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4th Utility Skill?


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I’m sure others have talked about this before, but I’m wondering what other Revenants are currently thinking about with regards to this idea. Revenants are the only class that is locked into a set of 3 utility skills. If a 4th skill could be added to each legend, opening the room for more build versatility, what would you like to see?

Some of my thoughts (imagine for perfect numbers):

Shiro - Dark Apostasy
Your critical hits remove boons. If there are no boons, then the target is tormented.

Mallyx - Words of MadnessTarget for is dazed, tormented, and slowed. Stun instead of daze if target foe is using a skill.

Jalis - Great Dwarf’s WeaponYour weapon attacks have a chance to knock down.

Ventari - Ronan’s HarrowDrag the tablet across the ground creating a line that slows and cripples foes and gives quickness and swiftness to allies.

Glint - Move Facet of Nature to utility slot. Grant Ancient Echo to Heralds.

Kalla - No change due to her Citadel Orders.

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That would involve re-working the UI as well as being awkward to play.

For the former, I doubt Anet has the resources for, nor willing to commit them, to do this.

For the latter, what hot keys would the new utility have considering 1 through zero are taken?

How about Anet adds an additional utility skill that players can select as one of the three slotted?

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@Ayrilana.1396 said:That would involve re-working the UI as well as being awkward to play.

For the former, I doubt Anet has the resources for, nor willing to commit them, to do this.

For the latter, what hot keys would the new utility have considering 1 through zero are taken?

How about Anet adds an additional utility skill that players can select as one of the three slotted?

Pretty sure that is what OP is talking about, adding a 4th utility skill that can be interchanged with one of the 3.

Honestly I really wouldn't mind each legend having 5 or 6 utility skills to choose from. As it is now, Rev seriously lacks build diversity, mostly because each weapon and legend has a specific purpose and set skills.

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@Ayrilana.1396 said:That would involve re-working the UI as well as being awkward to play.

Would it though? You can already choose the placement of your utility skills as a Revenant. Other professions can swap in and out a multitude of skills, so I don’t think the issue is as technically impossible as might be assumed.

I like the Revenant as a profession. I think it has very intriguing gameplay and lore. But the biggest complaint I have about the profession is that since it’s inception in HoT the profession feels half complete, even rushed a bit. Other professions are far more rounded and have more control over their builds. Basically the Revenant can only pick a couple of legends and then your choices end quickly from there. I think at least adding an additional 4th utility skill could allow for more unique builds among the profession.

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@Justine.6351 said:I don't think it is necessary. Revs have 2 legends for TEN utility skills with some pretty low cooldowns.

Including the elite specializations Revenants have a total of 18 utility skills profession-wide. Other professions have a great many more skills at their disposal. Ranger for instance has instance has 28 utility skills to choose from.

I understand that utility skills are linked to legend choices. But it is already a Revenant sacrifice that they don’t get access to other skill types (Glyph, Shout, Physical, etc.). Why should there be also be a sacrifice of no choices among utility skills? It feels incomplete.

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@Drgnfly.5812 said:I’m sure others have talked about this before, but I’m wondering what other Revenants are currently thinking about with regards to this idea. Revenants are the only class that is locked into a set of 3 utility skills. If a 4th skill could be added to each legend, opening the room for more build versatility, what would you like to see?

Some of my thoughts (imagine for perfect numbers):

Ventari - Ronan’s HarrowDrag the tablet across the ground creating a line that slows and cripples foes and gives quickness and swiftness to allies.

Yes.

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I dont think it would be that dificult because if we can already swap legends and the game remembres where the skill was it could also work with one option more .That being said what i think we need is :Shiro needs a direct dmg skill , maybe 20 energyJalis maybe other way of gaining retaliation or a cc like push (we have the taunt but its mostly for pvp and a soft cc)Mallynx the option of Drgnfly is fine (direct condi and not corruptboon)Ventary maybe a buff skill (vigor ,regen and swiftness?) or a water field that also gives heal over timeHerald either a new facet with quickness or a non upkeep that deals good dmg (throwing a dragon at the enemie like rythlock does in the video?)and drgnfly option is cool tooKaltooits true it has almost everything already so i dont know what could we put there

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@"Drgnfly.5812" said:Revenants are the only class that is locked into a set of 3 utility skills.

Except for like, how Revs have access to 6 utility, 2 heals, and 2 elites at once... So technically you are "locked into TWO sets of 3 utility skills," and you can pick which sets those are. You lose a bit of build diversity vs the other classes, but you get to have in-combat access to twice the number of skills... It's a pretty fair trade off--especially when you factor in how those classes with tons of different utility skills to pick from all end up using the same 5-6 anyways cuz the rest are super-garbage.

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@narcx.3570 said:

@"Drgnfly.5812" said:Revenants are the only class that is locked into a set of 3 utility skills.

Except for like, how Revs have access to 6 utility, 2 heals, and 2 elites at once... So technically you are "locked into TWO sets of 3 utility skills," and you can pick which sets those are. You lose a bit of build diversity vs the other classes, but you get to have in-combat access to twice the number of skills... It's a pretty fair trade off--especially when you factor in how those classes with tons of different utility skills to pick from all end up using the same 5-6 anyways cuz the rest are super-garbage.

What twice number of skills? So F keys doesnt matter now? Necromancer doesnt gain 5 extra skills, guardian doesnt access 3 extra utilities called virtues etc?

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@Scoobaniec.9561 said:

@"Drgnfly.5812" said:Revenants are the only class that is locked into a set of 3 utility skills.

Except for like, how Revs have access to 6 utility, 2 heals, and 2 elites at once... So technically you are "locked into TWO sets of 3 utility skills," and you can pick which sets those are. You lose a bit of build diversity vs the other classes, but you get to have in-combat access to twice the number of skills... It's a pretty fair trade off--especially when you factor in how those classes with tons of different utility skills to pick from all end up using the same 5-6 anyways cuz the rest are super-garbage.

What twice number of skills? So F keys doesnt matter now? Necromancer doesnt gain 5 extra skills, guardian doesnt access 3 extra utilities called virtues etc?

We also gain 2 healing skill :)

Pretty much that, revs have 6!utilities.

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@Aeolus.3615 said:

@"Drgnfly.5812" said:Revenants are the only class that is locked into a set of 3 utility skills.

Except for like, how Revs have access to 6 utility, 2 heals, and 2 elites at once... So technically you are "locked into TWO sets of 3 utility skills," and you can pick which sets those are. You lose a bit of build diversity vs the other classes, but you get to have in-combat access to twice the number of skills... It's a pretty fair trade off--especially when you factor in how those classes with tons of different utility skills to pick from all end up using the same 5-6 anyways cuz the rest are super-garbage.

What twice number of skills? So F keys doesnt matter now? Necromancer doesnt gain 5 extra skills, guardian doesnt access 3 extra utilities called virtues etc?

We also gain 2 healing skill :)

Pretty much that, revs have 6!utilities.

Weaker than one healing skill from other classes yet 2x chance to interrupt and so on. Fair tradeLets also not forget the best healing skill ingame from Shiro which any enemy with reflect can use it up to damage u and heal themself.

Indeed rev is the best class ingame

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@narcx.3570 said:

@"Drgnfly.5812" said:Revenants are the only class that is locked into a set of 3 utility skills.

Except for like, how Revs have access to 6 utility, 2 heals, and 2 elites at once... So technically you are "locked into TWO sets of 3 utility skills," and you can pick which sets those are. You lose a bit of build diversity vs the other classes, but you get to have in-combat access to twice the number of skills... It's a pretty fair trade off--especially when you factor in how those classes with tons of different utility skills to pick from all end up using the same 5-6 anyways cuz the rest are super-garbage.

If you want to look at it like that, the profession that has “access” to the most skills at any given time is the Elementalist. Yet still the Elementalist has access to more choice among utility skills. Also a total of 28 utility skills, where 4 of the 28 are Conjure Weapons that each give access to 5 more skills in which the total rises to 48 possible utility skills to be chosen from.

This post wasn’t meant to trash the Revenants in the game. I like the profession, I like the mechanics, I like the lore, I like the gameplay. The biggest complaint that I have about the profession is the lack of build diversity. The profession feels like it has not received the same amount of attention as the others. Perhaps, just perhaps, opening up a bit of choice for the utility skills would solve that problem.

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Something I've thought up could improve revenant diversity is to add a new training line: glyphs. There's one heal, one elite and three utilities. Then you can use these glyphs to replace any of the legend utilities (however, for balance purposes I would prefer if slotting a glyph would place it in both legends, so, eg, using the healing glyph exchanges two heal skills for one). Since they are glyphs, their effects would change based on active legend.

For example, one utility could invoke a storm from the mists, and created combo field of effect and conditions per hit would change based on legend. There could be one glyph for removing / placing conditions, and the third one could be a stun break. The healing skill could have a minor version of the default heal skill effect (yet with a reduced cooldown), while the elite could do that as well. What would be an elite glyph? Up for debate, but recovering 100 energy would make it very elite (just give it an appropriately long cooldown).

Finally, I would make glyph cost all 5 energy, and make their use cooldown based.

Of course, all is up for debate, and pretty pointless as ANet will never do it. :D

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@Skotlex.7580 said:Something I've thought up could improve revenant diversity is to add a new training line: glyphs. There's one heal, one elite and three utilities. Then you can use these glyphs to replace any of the legend utilities (however, for balance purposes I would prefer if slotting a glyph would place it in both legends, so, eg, using the healing glyph exchanges two heal skills for one). Since they are glyphs, their effects would change based on active legend.

For example, one utility could invoke a storm from the mists, and created combo field of effect and conditions per hit would change based on legend. There could be one glyph for removing / placing conditions, and the third one could be a stun break. The healing skill could have a minor version of the default heal skill effect (yet with a reduced cooldown), while the elite could do that as well. What would be an elite glyph? Up for debate, but recovering 100 energy would make it very elite (just give it an appropriately long cooldown).

Finally, I would make glyph cost all 5 energy, and make their use cooldown based.

Of course, all is up for debate, and pretty pointless as ANet will never do it. :D

That actually could work invocation traitline has no related utilities, usually on other classes traits are tied to weapons, utilities sometimes both, but it is only boosting F2, kinda feels like if hammer and consecrations were removed from virtues in guardian.

That could be a way to improve it.

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@Scoobaniec.9561 said:

@"Drgnfly.5812" said:Revenants are the only class that is locked into a set of 3 utility skills.

Except for like, how Revs have access to 6 utility, 2 heals, and 2 elites at once... So technically you are "locked into TWO sets of 3 utility skills," and you can pick which sets those are. You lose a bit of build diversity vs the other classes, but you get to have in-combat access to twice the number of skills... It's a pretty fair trade off--especially when you factor in how those classes with tons of different utility skills to pick from all end up using the same 5-6 anyways cuz the rest are super-garbage.

What twice number of skills? So F keys doesnt matter now? Necromancer doesnt gain 5 extra skills, guardian doesnt access 3 extra utilities called virtues etc?

OP was complaining about being locked into only 3 utility skills, so I left weapon and f-skills out of it and just thought I would point out the trade off going on with Rev Utilities.

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Revenants right now are pretty strong with the addition of Ancient Echo, adding an extra skill would already make their strong momentum stronger.

But for the sake of sharing my thoughts, I'd like to see offensive effects on next hit definitely. Just as of right now, any of this besides Shiro is pretty fair since power revenant has no boon hate aside stability removal. The rest seem OP on the latter.

I say that because, when you play without Mallyx. If you face a boon heavy foe. You're unlikely to win unless kitting for hours.

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I do really like the idea of giving each legend a fourth utility skill. Each skill is currently pretty important to their corresponding legend's kit, so having to sacrifice one to gain access to the new one is a pretty significant trade-off. I could not imagine playing Mallyx without all of its utility skills, for example. However, the fourth utility skill would allow space for making legends overall more diverse and widely applicable. Jalis and Ventari lack mobility for example, whereas Shiro is a bit lacking in utility, or even support. Mallyx's kit is pretty diverse, so I could see the fourth skill going any direction. A build with no healing power wanting to actually play Ventari for the projectile denial and cleanse wouldn't be quite so bad if able to replace Natural Harmony for some sort of mobility/stunbreak skill. PvP/WvW Renegades could finally replace the memeworthy Razorclaw for something...worthwhile. Shiro users could replace Impossible Odds for something that lends better to teamfights. I imagine the balance implications of having a fourth utility skill would be pretty severe, but the possibilities are exciting.

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@narcx.3570 said:

@"Drgnfly.5812" said:Revenants are the only class that is locked into a set of 3 utility skills.

Except for like, how Revs have access to 6 utility, 2 heals, and 2 elites at once... So technically you are "locked into TWO sets of 3 utility skills," and you can pick which sets those are. You lose a bit of build diversity vs the other classes, but you get to have in-combat access to twice the number of skills... It's a pretty fair trade off--especially when you factor in how those classes with tons of different utility skills to pick from all end up using the same 5-6 anyways cuz the rest are super-garbage.

That's Revenant's schtick. Having more in-combat access to skills does not mean a profession should have less available utilities to choose from.

I agree that Revenant needs an extra one or two utilities to choose from, which can replace any of the current existing three.

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@"Justine.6351" said:I don't think it is necessary. Revs have 2 legends for TEN utility skills with some pretty low cooldowns.

All profession except Revenants can have 5 useful skills in 5 slotsRevenants can have 2 ... 3? skills bundled with 8/7 somewhat usable (I am still doubt should I classify them as "usable" like some chains of the Dwarf ... some corruptible resistance gain by the Demon) skills in 10 slots ...I don't think is will be a problem to have a 4th choice of utility skill in each Legend.It will not make Revenants having 12 slots ......

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