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Balance Patch Preview - PvP


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@ZDragon.3046 said:

@viquing.8254 said:If you want to pull a l2p discussion here we go but it's not me who will start it.

Hard Pass
ViquingIm not doing this with you.
  • 1 i dont have the time for it
  • 2 this is not the place for it
  • 3 back and forth argument (specifically with you) give me headaches
  • 4 you wont agree with me and i wont agree with you regardless of what i type.

Ive already said i think the change is pretty unfair but without a doubt it could be still technically going in the right direction considered.

There is an old saying...If you throw a rock into a pack of wolves the one that howls in the one you hit.

Yeah it's boring to see this endless factual things from the same guys forever, I all agree with you about how boring it will be, just remember that there is people here who will pop when you pull them. Because random guys who take their dream as facts (again when we ask for proves, there is nobody.) make me mad.

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Hi Everyone, Today we’re previewing the upcoming balance update. We’re starting with a bit of process and general thoughts, then following up with a pile of patch notes. Note that this post is identic

"Spike Trap: Reduced power coefficient from 0.2 to 0.01. Adjusted bleeding from 6 stacks from 6.25 seconds to 1 stack for 1 second. Reduced cooldown from 30 seconds to 20 seconds" There will be very little reason to take up a slot for this one, imo. I would rather see that you removed the CC from it and let it do condi damage... 1 stack for 1 sec.. No, just no

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@viquing.8254 said:

@Cal Cohen.2358 said:Mirror Blade: Increased cooldown from 5 seconds to 8 seconds

so whats the cd cuz the global changes says its 5 sec. why even have this here if the cd is remaining the same? its confusing.

it will not change after patch : 5 sec for PVE -> 8 sec for PvP like usual.

in this thread ya it says from 5 to 8 seconds cd which I thought was a typo since the global thread in professions says 5. why mention it at all if it isn't changing? the wording is weird and I guess i'm the only one whos confused about this.

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I'll just repost what I wrote in the engi forum:

It is weird how they're nerfing some already awful traits to be even worse. Like, at some point you might as well not even have a trait. Did anyone think about how much these traits were actually contributing in a fight before they went at them with the nerf stick?

Eg. in the Firearms line:

Sharpshooter: Reduced bleeding duration from 3 seconds to 1 second

So for reference, Sharpshooter is: 33% chance on crit, cause bleeding for 3s.

So if you crit, and if you get the sharpshooter proc (~18-20% chance of this happening on a deadshot amulet) and it's not cleansed, you're currently going to get a whopping 433 damage after factoring in expertise / condi duration extensions. If we multiply by the proc chance, that's about 86.7 damage per hit. That's .. really not good.

Cutting this to 1/3 of its current value is perplexing. It's barely doing anything now. After the patch, it'll be doing less than 1/3 of this. 28 dph? Twenty. Eight.

I'm more perplexed than anything. The fact that it's getting nerfed means someone looked at it and thought 87 dph was too much. What even?

Overall though, great patch. I am optimistic about most of these changes.

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@Azure The Heartless.3261 @viquing.8254 @ZDragon.3046

Just want to acknowledge your nice replies without derailing too much. Apologies if I sounded harsh. I just feel the dedicated Mes community has for the most part been pretty reasonable concerning balance. For reasons unknown, good suggestions have rarely been implemented, in favor of nerfing around the root issues, leaving traitlines in tatters, introducing clunky mechanics, and leaving but a few playable builds. If it happens, this proposed endurance nerf may be the final nail in the coffin for the class of casual 50%+ nerfs. That may be music to some peoples' ears, but I do hope I'm wrong.

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Ok let me start of by saying that I do like the idea of this patch. Less extreme spamming of a bunch of stuff with like longer cooldowns and some more purity of purpose on skills sounds quite nice. Generally a good direction for the future I'd say and I hope to see even more culling of extremes. Regardless if it is extreme damage or extreme survivability.
But...If I could change one thing for necromancer, it would be the damage on executioner's scythe. This is a change that kinda ruins the theme of the skill.I feel like they looked at this skill from the wrong angle.Because it isn't a CC skill with some (more or less decent) damage added on top of it, it's a damage skill that also has a CC portion. It is supposed to be a "finisher move".I mean, it even scales damage with the enemy's health which is absolutely pointless if the coefficients are basically 0.Reduce the scaling to something like 1.25/1.5/1.82 or whatever, but don't just erase all damage on it. Especially since it's a slow single target skill, despite what it may look like.Just applying everything exactly the same way to every skill that falls in a certain category isn't always good since a few of them started at way different levels.Losing the damage from a skill like static field might be annoying, but that damage was more "nice to have", rather than really that big of a deal. With executioner's scythe on the other hand, it's a big deal losing basically all damage on it.

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@Twilight Tempest.7584 said:Just want to acknowledge your nice replies without derailing too much. Apologies if I sounded harsh. I just feel the dedicated Mes community has for the most part been pretty reasonable concerning balance.

Nah, I get it. And like I said, there have been and continue to be reasonable mesmers. Just, there's also unreasonable ones that are exploiting the design flaw and calling it fair pretty damn loudly. That group is who the vitriol is for.

For reasons unknown, good suggestions have rarely been implemented, in favor of nerfing around the root issues, leaving traitlines in tatters, introducing clunky mechanics, and leaving but a few playable builds.

It's probably due to the above. The devs are aware some mechanics promote what they have themselves described as degenerate play, but for some reason they have an aversion to changing the specs a whole lot. It might be because they were preparing for this, it might not be; who knows.

this proposed endurance nerf may be the final nail in the coffin for the class of casual 50%+ nerfs. That may be music to some peoples' ears, but I do hope I'm wrong.

I am hoping that as well, or that a less extreme solution that has similar effects on balancing the spec mechanically gets proposed (and taken into consideration) instead.

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It's taken me a very long time studying all the changes in great detail to get an idea for what will happen.

Here are my concerns:

  • Overall too much devaluing of healing coefficients instead of base healing, this is highly effective at nerfing healing amulet builds more so than actually reducing the healing flying around from demolisher amulet duelists, and high damage roamers. They are the go-to and currently don't have/need healing power. Suggestion: Roll a bit more of the healing coefficient nerfs into base healing nerfs.

  • Indiscriminate coefficient nerfs. A few of these coefficient nerfs are an utter waste of development time, such as taking the time to lower power damage on Engineer Pistol #1-#3, Warrior Longbow #1-#2. On the flip side, in the pursuit of blanket sustain nerfs all at the same rate across all classes, there's a big missed opportunity to bring up Ventari Revenant, Engineer, & Druid allied support skills for instance by shielding them from some nerfs. Blanket nerfs are happening, yes, but many classes were nerfed further - except for Guardian and Thief from what I can tell, in my opinion the patch needs to make sense even if we ignore all of the blanket nerfs. Currently it does not, many OP specs are left, and many UP specs are getting it harder than the blanket nerfs should go.

  • Some CC skills going to a .01 coefficient is a little overkill. Specifically, the highly telegraphed, small area of effect, significant cast-time skills like Backbreaker, Skull Crack, Headbutt, Banish, Daredevil Uppercut, Holographic Shockwave - (guaranteed crit skill that's now designed to do 50 damage, 100 damage on a crit I guess?) Wild Blow, Personal Battering Ram, Static Shock (A.E.D Toolbelt), Gale Strike. These are control skills that are often used at a risky position, and/or difficult to connect with due to a variety of reasons. My suggestion would be to either add back some damage to these select skills, OR improve the range, area of effect, or attach a short advance or evade, or otherwise quality of life to these CC skills.

  • Better yet - how about instead of making CC skills have 0.01 coefficients, we keep the coefficients but remove the CC component! There's lots of CC floating around, and stability is disappearing, and CC skills are getting their cooldowns reduced in many places by 5-30 seconds. We need less CC skills as well as these skills being balanced.

Some miscellaneous individual changes that are problematic/outliers:

  • Nerfing Druidic Clarity to not stunbreak the Druid when entering Celestial avatar... the horse is already dead.
  • Spike Trap going to a 0.01 damage coefficient and bleeding reduced to 1 stack for 1 second. Quite overkill a nerf.
  • Breaching Strike going from 2 to 3 boons removed. Hmm.. this skill is pretty good already, and poorly telegraphed - I would suggest increasing the skill animation to 500-600ms to balance it.
  • Launch Personal Battering Ram projectile going from 1.5 coefficient to .5 -66% is a bit heavy handed for this dead skill.
  • Takedown Round going from 2.0 to 0.5 coefficient, -75% a bit overkill for an already weak, pure damage trait with no secondary effect.
  • Elementalist Arcane Ressurection - Geyser going from 7% revive ticks to 1% is pretty heavy handed. Perhaps 2, or 3% instead?
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@Fueki.4753 said:I think it'd be better if they prioritized damage over CC on weapon skills.Remove the CC on weapon skills across the board and give back the damage.The CC from traits and utilities already is significantly higher than what is healthy for a game mode that is based on players interacting with each other.

Yup, that's what I'm saying. Instead of going in the CC over Damage direction, I think we need to take away or reduce CC on many skills and preserve the damage coefficients.

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Haven’t had time to read all the comments so I apologize if this has been asked but...

Evade frames? Protection? Aegis? It seems like you are going ham on damage and not even paying attention to other forms of sustain outside of flat healing.

One of the biggest issues this games has with pvp is evade and stealth uptime on thief/Mesmer. I don’t have a nicer way to say it but this sounds like more bad design that hasn’t fully been thought through or tested.

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@Cal Cohen.2358 said:

Thief

Weapons

Short Bow

  • Trick Shot: Reduced power coefficient from 0.55 to 0.366
  • Detonate Cluster Bomb (Cluster Bomb): Reduced power coefficient per strike from 0.5 to 0.375
  • Disabling Shot: Increased initiative cost from 4 to 5

Sword

  • Autoattack Chain: Reduced power coefficients from 0.6/0.6/1.3 to 0.4/0.4/0.866
  • Infiltrator's Strike: Reduced power coefficient from 0.75 to 0.5
  • Flanking Strike: Reduced power cofficient from 0.8 to 0.5
  • Pistol Whip: Reduced initial hit power coefficient from 0.37 to 0.01. Reduced stun duration from 0.75 seconds to 0.5 seconds. Reduced flurry hit power coefficients from 0.79 to 0.53. Increased initiative cost from 5 to 6.

Dagger MH

  • Autoattack Chain: Reduced power coefficients from 0.6/0.65/1.1 to 0.4/0.433/0.733
  • Shadow Shot: Increased intiative cost from 4 to 5
  • Death Blossom: Increased initiative cost from 4 to 5
  • Backstab: Reduced base power coefficient from 1.2 to 0.9. Reduced flanking power coefficient from 2.4 to 1.8

Pistol MH

  • Vital Shot: Reduced power coefficient from 0.575 to 0.383
  • Unload: Reduced power coefficient per hit from 0.4 to 0.27. Reduced might duration from 8 seconds to 6 seconds
  • Sneak Attack: Reduced power coefficient per hit from 0.36 to 0.3

Dagger OH

  • Dancing Dagger: Reduced power coefficient from 0.6 to 0.45

Staff

  • Autoattack Chain: Reduced power coefficients from 0.666/0.666/1.672 to 0.444/0.444/1.114
  • Weakening Charge: Reduced power coefficient per hit from 0.7 to 0.45. Reduced weakness duration per hit from 2 seconds to 1 second
  • Debilitating Arc: Reduced power coefficient from 1.0 to 0.5. WvW will now use the PvP initiative cost of 5
  • Dust Strike: Increased vulnerability stacks from 5 to 8
  • Vault: Reduced power coefficient from 2.25 to 1.82. WvW will now use the PvP initiative cost of 6
  • Hook Strike: Reduced power coefficient from 0.65 to 0.01

Rifle

  • Brutal Aim: Reduced power coefficient from 0.6 to 0.4
  • Deadly Aim: Reduced power coefficient from 0.8 to 0.533
  • Spotter's Shot: Reduced power coefficient from 0.8 to 0.4. Increased immobilize duration from 1 second to 1.5 seconds
  • Double Tap: Reduced might stacks per hit from 3 to 1. Reduced power coefficient per hit from 0.65 to 0.5
  • Three Round Burst: Reduced power coefficient per hit from 0.55 to 0.5. Reduced might stacks per hit from 3 to 1
  • Death's Retreat: Increased initiative cost from 5 to 6
  • Death's Judgment: Reduced power coefficient from 1.65 to 1.11

Heal

  • Skelk Venom: Reduced initial heal coefficient from 0.75 to 0.4. Reduced initial base heal from 4210 to 3578
  • Withdraw: Increased cooldown from 18 seconds to 25 seconds. Increased base heal from 4778 to 5243
  • Channeled Vigor: Increased cooldown from 20 seconds to 30 seconds
  • Malicious Restoration: Increased cooldown from 25 seconds to 30 seconds

Utility

  • Smoke Screen: Increased cooldown from 25 seconds to 35 seconds
  • Pitfall: Reduced power coefficient of the knockdown strike from 1.25 to 0.01. Reduced power coefficient of the pulsing strikes from 0.5 to 0.3
  • Infiltrator's Signet: Increased cooldown from 30 seconds to 35 seconds
  • Haste: Reduced quickness duration from 6 seconds to 4 seconds. Increased cooldown from 30 seconds to 45 seconds
  • Roll for Initiative: Increased cooldown from 40 seconds to 50 seconds
  • Scorpion Wire: Reduced power coefficient from 0.5 to 0.01
  • Skale Venom: Reduced vulnerability duration from 10 seconds to 6 seconds
  • Bandit's Defense: Increased cooldown from 20 seconds to 30 seconds
  • Reflexive Strike (from Bandit's Defense): Reduced power coefficient from 0.75 to 0.01
  • Distracting Daggers: Reduced power coefficient from 0.55 to 0.25
  • Impairing Daggers: Reduced slow duration from 5 seconds to 2 seconds
  • Fist Flurry: Reduced overall power coefficient from 3.75 to 2.5
  • Palm Strike (from Fist Flurry): Reduced initial power coefficient from 1.75 to 0.01
  • Binding Shadow: Reduced power coefficient from 1.0 to 0.01. Reduced vulnerability duration from 10 seconds to 6 seconds
  • Shadow Gust: Reduced power coefficient from 0.4 to 0.01

Elite

  • Dagger Storm: Reduced power coefficient from 1.0 to 0.4
  • Uppercut (from Impact Strike): Reduced power coefficient from 2.25 to 0.01
  • Finishing Blow (from Impact Strike): Increased power coefficient from 2.0 to 2.5
  • Shadow Meld: Reduced stealth duration from 3 seconds to 2 seconds

Traits

Deadly Arts

  • Lotus Poison: Reduced weakness duration from 4 seconds to 3 seconds
  • Mug: Reduced power coefficient from 1.5 to 0.75
  • Even the Odds: Reduced might and vulnerability durations from 10 seconds to 6 seconds
  • Panic Strike: Reduced poison duration from 2 seconds to 1 second
  • Potent Poison: Reduced bonus poison duration from 20% to 5%

Critical Strikes

  • Assassin's Fury: Reduced might duration from 8 seconds to 6 seconds. Reduced might stacks from 3 to 2
  • Ankle Shots: Reduced cripple duration from 3 seconds to 2 seconds

Shadow Arts

  • Merciful Ambush: Reduced revive percentage from 3% to 1%
  • Shadow's Rejuvenation: Reduced base heal from 293 to 219

Acrobatics

  • Feline Grace: Reduced vigor duration from 5 seconds to 3 seconds
  • Endless Stamina: Reduced concentration from 240 to 60
  • Pain Response: Increased cooldown from 40 seconds to 60 seconds
  • Hard to Catch: Increased cooldown from 90 seconds to 300 seconds
  • Instant Reflexes: Increased cooldown from 90 seconds to 300 seconds

Trickery

  • Uncatchable: Reduced bleeding duration from 3 seconds to 1 second
  • Lesser Haste (from Burst of Agility): Reduced quickness duration from 6 seconds to 3 seconds
  • Bountiful Theft: Reduced number of boons removed from 3 to 2
  • Thrill of the Crime: Reduced might duration from 10 seconds to 6 seconds

Daredevil

  • Weakening Strikes: Reduced weakness duration from 3 seconds to 2 seconds
  • Escapist's Fortitude: Reduced base heal from 456 to 150
  • Pulmonary Impact (from Impacting Disruption): Reduced power coefficient from 2.0 to 0.75
  • Lotus Training: Reduced power coefficient from 0.1875 to 0.0625. Reduced bleeding duration from 4 seconds to 1.5 seconds. Reduced torment duration from 4 seconds to 1.5 seconds. Increased bonus condition damage from 10% to 15%
  • Bounding Dodger: Reduced power coefficient from 1.33 to 0.5. Increased bonus damage from 10% to 15%

Deadeye

  • Payback: This has been unsplit and will use the lower (20%) recharge value in all modes
  • Premeditation: Reduced concentration from 180 to 60
  • Be Quick or Be Killed: Reduced quickness duration from 4 seconds to 2.5 seconds
  • Maleficent Seven: Reduced might duration from 10 seconds to 6 seconds
  • Fire for Effect: Reduced might duration from 12 seconds to 6 seconds

Gotta touch thief a bit more.... They are going to be S tier after patch.

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@Twilight Tempest.7584 said:@Azure The Heartless.3261 @viquing.8254 @ZDragon.3046

Just want to acknowledge your nice replies without derailing too much. Apologies if I sounded harsh. I just feel the dedicated Mes community has for the most part been pretty reasonable concerning balance. For reasons unknown, good suggestions have rarely been implemented, in favor of nerfing around the root issues, leaving traitlines in tatters, introducing clunky mechanics, and leaving but a few playable builds. If it happens, this proposed endurance nerf may be the final nail in the coffin for the class of casual 50%+ nerfs. That may be music to some peoples' ears, but I do hope I'm wrong.

Np, it's jut that the historic mesmer community has for the most part already leave the game.And yeah it's true that they were globally for nerfs.

@Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

@Twilight Tempest.7584 said:Just want to acknowledge your nice replies without derailing too much. Apologies if I sounded harsh. I just feel the dedicated Mes community has for the most part been pretty reasonable concerning balance.

Nah, I get it. And like I said, there have been and continue to be reasonable mesmers. Just, there's also unreasonable ones that are exploiting the design flaw and calling it fair pretty kitten loudly. That group is who the vitriol is for.

Don't forget to come back with a pic of your top 50 or winning mAt mirage next patch.Proves mean better than smooth talking and spikes.It Remember me that it's true that there is group in this forum who will whine whine as long as mesmer exist.If you want a spike battle we can play this game too, it look pretty funny :Like just there's also unreasonables ones that are making balance suggestions while not even able to perform with what they want to nerf, calling it op, bad designed or cheesy pretty loudly.You see ? It's fun how words work in the opposite too.

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I like the changes and feel it's a move in the right direction.

However, reducing the stability on Reaper "terrify" is going to make it more of a ping pong ball than it already is.

Also reducing reaper great sword damage by so much, should also warrant an increase in it's attack speed. Half time you use it enemies have high animated swings and nearly 1,5 secs react time so they either dodge or walk out of range, with the changes now when you do finally land a hit it will not even do damage

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@"Cal Cohen.2358"Got some questions...Traits that boost power/precision/ferocity ... why they are not getting nerfed as well?Thief & Bundle.What will happen to CONSUME PLASMA? It will be OP-overloaded as hell? Because couldnt find any changes on it. Even being interrupted he doesnt lose it and unpunished, how did it pass?Binding shadow - can you remove the immobilize, so this skill wouldnt need a breakstun and cleanse(at the same time) to get out of it ?MesmerIn addition to previous post.Can mantra face requirement be reviewed ? Since they are seeing major nerfs, pretty clunky as they are nowElementalist.Lightning rod turns every CC into DMG spike with a weakness on it, no icd. I'd like to remind that power block (on mesmer) has 3s icd, cant crit and procs on interrupt . We had a trait with exact the same functionality - "lost time" on chrono before and it did half of LROD damage, it was deleted entirely. Disable the crits at least, may be?Engineer.AED (engi heal) escaped the nerfs?Warrior.Also want to remind that "Attacker's Insight" is an overloaded trait, aside REFRESHING warrior's burst skill it does give a stat boost (which is super easy to get and keep) 225 power and 225 ferocity (450 overall), thats waaaaay too much.Always felt that Greatsword burst is weird. It has no difference between burst tier 1-2-3 (the onle change is a boon duration, really?). Its always the same and always strong (and somehow will be barely nerfed, like really). Higher tier level -more power/damage/stronger effect but its just the same.This favors spellbreaker the most and let it use its full strength as tier 1 burst. That supposed to be a spellbreaker trade off? To not hit you with lvl3 bursts at cost of 1 adrenaline bar but in reality its lvl3 burst but count as lvl1, thats the only difference. Because of that we have to evade in that manner F1 -> F2 (if hits refreshing F1 again) ->F1->swap-> F1 again and every burst is worth a dodge because magebane tether and GS F1 hit like a truck.(Not sure if fixed) Would be nice if sword burst wouldnt immobilize people before it even hit them.

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What's with the condi engi nerf?

Sharpshooter: Reduced bleeding duration from 3 seconds to 1 secondSerrated Steel: Reduced bonus bleeding duration from 33% to 15%Incendiary Powder: Reduced bonus burning duration from 33% to 10%. Reduced burning duration from 8 seconds to 4 seconds

Condi engi does barely any damage as for now, @"coro.3176" did the math of bleeding from Sharpshooter:

Sharpshooter: Reduced bleeding duration from 3 seconds to 1 second

So for reference, Sharpshooter is: 33% chance on crit, cause bleeding for 3s.

So
if you crit
, and
if you get the sharpshooter proc
(*
~18-20% chance of this happening on a deadshot amulet)
and* it's not cleansed, you're currently going to get a whopping 433 damage after factoring in expertise / condi duration extensions. If we multiply by the proc chance, that's about 86.7 damage per hit. That's .. really not good.

Cutting this to 1/3 of its current value is perplexing. It's barely doing anything
now
. After the patch, it'll be doing less than 1/3 of this. 28 dph? Twenty. Eight.

I'm more perplexed than anything. The fact that it's getting nerfed means someone looked at it and thought 87 dph was too much. What even?

Exactly, what even? Can you re-thing this change please? Condi engi used to be a great spec back a few years ago, and now... it does exactly the same as before, which is barely anything, with stuff like Sigil of Cleansing present, which can clease all the condi from "spike" engi can do with a single weapon swap.

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The team should reconsider just replacing the passive traits rather than a cd increase of 300, 100 is fine otherwise ur just changing the traits to ensure they fall into the never used pile that's already to large in gw2 as is. Does the team really think a trait giving 2 sec of invulnerability or few seconds of stability is so strong that it warrants only 2 or so procs in a entire match? If so good luck with that.

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"Eating pop corn :# and watching the forum with all his salt, hope and despair"

Maybe thief will be The only meta, sd thief vs condi thief vs deadeye vs dp thief = Thiefs wars 2 (a nice name btw)

Maybe we'll see no mirage anymore in pvp, maybe Weaver can't vs many ppl anymore, 1 pet for the slb in fight .?? the second one was used just to run away =) and more and more....

I don't have any idea of how it's gonna be after the patch and i don't have any judgment till the patch fall.

I just hope (really) that @net have done some good tests before, with a real pvp players and they'll be super reactive to fix any oppeness cuz in the past with just a patch with 20-30 changes, they took weeks maybe months to react, what's gonna be with a patch with a TON of changes.....will see.

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TEMPESTElemental Bastion: Increased internal cooldown from 30 seconds to 40 seconds. Reduced base heal from 522 to 391. Reduced healing coefficient from 0.55 to 0.4125Increased CD is fine and ok for me. But reduced base heal makes me gasp.Weaver was sooo superior compared to tempest and with this detail-change it will remain superior.Please rethink and give tempest a chance to compete in PvP again.In terms of the whole patch, its a great job dev-team has done. When all this changes will get balanced the next months, then I think that "PvP IS ALIVE" :)

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@Twilight Tempest.7584 said:@Azure The Heartless.3261 @viquing.8254 @"ZDragon.3046"

Just want to acknowledge your nice replies without derailing too much. Apologies if I sounded harsh. I just feel the dedicated Mes community has for the most part been pretty reasonable concerning balance. For reasons unknown, good suggestions have rarely been implemented, in favor of nerfing around the root issues, leaving traitlines in tatters, introducing clunky mechanics, and leaving but a few playable builds. If it happens, this proposed endurance nerf may be the final nail in the coffin for the class of casual 50%+ nerfs. That may be music to some peoples' ears, but I do hope I'm wrong.

I mean i know the feeling considering scourge is not viable due to wvw changes back when things were still tied together. To be clear i dont dislike it to the point i want it to not exist. I can tolerate mirages even though i dont ever light fighting them but i cant tolerate when something is bluntly imbalanced past a certain point. My call out to the old CI mirage was more of a reference to one particular point in time that is easy for anyone who has played in that past year to recall if anything.

But YOU ARE NOT WRONG to vent your own frustration here from that perspective.Balance is just so rough to nail and players who have god complex (not everyone obviously) while playing questionably super oppressive builds dont help decrease peoples frustration for an elite or build any profession might use which can quickly lead to a "Delete this class" thread and we have seen more last and going into this year than ever before @_@.

Moving back to the mirage issue that so many people are concerned about.I think that anet however might possibly be going super strict on it because of how much it was used and sheer number of complaints thats come up about it over the past year along with the general subject of people hating on "Evasive skills or traits that do damage" which was noted to be one of their biggest things they would be looking into.

Lowering the endurance cap might not be the wrong way to go in theory, but by how much? 50 might actually be too much. Perhaps maybe even letting them keep 100 endurance and just making evasive activations cost slight more than 50 points based on clones up at the time. I think there is room for rebalancing IH other than just shaving 50 points especially if people really do think that removing 50 points will erase the elite completely how ever now is the time to figure out how to rebalance it so that its a bit more fair for the power it provides.

Anet has a bad history of making questionable choices with traits across several professions even right now with the removal of say foot in the grave & spectral mastery some time ago for example in necromancers case combined with the fact that the cooldowns on spectral defenses are increasing with no options to reduce them its got me like ???.

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@Odik.4587 said:

@"Cal Cohen.2358"Got some questions...Traits that boost power/precision/ferocity ... why they are not getting nerfed as well?

This is a good question but its possibly one of those things where if they do it to 1 profession expect it to be done to every profession so i think this one is more of a careful what you ask for kind of question.

Thief & Bundle.What will happen to CONSUME PLASMA? It will be OP-overloaded as hell? Because couldnt find any changes on it. Even being interrupted he doesnt lose it and unpunished, how did it pass?

Also a good question so long as boon duration drops a bit on it i think it would be fine though. How ever we have to remember its not something a thief will get all the time only if they can successfuly steal from a mesmer which is likely why it got a pass there is a 1/9 chance of being able to even steal this in a match if the match has no mesmer you wont ever get the bundle.

Binding shadow - can you remove the immobilize, so this skill wouldnt need a breakstun and cleanse(at the same time) to get out of it ?

I feel like it just needs to reveal on cast so it cant pop you out of stealth. If you see it coming you can almost always evade this. Only when they use it from stealth is it ever really a problem imo.

Elementalist.Lightning rod turns every CC into DMG spike with a weakness on it, no icd. I'd like to remind that power block (on mesmer) has 3s icd, cant crit and procs on interrupt . We had a trait with exact the same functionality - "lost time" on chrono before and it did half of LROD damage, it was deleted entirely. Disable the crits at least, may be?

This is questionable. Mind that power-block cant crit but it does basically reset a cooldown if it interrupts a person during a cast which depending on what skill is interrupted can be more powerful than just out right damage. Each skill kind of has their own niche. At best i would say dont nerf lightning rods damage anymore just making it only proc on interrupting and not just any disable would bring it more in line with powerblock.

Engineer.AED (engi heal) escaped the nerfs?Its basically some what like defiant stance/hearld heal not really sure it needs to be touched.

Warrior.Also want to remind that "Attacker's Insight" is an overloaded trait, aside REFRESHING warrior's burst skill it does give a stat boost (which is super easy to get and keep) 225 power and 225 ferocity (450 overall), thats waaaaay too much.

This is more so one of those things that if you change it the other 8 professions also need to receive more stat nerfs. Its the careful what you wish for situation imo. I want to think they purposely left stat increasing traits alone because of the removal of some of the amulets and the overall drop to scaling power hits across the board ontop of the fact that most cc wont do damage its a lot of damage removed from the game so removing stats like these might remove way more damage than intended as they might already be riding a fine line between removing too much dps across the board.

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Theres de-powercreeping which the game needed and then there's lazy nerfing-blamket nerfing across all skills and traits with zero regards to what their actual function which is the route this patch has been taken to no surprise. The damage reductions and boon reductions were needed but actual thought and consideration should have been given for each. Given the already large amount of useless skills/traits and function in this game it will now be even more bloated with them.Reaper scythe will feel shallow and damage will not match its animation. Lower the damage of the skill sure but that much-stupid.Shield on warrior giving 1 sec might lmao u serious team? Why not just remove the might gain to remove some of the bloat?1 sec in game on might boon is useless garbage and might as well not be there. Yeah 1 Sec daze or imobilize is significant sure but is one sec might? no-no thought or consideration.As I stated above passive skills on300 cd is like 2 maybe 3 whole procs a match to what, get a whopping2 secs invulnerability or to get a free evade? 100 secs or replace the traits-again lazy route with no thoughtMaking traits useless and with zero compensation leads to lowerbuild deversity-good job lolThe cc doing zero dps across all classes with zero thought or consideration for their actual weapon skills and how the cc skill or skills function within the kit or playstyle of the spec. For example if a weapon kit consist of cc on 2 or 3 of the weapon skills do u plan on the player using one or 2 skills on CD than auto attack rest other the time unless a cc skills useable again-for zero damage lol sounds fun.I get if a hard cc skill got reduced to zero if its surrounded by damage skills but if warrior hammer etc are build around being a cc weapon than half its skills do basically no damage-smart.

Honestly this reminds me a lot of the clown fiesta in eso half way thru last year when they did a blanket nerf across certain skill type types and a blanket buff across all dots with no regards to the actually functions or surrounding skills of each class nor its playstyle resulting in a complete mess and them having to back peddle by reducing their initial buffs/nerfs by like 30%. Cuz drastic blanket buffs/nerds with no thought creates a disaster so good luck anet lol

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