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Upcoming Changes to Fall Damage and Revival


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So... Toss Elixir R is fine?

The weakest revival skills in effect, condition and cooldown.90s CD for a projectile skill that creates a r180 field in which allies receive 16% HP per second.

To start with, you need line-of-sight, no projectile hate and no body-block to put the field down.Then for a low HP downed it takes 5s to actually revive without any incoming damage.There is no protection against conditions, projectiles or any source of damage. Heal is also reduced when you have poison.Even in a dedicated build with tools and HGH you got a 60s CD on tossing.

Of course, you get a 30s CD skill in addition that gives endurance and removes immo (but not stun, or cripple, slow/chill). But it's hard to imagine a build where this is a better addition than using evade-sigil + kit.

How about making Toss-R unblockable or non-projectile and the field projectile absorbing? Then it's still awfully slow at reviving, but actually a revival skill. Also, a 40s CD would probably fit its effect better.

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The falling damage change is on par with the Chrono rework: it removes tons of minor fun, situational interactions that added depth and variety into the game. Even WvW aside, there are new players that want to go through the vanilla experience without mounts and gliders, there are jumping puzzles, and there are meta shenanigans where those choices added to the experience.

Gimmicky revival-focused builds were also fun, that was a specific playstyle that could exist. Was that so much of an issue in PvPs to remove even its possibility from everywhere?

Or is it that some database is running out of parameter slots so those two have to be removed to make space for others? /headscratch

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@Gamander.7269 said:You're forgetting that there are free-2-play accounts that don't have gliding. In WvW fall damage reduction was obligatory for those accounts.Strongly disagree. I dont have HoT nor PoF on my alt. As such i can only run core builds (obviously). The only falling damage reduction trait i use is Peak Performance on my warrior. Even that is because it gives me extra damage on physical skills. Or in rare occasions surprise my enemies with a cc when i want to jump on top of them. But the moments i like to benefit from falling damage reduction is non- existing. Never felt the need for it.

Also, @"Robert Gee.9246" since you're revisiting these kind of traits. Perhaps you may want to look at/change Rune of Snowfall as well.

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I dont see why the fall damage had to be removed. Not like you gave us anything new for taking that away. Now this is gonna affect the players who likes jumping puzzles where we cannot use mounts or gliders. I always used to trait for falling damage reduction while doing a JP just to avoid the risk of falling and dying. I mean, it wouldn't really hurt for it to be there especially since we're not getting any other additional bonus for the trait. Just my thoughts

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@"Robert Gee.9246" said:

Guardian

  • Protectors Impact: Removed fall damage functionality from this trait. Renamed to "Protector's Restoration".
  • Signet of Mercy: Reduced recharge to 90 seconds in all game modes. Changed passive effect from granting 180 healing power (216 when traited) to granting 120 concentration (150 when traited).
  • Protective Reviver: This trait no longer increases revival speed and no longer grants boons on a successful revival. Fixed skill fact to show correct 3 second duration. Fixed a bug which prevented the recharge of Lesser Shield of Absorption from being affected by Stalwart Defender. Lesser Shield of Absorption now heals nearby allies when it ends. This trait now causes all versions of Shield of Absorption to revive allies by 15% when it detonates.
  • Courageous Return: This trait has been reworked and it has been renamed to "Stalwart Courage". It grants the guardian Protection for 3 seconds whenever aegis on the guardian is removed due to blocking an attack.

Is there going to be an Internal cooldown for this new Courageous Return trait ? I see this is going to be an issue since Firebrands can put out constant aegis and thus having perma protection uptime. It should probably have a 12 second cooldown which pretty much goes in line with Guard counter trait of spellbreaker since full counter has a 12 sec cooldown.

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@"noiwk.2760" said:Terrifying Descent: This trait has been reworked. It has been renamed to "Insidious Disruption". It now causes control effects to inflict torment on foes.

does that mean that even soft controls like blind/slow/cripple / weakness will also cause Torment ?

if so this could be quite poweful ! remember Scourge got more torment damage and also burning when you cause torment .!

Nope, it's only on hard CC. Knowing ANet it could even end up either only affect fear or only affecting pure hard CC (WH#4, GS#5, spectral grasp, RS#5). They probably worded it poorly and meant "disabling" effect instead or the wide crowd control effects.

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guess i cant jump onto enemies anymore and watch them fly away :( feelsbadmanif they are so "useless" anyways, just leave them on for those ppl who actually use themthey do give a good advantage in wvw roaming over ppl who dont have themwe all know you wont touch those traits anytime soon, so no reason to mess with it, until you actually know what else you gonna give for it.if you just remove it now it feels like we just lose something cool for nothing

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While I agree these traits are niche, they are usefull at times as others already stated.I really do appreciate falling damage trait when doing a JP or fighting on height with a moderate chance to fall off.Additionally, I really like some falling effect like warrior knock back. It can be very strong in some situations.I understand it is not commonly used. What if these falling damage reduction and/or effect be merged with their corresponding minor adept trait?That effect would be restricted to falling damage and not heal as it might be the case today.

It could lead to OP minor adept, but at least, falling damage reduction alone could be enough.

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@Dadnir.5038 said:

@"noiwk.2760" said:Terrifying Descent: This trait has been reworked. It has been renamed to "Insidious Disruption". It now causes control effects to inflict torment on foes.

does that mean that even soft controls like blind/slow/cripple / weakness will also cause Torment ?

if so this could be quite poweful ! remember Scourge got more torment damage and also burning when you cause torment .!

Nope, it's only on hard CC. Knowing ANet it could even end up either only affect fear or only affecting pure hard CC (WH#4, GS#5, spectral grasp, RS#5). They probably worded it poorly and meant "disabling" effect instead or the wide crowd control effects.

if its hard cc then it sucks and not worth.. but they clearly say control effects .. ? i guess we gotta wait and see.. i start disliking this game to be honest . or not disliking but turned down by it patch after patch.. they keep making only handful of builds worth playing and its just not fun anymore.. i hate to see gurdian which is super broken and most op class in every game mode only gettig buffed and necro which literally sucks in every game mode only getting nerfed with every patch.. warrior support does mode damage than a full DPS necro.. i find it retarded. support ele ... offers basically nothing at all but good healing (which is already meh in the current game state) and they nerf it .. idk how they figure out these changes really.. but i can say if its only hard cc ima just literally delete my Scourge.. not just undress it but delete it so it wont appear on their data .. and i suggest all necro players do the same

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Please do not remove the fall damage aspect. these traits are fine you can just remove revive speed and leave everything else alone.just stop dont do this you are hurting small scale in wvw even more with these awful changeswe dont need more revive buffs for all classes when some dont have any or theirs is just bad in comparison

Fall damage reduction traits matter!

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@Robert Gee.9246 said:At this point we felt it just makes more sense to remove the fall damage portion, which leaves some design space if we want to buff these traits in the future.

If you're going to remove those portions of the traits, then why not buff them now to compensate? I understand that fall damage reduction was niche, but there were some instances in which it was really useful. Removing them without otherwise buffing the traits they were attached to is still a straight up nerf.

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This affects one raid instance, too. In Twisted Castle, there's a strategy that involves a Mesmer taking Descent Into Madness and jumping off a ledge by a doorway and onto the top of a staircase, and then portaling the squad to the Mesmer's location, while the Mesmer looks at the statues to keep them from chasing people, and Focus 4's them into a safe location. This allows the squad to hit all the remaining buttons off the main pathway, allowing everyone to resume taking the normal path.

Removing Falling damage doesn't make this strategy impossible, but it certainly makes it much more difficult. Now, instead of trying to jump for the staircase, the Mesmer will be asked to jump to the top of the archway on top of the staircase for portal, since that's just enough distance to not be lethal. That job will be harder.

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Count me in as disappointed in losing fall damage reduction as well. Sure it might not be a go-to trait, but it has it's uses when doing various things. Jumping puzzles and WvW being the major ones.It's cool that you're optimising the traits for future updates, but I feel like the damage reduction should still be available somehow. Possibly as a mastery?

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Does this mean we will be getting the ability to use gliding and mounts in all areas of the game, including instances? There are still uses for such traits and as is currently people have to make a choice to use these traits instead of receiving another benefit.

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I don't see why people complain about the removal of fall damage traits. If you can't do a jumping puzzle without, you dont deserve to finish that. As simple as it is. Also who wants passive skill activation for example in WvW. Just start playing the game properly and stop complaining about things that require no active skill usage, you can easily fix that issue by using your brain while you play :)

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@Dreggon.6598 said:Could you move the fall damage reduction onto some of the minor traits instead? Sometimes - in PvE at least - I really, really need fall damage reduction. Usually when I'm doing a jumping puzzle that doesn't allow gliders, or I have some distance to fall but it's a biiiit further than I'd survive otherwise.

I like the Signet of Undeath change a lot. Hopefully you can also look at Signet of Spite sometime - a power signet that applies a bunch of damaging conditions doesn't make a lot of sense.

Courageous Return definitely needs a PvP/WvW split.

Get position rewinder you can use it while you're falling.

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@Robert Gee.9246Please reconsider that health cost for signet of undeath.Im not against the idea just that cost is way to too much for only 1 target revival unless this thing bings back a fully defeated player lol.

Increasing the passive was a good choice for all forums of necromancer ?but 50% of base hp to save 1 person is not worth it in my opinion. Even if i want to play a support form of necromancer ill take my chances with transfusion + f before this thats far more risk than reward its not in anyway balanced in weight which is often the case with a a lot of necromancer things (looking at you Unholy Martyr and Trait boosted Plague signet).

I would much rather suffer a higher cd for less health cost on active 20% maybe even 25% but 50% is far too much.Or why not have it consume life force considering the signets passive is all about generating life force.?

Overall the direction for this is not bad but can we get the cost for the caster balanced a bit better to the reward.

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