Vamipric Rituals - Please bring it back!

[Arichan.9027]

The removal of this trait has utterly destroyed the wells build I've been using for years. I work 60 hours a week and simply do not have the time to learn an entirely new play-style. Call me lazy but I do not enjoy using scourge. Protection on wells oftentimes saved my team from annihilation, and I use it for soloing dungeons/open world. No reason why this should have been removed - please put it back.

Please comment if you share the same sentiment, thanks!

[Caine.8204]

it was kind of a pointless trait, and necros shouldnt really have high protection uptime anyway. i dont know anyone who took this trait seriously in pvp, the condi removal trait in blood is much better in comparison because it feeds you additional life force.

i doubt the reduction in protection will affect you much in dungeons, or the open world. If you can't deal without the protection, then the issue is you're getting hit too much, not that you need Protection.

i really dont understand why they changed it to something different, but whatever. its a bad player trap.

[Emapudapus.1307]

+1 this trait opened so much extra options and different playstyles, even serious competitive.

[Dantheman.3589]

It’s would make many necro builds too good rn.Edit: I liked the trait tbh, not trying to be biased though.

[pah.4931]

It would not have been sooooooo bad if they had replaced it with something not terrible (blood bank) and if they hadn't buffed and then nerfed wells in PvP within 24 hours lol

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

@Arichan.9027 said:The removal of this trait has utterly destroyed the wells build I've been using for years. I work 60 hours a week and simply do not have the time to learn an entirely new play-style. Call me lazy but I do not enjoy using scourge. Protection on wells oftentimes saved my team from annihilation, and I use it for soloing dungeons/open world. No reason why this should have been removed - please put it back.

Please comment if you share the same sentiment, thanks!

Completely agree.

At the very least they could replaced it with a trait that had actual value. Blood Bank is useless.

[Caine.8204]

@Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

@Arichan.9027 said:The removal of this trait has utterly destroyed the wells build I've been using for years. I work 60 hours a week and simply do not have the time to learn an entirely new play-style. Call me lazy but I do not enjoy using scourge. Protection on wells oftentimes saved my team from annihilation, and I use it for soloing dungeons/open world. No reason why this should have been removed - please put it back.

Please comment if you share the same sentiment, thanks!

Completely agree.

At the very least they could replaced it with a trait that had actual value. Blood Bank is useless.

is it? i havent tried it, but i assumed that scourge + tempest = god

[Teratus.2859]

@Caine.8204 said:it was kind of a pointless trait, and necros shouldnt really have high protection uptime anyway. i dont know anyone who took this trait seriously in pvp, the condi removal trait in blood is much better in comparison because it feeds you additional life force.

i doubt the reduction in protection will affect you much in dungeons, or the open world. If you can't deal without the protection, then the issue is you're getting hit too much, not that you need Protection.

i really dont understand why they changed it to something different, but whatever. its a bad player trap.

Necros already have trash stability uptime and very limited group support options, the last thing they needed was to loose some beneficial group play in all game modes in favour of a trait that is mostly garbage outside of a WvW blob..

Unholy Martyr is the only Blood Magic grandmaster I never used, It probably has some use in PvP but in PvE and WvW it's garbage thanks to cleanse spam.. same problem that corruption Necros have had for years.I cannot even count how many times I have pulled condies to myself to buff my healing skill only to have someone blast them off me instantly crippling my healing potential and getting me killed.. I'm not joking, this has happend so many times over the years that I stopped running condi Necro builds a good while ago.The concept of Necros pulling condis to themselves to consume simply doesn't work well in this game, not unless you're in an organized group and everyone actively avoids cleansing the Necro which is just adding unnecessary complications.

Without protect and siphon on wells pretty much the only viable lifesteal method left is minions.

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

@Caine.8204 said:

@Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

@"Arichan.9027" said:The removal of this trait has utterly destroyed the wells build I've been using for years. I work 60 hours a week and simply do not have the time to learn an entirely new play-style. Call me lazy but I do not enjoy using scourge. Protection on wells oftentimes saved my team from annihilation, and I use it for soloing dungeons/open world. No reason why this should have been removed - please put it back.

Please comment if you share the same sentiment, thanks!

Completely agree.

At the very least they could replaced it with a trait that had actual value. Blood Bank is useless.

is it? i havent tried it, but i assumed that scourge + tempest = god

The Core Necro build I was using had Vampiric Wells with:

1. Well of Blood
2. Well of Suffering, or Well of Corruption, or sometimes Corrosive Poison Cloud vs. certain comps
3. Well of Power
4. Plague Signet
5. Lich

Vampiric Rituals https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Vampiric_Rituals granted that utility list A LOT of extra sustain. & substantial damage output. When you're talking about 250 life steal heal & damage per tick per target, that turns something like Well of Power into a substantial heal when it's dropped on 3 to 5 targets with 5s duration 1s ticks, as well a lot of extra damage that isn't effected by toughness or protection.

The build and the way Vampiric Rituals worked, just felt good to play man. There was more versatility before Vampiric Rituals was removed, more distinct build structures. Now after it's been removed, the utility list is just sort of narrow as hell, now with everyone always using Spectral Walk and Flesh Wurm all of the time. Pretty much what's going on now is that all wells suck outside of Well of Darkness https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Well_of_Darkness, which can be turned into a single monstrous skill when synergized with https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Bitter_Chill - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Chilling_Darkness - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Cold_Shoulder but that's all wells are good for now with removal of Vampiric Rituals.

And yeah, Scourge + Tempest is coming on a bit strong lately. Should see what it's like when they're stacked in a FB + Ren on top of that. Four classes with good dps and all tossing each other support cleanse & heal. You can't dent that in a team fight. Right now there isn't enough dps in spvp to match the sustain of that combo. Give it another couple weeks, everyone will be complaining about it.

[lovemghool.7613]

we dont need damage on well of darkness and we do not need bankrupt blood bank. please just revert and give us back vampiric rituals. what you did is not an improvement and blood magic grand masters were fine but the rest of the tiers were absolute trash and the picks havent changed since forever.

please just stop stop stop touching this class. you do more harm than good tyvm

btw anet when can i go back to playing my spellbreaker?

[Caine.8204]

@"Trevor Boyer.6524" said:The Core Necro build I was using had Vampiric Wells with:

1. Well of Blood
2. Well of Suffering, or Well of Corruption, or sometimes Corrosive Poison Cloud vs. certain comps
3. Well of Power
4. Plague Signet
5. Lich

Vampiric Rituals https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Vampiric_Rituals granted that utility list A LOT of extra sustain. & substantial damage output. When you're talking about 250 life steal heal & damage per tick per target, that turns something like Well of Power into a substantial heal when it's dropped on 3 to 5 targets with 5s duration 1s ticks, as well a lot of extra damage that isn't effected by toughness or protection.

The build and the way Vampiric Rituals worked, just felt good to play man. There was more versatility before Vampiric Rituals was removed, more distinct build structures. Now after it's been removed, the utility list is just sort of narrow as hell, now with everyone always using Spectral Walk and Flesh Wurm all of the time. Pretty much what's going on now is that all wells suck outside of Well of Darkness https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Well_of_Darkness, which can be turned into a single monstrous skill when synergized with https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Bitter_Chill - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Chilling_Darkness - https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Cold_Shoulder but that's all wells are good for now with removal of Vampiric Rituals.

And yeah, Scourge + Tempest is coming on a bit strong lately. Should see what it's like when they're stacked in a FB + Ren on top of that. Four classes with good dps and all tossing each other support cleanse & heal. You can't dent that in a team fight. Right now there isn't enough dps in spvp to match the sustain of that combo. Give it another couple weeks, everyone will be complaining about it.

well-heavy builds run into the pvp issue of not being able to escape any fight. the heal is nice, but when you have a thief on you, its gonna take more than a couple Wells to get him off. you have to make space or he will eat you. this goes with most of the people necro has to fight - if you're in melee range, you're dead. if you can't escape, you're dead. spectral walk, and wurm, have always been mandatory for necros in plat.

[Emapudapus.1307]

@Caine.8204 said:

@"Trevor Boyer.6524" said:The Core Necro build I was using had Vampiric Wells with:

1. Well of Blood
2. Well of Suffering, or Well of Corruption, or sometimes Corrosive Poison Cloud vs. certain comps
3. Well of Power
4. Plague Signet
5. Lich

Vampiric Rituals

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Vampiric_Rituals

granted that utility list A LOT of extra sustain. & substantial damage output. When you're talking about 250 life steal heal & damage per tick per target, that turns something like Well of Power into a substantial heal when it's dropped on 3 to 5 targets with 5s duration 1s ticks, as well a lot of extra damage that isn't effected by toughness or protection.

The build and the way Vampiric Rituals worked, just felt good to play man. There was more versatility before Vampiric Rituals was removed, more distinct build structures. Now after it's been removed, the utility list is just sort of narrow as hell, now with everyone always using Spectral Walk and Flesh Wurm all of the time. Pretty much what's going on now is that all wells suck outside of Well of Darkness

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Well_of_Darkness

, which can be turned into a single monstrous skill when synergized with

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Bitter_Chill

-

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Chilling_Darkness

-

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Cold_Shoulder

but that's all wells are good for now with removal of Vampiric Rituals.

And yeah, Scourge + Tempest is coming on a bit strong lately. Should see what it's like when they're stacked in a FB + Ren on top of that. Four classes with good dps and all tossing each other support cleanse & heal. You can't dent that in a team fight. Right now there isn't enough dps in spvp to match the sustain of that combo. Give it another couple weeks, everyone will be complaining about it.

well-heavy builds run into the pvp issue of not being able to escape any fight. the heal is nice, but when you have a thief on you, its gonna take more than a couple Wells to get him off. you have to make space or he will eat you. this goes with most of the people necro has to fight - if you're in melee range, you're dead. if you can't escape, you're dead.

spectral walk, and wurm, have always been mandatory for necros in plat

.

Thats why wells were good utility for dagger, for close range combat, now they indirectly nerfed it too (eventho it was already rarely used) which shows they didnt put much thought into this patch. Also in bold text is not true.

[Ziggityzog.7389]

@Ben Phongluangtham.1065

This has to be one of the worst changes ever. Either give wells steal life or have it on the trait tree like it was. The wells now are just pathetic and are barely used.

With vamp rituals it made wells worth playing since life steal. Now they are a meme skill set.

[Caine.8204]

@Ziggityzog.7389 said:@Ben Phongluangtham.1065

This has to be one of the worst changes ever. Either give wells steal life or have it on the trait tree like it was. The wells now are just pathetic and are barely used.

With vamp rituals it made wells worth playing since life steal. Now they are a meme skill set.

no. the wells are still used in pve, wvw, and corruption well/blinding well probably still have a place in spvp as well. but going full wells is awful.

[Caine.8204]

@Emapudapus.1307 said:Thats why wells were good utility for dagger, for close range combat, now they indirectly nerfed it too (eventho it was already rarely used) which shows they didnt put much thought into this patch. Also in bold text is not true.

bold text IS true. spectral walk/wurm are both mandatory skills in spvp. if you dont have them, you are worse than any necro that does have them. easier to lock down, so you will die more, deal less damage, and get less kills overall. theres a reason im a plat 2 necro purely solo queueing, and you are not. its because i know what skills i need to run to be effective. i dont run meta, but even i realize that those two skills are like 99% of your build. the swiftness alone is amazing, lasting 30 seconds, and the teleport juke is AMAZING for making range and getting kills. the wurm can be used to teleport behind a wall, so you can leave any fight that you're losing.

trust me. i know what im talking about. if you went full wells, even with dagger, you are a bad necro.

[Emapudapus.1307]

@Caine.8204 said:

@Emapudapus.1307 said:Thats why wells were good utility for dagger, for close range combat, now they indirectly nerfed it too (eventho it was already rarely used) which shows they didnt put much thought into this patch. Also in bold text is not true.

bold text IS true. spectral walk/wurm are both mandatory skills in spvp. if you dont have them, you are worse than any necro that does have them. easier to lock down, so you will die more, deal less damage, and get less kills overall. theres a reason im a plat 2 necro purely solo queueing, and you are not. its because i know what skills i need to run to be effective. i dont run meta, but even i realize that those two skills are like 99% of your build. the swiftness alone is amazing, lasting 30 seconds, and the teleport juke is AMAZING for making range and getting kills. the wurm can be used to teleport behind a wall, so you can leave any fight that you're losing.

trust me. i know what im talking about. if you went full wells, even with dagger, you are a bad necro.

Not saying they arent good for specific playstyle. I went 4 wells, dagger, reaper to mid plat 3/top 25 at that time, before nerf, so your point is invalid.

[Jasonbdj.4021]

@Emapudapus.1307 said:

@Caine.8204 said:

@Emapudapus.1307 said:Thats why wells were good utility for dagger, for close range combat, now they indirectly nerfed it too (eventho it was already rarely used) which shows they didnt put much thought into this patch. Also in bold text is not true.

bold text IS true. spectral walk/wurm are both mandatory skills in spvp. if you dont have them, you are worse than any necro that does have them. easier to lock down, so you will die more, deal less damage, and get less kills overall. theres a reason im a plat 2 necro purely solo queueing, and you are not. its because i know what skills i need to run to be effective. i dont run meta, but even i realize that those two skills are like 99% of your build. the swiftness alone is amazing, lasting 30 seconds, and the teleport juke is AMAZING for making range and getting kills. the wurm can be used to teleport behind a wall, so you can leave any fight that you're losing.

trust me. i know what im talking about. if you went full wells, even with dagger, you are a bad necro.

Not saying they arent good for specific playstyle. I went 4 wells, dagger, reaper to mid plat 3/top 25 at that time, before nerf, so your point is invalid.

I was also in plat via solo using wells instead of a escaping bar lol. Teamfights benefits from your wells and can survive better if you placed them well.

Escaping bar dosent give anything to your team, a decent team would switch targets while you run away lol, usual case whoever you left escaping would be out-numbered while you and your large HP recover, may aswell be dead then trying to get ooc.

[Caine.8204]

@"Emapudapus.1307" said:Not saying they arent good for specific playstyle. I went 4 wells, dagger, reaper to mid plat 3/top 25 at that time, before nerf, so your point is invalid.

ive never heard of you, so very unlikely this is true. that, or you did 10 games and "placed high" but never actually got on the leaderboards, making YOUR point invalid..

[Caine.8204]

@Jasonbdj.4021 said:Escaping bar dosent give anything to your team, a decent team would switch targets while you run away lol, usual case whoever you left escaping would be out-numbered while you and your large HP recover, may aswell be dead then trying to get ooc.

spoken like someone who doesn't know how to pvp. literally any good necro, especially in tournaments or solo queue, use these abilities. i dont know any consistent necros who don't use them, i dont know any necro who actually made it to the top 50 without them, especially solo queue.

you guys are talking out of your ass. wells are fucking terrible lmao. especially 4 stacking them

any good player will realize you are wells and just murder you because you cant get away.

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

@Caine.8204 said:

@Jasonbdj.4021 said:Escaping bar dosent give anything to your team, a decent team would switch targets while you run away lol, usual case whoever you left escaping would be out-numbered while you and your large HP recover, may aswell be dead then trying to get ooc.

spoken like someone who doesn't know how to pvp. literally any good necro, especially in tournaments or solo queue, use these abilities. i dont know any consistent necros who don't use them, i dont know any necro who actually made it to the top 50 without them, especially solo queue.

you guys are talking out of your kitten. wells are kitten terrible lmao. especially 4 stacking them

any good player will realize you are wells and just murder you because you cant get away.

Conquest & 2v2/3v3 were very different things.

In 2v2/3v3, well builds were stronger than flesh wurm/spectral.

[Aktium.9506]

@Caine.8204 said:

@"Emapudapus.1307" said:Not saying they arent good for specific playstyle. I went 4 wells, dagger, reaper to mid plat 3/top 25 at that time, before nerf, so your point is invalid.

ive never heard of you, so very unlikely this is true. that, or you did 10 games and "placed high" but never actually got on the leaderboards, making YOUR point invalid..

Nah. I've seen him often at P2-P3 and in top 50 a good deal of times. I've never seen you though, so we can surmise that you probably play on NA ?

[Jasonbdj.4021]

@Caine.8204 said:

@Jasonbdj.4021 said:Escaping bar dosent give anything to your team, a decent team would switch targets while you run away lol, usual case whoever you left escaping would be out-numbered while you and your large HP recover, may aswell be dead then trying to get ooc.

spoken like someone who doesn't know how to pvp. literally any good necro, especially in tournaments or solo queue, use these abilities. i dont know any consistent necros who don't use them, i dont know any necro who actually made it to the top 50 without them, especially solo queue.

you guys are talking out of your kitten. wells are kitten terrible lmao. especially 4 stacking them

any good player will realize you are wells and just murder you because you cant get away.

This is the type of build you would use for roaming solo in WvW lol.

This mode is a team-based capturing points, escaping bars might save you but this action likely leave other members in your team (who you abandoned) out-numbered.

The time it takes to get back to 100% may as well be dead lol.

Your cutting out utilities where the team can benefit from it just so you can abandoned them and escape.

And no you don't stack all 4 wells as that just stupid and a wasteful, faceroll game-play may be your way but it isn't mine.

I could take on most meta players (the usual facerollers) 1vs1 while running wells lol.

In smaller maps like 2vs2/3vs3 you really can not run far, if you did your just abandoning your team anyways when things gets a little scary for you.

I've been playing PVP modes for a long time, playing a monk in GW1 kiting with pressure while looking out for spike attack on other teammates with infuse, interrupting Mesmer/ranger etc.

Wells was useful when used correctly, until now.

[Caine.8204]

@Aktium.9506 said:

@Caine.8204 said:

@"Emapudapus.1307" said:Not saying they arent good for specific playstyle. I went 4 wells, dagger, reaper to mid plat 3/top 25 at that time, before nerf, so your point is invalid.

ive never heard of you, so very unlikely this is true. that, or you did 10 games and "placed high" but never actually got on the leaderboards, making YOUR point invalid..

Nah. I've seen him often at P2-P3 and in top 50 a good deal of times. I've never seen you though, so we can surmise that you probably play on NA ?

oh i didnt realize these forums included EU as well, thats my bad.