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PvP thread: Life Blast range


Huskyboy.1053

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Call me crazy, but it seems like Life Blast is one of the least useful skills in the core necro kit. Condi necro doesn't get value out of it and power necro can't afford to just sit in shroud and spam it, as you have no utilities in shroud and as necro you get focused.

Since core power necro is fun but relatively unviable, one nice thing to do would be to extend the range to 1500. This is hardly a game-breaking change, but it would allow power necro to snipe from a safe position. As the skill does upward of 4k damage per hit with high levels of might, it's a good option for damage, but right now the fact that you're vulnerable precludes any realistic chance of using it. Increasing the base power damage and scaling of Dark Path would also be helpful.

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Wouldnt change a thing.

Youll get hunted and die cz only low tier players fight glued to node circles.Youll start the match and most respawns with 0 lifeforce so youll need to fight normally.Theres a too much sustain, block, evades, projectile hate and map obstacles to make projectiles good. Till 2015 melee was 100 and 900 was ranged, and melee was at huge risk of getting 100-0 kited on 1 ledge. Nowadays most melee things do their burst in 600 ranged evade frames, with up to 2000 range of ports, leaps and CC resistance to fully prevent kiting.

Kiting today means running away faster than they can chase.

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Personnally, I'd be fine with life blast just doing splash damage instead of piercing through foes. Only having piercing ranged abilities on the necromancer have always been what irked me the most, and since ANet seem to be in love with the ugly floating hand of staff auto, I'd root for life blast doing the splash damage.

When I play core, I usually don't mind the death shroud skills range. The Death shroud is mostly used in melee range anyway and there is no inbuilt tools to kite with it.

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This skill is the main reason why power core necro is trash. It's too clunky. Just core condi necro is viable because it doesn't need it.

I don't care what anet does with that skill. The only task is to make it less clunky.

Btw.: the underwater version (plague blast) deals less damage (multiplyer: 1.4 -> 1.0) but has only a 0,5 second cast time and transfers a condition on hit. The skill feels like living in a different (much better) world.

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@Sigmoid.7082 said:It doesn't need more range just a slightly faster cast time. Compensate by lowering the damage slightly.

Removing the need to face your target would be huge QOL but it's something that never will happen.

I like that idea, I hadn't thought about that. I think that reducing the casting time would make it too abuseable tbh but that's just me. The skill isn't as bad as some people are saying in regard to power builds, but it's just UP enough that core power is clearly not viable.

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@Huskyboy.1053 said:

@Sigmoid.7082 said:It doesn't need more range just a slightly faster cast time. Compensate by lowering the damage slightly.

Removing the need to face your target would be huge QOL but it's something that never will happen.

I like that idea, I hadn't thought about that. I think that reducing the casting time would make it too abuseable tbh but that's just me. The skill isn't as bad as some people are saying in regard to power builds, but it's
just
UP enough that core power is clearly not viable.

IMO, core Necro is in a very good place. It can work as power, condi or hybrid and all of them are strong enough to compete with meta builds. Yes, there are numerous builds that also give it trouble and it suffers the usual Necro weaknesses, but I think in general, it's doing quite well.

I'd be okay with small adjustments here and there but this is one of those things I wouldn't want. I feel it could put it in the spot light for nerfs because historically, when any profession is in a good place and gets a buff that's a tiny bit too strong, it takes ten steps back with nerfs the following patch.

This is mostly paranoia, but I do genuinely feel core is very good right now. At least in WvW roaming, I'm capable of 1v1'ing pretty much anything with full berserker gear, hybrid Cele/Grieving or full condi Dire/Trailblazer. Some things are a little harder than others, but for the most part I feel no where near as weak as I did shortly after Pof release. At that time, it felt almost impossible to beat anything regardless of patience or skill. Now, core has been brought up to a decent level while everything around it continues to get brought down, and it feels a lot more capable of having the upper hand.

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@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:

IMO, core Necro is in a very good place. It can work as power, condi or hybrid and all of them are strong enough to compete with meta builds. Yes, there are numerous builds that also give it trouble and it suffers the usual Necro weaknesses, but I think in general, it's doing quite well.

I'd be okay with small adjustments here and there but this is one of those things I wouldn't want. I feel it could put it in the spot light for nerfs because historically, when any profession is in a good place and gets a buff that's a tiny bit too strong, it takes ten steps back with nerfs the following patch.

This is mostly paranoia, but I do genuinely feel core is very good right now. At least in WvW roaming, I'm capable of 1v1'ing pretty much anything with full berserker gear, hybrid Cele/Grieving or full condi Dire/Trailblazer. Some things are a little harder than others, but for the most part I feel no where near as weak as I did shortly after Pof release. At that time, it felt almost impossible to beat anything regardless of patience or skill. Now, core has been brought up to a decent level while everything around it continues to get brought down, and it feels a lot more capable of having the upper hand.

WvW necro. In PvE it's bottom of all damage charts, among core dps profession builds, and in sPvP the stab shortage is still a royal pain vs meta builds and cc spam.

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@ZeftheWicked.3076 said:

@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:

IMO, core Necro is in a very good place. It can work as power, condi or hybrid and all of them are strong enough to compete with meta builds. Yes, there are numerous builds that also give it trouble and it suffers the usual Necro weaknesses, but I think in general, it's doing quite well.

I'd be okay with small adjustments here and there but this is one of those things I wouldn't want. I feel it could put it in the spot light for nerfs because historically, when any profession is in a good place and gets a buff that's a
tiny bit
too strong, it takes ten steps back with nerfs the following patch.

This is mostly paranoia, but I do genuinely feel core is very good right now. At least in WvW roaming, I'm capable of 1v1'ing pretty much anything with full berserker gear, hybrid Cele/Grieving or full condi Dire/Trailblazer. Some things are a little harder than others, but for the most part I feel no where near as weak as I did shortly after Pof release. At that time, it felt almost impossible to beat anything regardless of patience or skill. Now, core has been brought up to a decent level while everything around it continues to get brought down, and it feels a lot more capable of having the upper hand.

WvW necro
. In PvE it's bottom of all damage charts, among core dps profession builds, and in sPvP the stab shortage is still a royal pain vs meta builds and cc spam.

In PvE yes, I think it could definitely use a boost. In PvP, it's in a similar spot to WvW - it's all about position.

I'm not saying Necro doesn't need some buffs here and there, just that I think it's doing quite well in PvP/WvW. It has always been a punishing class that doesn't reward facerolling your keyboard ( with some exceptions; such as Minion Master back when it was good, Chill Reaper at HoT release, etc. ). But if you know how to force people to come to you by abusing terrain and your zoning strengths ( AOE's ) it becomes a lot more apparent how strong it can be even against meta builds. It can't face tank and it struggles to 1v1 on an open field but that doesn't mean it can't win fights, it just needs to kite.

I don't think increasing the range of Life Blast would help with this but I do think a slight boost would help. A small reduction in cast time, some kind of additional effect that benefits condition builds, or something like that. While a range increase would be nice, I think it might make builds like Dreadmancer a little obnoxious. I frequently play zerk Necro with Dread and Fear Of Death and while a target is Feared, I can spank people for 10 - 15k Life Blasts every single hit as long as they're Feared while I'm doing it. And even when they're not, Life Blast does some nasty damage.

Maybe I'm being a little opinionated, and I apologize if so. But again, I just don't want Necro to get too much love for fear of seeing it getting swiftly kneecapped. I'd rather it be roughly balanced, if slightly underpowered, than briefly overpowered, nerfed too hard, and never fixed.

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@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:

@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:

IMO, core Necro is in a very good place. It can work as power, condi or hybrid and all of them are strong enough to compete with meta builds. Yes, there are numerous builds that also give it trouble and it suffers the usual Necro weaknesses, but I think in general, it's doing quite well.

I'd be okay with small adjustments here and there but this is one of those things I wouldn't want. I feel it could put it in the spot light for nerfs because historically, when any profession is in a good place and gets a buff that's a
tiny bit
too strong, it takes ten steps back with nerfs the following patch.

This is mostly paranoia, but I do genuinely feel core is very good right now. At least in WvW roaming, I'm capable of 1v1'ing pretty much anything with full berserker gear, hybrid Cele/Grieving or full condi Dire/Trailblazer. Some things are a little harder than others, but for the most part I feel no where near as weak as I did shortly after Pof release. At that time, it felt almost impossible to beat anything regardless of patience or skill. Now, core has been brought up to a decent level while everything around it continues to get brought down, and it feels a lot more capable of having the upper hand.

WvW necro
. In PvE it's bottom of all damage charts, among core dps profession builds, and in sPvP the stab shortage is still a royal pain vs meta builds and cc spam.

In PvE yes, I think it could definitely use a boost.It won't get one because everyting could be abused by reaper and scourge.

Buff dagger? - Power reapers will use it over GS, which would be a huge upgrade, because dagger is fast and has decent utility. Even power scourges would deal more damage with dagger than core because they have additional damage on the shade skills.

Buff shroud? - The auto is ranged and should not deal more damage. Skill 4 is aoe and has also no room for more damage (and one single skill on a high cooldown won't increase dps significantly).

Necro is a design fail because the elite specs are direct upgrades in terms of damage (only damage! - not utiliy, for the latter the specs have tradeoffs).Reaper: all that core has but much more damage with the elite weapon and shroud which is melee and so allows to deal more damage.Scourge: all that core has, but much more damage through shade striking on every shade skill.

Core can only be saved with massive skill splitting between the specs, which is something anet doesn't want to do. They just boosted core survivability instead. It's now the most durable necro spec, but with poor damage.

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@KrHome.1920 said:Core can only be saved with massive skill splitting between the specs, which is something anet doesn't want to do. They just boosted core survivability instead. It's now the most durable necro spec, but with poor damage.

This is what happen when you bandaid fix seven year in a row instead of acknowledging and resolving the true issues.

  • That said, replacing the piercing effect of life blast by a splashing effect would help a bit in PvP without making core necro OP.
  • Reducing cast time and damage of life blast is a bit more dangerous because it increase the potential of the associated traits. (removing those traits might be a good idea thoughts, they are a permanent threat to the balance between core and e-specs)
  • As for the range, most of the death shroud skills work better at mid range, 1200 range life blast isn't something necessary and wouldn't really improve the core necromancer's performances.
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I think life blast is pretty much fine, but core shroud as a whole is weak. I would change reapers might (spite might on auto) and unyielding blast (soul reaping vuln on auto) to work better with life blast (nerf duration a bit, increase stacks, add 1s cd). cut out life blast after cast completely. yes yes this will nerf reaper but the increased stacks should balance it out (honestly since reaper got quickness these two traits have been overperforming anyway). get rid of dark pursuit increasing dark path cd, add a blind to dark pursuit and maybe even a small daze. reduce cd of doom. maybe add boon strip to life transfer (1 boon per second). the biggest drawback to core shroud is that its impossible to create distance from your enemy without leaving shroud, this is how it should be since good range damage + tankiness shouldn't have good mobility. anything that has this should be nerfed. back in the day necro didn't need stability, but nowadays i'm thinking core nec should get some stab love. maybe put it on life transfer instead of the boon strip? idk. maybe a boon strip on the auto lol? sounds op, but hey scepter had a corrupt on auto for a while and mes sword has a boon strip on their auto. idk.

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Life Blast is good for power builds but, as HuskyBoy said, it does not benefit condition builds as much.

SuggestionSelecting Dhuumfire removes 90% of direct damage and replaces it with Burning stacks.Selecting Terror removes 90% of direct damage and replaces it with Torment stacks.Make it so Dhuumfire and Terror will not stack effects for shroud AA.

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I kinda agree but a longer range wont solve the problem for condi specs. What i would like to see is that Lifeblast gets altered based on your mainhand weapon. Some condi application when wielding a scepter, better range when wielding an axe, splash damage when wielding a staff, something like that.

The same thing for DS 4 but based on the offhand weapon and i feel like Core shroud would be in a much much better spot.

And please get rid of the horrendrous aftercast on the last hit of the dagger AA chain..

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Increasing any autoattack dmg is bad for the game in general in my opinion.

Also if the general nerf patch comes, core should be in good place, even power. If you build right, shroud 1 is also good dmg even for condi, if you take like carrion ammu. Maybe atm the damage feels too low because of all overperforming things, but in past and if they realy nerf things it should be fine.And what do you mean with core power not viable in PvP? Can you win monthly AT with it? Probably not. Can you reach ranked plat 3 with it? Def yes.For me core necro is one of the best proffesion designs in this game (with lots of depth), condi, power or hybrid.

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Life Blast gets easier to avoid as range increase. That helps justify the large amount of direct damage and allows kiting as a counter while pressure on the opponent increases as distance decreases.

It is hard to say it should be faster travel speed or faster AA rate without nerfing it. Splash damage for 2 additional large hitbox targets would help in PvE but might be problematic for PvP as it would then be an AoE needing a nerf. I do still prefer an option in traits or weapons to tune the damage between power and condi.

At one time, LB used to also heal players between it and its target but that was exceedingly difficult to position for. A trait that converts LB to a heal blast or boon blast / AoE could be another option. (e.g., if a player has more than 1200 healing, LB becomes a heal bomb when a friendly player is targeted.)

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@Anchoku.8142 said:Life Blast gets easier to avoid as range increase. That helps justify the large amount of direct damage and allows kiting as a counter while pressure on the opponent increases as distance decreases.

It is hard to say it should be faster travel speed or faster AA rate without nerfing it. Splash damage for 2 additional large hitbox targets would help in PvE but might be problematic for PvP as it would then be an AoE needing a nerf. I do still prefer an option in traits or weapons to tune the damage between power and condi.

At one time, LB used to also heal players between it and its target but that was exceedingly difficult to position for. A trait that converts LB to a heal blast or boon blast / AoE could be another option. (e.g., if a player has more than 1200 healing, LB becomes a heal bomb when a friendly player is targeted.)

Renewing Blast was a really powerful heal, as it should have been, given the extreme difficulty of use. Maybe that could replace Life From Death? Make Life Blast heal allies near your target? Not exactly relevant to the primary discussion here, but it would be cool to see that return. Also nicely fills a different niche than Vampiric Presence, as it would be the choice for a clear support Necro instead of the more general use of VP.

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