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Balance Patch Preview - WvW


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@Xenash.1245 said:

@JTGuevara.9018 said:Bring on this new era, I say!

For once, I'm going to against the grain here and
look forward
to what's coming instead of being jaded like a good number of people are here. Powercreep is directly being addressed both in terms of damage and defensive output right before our eyes and people are still not satisfied. I and many others have asked for this to be addressed for YEARS.

I can be jaded but still look forward to what the future may bring.

It's in the same vein of me saying a cool mount was added into wvw, but also heavily disagreed with a mount in general being added to the gamemode.

As long as this is the ground work for more consistent updates. If this is a big one and done, its going to be AlLiAnNeS hype all over again.

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@Jski.6180 said:

@Xenash.1245 said:This whole back and forth here is pointless and I don't really see why you guys are fighting with each other.

Personally yeah I guess I have to admit that I'm going to enjoy people having to think of their own builds for at least awhile, it might make things more enjoyable in turn. But at the same time I don't like the changes overall because they just seem poorly thought out and hit certain classes and specs far harder then the rest which will probably cause some issues with classes you'll see commonly.

@Xenash.1245 said:This whole back and forth here is pointless and I don't really see why you guys are fighting with each other.

Personally yeah I guess I have to admit that I'm going to enjoy people having to think of their own builds for at least awhile, it might make things more enjoyable in turn. But at the same time I don't like the changes overall because they just seem poorly thought out and hit certain classes and specs far harder then the rest which will probably cause some issues with classes you'll see commonly.

That the thing this update makes you less likely to see the odd ball builds in wvw as you will have to max your power dmg or healing to keep up OR you NEED to have a gurd or 2 in every group just to have enofe stab as they are nerfing number of targets for the support stab and nerfing every one self stab.

This update is the worst way to promote fun game play.

Guard is already in every group... You must be new.

@Xenash.1245 said:This whole back and forth here is pointless and I don't really see why you guys are fighting with each other.

Personally yeah I guess I have to admit that I'm going to enjoy people having to think of their own builds for at least awhile, it might make things more enjoyable in turn. But at the same time I don't like the changes overall because they just seem poorly thought out and hit certain classes and specs far harder then the rest which will probably cause some issues with classes you'll see commonly.

@Xenash.1245 said:This whole back and forth here is pointless and I don't really see why you guys are fighting with each other.

Personally yeah I guess I have to admit that I'm going to enjoy people having to think of their own builds for at least awhile, it might make things more enjoyable in turn. But at the same time I don't like the changes overall because they just seem poorly thought out and hit certain classes and specs far harder then the rest which will probably cause some issues with classes you'll see commonly.

That the thing this update makes you less likely to see the odd ball builds in wvw as you will have to max your power dmg or healing to keep up OR you NEED to have a gurd or 2 in every group just to have enofe stab as they are nerfing number of targets for the support stab and nerfing every one self stab.

This update is the worst way to promote fun game play.

Guard is already in every group... You must be new.

But you will need more as they no longer hit 10 targets and lack as much support stab AND classes who had some version of self stab is only getting nerfed by being made into 60 sec cd. We can also point out that blocks and non healing support will become much stronger something witch guard has and other support classes do not.

The thing with 2 support guards is that you start running out of space for damage, you generally want a rev and necro in that party too. But than you also need a thief or 2 and some warrior things. Who does damage now, how much? With pretty much all applications of might being 6s, someone has to provide that to, maybe a mesmer with 40s extension to all might stacks? But than you run out of damage slots and since cc does no damage now, being CCed might not kill you outright?

Will condi resurge? Some say that, but than again, the 2 classes most attuned for condi are rev and necro, with poor stunbreaks and basically no self stab, they just might not be viable, without 2 guards, but than you lose all benefits from above mentioned classes.

With such extensive changes, it is just not possible to determine the direction, until it's playtested and thus it means it's not as linear as you make it believe.

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@SloRules.3560 said:

@Xenash.1245 said:This whole back and forth here is pointless and I don't really see why you guys are fighting with each other.

Personally yeah I guess I have to admit that I'm going to enjoy people having to think of their own builds for at least awhile, it might make things more enjoyable in turn. But at the same time I don't like the changes overall because they just seem poorly thought out and hit certain classes and specs far harder then the rest which will probably cause some issues with classes you'll see commonly.

@Xenash.1245 said:This whole back and forth here is pointless and I don't really see why you guys are fighting with each other.

Personally yeah I guess I have to admit that I'm going to enjoy people having to think of their own builds for at least awhile, it might make things more enjoyable in turn. But at the same time I don't like the changes overall because they just seem poorly thought out and hit certain classes and specs far harder then the rest which will probably cause some issues with classes you'll see commonly.

That the thing this update makes you less likely to see the odd ball builds in wvw as you will have to max your power dmg or healing to keep up OR you NEED to have a gurd or 2 in every group just to have enofe stab as they are nerfing number of targets for the support stab and nerfing every one self stab.

This update is the worst way to promote fun game play.

Guard is already in every group... You must be new.

@Xenash.1245 said:This whole back and forth here is pointless and I don't really see why you guys are fighting with each other.

Personally yeah I guess I have to admit that I'm going to enjoy people having to think of their own builds for at least awhile, it might make things more enjoyable in turn. But at the same time I don't like the changes overall because they just seem poorly thought out and hit certain classes and specs far harder then the rest which will probably cause some issues with classes you'll see commonly.

@Xenash.1245 said:This whole back and forth here is pointless and I don't really see why you guys are fighting with each other.

Personally yeah I guess I have to admit that I'm going to enjoy people having to think of their own builds for at least awhile, it might make things more enjoyable in turn. But at the same time I don't like the changes overall because they just seem poorly thought out and hit certain classes and specs far harder then the rest which will probably cause some issues with classes you'll see commonly.

That the thing this update makes you less likely to see the odd ball builds in wvw as you will have to max your power dmg or healing to keep up OR you NEED to have a gurd or 2 in every group just to have enofe stab as they are nerfing number of targets for the support stab and nerfing every one self stab.

This update is the worst way to promote fun game play.

Guard is already in every group... You must be new.

But you will need more as they no longer hit 10 targets and lack as much support stab AND classes who had some version of self stab is only getting nerfed by being made into 60 sec cd. We can also point out that blocks and non healing support will become much stronger something witch guard has and other support classes do not.

The thing with 2 support guards is that you start running out of space for damage, you generally want a rev and necro in that party too. But than you also need a thief or 2 and some warrior things. Who does damage now, how much? With pretty much all applications of might being 6s, someone has to provide that to, maybe a mesmer with 40s extension to all might stacks? But than you run out of damage slots and since cc does no damage now, being CCed might not kill you outright?

Will condi resurge? Some say that, but than again, the 2 classes most attuned for condi are rev and necro, with poor stunbreaks and basically no self stab, they just might not be viable, without 2 guards, but than you lose all benefits from above mentioned classes.

With such extensive changes, it is just not possible to determine the direction, until it's playtested and thus it means it's not as linear as you make it believe.

Right so you will only have room for "meta" class and "meta" builds removing the room for off builds and more "fun" that and you have to have more ppl playing guard and that type of game play in a game like this is a good way to get ppl to quit playing gw2. CC is getting an buff from this update all it may seem not you dont use cc skills for dmg so removing dmg from them is not a means of nerfing the skill it self but by nerfing stab skills as they are (mostly self stab) they are making it harder for ppl to "move in combat" as hard cc will stop ppl dead. Compounded with stun brake cd getting longer as well its going to be an out right mess. The ranged "pirate" ship meta will be coming back hard.

Conidl or power dmg if you stack enofe on over splized builds on the "meta" classes no amount of nerfs will fix as long as they go with numbers only. That the thing when you drop % effect numbers on skills you push the game into more exsteam builds. Your ele who use to build some def though vit gear may not need to go full zerk and be a zombly power bomber (they do not seem to be updating retal so the only real way of playing is to plan to go into down state to land real dmg) or your scraper who could at one point go in to do some type of dmg will need to go all in on healing power just to keep up with the lower healing power %.

Duration drop on effects of boons will not fix any of the problems with the boons them self its the effect of the boons that tend to be more of the problme when it comes to counter play and stacking. Wvw is an environment of plenty or non at all. If your have your comp. you will have every thing all the time if you do not have your comp. you will have nothing. So by only nerfing duration even cd your doing nothing for the balancing of comp. groups your only destroying non comp. groups making wvw a less fun places to play in.

This is NOT how you fix wvw. This is how you end wvw.

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@Jski.6180 said:

@Xenash.1245 said:This whole back and forth here is pointless and I don't really see why you guys are fighting with each other.

Personally yeah I guess I have to admit that I'm going to enjoy people having to think of their own builds for at least awhile, it might make things more enjoyable in turn. But at the same time I don't like the changes overall because they just seem poorly thought out and hit certain classes and specs far harder then the rest which will probably cause some issues with classes you'll see commonly.

@Xenash.1245 said:This whole back and forth here is pointless and I don't really see why you guys are fighting with each other.

Personally yeah I guess I have to admit that I'm going to enjoy people having to think of their own builds for at least awhile, it might make things more enjoyable in turn. But at the same time I don't like the changes overall because they just seem poorly thought out and hit certain classes and specs far harder then the rest which will probably cause some issues with classes you'll see commonly.

That the thing this update makes you less likely to see the odd ball builds in wvw as you will have to max your power dmg or healing to keep up OR you NEED to have a gurd or 2 in every group just to have enofe stab as they are nerfing number of targets for the support stab and nerfing every one self stab.

This update is the worst way to promote fun game play.

Guard is already in every group... You must be new.

@Xenash.1245 said:This whole back and forth here is pointless and I don't really see why you guys are fighting with each other.

Personally yeah I guess I have to admit that I'm going to enjoy people having to think of their own builds for at least awhile, it might make things more enjoyable in turn. But at the same time I don't like the changes overall because they just seem poorly thought out and hit certain classes and specs far harder then the rest which will probably cause some issues with classes you'll see commonly.

@Xenash.1245 said:This whole back and forth here is pointless and I don't really see why you guys are fighting with each other.

Personally yeah I guess I have to admit that I'm going to enjoy people having to think of their own builds for at least awhile, it might make things more enjoyable in turn. But at the same time I don't like the changes overall because they just seem poorly thought out and hit certain classes and specs far harder then the rest which will probably cause some issues with classes you'll see commonly.

That the thing this update makes you less likely to see the odd ball builds in wvw as you will have to max your power dmg or healing to keep up OR you NEED to have a gurd or 2 in every group just to have enofe stab as they are nerfing number of targets for the support stab and nerfing every one self stab.

This update is the worst way to promote fun game play.

Guard is already in every group... You must be new.

But you will need more as they no longer hit 10 targets and lack as much support stab AND classes who had some version of self stab is only getting nerfed by being made into 60 sec cd. We can also point out that blocks and non healing support will become much stronger something witch guard has and other support classes do not.

The thing with 2 support guards is that you start running out of space for damage, you generally want a rev and necro in that party too. But than you also need a thief or 2 and some warrior things. Who does damage now, how much? With pretty much all applications of might being 6s, someone has to provide that to, maybe a mesmer with 40s extension to all might stacks? But than you run out of damage slots and since cc does no damage now, being CCed might not kill you outright?

Will condi resurge? Some say that, but than again, the 2 classes most attuned for condi are rev and necro, with poor stunbreaks and basically no self stab, they just might not be viable, without 2 guards, but than you lose all benefits from above mentioned classes.

With such extensive changes, it is just not possible to determine the direction, until it's playtested and thus it means it's not as linear as you make it believe.

Right so you will only have room for "meta" class and "meta" builds removing the room for off builds and more "fun" that and you have to have more ppl playing guard and that type of game play in a game like this is a good way to get ppl to quit playing gw2. CC is getting an buff from this update all it may seem not you dont use cc skills for dmg so removing dmg from them is not a means of nerfing the skill it self but by nerfing stab skills as they are (mostly self stab) they are making it harder for ppl to "move in combat" as hard cc will stop ppl dead. Compounded with stun brake cd getting longer as well its going to be an out right mess. The ranged "pirate" ship meta will be coming back hard.

Conidl or power dmg if you stack enofe on over splized builds on the "meta" classes no amount of nerfs will fix as long as they go with numbers only. That the thing when you drop % effect numbers on skills you push the game into more exsteam builds. Your ele who use to build some def though vit gear may not need to go full zerk and be a zombly power bomber (they do not seem to be updating retal so the only real way of playing is to plan to go into down state to land real dmg) or your scraper who could at one point go in to do some type of dmg will need to go all in on healing power just to keep up with the lower healing power %.

Duration drop on effects of boons will not fix any of the problems with the boons them self its the effect of the boons that tend to be more of the problme when it comes to counter play and stacking. Wvw is an environment of plenty or non at all. If your have your comp. you will have every thing all the time if you do not have your comp. you will have nothing. So by only nerfing duration even cd your doing nothing for the balancing of comp. groups your only destroying non comp. groups making wvw a less fun places to play in.

This is NOT how you fix wvw. This is how you end wvw.

I'm sorry, but i disagree with this on so many levels, i don't even know how to respond.

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@VALARMORGHULIS.9173 said:OVERALL INPUT:

_**After playing this game for 7 years and maining necro for those 7 years with over 10k games in Spvp, and after being involved in the pvp community and attending 2 of the WTS lans I can say:

These are good changes for Spvp balance as a start.

It's hard to gauge how things will turn out because this time around - so many variables are being changed which is why nobody relevant in the spvp community has posted this thread yet.Most of their feedback will be on their streams to their viewers. So if you really want the inside scoop on their educated guesses go watch Chaith, Naru, Sindrener, Angels, Vallun, Grimjack, and Shorts, and don't be surprised if Helseth logs in to do a review.

Additionally, What most of us would like to see next:Now that damage, survivability, and sustain have been nerfed across the board - the devs need to start changing how skills, traits, and all that work (functionality).

Instead of responding with useless and lazy damage, survivability, and sustain nerfs, they need to change functionality of things that need to be buffed, or nerfed to add depth to the game, provide fun/entertaining/in depth counterplay opportunity, and change the way the conquest is currently being played for the better.

This is all a good start though. We are raising the skill ceiling on the game once again, and getting rid of cheese mode builds that require low skill, but have a big affect on matches such as condi mirage, s/p thief, and symbols firebrand. **_

-Contraversy

Well, couldn't put it better myself.

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This is really going to kill wvw.

Completely aside from my main classes being sword weaver and scrapper (of which you murdered in cold blood), you're bringing back what the majority of your player base complains about: condi meta is too strong. I really get a sense that Anet just tries things and hopes they stick, rather than legitimately listening to the overall player base. I'm fine with nerfs, that's part of balance. But this...this is ridiculous. These patch changes only prove: 1) to limit diversity for both roaming and zerg play and 2) that Anet considers skills from each class to be equal, when they aren't. Making templated nerfs doens't help solve a problem when you have 9 classes with 3 playstyles a piece. They're creating more problems than their solving, especially if people gravitate away from WvW.

Bottom line: rethink this Anet.

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@"God.2708" said:

Not to mention fairly irrelevant given the person I was replying to said 'developers, which had no clue about how the game worked in the competitive parts of the game' which is factually false given CmCs history and is probably coming from a player who in fact has no idea how the game works in the competitive parts.

The developer of my main class leaved ArenaNet more than a year ago and the replacement weren't able to make any patch without botchering the program code and introducing all kind of new bugs (or re-booting older ones). Sorry but science based in statistics and facts prevents me from "having faith" in the capabilities of the balance team. I also don't believe their promises of a fast cadence of patches: they promised the WvW server alliance revamp more than two years ago, and was ndever delivered, I could go on and on...

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Overall I like these changes.

I don't think condis were ever that impactful in WvW, even epi meta was only working because pets and downed states. So I don't share anyones conserns regarding condis being too strong in group play, in non-support roaming setting maybe.

My main consern is that player/commander skill level is already so low due to people relying to 10 man supporting and permasuperspeed that they won't be able to survive.

Thankfully times of one meteor, rev or warrior deleting your whole team will be over. Literally the most optimal way to play the game was just pressure enemy group 100% of time and ignore your own commander, provided you were skillful enough to stay alive. Now you can't just "do your own thing" but you need to do so with at least 1 other person if you hope to down people.

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@SloRules.3560 said:

@Xenash.1245 said:This whole back and forth here is pointless and I don't really see why you guys are fighting with each other.

Personally yeah I guess I have to admit that I'm going to enjoy people having to think of their own builds for at least awhile, it might make things more enjoyable in turn. But at the same time I don't like the changes overall because they just seem poorly thought out and hit certain classes and specs far harder then the rest which will probably cause some issues with classes you'll see commonly.

@Xenash.1245 said:This whole back and forth here is pointless and I don't really see why you guys are fighting with each other.

Personally yeah I guess I have to admit that I'm going to enjoy people having to think of their own builds for at least awhile, it might make things more enjoyable in turn. But at the same time I don't like the changes overall because they just seem poorly thought out and hit certain classes and specs far harder then the rest which will probably cause some issues with classes you'll see commonly.

That the thing this update makes you less likely to see the odd ball builds in wvw as you will have to max your power dmg or healing to keep up OR you NEED to have a gurd or 2 in every group just to have enofe stab as they are nerfing number of targets for the support stab and nerfing every one self stab.

This update is the worst way to promote fun game play.

Guard is already in every group... You must be new.

@Xenash.1245 said:This whole back and forth here is pointless and I don't really see why you guys are fighting with each other.

Personally yeah I guess I have to admit that I'm going to enjoy people having to think of their own builds for at least awhile, it might make things more enjoyable in turn. But at the same time I don't like the changes overall because they just seem poorly thought out and hit certain classes and specs far harder then the rest which will probably cause some issues with classes you'll see commonly.

@Xenash.1245 said:This whole back and forth here is pointless and I don't really see why you guys are fighting with each other.

Personally yeah I guess I have to admit that I'm going to enjoy people having to think of their own builds for at least awhile, it might make things more enjoyable in turn. But at the same time I don't like the changes overall because they just seem poorly thought out and hit certain classes and specs far harder then the rest which will probably cause some issues with classes you'll see commonly.

That the thing this update makes you less likely to see the odd ball builds in wvw as you will have to max your power dmg or healing to keep up OR you NEED to have a gurd or 2 in every group just to have enofe stab as they are nerfing number of targets for the support stab and nerfing every one self stab.

This update is the worst way to promote fun game play.

Guard is already in every group... You must be new.

But you will need more as they no longer hit 10 targets and lack as much support stab AND classes who had some version of self stab is only getting nerfed by being made into 60 sec cd. We can also point out that blocks and non healing support will become much stronger something witch guard has and other support classes do not.

The thing with 2 support guards is that you start running out of space for damage, you generally want a rev and necro in that party too. But than you also need a thief or 2 and some warrior things. Who does damage now, how much? With pretty much all applications of might being 6s, someone has to provide that to, maybe a mesmer with 40s extension to all might stacks? But than you run out of damage slots and since cc does no damage now, being CCed might not kill you outright?

Will condi resurge? Some say that, but than again, the 2 classes most attuned for condi are rev and necro, with poor stunbreaks and basically no self stab, they just might not be viable, without 2 guards, but than you lose all benefits from above mentioned classes.

With such extensive changes, it is just not possible to determine the direction, until it's playtested and thus it means it's not as linear as you make it believe.

Right so you will only have room for "meta" class and "meta" builds removing the room for off builds and more "fun" that and you have to have more ppl playing guard and that type of game play in a game like this is a good way to get ppl to quit playing gw2. CC is getting an buff from this update all it may seem not you dont use cc skills for dmg so removing dmg from them is not a means of nerfing the skill it self but by nerfing stab skills as they are (mostly self stab) they are making it harder for ppl to "move in combat" as hard cc will stop ppl dead. Compounded with stun brake cd getting longer as well its going to be an out right mess. The ranged "pirate" ship meta will be coming back hard.

Conidl or power dmg if you stack enofe on over splized builds on the "meta" classes no amount of nerfs will fix as long as they go with numbers only. That the thing when you drop % effect numbers on skills you push the game into more exsteam builds. Your ele who use to build some def though vit gear may not need to go full zerk and be a zombly power bomber (they do not seem to be updating retal so the only real way of playing is to plan to go into down state to land real dmg) or your scraper who could at one point go in to do some type of dmg will need to go all in on healing power just to keep up with the lower healing power %.

Duration drop on effects of boons will not fix any of the problems with the boons them self its the effect of the boons that tend to be more of the problme when it comes to counter play and stacking. Wvw is an environment of plenty or non at all. If your have your comp. you will have every thing all the time if you do not have your comp. you will have nothing. So by only nerfing duration even cd your doing nothing for the balancing of comp. groups your only destroying non comp. groups making wvw a less fun places to play in.

This is NOT how you fix wvw. This is how you end wvw.

I'm sorry, but i disagree with this on so many levels, i don't even know how to respond.

Just response point for point that what i try to do.

My reason is knowing how ppl play the game and how comp. groups work and what it will take to win fights.

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@"DeadlySynz.3471" said:Barely anybody want to go back to the warrior/guardian meta of old.The funny thing is that we may have passed a point where this is starting to become true.However, those "barely anybody" are still the people who are in guilds and do command. For large-scale purposes, their oppinion is valuable and the people who join their pickup squads, well, their oppinions on the matter has virtually no value at all. If a commander leaves a squad he will be missed by 49 other people. If an anonymous self-entitled backliner leaves the squad he will be missed by no one. That is the cold hard truth.

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@subversiontwo.7501 said:

@"DeadlySynz.3471" said:Barely anybody want to go back to the warrior/guardian meta of old.The funny thing is that we may have passed a point where this is starting to become true.However, those "barely anybody" are still the people who are in guilds and do command. For large-scale purposes, their oppinion is valuable and the people who join their pickup squads, well, their oppinions on the matter has virtually no value at all. If a commander leaves a squad he will be missed by 49 other people. If an anonymous self-entitled backliner leaves the squad he will be missed by no one. That is the cold hard truth.

The comparison you make at the end is very biased though, flip it and consider "If the high damage backliner leaves a squad he will be missed by 49 other people. If an anonymous self-entitled commander leaves the squad he will be missed by no one. That is the cold hard truth."

I've seen open tags literally crumble in minutes because 3 guys left who were doing the bulk of the work at the right time, they often don't appear on the logs because getting 10 downs and moving on to down others gives less dps. The 2 FBs that carry the rest of the group get no recognition for stunbreaking those 5-10 guys who would have rallied the enemy losing a rally war, the healers who hand back to make sure the slow aren't culled too quickly.

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@apharma.3741 said:

@"DeadlySynz.3471" said:Barely anybody want to go back to the warrior/guardian meta of old.The funny thing is that we may have passed a point where this is starting to become true.However, those "barely anybody" are still the people who are in guilds and do command. For large-scale purposes, their oppinion is valuable and the people who join their pickup squads, well, their oppinions on the matter has virtually no value at all. If a commander leaves a squad he will be missed by 49 other people. If an anonymous self-entitled backliner leaves the squad he will be missed by no one. That is the cold hard truth.

The comparison you make at the end is very biased though, flip it and consider "If the high damage backliner leaves a squad he will be missed by 49 other people. If an anonymous self-entitled commander leaves the squad he will be missed by no one. That is the cold hard truth."

I've seen open tags literally crumble in minutes because 3 guys left who were doing the bulk of the work at the right time, they often don't appear on the logs because getting 10 downs and moving on to down others gives less dps. The 2 FBs that carry the rest of the group get no recognition for stunbreaking those 5-10 guys who would have rallied the enemy losing a rally war, the healers who hand back to make sure the slow aren't culled too quickly.

That high damage backliner is gvg player or former gvg player though.

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@SloRules.3560 said:

@"DeadlySynz.3471" said:Barely anybody want to go back to the warrior/guardian meta of old.The funny thing is that we may have passed a point where this is starting to become true.However, those "barely anybody" are still the people who are in guilds and do command. For large-scale purposes, their oppinion is valuable and the people who join their pickup squads, well, their oppinions on the matter has virtually no value at all. If a commander leaves a squad he will be missed by 49 other people. If an anonymous self-entitled backliner leaves the squad he will be missed by no one. That is the cold hard truth.

The comparison you make at the end is very biased though, flip it and consider "If the high damage backliner leaves a squad he will be missed by 49 other people. If an anonymous self-entitled commander leaves the squad he will be missed by no one. That is the cold hard truth."

I've seen open tags literally crumble in minutes because 3 guys left who were doing the bulk of the work at the right time, they often don't appear on the logs because getting 10 downs and moving on to down others gives less dps. The 2 FBs that carry the rest of the group get no recognition for stunbreaking those 5-10 guys who would have rallied the enemy losing a rally war, the healers who hand back to make sure the slow aren't culled too quickly.

That high damage backliner is gvg player or former gvg player though.

@"DeadlySynz.3471" said:Barely anybody want to go back to the warrior/guardian meta of old.The funny thing is that we may have passed a point where this is starting to become true.However, those "barely anybody" are still the people who are in guilds and do command. For large-scale purposes, their oppinion is valuable and the people who join their pickup squads, well, their oppinions on the matter has virtually no value at all. If a commander leaves a squad he will be missed by 49 other people. If an anonymous self-entitled backliner leaves the squad he will be missed by no one. That is the cold hard truth.

The comparison you make at the end is very biased though, flip it and consider "If the high damage backliner leaves a squad he will be missed by 49 other people. If an anonymous self-entitled commander leaves the squad he will be missed by no one. That is the cold hard truth."

I've seen open tags literally crumble in minutes because 3 guys left who were doing the bulk of the work at the right time, they often don't appear on the logs because getting 10 downs and moving on to down others gives less dps. The 2 FBs that carry the rest of the group get no recognition for stunbreaking those 5-10 guys who would have rallied the enemy losing a rally war, the healers who hand back to make sure the slow aren't culled too quickly.

That high damage backliner is gvg player or former gvg player though.

Maybe the old ele players its the only way to be "good" at the roll at this point in the game. There so much better skills and effects to be a mid range dps.

The thing is dmg is dropping on your back line but retaliation is not as well as passive def / boons effects. This game will oddly become more ranged aim from the stab updates coming down the line BUT only for your mid ranged classes who have build in def and will not simply grind them self on retaliation dmg. Ele will need to go bezerk gear so 12k hp build taking 200ish every target hit. Seeing that they can hit a lot of targets at the same time you will find them taking more dmg from there own spells then what the other team is doing in attks. That with less healing effects making it all the worst.

This update is very much not though out.

Added note i love how the ele update in the gen. notes is mostly about its pets that no one will still use after the update.

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@Strider Pj.2193 said:

@"Burnfall.9573" said:few minutes ago couple of us were fighting a Thief Profession player who was teleporting back and forth inside Klovan. Afterward, she told us that she noticed that Anet hasn't even mentioned Thief teleport hack in the upcoming balance and laughed.

Yeah, she spoke to me after we returned to Klovan; she was quite relaxed with us as her teammates stood by,

She then asked me to add her to my following list as she added me to hers so she could 'show me after the balance patch how it is done'.

I'm no longer surprised by Thief Players exploiting their designs and will continue to congratulate them of doing it. Also i encourage everyone to not report them for doing so. As she also said, "Anet is cool with it' so in return, we should be cool with it also.

Anet doesn't care because if they did, they would have done something about it long time ago, so why bother reporting.

Kudos to that Thief Profession Player

(as always, i never put blame on Thief Profession players for being Toxic, but solely blame Anet for designing them this way)

(as in game, some are good spirit individuals, can;'t blame them)

But wait... you don’t play and you were going for another month.

So...,

We took a break from playing Square Enix: Final Fantasy 14 and so i finally decided to help some guild wars 2 twitch players take Klovan. They also play guild wars 2 and had helped me alot so just showing gratitude when i can.

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@jakolasku.4971 said:Arrow carts are the winners of the patch. With all the healing coefficient nerfs they just annihilate blobs. I am going to bring them to open field battles as well.

Ballistas, and get two people co ordinated on voice comms to fire at exactly the same time at the same spot..it'll be great for stopping zergs coming through gates too...

As for rangers..did I see they nerfed barrage to only 5 targets plus nerfed damage...urgh. Throwing wet noodles now.

I'll be one of those using siege- expect more siege wars.

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@Pemberly.6305 said:

Cooldowns and Durations

We want cooldowns to be felt. Longer cooldowns promote more calculated usage of skills; if skills are used poorly it should create an opportunity for the enemy to push their advantage. Shorter durations of high impact buffs have a similar effect. Skillful timing is going to be rewarded, and poor usage is going to be exploitable by enemies. In some cases, it’s still going to make sense to have a longer duration attached to a longer cooldown, but most of the time we’re looking at shorter durations for things like stability, protection, quickness, high might stacks, among others.

Instant Skills and Passive Traits

Counterplay is important. Skills that have a major impact on an enemy player should allow that player the opportunity to react, which means that we want to avoid instant skills that do large amounts of damage or hard cc. In general, this means that instant skills are going to deal less damage or focus more on a secondary effect where applicable. Traits that fire instant skills, or that trigger an offensive effect under easy to fulfill conditions (on hit, on crit, mid-high health threshold, etc.) received similar considerations.

We’ve also done a pass on traits that provide automatic defensive triggers. Traits that negate incoming CC or grant hard damage mitigation are getting large cooldown increases. Lesser defensive procs (protection on cc, auto condition cleanse, etc.) are also receiving longer cooldowns or reduced effectiveness, though not as extreme. We want to promote more active gameplay and this update is a good opportunity to make heavier adjustments to these passive traits.

haven’t seen this mentioned, so here is my 2 coppers....This is going to kill WvW 50 on 50 fights dominated by skill lag.

How can you time spell casts as required above when your servers can’t keep up?

Also, what happens to players who have 300 ping? With shorter durations of channeled casts, what happens in the client when the server thinks the spell cast is over before the animation has begun? What about players whose hardware has a FPS of 25 in Zerg on Zerg fights? How can they time spells?Players in OCX and SEA time slots just got screwed.

While the proposed changes may be good for sPvP, and 1v1 roamers, map queue on map queue fights are screwed.

Use the force, Pemberly.

Joking, I am not.

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