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Was/is there a problem with matchmaking?


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I've started playing GW2 again after a couple of years, mostly enjoying PVP. I started out in Gold Tier at 1250 Rating. There I spent a couple of weeks, until last week, matches suddenly became really brutal, and I dropped down to Silver within a single day (down to about 1050 Rating).I've had big troubles climbing up again all week long, staying between 1050 and 1100. Most matches were complete onesided slaughters - interestingly, with me being on the winning and losing side about 50% of the time. If I lost, my team was getting ripped apart, not even reaching 200 points. And when my team won - I could have just rolled my face over the keyboard, it would not have mattered.Then suddenly out of nowhere, today I had a 10 game winning streak, and now I'm up from Silver 2 in Gold again.I really want to point out that I'm not complaining about my rating or class balance or anything. The problem seems that something weird was/is going on with matchmaking. The onesided slaughters are really no fun, not even on the winning side.

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I think it is because low pop times. That is when the bots are particularly thick because there are fewer players. Bots seem to really throw off the balance. If the bot account is high rank, but the bot is bad, the team is off. If the account is low rank, but the bot is good, similar results. Also depends if the botters has an ulterior motive than farming gold and can determine bot play

Had three bot on two of my teams last night. One literally would run up to mid over and over and just stand there waiting to die. She didn't even use skills. She wouldn't even stand on point, just off to the side. Another you uncle, but run away before recapping for our side.

I won't lie, some of those bots reck me, and they are like terminators, you can't shake them, just have to try to confuse their ai if you can. Flat maps aren't good for that. Some of them even seem to be able to ignore some mechanics, like invisible and fear, so you can't at least get a sec to regroup and respond.

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All the problems stem from low population. With low population u get unfair matches that lead to land slide games. The match maker tries to keep everyone in a 50-50 win ratio it seems from all the posters and evidence brought around matchmaking. so one game u might have 1 high plat on ur team (because he has been waiting for 3-6+ min his que has been expanded drastically to include gold's and silvers) that can litteraly 1v3 and farm low tier players, then u get games against those players because they've been in que for a long time so they get thrown into a game against you.

The currents match maker will always put people into a game eventually regardless of rank. And this is the problem imo. If no one is on that is in your tier to play, well....don't be in that teir. A high ranking plat player should never ever be against a gold or silver ever. I don't care if the high plat que person has to wait 30 min for a game. Anyone who plays against that player and is a full teir at least below shouldn't ever see each other.

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Metagaming and DuoQing during the low population hours are usually why the matchmaking breaks down.

If you get longer queue times; typically the matchmaking is going to be worse, because the longer you're in queue, the more desperately the matchmaker tries to find you a match regardless of who with. So if you are repeatedly losing games that you wait a long time for, it might be better to avoid Ranked for a short while.

There is no shame in queue-dodging so long as the queue styles are merged, especially if you SoloQ.

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There is no problem with match making.

The problem is NA population of active PvPers is too low.

The difference between somebody hovering at 1450 and say 1550 is much much larger than the numbers would suggest.

Tbh maybe the powers that be should stop marketing this game as a PvE game.

That’s why they keep spinning the wheels for new players to just come and go.

The end game is PvP and the nature of that is endless replayability.

Rather than make new map reskins, add PvP skin unlocks and auras, and focus on balancing and releasing new skills and classes; they choose to constantly release this one and done PvE crap.

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Thanks for all your responses. I can see how low population can explain some of these problems, but I'm still not entirely convinced.First, I always lose/win about 12-14 rating points - shouldn't those be inflated/deflated if the odds are stacked towards one side? And in the few odd games my team does manage a come-from-behind victory, I have not noticed a real difference either.Second, I had a pretty stable rating for weeks at around 1250. Then I fell by 200 rating points in a single day, stayed down there for dozens of games, and then suddenly got swept up again. 200 ratings is HUGE, if it's even remotely similar to ELO.Finally, my rating is only average. The matchmaking algorithm should not run into population problems in that bracket constantly, I'd imagine. Edit: Also, if you just put a platinum player on both sides, that should at least kinda even things out, shouldn't it?

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@"Stand The Wall.6987" said:they should toss the algorithm out the window at this point. it really doesn't work a lot of the time, plus which a ton of ppl are abusing it. it would be interesting to put teams together based on pvp rank (dragon, rabbit whatnot) like they do in some fps games.

Then use what? RNG when people are the same rank?

Some people have more ranks than I do at 500+ yet are much lower in rating. That wouldn't do anything better.

The algorithm is fine, the people trying to dodge Q or playing at "Prime" time is the reason why everything feels so chaotic, there is no such thing as prime time. People should just play to play, not hop on an alt account to avoid rating loss when they feel the need to play the game and play on their main when decay starts to kick it, this is something that can be avoided but as I was told, people don't care about rated yet waste their efforts with all those shenanigans.

Anet needs to increase decay and game requirements on more of a dedication basis rather than just numbers if you want real players to climb.

1 game is 15 minutes, it's not like playing CS:GO or league for an hour straight.

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@Koal.8029 said:Thanks for all your responses. I can see how low population can explain some of these problems, but I'm still not entirely convinced.First, I always lose/win about 12-14 rating points - shouldn't those be inflated/deflated if the odds are stacked towards one side? And in the few odd games my team does manage a come-from-behind victory, I have not noticed a real difference either.Second, I had a pretty stable rating for weeks at around 1250. Then I fell by 200 rating points in a single day, stayed down there for dozens of games, and then suddenly got swept up again. 200 ratings is HUGE, if it's even remotely similar to ELO.Finally, my rating is only average. The matchmaking algorithm should not run into population problems in that bracket constantly, I'd imagine. Edit: Also, if you just put a platinum player on both sides, that should at least kinda even things out, shouldn't it?

Do you know how the system awards points? I don't. But it's pretty easy to conceive of a plausible explanation for what you observe. For example...

Blue Team: 5 players, all 1200 rating.

Red Team: 4 players with 1100 rating and 1 player with 1600 rating.

If the system uses a simple average of the team's rating, then these teams are perfectly equal. But a 100 rating difference could be negligible while a 400 rating difference almost certainly isn't.

The system shouldn't be pulling that 1600 rating player into the match with 1100-1200 rating players, but if the pool of available players is small enough, that's what you sometimes end up with.

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@Shao.7236 said:snips

yes rng. why not? it will have the same effect as the current match maker who places plat2's against gold 2's, except it might do so evenly for both teams (instead of 1700s and 1500s against 1600s). how is rank even indicative of skill in the first place, when ppl can be carried by builds/ duo/ off hours q'ing or plain luck like getting good placements and ending up at plat1 where the mm forces a 50% win rate on you? or getting massive losing streaks whenever you reach plat? the sad thing is, even if the mm is working fine, the overriding perception is that it is not, which means low pop forever. balance is only one side of the coin. whatever anet does next I think they should consider that. more modes would probably make people forget this for the most part, too bad they are an ancient alien technology that is yet to be discovered if at all.

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@Stand The Wall.6987

Because factually speaking whether people that are in high rating or not are good, the way they do it still show if they have generally more knowledge than those who aren't.

Probably not the same skill compared those who no matter where they end up will carry themselves back up in the rating, hence why good players that end up in like gold 2-3 will pull themselves back up and those who don't deserve plat 1 will go back down into gold 2-3.

Yes, some people get carried by their build, but some people that know the game even more will reach further heights than those who don't know what they are doing with the same ez builds, meta is cancer for a reason and those who come up with solutions against it with more challenging means are the reason why things don't become so stale.

Having a system in place is still better than not having one and there is yet to be any other to implement that could be better because the system is technically fine, it's the human factor that keeps breaking it. Going RNG is going to cause even more chaos.

May the playerbase be fixed so that everything can get back in order, because I remember how legendary was easily accessible, that was 3 years ago before PoF dropped and made people rage with those broken unkillable builds.

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@Shao.7236 said:snips

dood its already rng. at least a mm that uses pvp rank is transparent and won't cause ppl to question the system itself. sometimes the perception of fairness is more powerful then the actual reality. probably will get more or less the same types of matches as we do currently. I can count the number of good close games I've had on one hand (not really just making a point). anyway i'm not fully serious about this, just disillusioned.

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Match making is horrible and you're basically at the whim of four strangers in that they will also play coordinated, or just do as what someone else did...

"I'm going to keep queuing for dailies!" but proceeds to run around, feed, not play objectives ,etc. Basically ruining the experience for others.

When told "Hey, could you que unranked in that case?" People pitch a fit and get mad and say it's not my place to say what and what not they play - which sure, is true. But why are you going to be 'that' person. Who just doesn't care about their team.

At this point. Rank is meaningless in my eyes. It's very clearly poorly designed or innately geared towards casuals. I placed mid-gold, had solid matches. Next two or three days. Almost every 8 out of 10 games I'd lose because of...

1.) Legitimate bots. (Or so I think) 'Players' who'd run into walls, run in random directions, idle, and do nothing.2.) Don't understand their class.3.) Don't understand the maps & the objectives.4.) Don't understand running in 1v3(4, 5) is guaranteeing death most of the time, and feeding.

Let's not forget the best kind of player. The one who is super toxic and -also- is one or multiple of the above points.

It's frustrating. I -want- to play the PvP and enjoy it, but at this point I have to play with my competitiveness in reserve and just treat it like a casual match because again - about 8 out of every 10 matches, I'm basically queued with people who don't care, don't know how to play, or are legitimate bots (or acting like ones).

Call it abuse but at this point I just report people who do any kind of this stuff. I don't know what else to do. There's no information online on how to deal with this, there is no in-game way to report people properly for some of these things, it's just a mess.

Lets not forget how MMR works. You lose a game, you lose like double or nearly triple the points you'd get winning. This kind of system is stupid. You should be rewarded with more points for wins - and less for losses. That way when you do manage to carry, or you do manage to get a solid team; you should get that extra boost up in rank. I'm honestly convinced I'm going to drop rank so much just because of the bad queues.

And if someone says "Well it depends on when you're queueing." I'm queueing at prime times when people would be on during my time EST.

Also-also, what is with the constant matches where I'm having nothing but spanish players in my game? People lagging, speaking a different language, etc. Not hating on them as a people or their language - but do you know how frustrating it is to have a team who you legitimately can't even speak to, or fighting a team that just lags around.

/rantover

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I played on a new alt account recently. I was placed silver 2 and climbed to gold 3 which is my usual rating. I did not climbed that fast as I would have expected. I got maybe a 60% winning rate and surprisingly I did not get many matches with throwers or AFK (which I started to encounter around gold 2). But what really makes me question the MMS is that out of the 40% matches I lost, most of them were 100s / 500 while my team did try their best.

What i want to point out here is that I was playing on an alt with a much lower rank that my true rank meaning that these matches we lost 100 / 500 were lost from the start no matter what the team could have done as extra efforts or coordination. In my opinion, the MMS is not suitable for the current population and is feeding the game with impossible to win / lose matches to favor queue time over quality game.

I'd rather wait a little longer for quality matches rather than waste 10 minutes playing a complete unfair match. While this balance patch is a good sign of some attention being brought into PVP, the main issue of PVP today is the matchmaking which exacerbates balance issue perception and with the slower pace of PVP gameplay incoming, it is going to be even more frustrating.

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dood its already rng. at least a mm that uses pvp rank is transparent and won't cause ppl to question the system itself. sometimes the perception of fairness is more powerful then the actual reality. probably will get more or less the same types of matches as we do currently. I can count the number of good close games I've had on one hand (not really just making a point). anyway i'm not fully serious about this, just disillusioned.

Controlled RNG is better than Pure RNG. Implying removing the chances of fair odds is better than none.

Y'all stuck in the illusion that anything would be better than what you already have, begging for change when in reality it will and only get worst.

The claims that pure RNG would be healthier for a game where people want things to be fair, it's a self contradicting statement.

People gobble that up even if you're disillusioned. Full context is never a thing.

@Ivarian.9018

There is still no better system, people better start playing and getting good or it'll be the end of it. Also alt accounts are another issue of it's own for the match manipulators on top. Playing on an alt account itself is match manipulating because you're falsifying the ratings of the main account involved.

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@Shao.7236 said:Controlled RNG is better than Pure RNG. Implying removing the chances of fair odds is better than none.

Y'all stuck in the illusion that anything would be better than what you already have, begging for change when in reality it will and only get worst.

The claims that pure RNG would be healthier for a game where people want things to be fair, it's a self contradicting statement.

People gobble that up even if you're disillusioned. Full context is never a thing.

lol. making matches based on pvp rank isn't pure rng. that's false. its also false to assume that glicko2 can realistically calculate a persons skill with the amount of factors in gw2s pvp. I wouldn't be saying that if pvp was 100% teams but its not. whats not fair is the current system, so hopefully they don't just leave it as is and hope for the best since that sort of attitude doesn't fix anything.

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