Top-end damage from Deadeye's

[Geikamir.6329]

I had this happen to me: https://imgur.com/a/sh50Z

I know the arguments of #getgud, L2P, loldodge. I've heard all that.

My question to you guys is that since Deadeye's can trait to go stealth directly before this attack, is the 1-shot possibility too high? Should any spec be able to do 21k+ damage coming from stealth? And you can add to that the fact that unload is spammable and can do tons of damage while mobile.

Opinions?

[Markri.9475]

Deadeye.Kneel can be traited for the stealth, but deaths judgment reveals the thief at the beginning of the cast. Also i recall there being a laser pointer tell?

As for unload, it hurts if you facetank it. Dodge the first, interrupt the second. Besides unload p/p doesnt do much else, and their means of escape gets limited to utilities.

[shippage.1983]

There's a way to get around that... it's called "dodge". Also that's a Deadeye, not Daredevil. Deadeye is actually really easy to counter, you just need basic awareness. Once they pop up you just smack them because they have next to no health. The gun is loud, and they need to build malice before doing most of their damage which lets you know they're coming.

It's not a 1-shot, it's a long channeled attack, and you can easily see you're marked so their one-shot actually takes really long to build up. If you see you're marked, you have easily 5 seconds to get ready for the burst, which is a very long time in PvP.

You can put up an invuln, break LoS by running behind objects, prepare a burst/interrupt right back at their face, dodge roll, there's a lot of ways to deal with them. If you can't react within that period of time with a counter, then that's entirely a L2P issue.

Daredevil needs a buff if anything.

[Zephyra.4709]

Play a class with reflects and CCs against P/P spam or rifle DE. Necro's have always been the easy target for thieves. Adjust your team comp before the match starts. I believe it's okay to have high dmg skills. Generally they require a ramp up time so good job on that Deadeye who would've had to mark you, go into stealth doing zero dmg and contributing nothing to the team during that time window until his malice stacks peaked plus taking into considering your dodges etc.

Also I believe you are mistaken... that skill is tied to Deadeye not Daredevil.

[Geikamir.6329]

Wow, fail. Sorry. Yeah. Deadeye.

[Unholy Pillager.3791]

From what I've heard, deadeye can mark random objects or other players to build up malice, then switch to mark you and immediately DJ for full damage. If so, that's a bit of a problem. Other than that, they can be a bit of a pain on some professions/specs, but nothing insurmountable and certainly nothing like the scourge and spellbreaker are right now.

[Ashgar.3024]

@Unholy Pillager.3791 said:From what I've heard, deadeye can mark random objects or other players to build up malice, then switch to mark you and immediately DJ for full damage. If so, that's a bit of a problem. Other than that, they can be a bit of a pain on some professions/specs, but nothing insurmountable and certainly nothing like the scourge and spellbreaker are right now.

Its one of our cantrips that does that. Its on a 30 seconds cooldown (if i remember, not hpme to look) and obviously takes an utility skill slot. Haven't heard of many DEs running with it.

[Urejt.5648]

deaths judgment deals that dmg only during 5 second window. Learn to count seconds after u get marked. Be carefull after 10 seconds.

[Aza.2105]

I can't believe you guys are saying 21k damage is ok. That's nearly twice as much as the lowest tier base health and more than the highest tier health. You guys are insane.

[Yakubyogami.7586]

I don't know about you guys but my DE has some form of stealth in 4 of the 5 utility/heal slots PLUS the 2 kneel stealths. Malice can be built up while on the move and Spotter's Shot is a cripple while on the run and immob when kneeling. While I don't PvP, I can see this combination as a problem to a lot of people even 1v1. In PvE/WvW I quite often mark a target, run if I'm seen, drop and crack off a Deaths Judgement. Even at NO malice stacks I still get 7k hits.

I'm not calling for a nerf, or saying 'L2P', just putting out facts.

[nacario.9417]

@Aza.2105 said:I can't believe you guys are saying 21k damage is ok. That's nearly twice as much as the lowest tier base health and more than the highest tier health. You guys are insane.

There are many things that are questionable if "ok". Yes 21k dmg is not normal, but look at the grand picture. So you have to be a deadeye to do that damage, that already gimps you in other aspects, especially when in higher play/leg play where you easily get focused. A deadeye has lower mobility so forget about being able to decap like a daredevil, and deadeye is an has little to offer in Group fights, other than its range and damage which you can LoS or focus the guy. Any class should have a cooldown or two to counter the deadeye burst, use them well to shut him down, otherwise he will do damage to you. It's the same thing on a deadeye, if you let the enemy, let's say a burn guard open on you for a few seconds you are toasted. That's the difference between being a meatsack or someone who actively use his abilities.

[Aza.2105]

@nacario.9417 said:

@Aza.2105 said:I can't believe you guys are saying 21k damage is ok. That's nearly twice as much as the lowest tier base health and more than the highest tier health. You guys are insane.

There are many things that are questionable if "ok". Yes 21k dmg is not normal, but look at the grand picture. So you have to be a deadeye to do that damage, that already gimps you in other aspects, especially when in higher play/leg play where you easily get focused. A deadeye has lower mobility so forget about being able to decap like a daredevil, and deadeye is an has little to offer in Group fights, other than its range and damage which you can LoS or focus the guy. Any class should have a cooldown or two to counter the deadeye burst, use them well to shut him down, otherwise he will do damage to you. It's the same thing on a deadeye, if you let the enemy, let's say a burn guard open on you for a few seconds you are toasted. That's the difference between being a meatsack or someone who actively use his abilities.

I don't want to hear any excuses. It doesn't matter what a class can or can't do. That kind of damage is unacceptable. Players are not raid bosses. When people say that the damage is ok and its a l2p issue and that you should just "dodge". What they really are saying is that gw2 is just dodge or die. Think about the balance there, if you don't dodge you die in one hit. Even in pve the stuff that one shots you typically has a long cast time or a very obvious sign (like a giant glob on the floor), in addition its also very predictable. In pvp you have 4 other characters possibly hitting on you who might be doing just as much damage. So who you going to dodge? That spellbreaker, scourge etc etc? Its just too much. None of this stuff is ok. Rock gazelle isn't ok, spellbreaker isn't ok, scourge instant conditions aren't ok, getting hit for 21k at long range by something you may or may not see isn't ok, DH traps were never ok, all the invuls and blocks going around isn't ok.

The game is a freaking mess.

[Vertep.2498]

@Aza.2105 said:I can't believe you guys are saying 21k damage is ok. That's nearly twice as much as the lowest tier base health and more than the highest tier health. You guys are insane.

for someone who must sacriface that much to get that high amount in single hit yes just because if you will catch his he dont have any defense, event stealth and teleport...when you know where he can be then just spam auto attacks and he will appear in downed and DE rifle is just annyoing and not effectife as even DE with any other weapons than rifle..any other thief build is able to kill or help with killing 5 other players and decap their far whiel DE will 1shot only single player in same time

@Aza.2105 said:

@nacario.9417 said:

@Aza.2105 said:I can't believe you guys are saying 21k damage is ok. That's nearly twice as much as the lowest tier base health and more than the highest tier health. You guys are insane.

There are many things that are questionable if "ok". Yes 21k dmg is not normal, but look at the grand picture. So you have to be a deadeye to do that damage, that already gimps you in other aspects, especially when in higher play/leg play where you easily get focused. A deadeye has lower mobility so forget about being able to decap like a daredevil, and deadeye is an has little to offer in Group fights, other than its range and damage which you can LoS or focus the guy. Any class should have a cooldown or two to counter the deadeye burst, use them well to shut him down, otherwise he will do damage to you. It's the same thing on a deadeye, if you let the enemy, let's say a burn guard open on you for a few seconds you are toasted. That's the difference between being a meatsack or someone who actively use his abilities.

I don't want to hear any excuses. It doesn't matter what a class can or can't do. That kind of damage is unacceptable. Players are not raid bosses. When people say that the damage is ok and its a l2p issue and that you should just "dodge". That they really are saying is that gw2 is just dodge or die. Think about the balance there, if you don't dodge you die in one hit. Even in pve the stuff that one shots you typically has a long cast time or a very obvious sign (like a giant glob on the floor), in addition its also very predictable. In pvp you have 4 other characters possibly hitting on you who might be doing just as much damage. So who you going to dodge? That spellbreaker, scourge etc etc? Its just too much. None of this stuff is ok. Rock gazelle isn't ok, spellbreaker isn't ok, scourge instant conditions aren't ok, getting hit for 21k at long range by something you may or may not see isn't ok, DH traps were never ok, all the invuls and blocks going around isn't ok.

The game is a freaking mess.

and here in overal you are righ about this everything

[Ithilwen.1529]

The biggest problem that I'm encountering is there is no counter for being marked. Invisibility, condi cleanse, LOS... nothing works. The DE can actually mark, then go completely out of LOS and simply let it tick. That's wrong. It's pretty much a free kill pass.

[Vertep.2498]

@Ithilwen.1529 said:The biggest problem that I'm encountering is there is no counter for being marked. Invisibility, condi cleanse, LOS... nothing works. The DE can actually mark, then go completely out of LOS and simply let it tick. That's wrong. It's pretty much a free kill pass.

DE mark do no any damage, its just passively to increase caster damage to marked foe and only how mark can deal damage its only while activating stolen skill which also have low damage and need to be in range to deal this damage

[Ithilwen.1529]

@Vertep.2498 said:

@Ithilwen.1529 said:

The biggest problem that I'm encountering is there is no counter for being marked.

Invisibility, condi cleanse, LOS... nothing works. The DE can actually mark, then go completely out of LOS and simply let it tick. That's wrong. It's pretty much a free kill pass.

DE mark do no any damage, its just passively to increase caster damage to marked foe and only how mark can deal damage its only while activating stolen skill which also have low damage and need to be in range to deal this damage

That's not the point. The DE can mark, then leave combat and wait. When they return they have a huge free burst. There's no way to remove the mark. So this is a death burst without reasonable counterplay.

[choovanski.5462]

pffft where were all you guys when gunflame was a thing. could have used the one-shot-defense-squad

the warrior lights up red, yells, charges up and shoots a fireball. so super easy to dodge. guess it's shouldn't have been nerfed then

1500 range attacks doing 0-100 seems like good game design to me, a chimpanzee

[BlaqueFyre.5678]

@Ithilwen.1529 said:

@Vertep.2498 said:

@Ithilwen.1529 said:

The biggest problem that I'm encountering is there is no counter for being marked.

Invisibility, condi cleanse, LOS... nothing works. The DE can actually mark, then go completely out of LOS and simply let it tick. That's wrong. It's pretty much a free kill pass.

DE mark do no any damage, its just passively to increase caster damage to marked foe and only how mark can deal damage its only while activating stolen skill which also have low damage and need to be in range to deal this damage

That's not the point. The DE can mark, then leave combat and wait. When they return they have a huge free burst. There's no way to remove the mark. So this is a death burst without reasonable counterplay.

Pressure the DE they lose a lot of Mobility, and kill them, putting a DE into Downstate Removes Mark, DEs are Free kills for anyone that has any awareness and basic Pvp gameplay knowledge.

If a DE isn’t actively engaging it is 3-4.5 second per Malice stack so very long Setup plus it’s not like the Burst comes from stealth and doesn’t have any Obvious Tells both Audio and Visual, so there is that.

[Vertep.2498]

@Ithilwen.1529 said:

@Vertep.2498 said:

@Ithilwen.1529 said:

The biggest problem that I'm encountering is there is no counter for being marked.

Invisibility, condi cleanse, LOS... nothing works. The DE can actually mark, then go completely out of LOS and simply let it tick. That's wrong. It's pretty much a free kill pass.

DE mark do no any damage, its just passively to increase caster damage to marked foe and only how mark can deal damage its only while activating stolen skill which also have low damage and need to be in range to deal this damage

That's not the point. The DE can mark, then leave combat and wait. When they return they have a huge free burst. There's no way to remove the mark. So this is a death burst without reasonable counterplay.

mark lasts around 22 seconds on you and to reach full stack of malice without combat need atleast 18 if now 20 seconds of waitintg, so DE have just around 2 steady seconds to shot it in clear way with not bringing anyother help to team while they for example are on mid, 1 of each team going cap close/far so ths 4v4 on mid whiel DE waiting that long time its just 4v3 fight which mostly will be know those with 1 player more will have advantage and before DE will shot on you this 1hit 1, 2 or all 3 his mates will die in mid while DE want to wait these 20 seconds out of combat waiting for max stack malice to 1shot one of 4-3 enemies who were left alive which wont then give victory to DE team because whiel his mates died he killed only 1 of the 3+ enemies and he need to go away now because they know where he is sitting or jsut die be 2-3 auto attacks

DE with this 1shot is more annyoing enemy than hard to deal with him and more like support to killing enemies from range but 1shoting isnt that effective than any other class with more buffs/healing/aoe damage in mid of fight or just someone with better mobility to cap/decap points

[snh.7091]

For the last time,

snipers are supposed to be deadly. What do you expect to be tickled with a rifle? Besides, aren't you playing a Necro based on the avatar and you're the one to complain???

[Geikamir.6329]

@Inoki.6048 said:For the last time,

snipers are supposed to be deadly. What do you expect to be tickled with a rifle? Besides, aren't you playing a Necro based on the avatar and you're the one to complain???

My Avatar is a Reaper, not a Scourge, if that's what you are implying. And I wasn't playing on that character when this happened.

Also, I can see that as a Deadeye you are eager to make excuses for ridiculously outrageous damage numbers.

In group fights, Deadeye's can basically 'tee off' on anyone at range. Doing tremendous damage without any real downside. They are able to do damage higher than melee characters from a perch. There is not much counterplay to that.

[Vertep.2498]

@Geikamir.6329 said:

@Inoki.6048 said:For the last time,

snipers are supposed to be deadly. What do you expect to be tickled with a rifle? Besides, aren't you playing a Necro based on the avatar and you're the one to complain???

My Avatar is a Reaper, not a Scourge, if that's what you are implying. And I wasn't playing on that character when this happened.

Also, I can see that as a Deadeye you are eager to make excuses for ridiculously outrageous damage numbers.

In group fights, Deadeye's can basically 'tee off' on anyone at range. Doing tremendous damage without any real downside. They are able to do damage higher than melee characters from a perch. There is not much counterplay to that.

while they have enough low health pool you can literally 2shot them with auto attacks while also fro scrouge which is more paper than reaper you need to deal decend damge to burn their high health pool while getteing instantly many stacks of condis and single cleanse wont help you

[Kuya.6495]

@choovanski.5462 said:pffft where were all you guys when gunflame was a thing. could have used the one-shot-defense-squad

the warrior lights up red, yells, charges up and shoots a fireball. so super easy to dodge. guess it's shouldn't have been nerfed then

1500 range attacks doing 0-100 seems like good game design to me, a chimpanzee

They nerfed gunflame damage by 20% though and then removed the pierce.

[Razor.9872]

Step 1: Roll a DeadeyeStep 2: See how it functions on golems.Step 3: Learn the tell/animation for Death's JudgementStep 4: When marked, increase your situational awareness range during the appropriate time of markage to see and dodge/block/reflect/destroy/blind/interrupt/LoS/damage-reduce Death's Judgement.Step 5: Enjoy your well-earned 4v5, because that Deadeye is now next to useless.

[FXLEACH.9436]

Basically if you don't kill these kinds of players right away using high burst and stuns then they will just use shadow step + longbow 5 to run away, re-stealth, and then come back. They're annoying and play like wimps but it feels damn good to burst them with my deadeye. I don't play the same way they do.