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The wvw mount was slowed down way too much


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@"TinkTinkPOOF.9201" said:So your mount was taken away? So what you are saying is you don't use it anymore and run on foot everywhere? No? You don't? Hmmm, thats odd.

The mount is still a HUGE advantage in WvW, it is also still used by EVERYONE who has access. It is still blindingly fast, fast enough that only a thief is able to keep you at distance, and he is probably using the mount, but mounting, double dodging, then dismounting once skills can be used, spamming ports/distance closers, then remounting etc etc. Why? Because he is smarter than you and has mobility baked into his build. If you are talking about a friendly, then he has the warclaw speed buff, so he doesn't need to be mounted and can still use mobility skills.

I was playing this weekend and watching people on warclaw, its amazing how clueless these people are on what they have. I was trying to dismount a thief I had been chasing, went for lance, and he dodged it, so I keep following, I see 4 friendlies he is running towards, I think "great, finally someone will dismount him" as mine was still on the looooong kitten CD.....He gets close to them and every single one uses battle maul at him.....?!?!?!?!?!? My brain about exploded. I see this more and more, people don't seem to know there is even a dismount skill, I even see it in people running at me, I am just waiting for them to turn or dodge or something, but nope, I dismount and kill in about 10 seconds.

It is still faster then most classes who run mobility outside of maybe thief, most others have (if running mobility) much faster burst mobility, but once on CD the warclaw will catch up. This is why gank groups love the warclaw, one person with mobility can keep up and keep the other in combat so they can't mount, while the others who are not specced into mobility can keep/catch up, and then they all gank you.

You get faster mobility, to fast really for ABLs, as someone said above, as a solo, spending time to cap a camp, run back and forth to build siege, use the siege, often having to counter at least one defender inside a buffed structure, get inside anyway, kill the person, have someone else show up and kill them at lord, only to have the first come back, and over and over again. Before, you killed each once and they didn't have time to get back before you capped. To me, with all those advantages, if you still can't kill the person, they deserve the cap. You also get two free (big) dodges, you get an extra HP bar, you get immunity to ALL CC <!!!!!!! and you get an instant AOE finisher, that is a gap closer that does more dmg than most of my burst skills, as I often get 5-6k hits from it. And you get sniff, something I don't see people use often enough, you are able to track people with it in structures, you can see who might be inside defending, you can see if the other zerg is stacked behind a wall waiting for you to push in, etc etc, its LITERALLY a wall hack.

Thats it people, anet, just turn WvW into a new PvE map, walls/gates are always open, remove PvP from it, and let us ktrain without having anyone bother us! And if you could just insta port us to the next cap after we finish the one we are at, that would be great as well.

this is about as frustrating as i feel tbh, the mode has gone in a stupid direction since hot release,,with all the gimmicks and the so called updates. you are wasting ur breath trying to talk reason to ppl who feel entitled to rely on cheesy game mechanics like the ones that come with mount, or dragon banners, or any and all tactivators, launchpads and shrine owls, cars and spaceships, stealth fountains, ( just typing some of these i cant believe what wvw actually has evolved into, its actually ridiculous)

One thing i do know though, is everyone on this forum , including me, is wasting their time, period, trying to convince others, or anet because they all have their own agenda. We all just waiting for the next "thing" to come along, be it... alliances...or a portable supply depot, or nerf to our friend henry the veteran worm because its too tall and asurans can only land ankle shots... nothing would surprise me tbh. (actually i lie, alliances would surprise me)

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The mount is fine now, it even helps allies move as fast as you do (or faster, if they're using skills). Its mostly used for its combat advantage which I think is what it was meant for (engaging). If anything though it still needs a Defiance bar, not CC immunity.

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I don't use the mount anymore, since you get the warclaw's blessing from some kindly idiot who keeps using it, I'm able to launch an attack or whatever instantly without having to dismount Mount is useless now in WVW. Wish I hadn't wasted so much time & energy getting something that used to be extremely useful, but Anet, who are perfect human beings and never make mistakes, decided to spam into oblivion. But Anet destroys the game with each update, so no surprises there. Frankly, don't understand how the WVW mount even slipped past their fun censors - "Can't have mounts in WVW - that smacks of FUN - delete immediately!"

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You see, you are omitting the essence of this problem, yet you mention it in the topic:

The wvw mount

was slowed down way too muchThe fact it exists is a problem. But I guess it's the main source of $$ income from WvW aside from transfers...

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@ArchonWing.9480 said:

@"TinkTinkPOOF.9201" said:

I was playing this weekend and watching people on warclaw, its amazing how clueless these people are on what they have. I was trying to dismount a thief I had been chasing, went for lance, and he dodged it, so I keep following, I see 4 friendlies he is running towards, I think "great, finally someone will dismount him" as mine was still on the looooong kitten CD.....He gets close to them and every single one uses battle maul at him.....?!?!?!?!?!? My brain about exploded. I see this more and more, people don't seem to know there is even a dismount skill, I even see it in people running at me, I am just waiting for them to turn or dodge or something, but nope, I dismount and kill in about 10 seconds.

Some people may not have leveled lance. Come to think about it I would have no idea of the leveling priority myself now. One would probably would want the first 3 levels of gliding and mount. And then I'm wondering why autoloot is even locked to begin with.

I've seen players throw the Lance at me when I'm dismounted, and battle maul fellow riders.

Sometimes it's like people never read their tooltips.

Hey well it's a way of hurting you when staying on the mount! You see, people don't want to ever leave it, despite how useless they claim it to be.

it puts u on combat i think.

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@aandiarie.7195 said:In wvw we were given mounts. (I spent 200 gold on a skin for my mount too.) The mounts were nice to have, but now they were slowed down by anet a while back.

Some people can outrun my mount on foot.

I was wondering if anet could give us back the mounts how they used to be or at least slightly speed them up, give them proper leaps, or something.

It's pretty disappointing to be given a mount for wvw, have it for a while/be happy with it, and then have that taken away. :(

No it hasn't . its perfect this way. doe snot make people that not have the expansion feel excluded now and makes it less easier to escape from a fight.

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I for one would like to know what ANET's vision for the Warclaw was in the first place, aside from the obvious which was to sell skins. It is really hard to comment on whether they hit the mark with this mount or not when we have no idea what their target was.

Most of this is just about perception though. As the mount used to move faster before, now it feels like it moves too slow. That doesn't mean it IS slow though.

I still maintain that they need to remove the damage and the stomp off of ability #1. Getting a free attack on dismount is great for mounts in PvE but shouldn't be a part of WvW.

In the end people's minds are made up. I mean we have people posting in this thread who have declared they no longer play GW2, but just the sight of a forum topic on the Warclaw triggers them to the point where they feel they need to reply. There is little point in debating the issue as the mount IS in the game, and ANET is just going to do what they are going to do, and the players who can't deal with the mount, just like the players who couldn't deal with gliding, will either learn to adapt or just leave the game (this is what adults do) or will keep playing but continue to whinge on the forums incessantly (what children do) . In between all of that, Tyria will live on.

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@DemonSeed.3528 said:

I've seen players throw the Lance at me when I'm dismounted, and battle maul fellow riders.

Haha sometimes I do that to keep them in combat. I don't get to use battle maul as an opener because it always goes randomly on CD when I need it.

@ASP.8093 said:

@LetoII.3782 said:I've seen players throw the Lance at me when I'm dismounted, and battle maul fellow riders.

Sometimes it's like people never read their tooltips.

The Lance tickle is a tactic to keep people "in combat," or to pop Aegis before you Maul. Since it doesn't dismount you unless you hit a rider, there's very little downside if you're about to jump off your mount anyway.

It does no damage to unmounted players, which is usually a requirement to keep someone in combat.

Have either of you experimented to confirm or are you wasting cooldowns in pure speculation?

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@Aeolus.3615 said:

@"TinkTinkPOOF.9201" said:

I was playing this weekend and watching people on warclaw, its amazing how clueless these people are on what they have. I was trying to dismount a thief I had been chasing, went for lance, and he dodged it, so I keep following, I see 4 friendlies he is running towards, I think "great, finally someone will dismount him" as mine was still on the looooong kitten CD.....He gets close to them and every single one uses battle maul at him.....?!?!?!?!?!? My brain about exploded. I see this more and more, people don't seem to know there is even a dismount skill, I even see it in people running at me, I am just waiting for them to turn or dodge or something, but nope, I dismount and kill in about 10 seconds.

Some people may not have leveled lance. Come to think about it I would have no idea of the leveling priority myself now. One would probably would want the first 3 levels of gliding and mount. And then I'm wondering why autoloot is even locked to begin with.

I've seen players throw the Lance at me when I'm dismounted, and battle maul fellow riders.

Sometimes it's like people never read their tooltips.

Hey well it's a way of hurting you when staying on the mount! You see, people don't want to ever leave it, despite how useless they claim it to be.

it puts u on combat i think.

I've seen players throw the Lance at me when I'm dismounted, and battle maul fellow riders.

Haha sometimes I do that to keep them in combat. I don't get to use battle maul as an opener because it always goes randomly on CD when I need it.

@ASP.8093 said:

@LetoII.3782 said:I've seen players throw the Lance at me when I'm dismounted, and battle maul fellow riders.

Sometimes it's like people never read their tooltips.

The Lance tickle is a tactic to keep people "in combat," or to pop Aegis before you Maul. Since it doesn't dismount you unless you hit a rider, there's very little downside if you're about to jump off your mount anyway.

It does no damage to unmounted players, which is usually a requirement to keep someone in combat.

Have either of you experimented to confirm or are you wasting cooldowns in pure speculation?

It does do a small amount of damage.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Lance

And yes, I have done it by accident before. Although it is highly unlikely this makes the difference, or players aren't just mindlessly pressing buttons.

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@LetoII.3782 said:

I've seen players throw the Lance at me when I'm dismounted, and battle maul fellow riders.

Haha sometimes I do that to keep them in combat. I don't get to use battle maul as an opener because it always goes randomly on CD when I need it.

@ASP.8093 said:

@LetoII.3782 said:I've seen players throw the Lance at me when I'm dismounted, and battle maul fellow riders.

Sometimes it's like people never read their tooltips.

The Lance tickle is a tactic to keep people "in combat," or to pop Aegis before you Maul. Since it doesn't dismount you unless you hit a rider, there's very little downside if you're about to jump off your mount anyway.

It does no damage to unmounted players, which is usually a requirement to keep someone in combat.

Have either of you experimented to confirm or are you wasting cooldowns in pure speculation?

Tested, back when mount first came out (and still use it to this day), it does dmg and does put you into combat. This is why it's very powerful to roamers and "gank" groups, they know all the tricks, I have won a number of fights purely due to the mount. Most of the people I end up running into will lance me first (I am a solo roamer), I can tell right off the bat if a fight is going to be hard just by this, the majority of people (though not all) who lance first tend to be roamers who are pretty good, while the number of fights I lose to those who don't lance are pretty small, though I am surprised from time to time.

I should upload some of the trolling videos I have of me using the mount. I just don't have the time to edit anything....and I am lazy.

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Fair enough, too much heresay to not question. Though I can't imagine seeing myself in a situation where I'd not just use a player skill to keep someone in combat... And also take chunks of their health. Seems inefficient to waste time tapping when I can WHACK.

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Mounts in WvW do enough by simply offering mobility.The mobility already has a huge impact to how fights (especially prolonged ones) pan out. People being able to return faster has made the meta in WvW even more of a "who outnumbers who" deal than it was before, lol.

Honestly, the mounts should have no combat abilities and everyone should be dismounted as soon as they get into any kind of Player combat.Players engaging with Mounts hitting for well over 4k even when you're running over 3k armor..? What? That same skill being an instant-stomp ..? What?The mount functioning as an easy 8k health sponge..?All in all, incredibly unhealthy for the game mode and I'd honestly rather they'd never add them. However, I know it's too late now and it's good marketing, so fair's far, use them as a boost to mobility (which is already doing a lot for tons of professions regardless of how they play WvW (roaming, zerging, just doing dailies or whatever)). But get rid of the ridiculous combat abilities that got no place in such a game mode.At the very least they got to get affected by CC skills.

TL:DR Mount Mobility is fair, Combat abilities got to get deleted, dismount upon any form of Player Combat.

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@LetoII.3782 said:Fair enough, too much heresay to not question. Though I can't imagine seeing myself in a situation where I'd not just use a player skill to keep someone in combat... And also take chunks of their health. Seems inefficient to waste time tapping when I can WHACK.

And how are you going to do that?

You are coming at me and don't lance me, so you use maul to put me in combat? Nope, I mount before the cast finishes. You are going to dismount with the normal action key and then open with a CC or burst? Nope, I am still going to mount before the action finishes and you just blew your opening CC/burst, as I stated above, you would be the person I end up trolling, you did no dmg to me because I double dodged on mount, you are now in combat and cant remount, I am still full HP on mount and no skills on CD....What are you going to do now? Well, probably like I said above, the person burns even more CDs to try and kill the mount, I am not going to run because I plan on killing you, once I troll long enough that you are able to get the mount low I am going to dismount with maul and get a free aoe 5-6k hit on you. So now you put yourself in a situation where you have many CDs burnt and just took a nice burst or have to blow an evade/block.

I think I understand why now so many people cry about the mount being nerfed, because they have NO idea how to use it. I find it funny the people who want it don't understand it, but the people who say it's OP and needs more nerfs or to be removed are the ones who make the most use of it....

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@LetoII.3782 said:Fair enough, too much heresay to not question. Though I can't imagine seeing myself in a situation where I'd not just use a player skill to keep someone in combat... And also take chunks of their health. Seems inefficient to waste time tapping when I can WHACK.

There difference is a enemy running away on foot will get out of combat and port before you get into range for Maul, so instead you use the lance with 1500 range to keep them in combat while you close the distance.

ANET only coded the lance to dismount the user when it dismounts another player off their warclaw, so you're free to use it to tag players and NPCs (handy if you want the participation for killing a sentry but want to keep riding past and attack the camp.

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@Turkeyspit.3965 said:

@LetoII.3782 said:Fair enough, too much heresay to not question. Though I can't imagine seeing myself in a situation where I'd not just use a player skill to keep someone in combat... And also take chunks of their health. Seems inefficient to waste time tapping when I can WHACK.

There difference is a enemy running away on foot will get out of combat and port before you get into range for Maul, so instead you use the lance with 1500 range to keep them in combat while you close the distance.

ANET only coded the lance to dismount the user when it dismounts another player off their warclaw, so you're free to use it to tag players and NPCs (handy if you want the participation for killing a sentry but want to keep riding past and attack the camp.

I also use it for tagging lord when I come in late, although I've tried when all the guards are there and it seems to pierce some of them at same time, I think 3.Edit: not sure if it's a pierce or a radius, I'll double check later.

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@DemonSeed.3528 said:

@LetoII.3782 said:Fair enough, too much heresay to not question. Though I can't imagine seeing myself in a situation where I'd not just use a player skill to keep someone in combat... And also take chunks of their health. Seems inefficient to waste time tapping when I can WHACK.

There difference is a enemy running away on foot will get out of combat and port before you get into range for Maul, so instead you use the lance with 1500 range to keep them in combat while you close the distance.

ANET only coded the lance to dismount the user when it dismounts another player off their warclaw, so you're free to use it to tag players and NPCs (handy if you want the participation for killing a sentry but want to keep riding past and attack the camp.

I also use it for tagging lord when I come in late, although I've tried when all the guards are there and it seems to pierce some of them at same time, I think 3.Edit: not sure if it's a pierce or a radius, I'll double check later.

It pierces, you can see it sometimes when dismounting someone with another person right behind them, as it will dismount both with one lance, most I have dismounted at once was 4 people. I don't think its piercing range is very large though, it's smaller than the aoe from maul.

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@TinkTinkPOOF.9201 said:

@LetoII.3782 said:Fair enough, too much heresay to not question. Though I can't imagine seeing myself in a situation where I'd not just use a player skill to keep someone in combat... And also take chunks of their health. Seems inefficient to waste time tapping when I can WHACK.

There difference is a enemy running away on foot will get out of combat and port before you get into range for Maul, so instead you use the lance with 1500 range to keep them in combat while you close the distance.

ANET only coded the lance to dismount the user when it dismounts another player off their warclaw, so you're free to use it to tag players and NPCs (handy if you want the participation for killing a sentry but want to keep riding past and attack the camp.

I also use it for tagging lord when I come in late, although I've tried when all the guards are there and it seems to pierce some of them at same time, I think 3.Edit: not sure if it's a pierce or a radius, I'll double check later.

It pierces, you can see it sometimes when dismounting someone with another person right behind them, as it will dismount both with one lance, most I have dismounted at once was 4 people. I don't think its piercing range is very large though, it's smaller than the aoe from maul.

I bet you 50 Eyes of Kormir that's a bug and wasn't intended...but then, the same devs originally designed Superior Battle Maw to finish 10 downed players in a 360 radius, so what do I know /shrug

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@"Turkeyspit.3965" said:I for one would like to know what ANET's vision for the Warclaw was in the first place, aside from the obvious which was to sell skins. It is really hard to comment on whether they hit the mark with this mount or not when we have no idea what their target was.I'm sure it goes a little something like this:Anet runs a focus group and sends out one of their periodic random email surveys to a small amount of the player base. And what they are asking is "What don't you like about WvW?" or "Why don't you play more WvW".And the responses that come back look like these... average responses from average gamers

"I hate how long it takes me to get back to the tag after I get killed"... "I wish there was a way to avoid a fight if I wanted"..."I don't like how all my builds have to have some mandatory source of swiftness"...."I feel useless when we are breaking down a door and I am not on a ram"...."Why can't there be a way to travel to my friends without getting globaled by a Thief or a Mesmer?"... "I want a way to counterplay the stealth of thieves and mesmers"These used to be super common complaints on the reddit especially before Path of Fire about WvW and I will wager that they were the most common bits of feedback they got from ordinary players in controlled settings.When they started to describe the Warclaw and it's features it just seemed so perfect that these common bits of feedback from players who had tried the game made with an open mind (not the "I loathe all forms of PvP types) were addressed.Did it accomplish the goals? Probably.Did it increase participation in WvW on a longer term sticky basis?Only Anet knows.I still maintain that they need to remove the damage and the stomp off of ability #1. Getting a free attack on dismount is great for mounts in PvE but shouldn't be a part of WvW.The damage is fine, but that stomp sure has bred some trash gameplay. It seems there's a certain breed of player that hovers around large fights mounted just to do stomps, then bugs out and repeats. It's a very low-effort/low-risk playstyle and really doesnt seem healthy. Otherwise I like the Engage.

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@Turkeyspit.3965 said:

@LetoII.3782 said:Fair enough, too much heresay to not question. Though I can't imagine seeing myself in a situation where I'd not just use a player skill to keep someone in combat... And also take chunks of their health. Seems inefficient to waste time tapping when I can WHACK.

There difference is a enemy running away on foot will get out of combat and port before you get into range for Maul, so instead you use the lance with 1500 range to keep them in combat while you close the distance.

ANET only coded the lance to dismount the user when it dismounts another player off their warclaw, so you're free to use it to tag players and NPCs (handy if you want the participation for killing a sentry but want to keep riding past and attack the camp.

I also use it for tagging lord when I come in late, although I've tried when all the guards are there and it seems to pierce some of them at same time, I think 3.Edit: not sure if it's a pierce or a radius, I'll double check later.

It pierces, you can see it sometimes when dismounting someone with another person right behind them, as it will dismount both with one lance, most I have dismounted at once was 4 people. I don't think its piercing range is very large though, it's smaller than the aoe from maul.

I bet you 50 Eyes of Kormir that's a bug and wasn't intended...but then, the same devs originally designed Superior Battle Maw to finish 10 downed players in a 360 radius, so what do I know /shrug

Indeed, I find it shocking many people still don't understand maul is not just a finisher, but an AOE finisher with pretty good AOE dmg. Do you remember, or ever play around with sic'em SB before the nerf? Stack buffs, stealth, get close to the person and mount and maul for an insta down? That remained in the game WAY to long. And not only the fact it does dmg as a mount skill but the fact it works with stats and dmg modifiers? WHY?

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It's kinda entertaining watching people say that warclaw, the thing that gave every character the best defensive attributes of daredevil, regardless of their class and build, is too weak because of daredevil mobility. A wee case of the grass calling the clover green, don't you think?

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@"mindcircus.1506" said:"I don't like how all my builds have to have some mandatory source of swiftness"....

Honestly, I do like how it addresses that. Classes have really uneven Swiftness access (partly driven by SPvP and combat), and some require awkward gear swaps between "mobility" and "combat" loadouts; as a baseline, Warclaw does address that without totally making your personal mobility completely irrelevant (which is why people used to just riding their mounts everywhere complain about chasing down thieves).

Some of the other stuff in the package — the insta-finisher, the 8k hp buffer, the awkward dynamics of two mounted players trying to engage each other — aren't to my taste, but that core idea of useful-but-not-too-speedy wvw mount is good, imo.

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