Revenant is the least played profession. Heres how to buff them

[MarzAttakz.9608]

Please for the love of Melandru, fix shortbow and utility skill pathing and placement issues, shortbow #4 is especially buggy as are most Kalla skills. Stands outside wall with a ranged weapon and can basically not do a thing. Poor Renegade.

[jpsssss.7530]

1) shortbow is good since they fixed seven shot. Its good on power AND condi builds2) Yes revs can't pick their skills, but the main issue is that they dont feel all that impactful for the energy cost or cooldown.3) rev needs a better way to deal with condis. it has 1 baby cleanse one stance swap, and 1 decent one on jalis. Resistance is bad and since it corrupts to chill you cant change my mind.4) Rev skills in general should only have big energy costs if the cooldowns are low. not both. Most are fine, but there are some offenders.

[otto.5684]

@felix.2386 said:definitely not underplayed, where you get that from?overall player base? there's plenty of inactive accounts specially from pre-HoT.you have to look in game yourselfplenty of rev everywhere, i kinda wish that isn't true as i don't want what i play get overpopulated, but meh..

and warrior is definitely not as played as it seems even tho it may show that warrior is most played, because easy key farm and everybody and their mom has a warrior as secondary, tho not many people mainly play warrior..for how boring and how not versatile it is in open world and etc.

When you look at the all rev characters made (which if I remember how it was measured), rev was a lowest class. It makes sense though. As someone mentioned earlier, it was put 3 years into the game, and has a different design that may not appeal to some players.

Btw this has nothing to do with performance.

[LucianTheAngelic.7054]

@jpsssss.7530 said:3) rev needs a better way to deal with condis. it has 1 baby cleanse one stance swap, and 1 decent one on jalis. Resistance is bad and since it corrupts to chill you cant change my mind.

With how many sources Rev has for resistance it’s not bad at all. Sure they can corrupt it, but you just reapply it a second or two later and it’s not a problem. And on top of that Condi Herald has plenty of potential cleanse anyway for when you don’t have resistance. In WvW you’re practically a condi immune god, which is not something you can say about the vast majority of other builds, even those wit high cleanse. In PvP however you’re partially right since they did nerf the durations by 50%, but you can still get high enough resistance for it to not really be a problem. Also corruption is only an issue against Necro so ??‍♂️

The issue with resistance as Rev’s main form of condi mitigation is mostly that it’s really only applicable to condi builds, which does leave power based builds wanting more cleanse. Personally I’m okay with this though it’s always felt like a fair trade off and something you can still partially build around with runes and sigils.

[jpsssss.7530]

@LucianTheAngelic.7054 said:

@jpsssss.7530 said:3) rev needs a better way to deal with condis. it has 1 baby cleanse one stance swap, and 1 decent one on jalis. Resistance is bad and since it corrupts to chill you cant change my mind.

With how many sources Rev has for resistance it’s not bad at all. Sure they can corrupt it, but you just reapply it a second or two later and it’s not a problem. And on top of that Condi Herald has plenty of potential cleanse anyway for when you don’t have resistance. In WvW you’re practically a condi immune god, which is not something you can say about the vast majority of other builds, even those wit high cleanse. In PvP however you’re partially right since they did nerf the durations by 50%, but you can still get high enough resistance for it to not really be a problem. Also corruption is only an issue against Necro so ??‍

♂️

The issue with resistance as Rev’s main form of condi mitigation is mostly that it’s really only applicable to condi builds, which does leave power based builds wanting more cleanse. Personally I’m okay with this though it’s always felt like a fair trade off and something you can still partially build around with runes and sigils.

While it does have good resistance up time, the energy cost of skills on malyx skills are high AND if you use the best resistance source on you you also get the condis from people around you, which makes boon strip/corrupt a sad time. Plus you dumped half of your energy and put your stunbreak on cooldown.

I disagree with it being a fair trade off when compared to other classes. I'd rather have more and more consistent ways of managing condis across the class instead of it mostly being on Malyx. The corruption traits are mediocre at best if you aren't running a condi or hybrid build. Additionally, there aren't really any other classes that have to trade a trait line AND Half of their utilities for condi control that is arguably better than what Malyx gives....

[Kichwas.7152]

While it took me a while to get used to it, I rather like the Revenant's quirky 'switch legendaries' system. I don't mind that the choices in each legendary are pre-picked for you - there's a lot of power in essentially having a loadout of twice as many utilities as everyone but some engineers - and engineers sacrifice in combat weapon swap as their tradeoff.

I end up with a lot of rapid fire abilities that can be quite powerful if I am smart about how I use them. My elite skills are often 'on demand' and spammable. I can hit the Mallyx one as part of my routine to break a CC bar, alongside the utility skill that 'applies a condition' as my talents are set to apply blind anytime I trigger an elite. The elite in Kalla coupled with the heal skill are enough that I can fully heal up myself and my entire group during a burn phase and likewise 'sustain heavy damage' during a phase we're being hit hard - if I remember to manage my energy right for it.

This in-play struggle to make my choices match up with my energy while still maximizing my DPS output makes the class engaging to play.

Some of my other characters are more interesting to 'edit the build on', but the Revenant ends up more interesting to actually play... which in my opinion is a LOT more important.

As for it's commonality - I don't see it as rare at all. I spam fractals and living world seasons most of the time - and in these areas I see a constant stream of them. Sure, 104% of people are on Guardian... ;)But... well... outside of 'Guardian Wars 2' gameplay, revenant seems fairly common. If I wanted to talk about professions that are dead, I'd be looking at Thief and Engineer. Those are so rare for the PUGs I join that I feel like I need to get an autograph anytime I see one.

[LucianTheAngelic.7054]

@jpsssss.7530 said:

@LucianTheAngelic.7054 said:

@jpsssss.7530 said:3) rev needs a better way to deal with condis. it has 1 baby cleanse one stance swap, and 1 decent one on jalis. Resistance is bad and since it corrupts to chill you cant change my mind.

With how many sources Rev has for resistance it’s not bad at all. Sure they can corrupt it, but you just reapply it a second or two later and it’s not a problem. And on top of that Condi Herald has plenty of potential cleanse anyway for when you don’t have resistance. In WvW you’re practically a condi immune god, which is not something you can say about the vast majority of other builds, even those wit high cleanse. In PvP however you’re partially right since they did nerf the durations by 50%, but you can still get high enough resistance for it to not really be a problem. Also corruption is only an issue against Necro so ??‍

♂️

The issue with resistance as Rev’s main form of condi mitigation is mostly that it’s really only applicable to condi builds, which does leave power based builds wanting more cleanse. Personally I’m okay with this though it’s always felt like a fair trade off and something you can still partially build around with runes and sigils.

While it does have good resistance up time, the energy cost of skills on malyx skills are high AND if you use the best resistance source on you you also get the condis from people around you, which makes boon strip/corrupt a sad time

It has good uptime through dozens of tiny packets of resistance though, so even if corrupted it gets immediately reapplied most of the time. You barely even need pain absorption for that. Mallyx skills are expensive, but the heal and elite are also cheap AF and can proc demonic defiance and the elite is spammable, so it’s not like you can’t proc it every 5seconds.

Pain absorptioning massive stacks on to yourself is awesome and rarely a burden. You can immediately transfer it and wreck people with Herald or cleanse it with shield/staff if needed. Just requires micro management, but super rewarding when played well.

And Rev also has enough cleanse in between resistance procs that if you do get corrupted and need to cleanse it you can. And the few times you do die to condis is fine. No class should be completely immune to an entire type of damage, which is what Mallyx Rev leans towards a lot of the time, so corrupt and downtime on resistance is fine as it helps balance that aspect of the class out.

. Plus you dumped half of your energy and put your stunbreak on cooldown.

The stunbreak Pain Absorption doesn’t have a CD, so it’s only gated by having enough energy. Perfectly possible to stunbreak multiple times with it in a row, especially when planning it out.

I disagree with it being a fair trade off when compared to other classes. I'd rather have more and more consistent ways of managing condis across the class instead of it mostly being on Malyx. The corruption traits are mediocre at best if you aren't running a condi or hybrid build. Additionally, there aren't really any other classes that have to trade a trait line AND Half of their utilities for condi control that is arguably better than what Malyx gives....

To each his own then. The only builds that struggle with condis are non-Mallyx builds but those generally have access to higher amounts of evasion or other mechanics so it’s not a 1 to 1 comparison as it’s all a trade off. Other classes also make trade offs to carry more cleanse

Also rev’s weakness to condis (outside of Mallyx) is well documented and has been around since the class came out. Yet it hasn’t stopped it from being a top tier competitor or a crucial part of both WvW/PvP for the vast majority of the past 6 years. So to me this is more of a l2p/l2build/learn matchups type issue. I’m okay with classes having issues with certain things.

[Scoobaniec.9561]

Revenant is the least played profession how to uncluck them and bring them back to old fun glory?

As for condi cleanse and being top tier in pvp never forget the fact that they are always been carried by someone else cleansing conditions for them. Playing with a support and without is completely different experience for rev. If there wasnt a support builds being able to cleanse condi off rev u can bet rev would be at the bottom and never make it to the meta unlike thief.

[Cleopatra.4068]

Revenant is not underpowered in casual open world content. Core revenant is very capable of waltzing into HoT and soloing half the skill points. This lets you easily unlock the elite specs, which is great for casual play. Both condi and power have solid builds that make open world content easy to do. It has tons of cc for break bars, it has tons of sustain, and does good damage. Swapping legends when you run out of juice is not exactly rocket science, and as a casual player, I say we can handle it just fine.

I don’t know why people keep comparing it to engineer, as rev is 100% easier to play as a casual player. The legends do limit your utilities, but the utilities in the legends are really good for casual play. I don’t know why you would want to make legends kits, as all anyone does is complain about kits on the engineer. Core engineer is kitten for casual play. You cannot use a core engineer to solo much of HoT, which means you have to join a skill point train to unlock elite spec, which many casual players don’t particularly want to do, myself included. Kits eliminate weapon swap on engineer, and force you to use kits anyway. Half the skills in engineer kits are useless at any given time, while legends are not. The weapons for core engineer are kitten for casual play. You have to camp kits for weapon skills, not for utility skills. They replace the weapon skills, not the utility skills, and take up utility slots. This is all a silly, non-comparison. Engineer isn’t comparable to Revenant at all. The similarities are superficial only.

[Obtena.7952]

@Obtena.7952 said:Revenant does not need a buff just because it's the least played profession. That's actually a nonsensical reason because there is always a least played class.

Just a reminder: This is still true.

[Dixa.6017]

Not wanting to contribute to the necro, but the class is locked behind HoT right? that's going to skew it's "played" numbers.

if not well i don't know what everyone elses problem is. i mean if they don't want to play the best class in the game with the best shortbow then that's their loss imo.

[Blood Red Arachnid.2493]

I've got my own complaints. My biggest one being that Anet's prime way to fix the low DPS is to make the rotations substantially more difficult and punishing. I don't even play condi rev anymore because I can't physically do it. The timing required is too precise, there's too many resources to manage, and if you mess up that split-second timing the DPS floors and never goes back up again. The nerfs to anguish and the changes to embrace the darkness make it both inflexible and high-maintenance, making the entire thing just wholly unfun to play and completely unrewarding whenever I try.

Power rev has a similar problem. Anet tried to fix it by making the facet give a small bonus for a short window when activated. The end result is that the power build becomes just as punishing as the condi build to fail, and all for gains that are so low that snowcrows doesn't even host the power build. I hate Anet's nonsensical philosophy that makes it so the biggest obstacle to doing well in this game is moving our darn toons.

[serow.6524]

I'm a casual open world player, so numbers isn't my main concern. I just want to say that I love the Legend system and how each Legend gets its own set of matching thematic skills. It really gives more personality to the Legend. Please carry on with this model into EOD and beyond.

[Vasdamas Anklast.1607]

It receives way too much hate for how often it's played. Doesn't mean it's OP thoughIs condi roamer disgusting on WvW? Yes and it kinda needs nerfs (possibly through runes of tormenting). But is there more disgusting shit everywhere else? Hell yes. Some scourges are blooming again and I see more reapers than ever.

[NorthernRedStar.3054]

@Vasdamas Anklast.1607 said:It receives way too much hate for how often it's played. Doesn't mean it's OP thoughIs condi roamer disgusting on WvW? Yes and it kinda needs nerfs (possibly through runes of tormenting). But is there more disgusting kitten everywhere else? Hell yes. Some scourges are blooming again and I see more reapers than ever.

Comparing reaper and revenant (herald, to be precise) is like apples and oranges.

Reaper is extremely telegraphed for the entirety of its kit, and you can see everything they do clearly from a visual and audio perspective. They hit hard, but are extremely fair in terms of counterplay. Revenant has some telegraphs as well, but those can be largely negated by the fact they have multiple blinks on an insane range for such a tanky profession. Apart from those, they have better access to boons, apply much better consistent pressure even with their main burst skills on cooldown, and sustain themselves much better than reaper does in skirmishes and 1v1's.

The hate comes from people who realize how broken this class is, both from a fundamental as well as a numbers perspective. Yes, a bad revenant is most likely a free kill no matter where you encounter them. But anywhere from decent to great you'll start to see the issues with the class: low windows of vulnerability (and people complain about ranger's counterattack, lol), high mobility and burst (hello there, thief nerfs), versatility and utility thanks to legend swapping etc. the list goes on.

On a heavy armor class. Who on earth thought this was a good idea during development phase.

[felix.2386]

it is funny when 1 out of every 3 player u see in open world is a rev

[Buran.3796]

@"NorthernRedStar.3054" said:

The hate comes from people who realize how broken this class is, both from a fundamental as well as a numbers perspective. Yes, a bad revenant is most likely a free kill no matter where you encounter them. But anywhere from decent to great you'll start to see the issues with the class: low windows of vulnerability (and people complain about ranger's counterattack, lol), high mobility and burst (hello there, thief nerfs), versatility and utility thanks to legend swapping etc. the list goes on.

On a heavy armor class. Who on earth thought this was a good idea during development phase.

Condi Herald has moderate to low mobility, and lacks any ranged pressure. If has blocks (staff) either loses tons of dps when wielding that weapon or (shield) roots himself in the ground. As most of Revs, their cleansing capabilities are very limited, and they are easy to poke at range. Resistance has been butchered.

Power Herald has high mobility and barely any cleanse; usually no stability, also. In the current meta with damage from cc skills entirely nerfed they oftenly get demolished by condition bruisers.

Renegades have good range pressure but worse defenses, usually they have access to stability but their breakstuns are weak, their summons easy to counter and they are weak to condis, as always. The exception are power Renegades, which are (were) unusual until yesterday.

Do you know that the difference in this game from wearing a bikini (1920) to buttcapes (2064) to armor plate (2211) are merely 291 points? . I've seen Eles wearing ~4000 armor. The rise in armor from scholar to adventurer to soldier classes are barely 145.5 atribute points in each jump, which is not only neglectable in terms of % but also irrelevant because sustain is WAY more linked to the correct use of evades and mitigation skills than raw stats. Armor was (initially) mostly a choice of aesthetics (and no longer due the outfits). Base HP has WAY more impact and limitations in what you can do with your class that the "armor" that wears.

And big LOL about the "versatility" of the skill system with the legends. Only 3 utilities, witn each legend, you chose two sets of 3 predefined utilities. wereas the rest of classes freely chose between 16 skills for 3 slots... Not to mention the "savage" amount of weapons available: mace and axe for mele condition, swords, staff and shield for mele power? You want a secondary set of mele condition weapons? Oh, sorry, we forget to add it! You want a ranged condition weapon? Oh, then you need the Renegade spec, but don't worry: the power ranged weapon (hammer) is so bad that in core and Herald you won't miss the absence of a condition ranged weapon. Also, we apologize for forgetting a breakstun for Ventari (and initially releasing the one from Kalla in the healing skill), we will try to not do it again in EoD, lol!

Seriously, the class is amazing (despite being full of bugs) and yes, some numbers are overtuned to cover the lack of ideas and direction, but is far from being "broken" (except if you count the way in which the loadouts and template system keeps unfixed).

[medivh.4725]

I build myself a rev, and I enjoyed its game play. Its combos is very nice. Nicer then other toons. His skills effects is nice. I liked the double sword play and even the staff animation I think it is so refreshing. Also I see so many revs in Tyria or in PVP so there is sufficient revs. Be mindful it is a later add on by Anet so it needs time to catch on. People also require ample time to build up a new toon. So give it some time to mature and the rev population will come right up. People coming back to GW2 needs find time to discover rev as it wasn't avaliable to them before.

[Oxstar.7643]

Uh. Rev is one of my fav classes to play. I have specced my renegade rev to be a survivable and it still hits pretty decently for being nowhere close to optimized for damage. It's... really not in any way a weak class. Your self heal is absurdly good with battle scars, you can do amazing aoe and control with Kalla's warband and your shortbow, and you can do great support both from renegade and herald with buffs to fury and might. Being able to give a whole group in meta on demand 15 might stacks and an aoe field that both amps their damage and allows them insane self heal is no joke either. There are also times when it helps a lot to have an anti ranged shield. Revs dominate the field of saying no to projectiles, outdoing even guardians. While this is limited application in groups, it can sometimes be a downright blessing solo, and also if you use planar protection from the heal with protective solace and your hammer shield then you can stay protected from missile basically forever while still dishing out damage.

[Virdo.1540]

@"Oxstar.7643" said:Uh. Rev is one of my fav classes to play. I have specced my renegade rev to be a survivable and it still hits pretty decently for being nowhere close to optimized for damage. It's... really not in any way a weak class. Your self heal is absurdly good with battle scars, you can do amazing aoe and control with Kalla's warband and your shortbow, and you can do great support both from renegade and herald with buffs to fury and might. Being able to give a whole group in meta on demand 15 might stacks and an aoe field that both amps their damage and allows them insane self heal is no joke either. There are also times when it helps a lot to have an anti ranged shield. Revs dominate the field of saying no to projectiles, outdoing even guardians. While this is limited application in groups, it can sometimes be a downright blessing solo, and also if you use planar protection from the heal with protective solace and your hammer shield then you can stay protected from missile basically forever while still dishing out damage.

Renegade is not Revenant in whole.

Revenant as core if pretty much bottom of everything, while herald can be a bit better, but still nowhere near "being not a joke".

Renegade is extremely overtuned. 10man alac, 5man 25might, extreme group lifesiphone, extreme usage of battlescars, epic burst damage etc.

[Za Shaloc.3908]

Still waiting for support/Ventari Rev buffs for WvW, but beyond that I think the class is terrific and generally has a lot more build diversity in PvP/WvW than I believe it ever has.

[The Boz.2038]

@Virdo.1540 said:10man alac, 5man 25mightExpand on this.

[Oxstar.7643]

@Virdo.1540 said:

@"Oxstar.7643" said:Uh. Rev is one of my fav classes to play. I have specced my renegade rev to be a survivable and it still hits pretty decently for being nowhere close to optimized for damage. It's... really not in any way a weak class. Your self heal is absurdly good with battle scars, you can do amazing aoe and control with Kalla's warband and your shortbow, and you can do great support both from renegade and herald with buffs to fury and might. Being able to give a whole group in meta on demand 15 might stacks and an aoe field that both amps their damage and allows them insane self heal is no joke either. There are also times when it helps a lot to have an anti ranged shield. Revs dominate the field of saying no to projectiles, outdoing even guardians. While this is limited application in groups, it can sometimes be a downright blessing solo, and also if you use planar protection from the heal with protective solace and your hammer shield then you can stay protected from missile basically forever while still dishing out damage.

Renegade is not Revenant in whole.

Revenant as core if pretty much bottom of everything, while herald can be a bit better, but still nowhere near "being not a joke".

Renegade is extremely overtuned. 10man alac, 5man 25might, extreme group lifesiphone, extreme usage of battlescars, epic burst damage etc.

being bad without elite speccs is nothing new. And many revs I see use herald because of the facets.

[Virdo.1540]

@Oxstar.7643 said:

@Virdo.1540 said:

@Oxstar.7643 said:Uh. Rev is one of my fav classes to play. I have specced my renegade rev to be a survivable and it still hits pretty decently for being nowhere close to optimized for damage. It's... really not in any way a weak class. Your self heal is absurdly good with battle scars, you can do amazing aoe and control with Kalla's warband and your shortbow, and you can do great support both from renegade and herald with buffs to fury and might. Being able to give a whole group in meta on demand 15 might stacks and an aoe field that both amps their damage and allows them insane self heal is no joke either. There are also times when it helps a lot to have an anti ranged shield. Revs dominate the field of saying no to projectiles, outdoing even guardians. While this is limited application in groups, it can sometimes be a downright blessing solo, and also if you use planar protection from the heal with protective solace and your hammer shield then you can stay protected from missile basically forever while still dishing out damage.

Renegade is not Revenant in whole.

Revenant as core if pretty much bottom of everything, while herald can be a bit better, but still nowhere near "being not a joke".

Renegade is extremely overtuned. 10man alac, 5man 25might, extreme group lifesiphone, extreme usage of battlescars, epic burst damage etc.

being bad without elite speccs is nothing new. And many revs I see use herald because of the facets.

if im lucky i see one other herald per day, while most play renegade. Most heralds chose herald simply because of the "perma swiftness".

Because Rapid flow is kinda annoying & shiro is simply to loud

[Sobx.1758]

@Virdo.1540 said:

@Oxstar.7643 said:

@Virdo.1540 said:

@Oxstar.7643 said:Uh. Rev is one of my fav classes to play. I have specced my renegade rev to be a survivable and it still hits pretty decently for being nowhere close to optimized for damage. It's... really not in any way a weak class. Your self heal is absurdly good with battle scars, you can do amazing aoe and control with Kalla's warband and your shortbow, and you can do great support both from renegade and herald with buffs to fury and might. Being able to give a whole group in meta on demand 15 might stacks and an aoe field that both amps their damage and allows them insane self heal is no joke either. There are also times when it helps a lot to have an anti ranged shield. Revs dominate the field of saying no to projectiles, outdoing even guardians. While this is limited application in groups, it can sometimes be a downright blessing solo, and also if you use planar protection from the heal with protective solace and your hammer shield then you can stay protected from missile basically forever while still dishing out damage.

Renegade is not Revenant in whole.

Revenant as core if pretty much bottom of everything, while herald can be a bit better, but still nowhere near "being not a joke".

Renegade is extremely overtuned. 10man alac, 5man 25might, extreme group lifesiphone, extreme usage of battlescars, epic burst damage etc.

being bad without elite speccs is nothing new. And many revs I see use herald because of the facets.

if im lucky i see one other herald per day, while most play renegade. Most heralds chose herald simply because of the "perma swiftness".

Because Rapid flow is kinda annoying & shiro is simply to loud

Maaaaaaaaaaaaaybe if you're talking about pve only. Which this thread doesn't. And I'm sure you play herald because it's bad :D

Not only that, but OP takes his stats for the initial statement from some publicly accessible site, so when he says "revenant is the least played profession", he means "revenant and its especs".