shared boons:x = boon duration multiplier (it's 1 + BD %)

3 (number of casts)
2 (duration) x(tides of time) + 5 (number of casts in 70s window)
5 (base duration) x (WoR/WoA) + 3s * 5 (SOI, doesn't scale with BD) = 70s6x + 25x + 15 = 7031x + 15 = 7031x = 55x = 1.774...

BD = 77.4%

and for the bazillionth time, SC is for an optimal setup with 2 chronos. Now add 5 more SoI from the other chrono and your 15 seconds SoI duration go to 30. Now assume that there is nearly no boss with damage phases of above 1 minute for pro groups, and you can drop even below the 50% bd for more damage on chronos.

Inexperienced groups and chronos should be taking as much bd as possible to cover for mistakes and longer damage phases. tim has a calculator up on the mesmer forums which does the exact math too btw.

I'm really not sure what you are trying to prove. Except that you are able to work basic functions and solve for x.

Wow we're in circles again. Looks like you missed the memo about the chronos I've worked with sucking that I mentioned earlier (to someone else) (in addition to me flat out telling you I don't want to rely on someone else). Hahahahaha you seriously don't listen do you? There seriously needs to be a forum "block" function where you can't read someone posts if they block you and they can't read yours.

So take as much bd as possible, what have I been stating over and over this thread?

It's not only for you, it's for the group and covers potetmntially a bad offchrono or players not standing in wells.

I'm glad we finally agree and we've converged.

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I think, if I may.... What's happening here with OP, and what happens to a lot of smart, competent practiced gamers when then enter Gw2 raiding... Is the simple phenomenon of joining a moving crowd at the back of the line. Maybe the big group of people funneling into a stadium. You think, 'I've got my life in order, and I don't need to follow these sheep to get in'. And you'd be right. The issue is, that if given time, you'll figure out where the ticket booth is. You'll figure out the path to your seat.

But it's much easier to follow the crowd. So you think 'I hate this, I'm following these folks. And it's the only way in. If they just had 10 more ticket counters, I could get in. Nobody thinks about the placement of ticket counters... I'm sure I can find out a better way.'

Then you Google it. And you find efficiency guides. Websites detailing the fastest way in, to the counter, to the seats... The best moment to leave in order to miss a minimum amount of show, but to skip the traffic. So you think 'that's why the ticket line is so clogged! They all use the same efficiency guide!'

See, the issue is that the crowd isn't all one type of people. They aren't all guide readers. Of the ones who are, only some of them are guide followers. And some of them, didn't need a guide at all, and just figured it out. And some tiny number of them, wrote the guide.

So, to sum up... OP is right to an extent. But he'd have to find folks who, like him, figured it out and didn't need a guide. And together they'll come up with all sorts of other strategies. But by and large, those folks aren't on fourms. Cause they didn't need a guide. They're spending the time you're spending reading this, on playing. (or life.) And, the folks who read the guide? If you want to be mad at them, for trusting the people who are best at, the thing they want to do.... Then the entirety of human learning needs reexamination. And again, you're right... The folks that write the guide don't write about ways to do it other than the most efficient. But why would they? Millionaires don't write guides about loosing money. And pro ball players don't make videos about missing shots. It's not what they're into. Pro-speed-clear guys making a video or guide on how to 'slowly easy mode a thing' , that they can lazer blitz through... Like, that's like asking Michael Phelps to write a guide titled 'Coping with Silver, my battle with almost not winning as much.' even if the check you offer him is huge, that's just not his bag. Baby.

The phenomenon of KP.... This is just the crowd, recognizing its sheep status, and looking for a leader. Human psych again. They want folks who they know won't hold them up getting ready to go, who know the route, who can be trusted to save seats, go to the bathroom by themselves without getting lost.... Ect. So it's a bit like turning to your buddy in the stadium parking lot and saying 'dude. I'm not missing this show. If I miss the solo in Welcome Home because I'm helping you find the bathroom.... Again.... You can uber yourself home.'

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anet could give better incentives for vets to bring along a new player to raid. maybe extra rewards and maybe even campaign a little change the culture of raiding. This game will die without an influx of a new players. But as it stands right now, new players have a very hard time getting over that hurdle of learning fights and getting enough LI because no one wants to play with them. They will leave the game. The community has to start using common sense, and anet could do more.

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My God, your post hurts me physically. Let's break it down.

"I use fake LI/KP to not brag about how skilled I am" and yet here you are on the forum bragging of how you think you are more skilled than the average player, so what's that about?

Your twisted perception of how things work baffles me. The fact that you only did Dhuum 4 times and think you know all the possible outcomes and different RNG situations that can wipe a group screams wishful thinking. The reason why people ask for KP is because there is a number of different outcomes in every encounter that can go wrong. Having killed the boss multiple times means you have seen most of the possible outcomes of what can go wrong and will be more prepared for them than a person who did it only a few times and think they know it all (that's you, in case it's not clear).

Now let's talk about your solution. Make it harder! LMAO

Yes making Raids harder will make the Raid population grow (??????????). That makes a lot of sense. Since all we have in GW2 are skilled players that don't play Raids because they find it too easy, even though they don't have KP because they couldn't pug it properly. I don't know which world you live in, but the harder you make things, the fewer people will want to do it, it's not the other way around. Also, how is it that you expect to prove all of your skills that you have if not with the KP system? Do you propose a golem session with all the people in the squad everytime a pug is created? That would make it easier in your conception? Have you played other roles? Chrono Tank, Off Chrono, Druid, Heal Scourge, Heal brand, Quickbrand? Or you are just counting how much DPS you do in a pug and because you're always on the top you feel like Raids are easy for you and you are obviously skilled?

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@"Tuto.7305" said:My God, your post hurts me physically. Let's break it down.

"I use fake LI/KP to not brag about how skilled I am" and yet here you are on the forum bragging of how you think you are more skilled than the average player, so what's that about?

Your twisted perception of how things work baffles me. The fact that you only did Dhuum 4 times and think you know all the possible outcomes and different RNG situations that can wipe a group screams wishful thinking. The reason why people ask for KP is because there is a number of different outcomes in every encounter that can go wrong. Having killed the boss multiple times means you have seen most of the possible outcomes of what can go wrong and will be more prepared for them than a person who did it only a few times and think they know it all (that's you, in case it's not clear).

Now let's talk about your solution. Make it harder! LMAO

Yes making Raids harder will make the Raid population grow (??????????). That makes a lot of sense. Since all we have in GW2 are skilled players that don't play Raids because they find it too easy, even though they don't have KP because they couldn't pug it properly. I don't know which world you live in, but the harder you make things, the fewer people will want to do it, it's not the other way around. Also, how is it that you expect to prove all of your skills that you have if not with the KP system? Do you propose a golem session with all the people in the squad everytime a pug is created? That would make it easier in your conception? Have you played other roles? Chrono Tank, Off Chrono, Druid, Heal Scourge, Heal brand, Quickbrand? Or you are just counting how much DPS you do in a pug and because you're always on the top you feel like Raids are easy for you and you are obviously skilled?

this is the cultural issue, some people think mmorpg content is all about showing your ability in raids, 'i'm an important player because i can clear a raid, im important because ive got gear x, im important because i have dps y'. This is something that has oozed like a poison from games like wow and tools like dmg meters. mmorpg at its root come from the concept of a group of players fighting through a dungeon together and winning loot, not repeating a boss 40 times and burning shit into your memory muscles and min maxing gear stats. What pve and raids needs is content that the majority of the community enjoy player together.

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@vesica tempestas.1563 said:

@"Tuto.7305" said:My God, your post hurts me physically. Let's break it down.

"I use fake LI/KP to not brag about how skilled I am" and yet here you are on the forum bragging of how you think you are more skilled than the average player, so what's that about?

Your twisted perception of how things work baffles me. The fact that you only did Dhuum 4 times and think you know all the possible outcomes and different RNG situations that can wipe a group screams wishful thinking. The reason why people ask for KP is because there is a number of different outcomes in every encounter that can go wrong. Having killed the boss multiple times means you have seen most of the possible outcomes of what can go wrong and will be more prepared for them than a person who did it only a few times and think they know it all (that's you, in case it's not clear).

Now let's talk about your solution. Make it harder! LMAO

Yes making Raids harder will make the Raid population grow (??????????). That makes a lot of sense. Since all we have in GW2 are skilled players that don't play Raids because they find it too easy, even though they don't have KP because they couldn't pug it properly. I don't know which world you live in, but the harder you make things, the fewer people will want to do it, it's not the other way around. Also, how is it that you expect to prove all of your skills that you have if not with the KP system? Do you propose a golem session with all the people in the squad everytime a pug is created? That would make it easier in your conception? Have you played other roles? Chrono Tank, Off Chrono, Druid, Heal Scourge, Heal brand, Quickbrand? Or you are just counting how much DPS you do in a pug and because you're always on the top you feel like Raids are easy for you and you are obviously skilled?

this is the cultural issue, some people think mmorpg content is all about showing your ability in raids, 'i'm an important player because i can clear a raid, im important because ive got gear x, im important because i have dps y'. This is something that has oozed like a poison from games like wow and tools like dmg meters. mmorpg at its root come from the concept of a group of players fighting through a dungeon together and winning loot, not repeating a boss 40 times and burning kitten into your memory muscles and min maxing gear stats. What pve and raids needs is content that the majority of the community enjoy player together.

There's open world for those that don't like the existing raids. Not all content in the game must appeal to everyone. This content was designed for those that wanted a challenge or at least more of a challenge than what's being offered elsewhere in the game.

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People want experienced players for raiding because their time is limited and they want whatever they perceive increases their chances of successfully clearing a raid.Consider the gap where a pug can't clear 1 boss in 2 hours whereas a good static can clear 4 wings in that time. A lot of raids are such that one person can cause a 'GG' for everyone [having been responsible for that myself a few times] .

My view is that there will never be a way for the developers to prevent players from seeking 'only the best' -- but there may be a way to prevent unecessesary toxicity.

This is my proposal:

  1. Account wide completion of PVE content is stored as data and players can see the number of completions that they themselves have done (Would apply to raids, t4 fractals, and related CMs)
  2. LFG's creators can set completion filters where joining a squad is limited on a certain number of completions of a particular set of content.
  3. The catch is that the squad/party leader cannot set a filter higher than what they themselves have completed.
  4. Lastly, and perhaps most importantly. Having party members in the raid who have not completed it before [or only completed it a small number of times] increases the rewards given to all participants in the party or raid squad. People who've done raiding a little bit should be compensated by the game on bringing non-raiders through the content

If someone wants to demand a lot of KP they're free to do so, but it calls into question why they don't just use the filter if they are that good [perhaps because they don't have that much themselves?]. I think demanding various kinds of killproof becomes embarassing for the people in question in such circumstances.

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@AdmiralSnackbar.4859 said:Lastly, and perhaps most importantly. Having party members in the raid who have not completed it before [or only completed it a small number of times] increases the rewards given to all participants in the party or raid squad. People who've done raiding a little bit should be compensated by the game on bringing non-raiders through the content

Although this idea sounds fine on paper, what would prevent the raiding teams from creating alt accounts to get those extra rewards? Meaning in the end, less non-raiders get into teams because the spots will be filled by those alts.

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Kp system would be fine if it wasnt timegated. It fooks people who want indulge in hardcore content with that mentality, forcing casual nature upon them. For the community it doesnt matter if someone got 50kp in a day or in 6yrs as long that person has it and it gives a chance to new players to catch up fast if the grind a lot.

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KP system can easily be faked. Having insights means you have just been there when it was defeated the person could have easily leached all their kills.

The kp system will always be a failure at determining whether or not someone is worthy to raid.

Your best bet is to make a dedicated team yourself and train them from scratch. If anyone leaves then replace them with someone who is newer and be trained by the team.

This is the only way raids can truly be balanced for new players and old players and not based of mechanic skips and or pure damage or what I like to call (smashy smashy can’t go wrong but is always wrong.)

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@dodgerrule.8739 said:KP system can easily be faked. Having insights means you have just been there when it was defeated the person could have easily leached all their kills.

The kp system will always be a failure at determining whether or not someone is worthy to raid.

Your best bet is to make a dedicated team yourself and train them from scratch. If anyone leaves then replace them with someone who is newer and be trained by the team.

This is the only way raids can truly be balanced for new players and old players and not based of mechanic skips and or pure damage or what I like to call (smashy smashy can’t go wrong but is always wrong.)I'm sorry, but it doesn't follow. They way you create your team has no impact whatsoever on how the encounters are balanced. If there's any connection, it goes the other way.

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@dodgerrule.8739 said:Not everyone is going to use that lol.yes, not everyone. Only who want be in party memebers who is without fake kp

API keys aren’t personal keys for your account if someone puts it on there they’d be giving up privacyabout that privacy we talk? you can check my cms 700+ kp and be sure that this is not fake. and this is not ctrl+v or macro

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