Trypophobia Awareness and Kormir's Library

[Teratus.2859]

I have thalassophobia but that doesn't put me off underwater content.. i'm actually quite a fan of it because the discomfort I feel in games with deep dark water that limits my view adds to the experience.

I very much can't wait for Gw2 to finally get maps based in the Ocean.

I know it's not the same thing but sometimes a phobia can be a positive thing in games, guess i'm living proof of that.

[Tommo Chocolate.5870]

@Tyncale.1629 said:Tip: do not google the Surinam toad.

So obviously the first thing I did when I read this was google it...

@Hannelore.8153 said:ArenaNet is pretty good about phobias,

Genuine question: what has ArenaNet done in the game to accommodate phobias? As a person without any (that I know of), I'm really curious.

other companies like Blizzard just ignore them, like the Swarm Host from SC2 (don't Google it if you have this). I guess the difference is, in the audience size and how cheap it is to lose some players.

The Swarm Host is a fantastic design, but I'm not sure what you'd expect them to do about it affecting people with phobias. Offer an alternative skin I suppose, but how could they do that without compromising the design?

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

@"Hevoskuuri.3891" said:I'm usually very sympathetic to psychological... issues? such as phobias, but I feel that the people suffering from them have to understand that they are a minority. And people with super-specific rare phobias are a very, very small minority.

This is not only wrong, but completely uninformed. In fact phobias are very common, almost every person has at least one if not more, its just the way society treats them mean that most people go undiagnosed due to being told to "just get over it" etc.

Some people spend their entire time growing up being conditioned to repress their phobias by their families.

And this affects more than phobias; many instances of where people are "in a minority" have been theorised to affect far larger populations than is being projected, because that projection is controlled, for example keeping a company from "looking bad" by not hiring disabled people. Just having exposure to the possibility of mental and physical health issues has increased treatment & awareness significantly.

We live in an era where people have confused lack of education and exposure & the resulting repression as proof of good health.

[reapex.8546]

@Ayakaru.6583 said:

@Hannelore.8153 said:ArenaNet is pretty good about phobias, other companies like Blizzard just ignore them, like the Swarm Host from SC2 (don't Google it if you have this). I guess theGW2 is already very fobia friendly.Sometimes a little too much even soncr it was a leading argument against the spider mount. Even though there are obligatory spider bosses in the game alreadyThe thing with the spider mount is that unlike NPCs they are not player controlled. Having spider mount be available means, you'll see them all the time cities, races, lobbies and more. Being surrounded by player controlled spiders could cause massive freakouts in people. So, I feel Anet decision not to include a spider mount was a good one. They stuck to creatures that many people consider safe or develop new fantasy ones.

@"Hevoskuuri.3891" said:I don't mean to be rude by any means, but this seems to me like special snowflake behavior. The problem here is not on Arenanet's end, but rather the player's in question. Thus I feel like it's up to them to deal with it.First, using the term "special snowflake" is considered to be rude. There isn't nothing "nice" about calling another person a "special snowflake" for having a phobia.Second, no one told ArenaNet to "deal with it." When it comes to having the individual "deal with it" that solution you gave is what the person is already doing. In 2017, I had no idea I had a Trypophobia. I've been Guild Wars 2 since, 2012 and nothing in the game gave me the intense reaction that I had in that instance doing achievements. I did not know why my heart racing or why my body was shaking or why I was feeling nauseated . I never questioned that it was just from a simple wall texture in the distance that my eye picked up.

So, what did I do? I dealt with it

. I walked away, came back still sick. Stopped playing for a day, came back and still the same symptoms. I didn't know what was going on, so I just looked at the ground texture and felt better. If you read my original post it cites my reaction was minor compared to other people that had Trypophobia. So, I made an awareness post for those that have a more extreme case.

I DID NOT

ask for ArenaNet to change things it was awareness post that Trypophobia does exist and if anyone, else was experiencing the same they would know what's going on and not to have to deal with a sudden unknown phobia they didn't know existed.

If Arenanet starts removing holes from the gameYou really don't understand what Trypophobia is, I encourage you to do your own research or read my original post. There are plenty of holes in GW2 that do not activate Trypophobia. I wouldn't haven't play for 7 years, if Trypophobia affected every single hole in the game. Also, I wasn't even talking about holes. That wall pattern isn't a hole. I"m not even sure you read my original post now lol.

[reapex.8546]

@Hevoskuuri.3891 said:

@AgentMoore.9453 said:

@Hevoskuuri.3891 said:I'm usually very sympathetic to psychological... issues? such as phobias, but I feel that the

people suffering from them have to understand that they are a minority

.

They do. Telling them this is not helpful and implies that because not 'enough' people feel the same way, their fears and discomfort are not valid.

I never meant to imply that anyone's fears or discomfort aren't valid or acceptable. It just so happens that I personally know people with different kinds of phobias, and most of them accept their situation and deal with it gracefully.Gracefully is subjective to you, what you feel is graceful others may feel differently.

Now, as to my above post as a whole, I did not realize that OP was not in fact asking/demanding for anything at all to be changed or removed within the game. Despite reading their post twice, I still somehow got the impression they were asking for Arenanet to step in, instead of just raising awareness. This was a brainfart on my part, no excuses. I stand corrected, and deeply apologize.Thank you, however before giving psychological advice I would encourage you to learn more about a condition. You assumed I was talking about ArenaNet removing

holes

in the game. The wall texture in Kormir's Sanctuary has no holes. Also, giving people the generic advice of

deal with it

does not apply in all situations. Like the example, I listed in my previous post. It's hard to deal with something that you don't know what is going on but people still deal with their phobias the best they can.

To assume, they're not dealing with it just wrong imo.

[reapex.8546]

@AgentMoore.9453 said:

@Hevoskuuri.3891 said:I'm usually very sympathetic to psychological... issues? such as phobias, but I feel that the

people suffering from them have to understand that they are a minority

.

They do. Telling them this is not helpful and implies that because not 'enough' people feel the same way, their fears and discomfort are not valid.

@Hevoskuuri.3891 said:I don't mean to be rude by any means, but this seems to me like special snowflake behavior.

It's rude. It's also not something the OP was doing. No one is asking for things to be removed from the game.

To anyone who has gotten this far in the thread, here's a refresher:

• OP has Trypophobia (fear/disgust triggered by closely-grouped holes) and is spreading awareness to try and help other players manage the problem so they can enjoy the game with minimal discomfort
• Triggers for this condition can be found in Kormir's Library (and other places in the game)
• Users have suggested enlisting the help of friends to complete the content, averting their gaze, and other methods for dealing with this condition
• Several posters have also posted techniques for dealing with other phobias and conditions
• No one has requested changes to the game or removal of content

Thank you.

[reapex.8546]

@Teratus.2859 said:I have thalassophobia but that doesn't put me off underwater content.. i'm actually quite a fan of it because the discomfort I feel in games with deep dark water that limits my view adds to the experience.

I very much can't wait for Gw2 to finally get maps based in the Ocean.

I know it's not the same thing but sometimes a phobia can be a positive thing in games, guess i'm living proof of that.

That's awesome you don't get anxiety and more from doing underwater content in game :D.

@Tommo Chocolate.5870 said:

@Hannelore.8153 said:ArenaNet is pretty good about phobias,

Genuine question: what has ArenaNet done in the game to accommodate phobias? As a person without any (that I know of), I'm really curious.One thing is the elimination of the Spider Mount.

[reapex.8546]

@Hannelore.8153 said:

@"Hevoskuuri.3891" said:I'm usually very sympathetic to psychological... issues? such as phobias, but I feel that the people suffering from them have to understand that they are a minority. And people with super-specific rare phobias are a very, very small minority.

This is not only wrong, but completely uninformed. In fact phobias are very common, almost every person has at least one if not more, its just the way society treats them mean that most people go undiagnosed due to being told to "just get over it" etc.

Some people spend their entire time growing up being conditioned to repress their phobias by their families.We live in an era where people have confused lack of education and exposure & the resulting repression as proof of good health.

Thank you for this insightful and well informed post.

[sevenDEADLY.5281]

@"reapex.8546" said:One thing is the elimination of the Spider Mount.

And that right there is exactly the problem. They eliminated a mount that the VAST majority of people would have found fun and entertaining to cater to an incredibly small minority. If they did this with every existing phobia we would be playing a game where two dots bump into each other for combat. Except then people with a fear of dots would "live in fear", instead of just not playing the game. Phobias are real, but they are 100% an individual problem. As someone else already pointed out, should we remove all bodies of water from the game because thalassophobia is a thing? Should we remove all cats and dogs from the game because gatophobia and cynophobia are a thing? Or should people just realize that phobias are a problem in which only the individual has control over. It is not everyone else on earth's problem that someone is afraid of water, or dogs, or cats, or spiders, or heights, or random holes in a wall. The world does not revolve around the individual.

I have an irrational fear of heights, but I don't demand the world change to cater to my individual needs. This is all fun and games when you demand to have things change the way YOU want, but what when the next person rolls along with a fear you don't have and the only answer is to remove something from the game that you and the majority of people fully enjoy. Now they start taking away the things you like because person X doesn't like it, then person Y comes along and says "I'm afraid of Z" so now Z has to be changed and more and more people get things taken away until nothing exists at all. Its very easy to understand why it is 100% impossible to cater to the minority.

[Hevoskuuri.3891]

@"reapex.8546" said:Thank you, however before giving psychological advice I would encourage you to learn more about a condition. You assumed I was talking about ArenaNet removing holes in the game. The wall texture in Kormir's Sanctuary has no holes. Also, giving people the generic advice of deal with it does not apply in all situations. Like the example, I listed in my previous post. It's hard to deal with something that you don't know what is going on but people still deal with their phobias the best they can. To assume, they're not dealing with it just wrong imo.

Thank you for enlightening me on this subject. I think I understand more about phobias and the struggles that phobics go through now.

As I said before, I know people with phobias, but closely know even more people with severe mental conditions such as difficult anxiety disorders and depression that they have struggled with their entire lives. I guess in my mind I compared these to phobias and came out belittling and dismissing phobias as something stupid and irrational that one could "deal with" if one really wanted to, instead of accepting them as real problems.

Again, I apologise for my rude and misinformed post, and thank you again for educating me on the subject. I wish you all the best and hope your condition gets easier as time passes.

[AgentMoore.9453]

@Hevoskuuri.3891 said:Again, I apologise for my rude and misinformed post, and thank you again for educating me on the subject.

Honestly, very refreshing to see you say this. It's important to be open to learning, and you've demonstrated that very well here. The burden and care of things like phobias, disorders, and illnesses doesn't just lie with one person or company. Both the sufferers and the people around them can improve the situation with clear communication and an interest in learning new stuff.

That goes both ways: If a community is open to learning about a condition they might not have, then the victims should also be open to learning about possible solutions that don't alter the game.

Even if this thread is just a flash in the pan and it fades off the first page in a day or two, it was a very bright and pretty flash indeed.

Thank you for the dialogue.

[Mewcifer.5198]

@Hannelore.8153 said:

@"Hevoskuuri.3891" said:I'm usually very sympathetic to psychological... issues? such as phobias, but I feel that the people suffering from them have to understand that they are a minority. And people with super-specific rare phobias are a very, very small minority.

This is not only wrong, but completely uninformed. In fact phobias are very common, almost every person has at least one if not more, its just the way society treats them mean that most people go undiagnosed due to being told to "just get over it" etc.

Some people spend their entire time growing up being conditioned to repress their phobias by their families.

And this affects more than phobias; many instances of where people are "in a minority" have been theorised to affect far larger populations than is being projected, because that projection is controlled, for example keeping a company from "looking bad" by not hiring disabled people. Just having exposure to the possibility of mental and physical health issues has increased treatment & awareness significantly.

We live in an era where people have confused lack of education and exposure & the resulting repression as proof of good health.

Everyone having a slight phobia is not the same as everyone having the same phobia. According to the National Institute of Mental Health only 10% of people have a phobia. Personally, I think a lot of people misuse the term phobia and use it when they just mean something that makes them uncomfortable.

[Yannir.4132]

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:I have problems with viewing vistas. The camera movement when showing the scenery makes me really nauseated. I just close my eyes before I start the view and count to 10.

The game can’t remove everything that bothers everyone. If you can look away then that’s the best course of action.

You do know you can just press Esc during the camera panning to skip to the end?

[Teratus.2859]

@reapex.8546 said:

@Teratus.2859 said:I have thalassophobia but that doesn't put me off underwater content.. i'm actually quite a fan of it because the discomfort I feel in games with deep dark water that limits my view adds to the experience.

I very much can't wait for Gw2 to finally get maps based in the Ocean.

I know it's not the same thing but sometimes a phobia can be a positive thing in games, guess i'm living proof of that.

That's awesome you don't get anxiety and more from doing underwater content in game :D.

Oh I do, it just adds to the experience for me and makes it feel more like an accomplishment if I can push myself through it XDI guess you could think of it similar to the enjoyment people get from playing horror games or watching horror movies that make them freak out and panic.

My first experiences with Subnautica for example were hilarious, It took me ages to work up the nerve to leave the safe shallows lmfaoIt's really funny to me looking back on it now that i'm so familiar with the game and can play it without any anxiety.The Sequel/DLC though that's all new and still being worked on ;) so I play that one like a total wimp for now lmao!!

[Tekoneiric.6817]

I'm sure a lot of people have their own issues. The developers can't plan for every issue that people have. One of my biggest issues in the game is the slow down from them still using DirectX 9 code that very single core processor driven. When the frame rate gets to low for a long period of time I get massive headaches. I've passed out for a moment when low frame rates combine with all the flashing effects from weapon effects and legendary gear. I'd think that would be more common but they still haven't fixed it.

[reapex.8546]

@sevenDEADLY.5281 said:

@"reapex.8546" said:One thing is the elimination of the Spider Mount.

And that right there is exactly the problem. They eliminated a mount that the VAST majority of people would have found fun and entertaining to cater to an incredibly small minority.You and I don't work for ArenaNet, we don't speak for ArenaNet. So, you can say "that right there is the problem" but it doesn't it fact. It's your opinion.

I have an irrational fear of heights, but I don't demand the world change to cater to my individual needs.

No one in this thread demanded the world change to cater to your needs or anyone else needs. No one demanded ArenaNet to remove the spider mount either, it was discovered in old game dat files. ArenaNet makes their choices on what they want to do. No one is forcing them or the world to cater to their individual needs.

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

@Tekoneiric.6817 said:I'm sure a lot of people have their own issues. The developers can't plan for every issue that people have. One of my biggest issues in the game is the slow down from them still using DirectX 9 code that very single core processor driven. When the frame rate gets to low for a long period of time I get massive headaches. I've passed out for a moment when low frame rates combine with all the flashing effects from weapon effects and legendary gear. I'd think that would be more common but they still haven't fixed it.

Rewriting an entire game engine to use a new graphics API isn't exactly the same as fixing minor issues, love.

[reapex.8546]

@Hevoskuuri.3891 said:

@reapex.8546 said:Thank you, however before giving psychological advice I would encourage you to learn more about a condition. You assumed I was talking about ArenaNet removing

holes

in the game. The wall texture in Kormir's Sanctuary has no holes. Also, giving people the generic advice of

deal with it

does not apply in all situations. Like the example, I listed in my previous post. It's hard to deal with something that you don't know what is going on but people still deal with their phobias the best they can.

To assume, they're not dealing with it just wrong imo.

Thank you for enlightening me on this subject. I think I understand more about phobias and the struggles that phobics go through now.

As I said before, I know people with phobias, but closely know even more people with severe mental conditions such as difficult anxiety disorders and depression that they have struggled with their entire lives. I guess in my mind I compared these to phobias and came out belittling and dismissing phobias as something stupid and irrational that one could "deal with" if one really wanted to, instead of accepting them as real problems.

Again, I apologise for my rude and misinformed post, and thank you again for educating me on the subject. I wish you all the best and hope your condition gets easier as time passes.

@Hevoskuuri.3891 said:

@reapex.8546 said:Thank you, however before giving psychological advice I would encourage you to learn more about a condition. You assumed I was talking about ArenaNet removing

holes

in the game. The wall texture in Kormir's Sanctuary has no holes. Also, giving people the generic advice of

deal with it

does not apply in all situations. Like the example, I listed in my previous post. It's hard to deal with something that you don't know what is going on but people still deal with their phobias the best they can.

To assume, they're not dealing with it just wrong imo.

Thank you for enlightening me on this subject. I think I understand more about phobias and the struggles that phobics go through now.

As I said before, I know people with phobias, but closely know even more people with severe mental conditions such as difficult anxiety disorders and depression that they have struggled with their entire lives. I guess in my mind I compared these to phobias and came out belittling and dismissing phobias as something stupid and irrational that one could "deal with" if one really wanted to, instead of accepting them as real problems.

Again, I apologise for my rude and misinformed post, and thank you again for educating me on the subject. I wish you all the best and hope your condition gets easier as time passes.

Thank you, I now know what it is I can deal with it easier than in 2017. Instead of having an anxiety attack, like I did several years ago for not knowing what was going on with me.

@Teratus.2859 said:

@reapex.8546 said:

@Teratus.2859 said:I have thalassophobia but that doesn't put me off underwater content.. i'm actually quite a fan of it because the discomfort I feel in games with deep dark water that limits my view adds to the experience.

I very much can't wait for Gw2 to finally get maps based in the Ocean.

I know it's not the same thing but sometimes a phobia can be a positive thing in games, guess i'm living proof of that.

That's awesome you don't get anxiety and more from doing underwater content in game :D.

Oh I do, it just adds to the experience for me and makes it feel more like an accomplishment if I can push myself through it XDI guess you could think of it similar to the enjoyment people get from playing horror games or watching horror movies that make them freak out and panic.

Ah my mistake, still congrats to pushing yourself through it :D.

[reapex.8546]

@Tekoneiric.6817 said:I'm sure a lot of people have their own issues. The developers can't plan for every issue that people have. One of my biggest issues in the game is the slow down from them still using DirectX 9 code that very single core processor driven. When the frame rate gets to low for a long period of time I get massive headaches. I've passed out for a moment when low frame rates combine with all the flashing effects from weapon effects and legendary gear. I'd think that would be more common but they still haven't fixed it.

In game options, you can try lower your game settings to best performance. To keep your frame rate up. I'm sorry, you wound up passing out due to low frame rate and gained massive headaches. I didn't know that low framerate could cause that individuals. Thank you for informing us.

[Tekoneiric.6817]

@reapex.8546 said:

@"Tekoneiric.6817" said:I'm sure a lot of people have their own issues. The developers can't plan for every issue that people have. One of my biggest issues in the game is the slow down from them still using DirectX 9 code that very single core processor driven. When the frame rate gets to low for a long period of time I get massive headaches. I've passed out for a moment when low frame rates combine with all the flashing effects from weapon effects and legendary gear. I'd think that would be more common but they still haven't fixed it.

In game options, you can try lower your game settings to best performance. To keep your frame rate up. I'm sorry, you wound up passing out due to low frame rate and gained massive headaches. I didn't know that low framerate could cause that individuals. Thank you for informing us.

There was a famous incident in Japan decades ago where a cartoon flashing red triggered seizures, caused vomiting and people to pass out. It affected around 700 people across Japan at the same time. Limiting those types of effects in things like games, TV shows, etc is something the creators need to be aware of.

https://nytimes.com/1997/12/18/world/tv-cartoon-s-flashes-send-700-japanese-into-seizures.html

[nosleepdemon.1368]

Holes? That was what bothered you about that instance OP? Good Lord. I was triggered by the freaking stairs that SPIRAL INTO THE WALL, and the invisible walls everywhere, and by just how awful a character Kasmir is, and by how pointless talking to Komir was, and by just hos generally bland the story is.

The sandy bit with the puzzle was neat though.

[Eloc Freidon.5692]

@reapex.8546 said:Slightly off topic, I wonder what causes this condition? What evolutionary development made humans fear/get irritated by this type of thing?

Pests and disease.

[reapex.8546]

@Tekoneiric.6817 said:

@reapex.8546 said:

@Tekoneiric.6817 said:I'm sure a lot of people have their own issues. The developers can't plan for every issue that people have. One of my biggest issues in the game is the slow down from them still using DirectX 9 code that very single core processor driven. When the frame rate gets to low for a long period of time I get massive headaches. I've passed out for a moment when low frame rates combine with all the flashing effects from weapon effects and legendary gear. I'd think that would be more common but they still haven't fixed it.

In game options, you can try lower your game settings to best performance. To keep your frame rate up. I'm sorry, you wound up passing out due to low frame rate and gained massive headaches. I didn't know that low framerate could cause that individuals. Thank you for informing us.

There was a famous incident in Japan decades ago where a cartoon flashing red triggered seizures, caused vomiting and people to pass out. It affected around 700 people across Japan at the same time. Limiting those types of effects in things like games, TV shows, etc is something the creators need to be aware of.

https://nytimes.com/1997/12/18/world/tv-cartoon-s-flashes-send-700-japanese-into-seizures.html

Yeah there was a Pokemon episode that did that. It was edited for American audiences and slowed the flashing effect of the enemy's Gengar's attack down. But flashes wasn't related to slow fps. It was due to high number of flashes per second.

[reapex.8546]

@"nosleepdemon.1368" said:Holes? That was what bothered you about that instance OP? Good Lord. I was triggered by the freaking stairs that SPIRAL INTO THE WALL, and the invisible walls everywhere, and by just how awful a character Kasmir is, and by how pointless talking to Komir was, and by just hos generally bland the story is.

The sandy bit with the puzzle was neat though.

I don't think you what "trigger" or what a phobia means. Your use of "trigger" is not liking something. I don't hate the wall pattern, I think it looks cool. Despite my body being "triggered" by it.

[Tekoneiric.6817]

@reapex.8546 said:

Yeah there was a Pokemon episode that did that. It was edited for American audiences and slowed the flashing effect of the enemy's Gengar's attack down. But flashes wasn't related to slow fps. It was due to high number of flashes per second.

Which I mentioned. Flashing happens a lot on GW2 when players do open world boss fights. The flashing combined with the low FPS in the game can cause headaches, zone out episodes, momentary blackouts, etc. A thing they could be do is reduce the visual effects automatically when a lot of players group together in fights sort of how mini pets are disabled when there are to many players.