... But The Thief Got Away.

[DeLys.5380]

@"Naxos.2503" said:I find that copious amount of condis tend to take down fleeing thieves handily enough if they're seperated from their support.

I have an axe to grind against perma stealth thieves though.

AMEN! One day I got so sick of the thieves, mesmers, and trap rangers who attack then run I made a condi build especially for this. When it begins to annoy me too much or we are up against a server that runs a lot of these builds (you all know who they are), I pull it out. No matter how glassy they are, most of us cannot one shot them with power damage, but they can't run away from killing damage that they take with them. So far, I haven't met one that could escape dying to it after they run and use all their cleanses. It's even fun in squad fights when we think we are done killing everyone and then the commander turns around, looking 900 range away, and says "Wait! We still have all these downs over here. (And how do we have all these downs over here?)" (snicker)

[misterman.1530]

@Justine.6351 said:

@misterman.1530 said:

@Psycoprophet.8107 said:

@misterman.1530 said:

@AliamRationem.5172 said:

@"DemonSeed.3528" said:In my experience it's not always rolling thief that gets you away - it's knowing your limits and knowing when to pull away from enemy (besides your build). Some thieves get too greedy or in the moment which tends to get them killed (and it's good to bait the ones that play this way). Depending on their build, if you don't get coordinated effort you may not be able to kill the smarter ones.

You're not wrong. However, I can tell you my mesmer running multiple teleport and stealth skills never had any trouble walking away from a fight. Meanwhile, my sword weaver is pretty much all-in on every engagement!

Yeah, same with every Necro build. Pretty much an all-in every engagement. I don't believe there's any class without any good mobility (okay, the Wurm, if you pre-cast it away from the battle). Necro's don't have an "Oh kitten, better run" skill.

No they have a high dps oh.... extra hp button ontop of preplanned tele. All necro specs would need heavy sustain nerfs to receive more mobility.

So you think a Scourge has an "extra hp button" - whatever that is. You mean the "barriers"? The really, really weak barriers unless you are running a heavy healing build?

In any case, wasn't asking for more mobility - simply pointing out that, like Sword Weaver, necros are all in on close engagements.

And Scourges/Reapers in a WvW zerg wouldn't be running Wurm anyways. That would lose out on better skills.

Who is talking about zergs here...

I was.

[Magnuzone.8395]

It's fun when you are on your warrior or guard and you notice a slight decrease in your health, and you see someone stealth. Like when you get bitten by a mosquito. "Huh....what was that?..oh never mind"

There are many thieves in wvw, but not really many good ones. But when you meet one, they can really mess you up.

[MarzAttakz.9608]

It's fun when you are on your warrior or guard Elementalist and you notice a slight massive decrease in your health, and you see someone stealth hear something behind you. Like when you get bitten by a mosquito Great White. "Huh....what was that?..oh never mind, let me respawn"

There are many thieves in wvw, but not really many good ones and every one of them, good or bad, prey on Elementalists. ~~But when you meet one,~~ they can really mess you up.

[DemonSeed.3528]

I actually enjoy fighting them on my core ele or Weaver, haven't given any time to my tempest though.

[Aeolus.3615]

Well all i can say is thief needs to work like that due game nature of aoe/cleave spam :\

its a class ideology design problem that led to mechnics problems...like a snow ball effect.

[urd.8306]

How is thief there any different than any other class?

[Tuna Bandit.3786]

Remove stealth equals Remove Thief.Wow the hatred towards a class is extreme.

The perma stealth power thief comes with a trade-off. Remove stealth... Sure, if we get massive sustain increase without loosing power. Anyone? Likely not.

Thieves aren't the issue in WvW. Haters that Exaturate ANY thief they encounter and feel the TOXIC need to Whisper hatred after killing one.THAT is the TRUE problem with WvW.

I am not your best player (will never be, due to handicaps)I play a Deadeye in WvW. I think escape vs getting killed is 50/50 ish...But ow my GOSH to the SHEER AMOUNT OF HATRED IN WHISPER!!!THAT is the TRUE burdon of playing thief in WvW. THE SHEER TOXICITY!!

And look and behold on the forums: EXACTLY the same.

Wow!

[MiniMe.1960]

@Tuna Bandit.3786 said:Remove stealth equals Remove Thief.Wow the hatred towards a class is extreme.

The perma stealth power thief comes with a trade-off. Remove stealth... Sure, if we get massive sustain increase without loosing power. Anyone? Likely not.

Thieves aren't the issue in WvW. Haters that Exaturate ANY thief they encounter and feel the TOXIC need to Whisper hatred after killing one.THAT is the TRUE problem with WvW.

I am not your best player (will never be, due to handicaps)I play a Deadeye in WvW. I think escape vs getting killed is 50/50 ish...But ow my GOSH to the SHEER AMOUNT OF HATRED IN WHISPER!!!THAT is the TRUE burdon of playing thief in WvW. THE SHEER TOXICITY!!

And look and behold on the forums: EXACTLY the same.

Wow!

my experience is different ... most of the rage whispers i get are from thief's. Also i die the least by far with my thief.

PS. you don't get hate but tears aka salt

[saerni.2584]

@MiniMe.1960 said:

@Tuna Bandit.3786 said:Remove stealth equals Remove Thief.Wow the hatred towards a class is extreme.

The perma stealth power thief comes with a trade-off. Remove stealth... Sure, if we get massive sustain increase without loosing power. Anyone? Likely not.

Thieves aren't the issue in WvW. Haters that Exaturate ANY thief they encounter and feel the TOXIC need to Whisper hatred after killing one.THAT is the TRUE problem with WvW.

I am not your best player (will never be, due to handicaps)I play a Deadeye in WvW. I think escape vs getting killed is 50/50 ish...But ow my GOSH to the SHEER AMOUNT OF HATRED IN WHISPER!!!THAT is the TRUE burdon of playing thief in WvW. THE SHEER TOXICITY!!

And look and behold on the forums: EXACTLY the same.

Wow!

my experience is different ... most of the rage whispers i get are from thief's. Also i die the least by far with my thief.

PS. you don't get hate but tears aka salt

Salt is great. Especially when they think your actual utility skills are “hacking” and that you clearly must have cheated to beat them.

[TheGrimm.5624]

Hadn't played any of my thieves lately but ran into one running an old core build who did a great job of kiting my hammer scrapper around till they got me a couple of times. Had to pull out to one of my thieves to play and re-affirm what I think I was doing wrong. Likewise not a good thief since I playmore like a scrapper on my thief and don't disengage enough. That said, the ease in which to bait people out of objectives is crazy and makes me want to ask myself if I am being that easily baited at times. Have to remind the havoc to stop squirilling on the thief that's going to run away, either lock them down or move along they aren't going to be doing anything but waste their own time. And being not a good thief it's always funny when jumped by another thief and they take a rotation and then run away. Had one whisper me the other day that thieves aren't suppose to be tanks. So yeah guide to all not playing a thief, you might have let the mental game get to you. Good hunting!

[arielqueen.6587]

Tower of Aion (which is NCsoft game) has skills that can see stealth enemies for few seconds. I think that can be good counter play for stealth mechanics.

[Straegen.2938]

If a thief takes stealth or acro, they neuter their damage but yes they can run well. If they don't take these two, they die a lot. The thief class has been destroyed over the last several years. They have barely functioning weapon sets and they are pretty much only good for +1 in a fight or killing crappy players.

Look at their weapon sets P/P dead. Staff dead. S/P dead. D/D dead. S/D on life support. P/D on life support. D/P barely functional. Rifle barely functional. Shortbow escape only.

[Arheundel.6451]

@Straegen.2938 said:If a thief takes stealth or acro, they neuter their damage but yes they can run well. If they don't take these two, they die a lot. The thief class has been destroyed over the last several years. They have barely functioning weapon sets and they are pretty much only good for +1 in a fight or killing crappy players.

Look at their weapon sets P/P dead. Staff dead. S/P dead. D/D dead. S/D on life support. P/D on life support. D/P barely functional. Rifle barely functional. Shortbow escape only.

...nobody here buys the BS you're trying to sell......so drop the comedy act already

[urd.8306]

Staff dead? You mean dead like for Elementalist or hitting for 22k dead?

[Fat Disgrace.4275]

@Straegen.2938 said:If a thief takes stealth or acro, they neuter their damage but yes they can run well. If they don't take these two, they die a lot. The thief class has been destroyed over the last several years. They have barely functioning weapon sets and they are pretty much only good for +1 in a fight or killing crappy players.

Look at their weapon sets P/P dead. Staff dead. S/P dead. D/D dead. S/D on life support. P/D on life support. D/P barely functional. Rifle barely functional. Shortbow escape only.

Thief either takes acro or shadow arts and still do plenty enough dmg lol. Very defensive are we?

[Shroud.2307]

I see Thieves like stray cats in small scale fights. If you run toward them when their team is losing, they're probably going to run for the hills and you'll have no way of stopping it. You can't just rush toward them, you have to make yourself open or indirectly move toward them in preparation for their retreat.

What I mean is, you're not going to catch them if they don't want you to. But if it's not the first thing on their mind you'll have a better chance.

I always keep a side eye on Thieves in these kinds of fights and if I can manage, I keep track of their usage of Shadow Step. If I see a good opportunity, ideally when they use Daggerstorm, 9 times out of 10 I can kill them with a Spectral Ring and some follow up pressure. I try to make sure they're not one of the last ones standing, but I don't directly focus them. The other times, the times they escape, it's because everyone is tunnel visioned on the Thief basically waving a giant red flag telling them to start running.

[Forevereveralone.6385]

New player here in WvW thank to the no down week and increased loot made me interest. But eh ... yea ... In my timezone of playing there is 2 of these daredevils from the same guild that always seem to be nonstop evasion and ridiculously hard to catch. Anytime I managed to immobilize them, they just press Dagger Storm and invis away. They would go into like a small group of 10, burst someone down, and come out alive. How do we deal with daredevil that seems to be permanent evasion with 3 dodge, dagger storm and invis. Playing a soulbeast build that my friend recommended me. It is basically just this squishy longbow hybrid damage build using Grievous stat.

[Ahnlok.3897]

@Straegen.2938 said:If a thief takes stealth or acro, they neuter their damage but yes they can run well. If they don't take these two, they die a lot. The thief class has been destroyed over the last several years. They have barely functioning weapon sets and they are pretty much only good for +1 in a fight or killing crappy players.

Look at their weapon sets P/P dead. Staff dead. S/P dead. D/D dead. S/D on life support. P/D on life support. D/P barely functional. Rifle barely functional. Shortbow escape only.

What kind of game are you playing? We are talking about Guild Wars 2

[Yasai.3549]

I find it funny how Thieves are still using the age old "No Stealth = No Thief" argument.That would have been a viable argument 2 years ago, but as of now, Thieves actually stand to be one of the most durable Professions in the competitive scene.

Just go ahead and fight a Condi DD with any Power build.Their entire DD traitline counters Power approach due to the constant Weakness application, and when they are faced with Condi threats, they can simply escape Condi threats and get so far away they don't have to fight them until they feel like the Condi opponent has used their cooldowns and then they strike.

"But just Condi them when they running"Sigil of Cleansing and Shadow's Embrace make a joke of Conditions.

[bambi.6214]

Stealth isn't a problem. All the teleports, shadowsteps, stunbreaks and mobility is what makes thief impossible to kill. If a thief stealths, they'r still vulnerable to AoEs, to CC, even to some channel skills like ranger longbow2, p-forge 4 (lazers), skilled player is even able to predict thief's movement. Meanwhile shadowstep can't be countered. There is no counter for 1200 instant stunbreak teleport, except maybe Megabane Tether (which doesnt even pull the thief all the way if I remember correctly?) and maybe Dragonhunter F1.

At this even, if DD gets a stunbreak on dodge, "fighting" them wouldn't be that different (DD specifically stands out in my mind coz of Dash, that even removes immobilize. But it's core thief mobility that is already ridiculous).

[SteepledHat.1345]

Yes, the thief got away and accomplished nothing. That's it's job. It's job is to +1 and pester you. It's not built to duel. It's not built to contest a node. It's built to make things unfair. That's by literal design. Getting away take a lot of resources. Use your reveals (and reveal traps), condi bomb, chill and cripple to steal endurance on dash, or send your own thieves to counter harass. I don't think people realize how much Thief v Thief happens all around them because it's so fast they miss it.

[UNOwen.7132]

@"Yasai.3549" said:I find it funny how Thieves are still using the age old "No Stealth = No Thief" argument.

Stealth is not that important to thief (we had 0 stealth thieves work before), but it does have enough offensive utility that it is still relevant.

That would have been a viable argument 2 years ago, but as of now, Thieves actually stand to be one of the most durable Professions in the competitive scene.

:lol:Wait, youre serious? Ok, jokes aside, its obviously nonsense. Theyre not anywhere near the most durable. You could argue if theyre the least durable or second or third-least, but no more than that.

Just go ahead and fight a Condi DD with any Power build.

Did that. They died. A lot. Turns out having subpar active defense is a weakness so large being able to apply passive damage reduction doesnt nearly make up for it. Who knew?

Their entire DD traitline counters Power approach due to the constant Weakness application, and when they are faced with Condi threats, they can simply escape Condi threats and get so far away they don't have to fight them until they feel like the Condi opponent has used their cooldowns and then they strike.

Do you mean Weakening Strikes? Its 2 seconds of weakness every dodge. Its less effective than the protection other classes can provide, and that is ontop of those classes having superior active defenses. And thats not mentioning it being cleansed. And against condi threats, they escape, and the condi threat doesnt follow. Not dying because you ran away and didnt stay in a fight doesnt make you "durable". By that logic afk at spawn builds are the most durable.

"But just Condi them when they running"Sigil of Cleansing and Shadow's Embrace make a joke of Conditions.

Uh, no. Just let them run. Thats still a won interaction.

[Vavume.8065]

@DeceiverX.8361 said:Play Soulbeast.Equip Longbow.Press 2.

DP thief presses 4 and laughs.

[Jugglemonkey.8741]

@Svarty.8019 said:We've all got stories about battles we've had. The most memorable for me are the 10-ish people ones. You know, where it's not small enough to be ganky and not big enough to be zergy. They're the Goldilocks battles. The fun ones.

Sadly, there's a recurring theme that thwarts these stories. The Thief always gets away.

Whether it's our thief or the enemy thief. It makes a mockery of the game. How is anybody supposed to take combat in GW2 seriously when they know they can roll thief and never die?

What do you expect, that the thief stands there and dies in a situation they can't win because you think it's unfair for them to get away? Would you not run into a tower when a blob shows up and ends the small scale fight because it's only fair they get a bag? Most classes can build to bug out if they choose to, and hit and run tactics can be used by any player. If thief didn't have the best mobility It'd be another class that gets away every time, and if you had the mobility to get away (which you don't because you main necro lol) you'd do the exact same thing the thief is doing. So you might want to get off your high horse and stop pretending you'd do anything different given our positions were reversed.