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[Feedback] New Drakkar Fight


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@Hannelore.8153 said:

@"Arden.7480" said:Felt kinda meh... It was still just punching his poor left leg, nothing more.

They should make it so when you break his bar he falls out of the ice and flat on the ground for a while instead of the usual "foot fight".

ArenaNet loves dragon feet(?).

That's neat, that's neat, that's neat, that's neat, they really love their dragon feet.

(Points for old fogies who get this.)

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@Manasa Devi.7958 said:

@"ron.6157" said:ok what in the kittens is going on in the office let me start out with yes Drakkar needed some buffing to match all the hype but as in the past OVERKILL 3 times now on maps that arnt quite full TT with a map roughly the same does better same with shatter after it got its buff and in the jahi fight but kitten when I see it take the full 20 min and health is at like 70% still well like I said OVER KILL I stoped doing AB meta for one reason got sick of sudo commander barking do this go there and when kitten went south it was every ones falt it faild as for this posable new drop I wont go in to how that's going to pan out I have played gw and gw2 frome bata as for GW2 to date never see a pree drop ascended drop take a look at that mount you all called a Pegasus a cross between a Unicorn and a Griffon or as I call it the out come of My Little Pony having kittens with a griffon get my point OVERkill don't fix things using the noodle between them ears and thinking it threw does if this is where GW is heading ill go back to Table top rpg's at least I can smack the GM up side his head for being a fool

You see that symbol between "ron" and "6157"? It's called a period, and its use is encouraged.

I’m stealing this BTW.

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@hugo.4705 said:02/11/2020—February 11 Release Notes~SNIP~With greater risks come greater rewards. Drakkar rewards have been updated with a new Broken Voice ascended weapon set, as well as other additions. Defeating Drakkar will also give an increased amount of experience once per day.-> Well I think there is an issue with that giant frozen chest! Everytime I do Drakkar it doesn't open like I'm not looting it with autoloot! Can't check because can't interact with it! If it's bugged it means I missed ton of loot! I don't see any difference, doing a 30 min meta for a such big unrewarding scam is outrageous.


~SNIP~

Last I checked the Auto-loot feature on World Boss chests does not open the chest on the map, it just automatically adds the loot to your inventory but the chest does show as already looted in the mini-map(on your mini-map the chest icon is open). You can walk up to the chest and try to interact, but you can't because you already auto-looted it, that's how it works for all of the World Bosses.

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Just ran the fight and noticed a few things:

  • Ran it on a map that wasn't full and had no problems completing the meta with about 6 minutes left on the clock - not any different than before
  • only new attack - extra shockwave added when Drakkar pops out of the ice during the champ/shield phase
  • no noticeable penalty for not grabbing the ice orb
  • Svanir Seers spawned during the shield phase that wiped the entire map squad not fighting the champ
  • CC definitely took longer but didn't have a meaningful impact on play
  • Champs had more HP, but not enough for their damage increase to register
  • stomp shockwaves deal a lot more damage
  • health bar definitely a little smaller
  • Loot seemed about the same; no one linked an Ascended drop on that map

Overall, lethality definitely increased, but the fight doesn't feel significantly different.

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@Liston.9708 said:lockout the 'ledge leechers' from rewards and achieves.

This is definitely causing bad blood...

...it really would bring more peace to the community to just lock the entrance behind the players once they get into the first part of the Arena and do the same with the second moshpit so everyone is forced to take part in the fight. Im not grumpy if some people afk sometimes but thats not an achievement that should be honored.

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Before the patch did it with a group of 30ish people fine. Since the patch tried twice with similar size groups both were fails, didn't even reach the last champ. Wouldn't be so bad if the meta wasn't so long.The meta is now a blobfest. I thought Anet were trying to get away from that sort of thing?

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  • ArenaNet Staff

Hey there everyone, thanks for taking the time to post your feedback on yesterday's changes. Your thoughts are incredibly important to us, and help us work to make the game a better experience for everyone.

There's one thing I'd like to clarify about yesterday's patch notes: Specifically, the note "Drakkar has gained new abilities."

We should've been clearer with this patch note since "new abiltities" is pretty vague--so we wanted to give you some more information on them. These additions were focused on providing a clear incentive to participate in mechanics by punishing failure, as well as giving you reasons to engage with some of the previously arbitrary mechanics.

The Falling Ice Orbs, for example, have a larger and more damaging attack that fires if no one catches the orb--so when you're performing the mechanic correctly, you're not seeing that punishment skill (way to go, being responsible!)

Additionally, Jhavi's shield in the intermission phase now provides protection from the storm (which deals constant damage if you're outside it), and allows you to go out and attack adds - but that protection only lasts a short time once you leave the shield, so you have to balance grabbing the buff with going after incoming enemies, or pulling them into the shield and damaging them down.

Finally, as some of you have experienced, we introduced a unique flavor mechanic to the fight when the group fails, to make it clearer that Drakkar's influence has won out in the struggle.

With these changes, we specifically wanted players to feel punished for ignoring mechanics, while still allowing for a few people to be the "heroes" of the group and save their allies from certain death. Since this is an open world encounter, it's important to encourage coordination while maintaining accessibility, especially as we get further into this content's life span and more diverse player groups of varying skill levels tackle it.

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@"Cameron Rich.3905" said:With these changes, we specifically wanted players to feel punished for ignoring mechanics, while still allowing for a few people to be the "heroes" of the group and save their allies from certain death. Since this is an open world encounter, it's important to encourage coordination while maintaining accessibility, especially as we get further into this content's life span and more diverse player groups of varying skill levels tackle it.

I suspect we're already approaching the end of this content's life span, Cameron. It's a bloated, over-long event that does not reward the player for their 30 minutes.

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@"Cameron Rich.3905" said:Hey there everyone, thanks for taking the time to post your feedback on yesterday's changes. Your thoughts are incredibly important to us, and help us work to make the game a better experience for everyone.

There's one thing I'd like to clarify about yesterday's patch notes: Specifically, the note "Drakkar has gained new abilities."

We should've been clearer with this patch note since "new abiltities" is pretty vague--so we wanted to give you some more information on them. These additions were focused on providing a clear incentive to participate in mechanics by punishing failure, as well as giving you reasons to engage with some of the previously arbitrary mechanics.

The Falling Ice Orbs, for example, have a larger and more damaging attack that fires if no one catches the orb--so when you're performing the mechanic correctly, you're not seeing that punishment skill (way to go, being responsible!)

Additionally, Jhavi's shield in the intermission phase now provides protection from the storm (which deals constant damage if you're outside it), and allows you to go out and attack adds - but that protection only lasts a short time once you leave the shield, so you have to balance grabbing the buff with going after incoming enemies, or pulling them into the shield and damaging them down.

Finally, as some of you have experienced, we introduced a unique flavor mechanic to the fight when the group fails, to make it clearer that Drakkar's influence has won out in the struggle.

With these changes, we specifically wanted players to feel punished for ignoring mechanics, while still allowing for a few people to be the "heroes" of the group and save their allies from certain death. Since this is an open world encounter, it's important to encourage coordination while maintaining accessibility, especially as we get further into this content's life span and more diverse player groups of varying skill levels tackle it.

Thanks for the reply.

Sadly none of your intentions have shone through. It's a mild adjustment at best. There is no punishment because failure with a a full group is almost impossible. It's a very long fight, which is barely more than a straight dps bashing.

  • The shield of Jhavi is never at risk. Why do you even need to leave it when there is no reason or incentive to do so? The mobs are totally insignifcant to the fight.
  • The visual noise is too intense for most to notice the new attacks. And even if you get hit harder, so what? It doesn't affect the overall flow of the fight. A bit more rezzing at best. Visual noise is a huge impediment in your game. I maintain this needs more urgent attention and careful planning in the design phase. Instead you seem to be stacking it more and more and more.
  • It's too condensed. I know you wanted claustrophobic, but ambience should never win out over gameplay in a boss fight. It should be second nature to be designing bosses that split up the playerbase by now. Once you get that nailed, then worry about ambience. This fight def would have been better out in the open and not crammed in a tiny cave (too late now). That would have helped give flexibility with mechanics, helped with splitting the playerbase and thus mitigated the intensity of the visual noise.
  • Accessibility is fine, but interesting fights also need consideration. This is a zerg fest. There is no punishment for ignoring the mechanics. No reward for coordination. The group piles in, a few go off an do champs which are destroyed without any effort. Even if the group doesn't split evenly it doesn't matter because 2-3 people on one champ might be slow, but doesn't affect the shield

Why not utilise Drakkar's uniqueness in the fight? The whispers for example. It needs meaningful mechanics and a feeling of accomplishment when beaten. There needs to be consequences to failing those mechanics as well and unless you are in a small group, who prob wont have the dps anyway, it doesn't have that.

  • Look at Tequatl. The mechanics aren't challenging, but ignore them and it is all over. Plus it took time for players to work out how to utilise the turrets and where to split groups up to. Being easy is fine, but having something to learn should be mandatory.
  • Look at Gerent. One lane fails to protect the thumpers, everyone fails - communication and coordination is key
  • Look at Tarir. Very easy meta, but it only takes one lane not to pay attention and the meta half resets
  • Look at Vinewrath. One lane fails and a stack builds up. Too many lost carriers and meta over

These are all accessible with consequences and punishments. They also mitigate the visual noise problem pretty well. Use the knowledge you have built up - dont go back to bad habits with design. Whilst I would have preferred a Triple Trouble kind of fight, it needn't be that hard. It just needs those consequences and it needs to be interesting - it's a half hour investment after all.

You seem worried about the life expectancy of the fight, yet all the above examples are still played daily. If you are worried Drakkar is going to be a struggle within the same Season, that does not bode well for the game's future.

If I forgot to mention it...the visual noise problem could use sorting.....

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@"Cameron Rich.3905" said:Hey there everyone, thanks for taking the time to post your feedback on yesterday's changes. Your thoughts are incredibly important to us, and help us work to make the game a better experience for everyone.

There's one thing I'd like to clarify about yesterday's patch notes: Specifically, the note "Drakkar has gained new abilities."

We should've been clearer with this patch note since "new abiltities" is pretty vague--so we wanted to give you some more information on them. These additions were focused on providing a clear incentive to participate in mechanics by punishing failure, as well as giving you reasons to engage with some of the previously arbitrary mechanics.

The Falling Ice Orbs, for example, have a larger and more damaging attack that fires if no one catches the orb--so when you're performing the mechanic correctly, you're not seeing that punishment skill (way to go, being responsible!)

Additionally, Jhavi's shield in the intermission phase now provides protection from the storm (which deals constant damage if you're outside it), and allows you to go out and attack adds - but that protection only lasts a short time once you leave the shield, so you have to balance grabbing the buff with going after incoming enemies, or pulling them into the shield and damaging them down.

Finally, as some of you have experienced, we introduced a unique flavor mechanic to the fight when the group fails, to make it clearer that Drakkar's influence has won out in the struggle.

With these changes, we specifically wanted players to feel punished for ignoring mechanics, while still allowing for a few people to be the "heroes" of the group and save their allies from certain death. Since this is an open world encounter, it's important to encourage coordination while maintaining accessibility, especially as we get further into this content's life span and more diverse player groups of varying skill levels tackle it.

The changes to the fight have made it even more of a blob-fest. Without a blob the odds are you will now fail.The "unique flavour mechanic" is probably the worst idea you have ever implemented. There are already people talking about forming squads on maps to deliberately screw with the Drakkar event to deliberately make it fail and make the "unique flavour mechanic" happen. The "unique flavour mechanic" encourages trolling and is anti-social.

You seriously need to consider rolling this event back and rethinking your changes.

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@"Nidome.1365" said:The changes to the fight have made it even more of a blob-fest. Without a blob the odds are you will now fail.The "unique flavour mechanic" is probably the worst idea you have ever implemented. There are already people talking about forming squads on maps to deliberately screw with the Drakkar event to deliberately make it fail and make the "unique flavour mechanic" happen. The "unique flavour mechanic" encourages trolling and is anti-social.

THIS. I get that it's in theme, but there's an undercurrent of open-pvp-lol that's specifically out now to threaten the event. Giving any incentive to failure is going to put the players at odds with those who need that event.It feels like nothing was learned from Orr shrines...

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Nothing to reply, I have the same opinion as the last Randulf Post. I don't feel punished by anything. Inspire yourselves with the big metas out there. Plz god, we got "whispers" said everywhere, and those aren't even influencing the fight. Now bring those kodans helping javi to continue the shield, make svanir totems mechanics/ svanir healers or whatever interesting in the fight and we can speak about it.

TLDR: Your fight is currently "jump jump jump", "be bored under javi shield because no gate buff", "gather your awful reward". It's not motivating at all.

I'm sorry for you Cameron, seems like made of good attentions, but haven't seen anything you said in the fight, nothing. It's still meh a zerg fest with skill 1 spam and just jumping over waves really sad.

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I even don't know what to say about this "unique flavour mechanic". When I first read about PVP in this open world PVE event I was thinking about a bug. Now someone from ArenaNet is giving a statement that this is intended.This is a dealbreaker for many people. At least it is a dealbreaker for me.

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@"Cameron Rich.3905" said:Hey there everyone, thanks for taking the time to post your feedback on yesterday's changes. Your thoughts are incredibly important to us, and help us work to make the game a better experience for everyone.

There's one thing I'd like to clarify about yesterday's patch notes: Specifically, the note "Drakkar has gained new abilities."

We should've been clearer with this patch note since "new abiltities" is pretty vague--so we wanted to give you some more information on them. These additions were focused on providing a clear incentive to participate in mechanics by punishing failure, as well as giving you reasons to engage with some of the previously arbitrary mechanics.

The Falling Ice Orbs, for example, have a larger and more damaging attack that fires if no one catches the orb--so when you're performing the mechanic correctly, you're not seeing that punishment skill (way to go, being responsible!)

Additionally, Jhavi's shield in the intermission phase now provides protection from the storm (which deals constant damage if you're outside it), and allows you to go out and attack adds - but that protection only lasts a short time once you leave the shield, so you have to balance grabbing the buff with going after incoming enemies, or pulling them into the shield and damaging them down.

Finally, as some of you have experienced, we introduced a unique flavor mechanic to the fight when the group fails, to make it clearer that Drakkar's influence has won out in the struggle.

With these changes, we specifically wanted players to feel punished for ignoring mechanics, while still allowing for a few people to be the "heroes" of the group and save their allies from certain death. Since this is an open world encounter, it's important to encourage coordination while maintaining accessibility, especially as we get further into this content's life span and more diverse player groups of varying skill levels tackle it.

Good changes :) Fun meta.The scaling on champ2+3 doesnt seem to not work though? Or it really is because so many run to first champ, the first champ always takes 3-4 times as long as champ2 or champ3.A slight criticism, the green fields give a dmg buff, but drakkar always despawns after the green fields. Maybe change the timing slightly to give a longer burst phase?

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@"Cameron Rich.3905"

I respect your ideas and I respect that it is not for everyone, but it still bums me out that we have no say over it. You could arguably say that we are being "punished", but I'm sorry that's a tad bit excessive in my opinion. That said, I appreciate your honesty and forwardness. I will not be doing that meta, I fear. Thanks for the effort ya'll put into it though! Also, sorry if this is messy, I've been doing beadwork and my eyes are shot. XD

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@Nidome.1365 said:

@"Cameron Rich.3905" said:Hey there everyone, thanks for taking the time to post your feedback on yesterday's changes. Your thoughts are incredibly important to us, and help us work to make the game a better experience for everyone.

~snip~

Finally, as some of you have experienced, we introduced a unique flavor mechanic to the fight when the group fails, to make it clearer that Drakkar's influence has won out in the struggle.

~snip~

The changes to the fight have made it even more of a blob-fest. Without a blob the odds are you will now fail.The "unique flavour mechanic" is probably the worst idea you have ever implemented. There are already people talking about forming squads on maps to deliberately screw with the Drakkar event to deliberately make it fail and make the "unique flavour mechanic" happen. The "unique flavour mechanic" encourages trolling and is anti-social.

You seriously need to consider rolling this event back and rethinking your changes.

Full agreement here, and with other posters in this thread saying that this is a dealbreaker. There's a reason why forum posters have said for years that Open World PvP is a very bad idea for this game every time of of those threads asking for it come up.

"A better experience for everyone"? I'm sorry, but this is completely wrong.

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