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@"pointaction.4639" said:I say Hybrid builds and Condi builds will be the meta.The latter will be viable for a few weeks until people realize "oh right we still have condi cleanses" and stack up on supports once again while the former will be continously phased over the coming months out as zerg commanders yell "where the kitten is my kitten kittens kitten damage you kitten kittens learn to kitten bomb!" and refuse to command.

Regarding Build-Changes, I only know in detail about engineers, but heal- and power-scrappers are mostly untouched (except explosive line).Ha, no. Alchemy nerfed, tools nerfed, healing nerfed (medkit 1 nerfed, elixir gun 5 nerfed, MDF nerfed, boon conversion duration nerfed). Condi heavily nerfed as well, both pistols (no more 4 burst) and firearms (~50% less durations and damage), but that doesnt affect power and heal scrappers. Hammer nerfed though.

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@Dawdler.8521 said:

Regarding Build-Changes, I only know in detail about engineers, but heal- and power-scrappers are mostly untouched (except explosive line).Ha, no. Alchemy nerfed, tools nerfed, healing nerfed (medkit 1 nerfed, elixir gun 5 nerfed, MDF nerfed, boon conversion duration nerfed). Condi heavily nerfed as well, both pistols (no more 4 burst) and firearms (~50% less durations and damage), but that doesnt affect power and heal scrappers. Hammer nerfed though.

Sorry, I didn't express myself correctly. While the traits and skills are nerfed the builds stay mostly the same. You still run purity of purpose, despite the shorter boons.In the end, you will pick the same traits, skills, and equipment (except those that went for blast-gyro) after the patch. And since most nerfs are average compared to other classes, the composition will also not likely change... tools are also not really nerfed in our case since we run lense+steamlined+gadgeteer(mines).Cleanses stayed mostly the same interestingly... also shredder-gyro, Bandage-self, and vital-burst was not touched...

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i'll concentrate on the guardian changes, because they are the ones i can say most about.

Several things got gutted. Damage scaling on most of the weapons. The staffs healing and might application. Healing in general and boon application. I would roughly estimate that Guardian loses about 50 % of its healing.

Now it completely depends on how engeneer and Elemental are treated healingwise. they also got a bit tuned down but may still be stronger healwise.

One thing will happen for sure: The skill ceiling of guarding will rise. it will rise to pre pof levels, and even above. If your guard is bad, your whole group will suffer badly. I think a lot of people underestimate how forgiving guardian is right now and how effectiv you still are, even if you suck. The gap between good and bad will widen by a huge margin.

Healing will lose some overall effectiveness in comparison too other tools. Guardian is not that much affected by that because litereally all his other stats got gutted as well.But it is quite possible, that healing power wont be main stat anymore.But neither will power due to reduced scalings but rather precision. I expect something pretty wild mixes, probably celestial making a big comeback.Staff will be dropped as a weapon.Mace and shield will stay because they literelly kept all their healing. probably Greatsword again for some spiking.

Ult Mantra will stay, as will stand your ground. and the cleansing mantra, Merciful intervention will be dropped. Purging will make a comeback, not touched at all.

Contemplation of purity will be of more interest as well.

But we will see.

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@Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

@"Burnfall.9573" said:Toxic Recycle Meta is the correct name for it

'So, I decided to take a look at condi deadeye.And oh my lord, why is this even a thing? All gear is level 80 exotics.This build is so hilariously disgusting I can only advise every not to play it, because wow.'

'Really nobody should be playing this, it's unacceptably [Toxic]'

How is this built?

This is what I run when im bored:

Your toon is set up differently so im intrigued.

It isn’t Burns toon. Stabitha has a page where they state it’s Dire and Rabid, thorn runes, and the channel has no other info as per their reply ‘it’s too cancer’

Anything thief is deletable per burn.

Dang, mine is cancer (saw someone use it vs me and I got rekt so I wanted to learn how to counter), however the one in the vid seems stronger. Ill have to do come research now

Edit: Theres 1 aspect of their build I am unsure of, however i believe ive gotten the rest down

The "1 thing" you are missing is they 2v1 every fight. There is a second deadeye playing anything, cause you should win every 2v1.

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@Dawdler.8521 said:

@"pointaction.4639" said:I say Hybrid builds and Condi builds will be the meta.The latter will be viable for a few weeks until people realize "oh right we still have condi cleanses" and stack up on supports once again while the former will be continously phased over the coming months out as zerg commanders yell "where the kitten is my kitten kittens kitten damage you kitten kittens learn to kitten bomb!" and refuse to command.

Regarding Build-Changes, I only know in detail about engineers, but heal- and power-scrappers are mostly untouched (except explosive line).Ha, no. Alchemy nerfed, tools nerfed, healing nerfed (medkit 1 nerfed, elixir gun 5 nerfed, MDF nerfed, boon conversion duration nerfed). Condi heavily nerfed as well, both pistols (no more 4 burst) and firearms (~50% less durations and damage), but that doesnt affect power and heal scrappers. Hammer nerfed though.

Lol, you have ran with Cookie :)

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The meta is not going to change because ANET didnt really shake up the main culprits. FBs will still be boonspam, scourge will still be Condi Bombs, Scrapper will still be condi cleanse, SBs will still do Bubbles...

This only reduces one shot builds, which I hate to say provides outsider profs some kind of usefulness in team fights outside of roaming.

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@DragonSlayer.1087 said:The meta is not going to change because ANET didnt really shake up the main culprits. FBs will still be boonspam, scourge will still be Condi Bombs, Scrapper will still be condi cleanse, SBs will still do Bubbles...

This only reduces one shot builds, which I hate to say provides outsider profs some kind of usefulness in team fights outside of roaming.

please show me a video of a scourge using a 'condi bomb' since dhuumfire was nerfed?

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@RisenHowl.2419 said:

@DragonSlayer.1087 said:The meta is not going to change because ANET didnt really shake up the main culprits. FBs will still be boonspam, scourge will still be Condi Bombs, Scrapper will still be condi cleanse, SBs will still do Bubbles...

This only reduces one shot builds, which I hate to say provides outsider profs some kind of usefulness in team fights outside of roaming.

please show me a video of a scourge using a 'condi bomb' since dhuumfire was nerfed?

Think they mean condition corruption bombs not condition damage bombs like burn guards...

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Could also become:

1support guard2 burn guards1condi cleanser1to put up cover conditions, also being able to strip boons (most likely scourge) or rev (depends on how rev changes play out)

Why this setup:Burn guard doesn't see any significant nerfs, if I saw that right and it can already be one of the best damage dealers in zergfights.Firebrand support is a no-brainer as well as an additional Condi cleanser, as condis will get more popular again.


For scourge I think it'll be a hybrid meta (either cele or grieving with a bit of cele) cause Wells didn't get nerfed that hard.

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@Seffen.2875 said:i'll concentrate on the guardian changes, because they are the ones i can say most about.

Several things got gutted. Damage scaling on most of the weapons. The staffs healing and might application. Healing in general and boon application. I would roughly estimate that Guardian loses about 50 % of its healing.

Now it completely depends on how engeneer and Elemental are treated healingwise. they also got a bit tuned down but may still be stronger healwise.

One thing will happen for sure: The skill ceiling of guarding will rise. it will rise to pre pof levels, and even above. If your guard is bad, your whole group will suffer badly. I think a lot of people underestimate how forgiving guardian is right now and how effectiv you still are, even if you suck. The gap between good and bad will widen by a huge margin.

Healing will lose some overall effectiveness in comparison too other tools. Guardian is not that much affected by that because litereally all his other stats got gutted as well.But it is quite possible, that healing power wont be main stat anymore.But neither will power due to reduced scalings but rather precision. I expect something pretty wild mixes, probably celestial making a big comeback.Staff will be dropped as a weapon.Mace and shield will stay because they literelly kept all their healing. probably Greatsword again for some spiking.

Ult Mantra will stay, as will stand your ground. and the cleansing mantra, Merciful intervention will be dropped. Purging will make a comeback, not touched at all.

Contemplation of purity will be of more interest as well.

But we will see.

I see alot of guards going for condi dmg, burn applications are almost untouched. Burn guards are on the rise.

@Dediggefedde.4961 said:I don't think the composition will change much. I also doubt that the used stats will change much.Perhaps guards go less towards concentration and more healers try cleric instead of minstrel...

We noticed that the number of conditions increased, but at the moment, incoming damage is 80% power damage. The main problem for years was always movement impeding conditions, not damaging ones. Since the cleanse amount is mostly untouched by the patch, the relative amount of condi-dmg goes up, but the absolute stays the same. Especially with the shift from stacks to duration on many skills, there will be little trouble.A group with power-scrappers, dmg-spellbreaker, and tempest-supporter will have little trouble against condi builds.

Regarding Build-Changes, I only know in detail about engineers, but heal- and power-scrappers are mostly untouched (except explosive line).

The largest impact might actually come from the details.Big-hit skills with CC that were nerfed from 3.0 to 0.01 coefficient (e.g. prime-light-beam).Other strong skills that are not listed and unchanged (like shredder-gyro or bomb-1).In my opinion, these details will have the largest impact on composition and equipment.

That being said, I think this patch is actually great and will lead to more build diversity, especially at roaming, but also for zergs.

Dmg spellbreaker, what a meme.Most of those were carried by auto endure pain and auto balanced stance, thats on 5min cd, im already seeing them drop like flies, dmg hasnt beed reduced that much, that they cant be reduced from 100 to 0 in a second.

And other classes do way more Dmg more reliably from safer positions or with better defenses.

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@LetoII.3782 said:

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:double cele radiance fb's gogogo

There's so many better ways to gear fb than Cele man....

AgreedThe temptation is always there to diversify, but it doesn't scale 1:1. When you try to get a little bit better with a secondary role you end up A LOT worse in your main role.

Shhhh. Everything should be cele with stars sigil and runes. Dye armor in rainbow formation, and wiggle your arms in combat all the while shrieking with a high pitch. This display will strike fear into the heart of most enemies.

D:

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@GDchiaScrub.3241 said:

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:double cele radiance fb's gogogo

There's so many better ways to gear fb than Cele man....

AgreedThe temptation is always there to diversify, but it doesn't scale 1:1. When you try to get a little bit better with a secondary role you end up A LOT worse in your main role.

Shhhh. Everything should be cele with stars sigil and runes. Dye armor in rainbow formation, and wiggle your arms in combat all the while shrieking with a high pitch. This display will strike fear into the heart of most enemies.

D:

Wait... are you on TC?

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@Strider Pj.2193 said:

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:double cele radiance fb's gogogo

There's so many better ways to gear fb than Cele man....

AgreedThe temptation is always there to diversify, but it doesn't scale 1:1. When you try to get a little bit better with a secondary role you end up A LOT worse in your main role.

Shhhh. Everything should be cele with stars sigil and runes. Dye armor in rainbow formation, and wiggle your arms in combat all the while shrieking with a high pitch. This display will strike fear into the heart of most enemies.

D:

Wait... are you on TC?

I can only confirm that at least 2 people in this quote chain have ever graced the Holy Lands of the Tarnished Coast.

D:

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@GDchiaScrub.3241 said:

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:double cele radiance fb's gogogo

There's so many better ways to gear fb than Cele man....

AgreedThe temptation is always there to diversify, but it doesn't scale 1:1. When you try to get a little bit better with a secondary role you end up A LOT worse in your main role.

Shhhh. Everything should be cele with stars sigil and runes. Dye armor in rainbow formation, and wiggle your arms in combat all the while shrieking with a high pitch. This display will strike fear into the heart of most enemies.

D:

Wait... are you on TC?

I can only confirm that at least 2 people in this quote chain have ever graced the Holy Lands of the Tarnished Coast.

D:

Make it three...

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