Vermilion Wings Are Causing Performance Issues For Everyone Who Plays The Game

[Kron.2351]

Hi all,Like title said this is a huge problem now, there are a lot of people with Vermilion wings and it causes high FPS loss.We tested it yesterday during weekly raids and my team experience FPS loss from 10 to 30 frames, for some of them raids become just slide show and I had to turn off my back skin (and swap to other class cause I don't want to play on class without complete glamour :cry: ). After that everything back to norm. We tested it on Chrono and FB and problem not class related but skin related.This problem affects not only raids but all open world areas and WvW, now everyone uses this skin and FPS drops in open world and WvW become unacceptable, even on high performance PC.We have two back items which causes huge FPS drops in a short period which result in general performance degradation.I think here we have 2 possible solutions:1) Some king of optimization (but I doubt that this is possible or easy to implement in short time)2) Add options to disable player auras\effects\back-items-skins like it done to armor and weapon glamour (this option will be the best in my opinion as it will help most number of people either in open world or WvW, there are a lot of other items which cause FPS drops and can't be disabled or hided)I hope this can be fixed ASAP because it becoming more and more critical.

[Astyrah.4015]

this is less of a bug and more of a QoL need, which i agree we should have.

the game needs an option to turn off all player visual effects and an option to turn off/simplify other player's skill animations/projectiles/effects

there are many other threads such as this that pop up once in a while in Guild Wars 2 Discussion subforum, such as https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/101483/please-let-us-turn-off-other-player-effects#latest ------------ and most of the time they get merged with the QoL thread https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/53097/suggestions-qol-quality-of-life-ideas-merged#latest

we can only hope that the devs/team have read all of these (and your post) and gives us a fix someday

[Nokomis.5076]

Players: We need more Shinys!ArenaNet: Here are your Shinys, but the FPS will drop because of too much effects.Players: ...

[Josiah.2967]

I thought I was the only one; however, on another platform, I saw others are having the same issue. I hope the performance issue can be fixed. I love the wings and the visual effects as they are.

[Kron.2351]

You are not the only one: https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/111366/vermilion-wings-and-other-auras-and-skins-result-in-huge-fps-drops-in-all-game-modes#latestAnd people experience huge fps drops everywhere because of this wings

[Josiah.2967]

It's a shame. I spent a lot of money for a back piece that drops 10-20 frames per second. I love the wings. I even bragged about them; however, the jarring performance drop is another level of optimized.

[CDBeauty.3691]

I usually have around 30, that's without any fancy graphic settings at all. When I have a full view of someones wings on my screen it drops down to 8 FPS and in DR Ive even reached 4 FPS :D It is really a shame because people love the wings and some spent a lot of money to get them! And now in some areas when we are packed together I can't even move normally so what the hell? Why lwoering the complexity and graphic settings doesn't affect some items like it does others?

[Josiah.2967]

My friends and I did some thorough testing.

I lose about 30 frames with Mesmer Clones.I lose about 5 frames for ever other player that uses the back piece.

If I use a back pieces, it will significantly hurt all other players near me. Each additional player also lowers frames further. This is the only back piece that doe sit.

They use the new effect (sames as the Skyscale that hurts frames). This should never be used.Primeval effect has 0 hit on performance and would give the same effectOlder flame effect has 0 hit on performance and would give a similar effect

This item alone is ruining everyones experience.

[Mewcifer.5198]

I feel kind of bad. I have been using the wings and not noticed any performance issues on my end.

I love how they look. But knowing they are negatively impacting people who aren't using high end PCs makes me feel like I am somehow wrong for using them.

[Josiah.2967]

@Mewcifer.5198 said:I feel kind of bad. I have been using the wings and not noticed any performance issues on my end.

I love how they look. But knowing they are negatively impacting people who aren't using high end PCs makes me feel like I am somehow wrong for using them.

I guarantee they are lowering your frame rate as well. An easy test is to have a spare back piece in your bank/inventory with a different look. You will need to open your graphic panel and your equipment panel. In the equipment panel go back and forth. Watch your frames change. If you have a Mesmer user a clone and watch how each clone with the backpack lowers your frames further. Already 20 people on Reddit have tested and are complaining about the same thing.

I have the beefiest computer in my controlled test of 8 people,. Friends willing to take the time to show the impact. I am incredibly sensitive to FPS changes, so I instantly pick up on it. For me personally, anything under 60 frames causes me to be sick. I constantly drop below that threshold now. Before this backpack 80 frames was my low. I have also tested on a fresh clean install. Our group tested using any other back piece in a secluded area and our frames all went up significantly.

Our group all confirmed that one person using the wings lowered everyone's frame rate.

I have a i9900K, 32GB Fast Ram, 2080 Super, and one of the fastest NVME drives you can find.

Note: I spent $$$ for this... The performance impact is so bad I can't even use it on a high-end machine.

[Mewcifer.5198]

@Josiah.2967 said:

@Mewcifer.5198 said:I feel kind of bad. I have been using the wings and not noticed any performance issues on my end.

I love how they look. But knowing they are negatively impacting people who aren't using high end PCs makes me feel like I am somehow wrong for using them.

I guarantee they are lowering your frame rate as well. An easy test is to have a spare back piece in your bank/inventory with a different look. You will need to open your graphic panel and your equipment panel. In the equipment panel go back and forth. Watch your frames change. If you have a Mesmer user a clone and watch how each clone with the backpack lowers your frames further. Already 20 people on Reddit have tested and are complaining about the same thing.

I have the beefiest computer in my controlled test of 8 people,. Friends willing to take the time to show the impact. I am incredibly sensitive to FPS changes, so I instantly pick up on it. For me personally, anything under 60 frames causes me to be sick. I constantly drop below that threshold now. Before this backpack 80 frames was my low. I have also tested on a fresh clean install. Our group tested using any other back piece in a secluded area and our frames all went up significantly.

Our group all confirmed that one person using the wings lowered everyone's frame rate.

I have a i9900K, 32GB Fast Ram, 2080 Super, and one of the fastest NVME drives you can find.

Note: I spent $$$ for this... The performance impact is so bad I can't even use it on a high-end machine.

I just tested saw pretty much no change, I am talking less than 5 fps of a change. Not nearly as bad as I have seen people saying it is for them.

[Josiah.2967]

@Mewcifer.5198 said:

@Josiah.2967 said:

@Mewcifer.5198 said:I feel kind of bad. I have been using the wings and not noticed any performance issues on my end.

I love how they look. But knowing they are negatively impacting people who aren't using high end PCs makes me feel like I am somehow wrong for using them.

I guarantee they are lowering your frame rate as well. An easy test is to have a spare back piece in your bank/inventory with a different look. You will need to open your graphic panel and your equipment panel. In the equipment panel go back and forth. Watch your frames change. If you have a Mesmer user a clone and watch how each clone with the backpack lowers your frames further. Already 20 people on Reddit have tested and are complaining about the same thing.

I have the beefiest computer in my controlled test of 8 people,. Friends willing to take the time to show the impact. I am incredibly sensitive to FPS changes, so I instantly pick up on it. For me personally, anything under 60 frames causes me to be sick. I constantly drop below that threshold now. Before this backpack 80 frames was my low. I have also tested on a fresh clean install. Our group tested using any other back piece in a secluded area and our frames all went up significantly.

Our group all confirmed that one person using the wings lowered everyone's frame rate.

I have a i9900K, 32GB Fast Ram, 2080 Super, and one of the fastest NVME drives you can find.

Note: I spent $$$ for this... The performance impact is so bad I can't even use it on a high-end machine.

I just tested saw pretty much no change, I am talking less than 5 fps of a change. Not nearly as bad as I have seen people saying it is for them.

It might depend on your settings. I'm on a 1440P Ultra Wide. My 4K friend seem to have similar drop in performance per set of wings.

[ototoxin.6052]

can also attest to this... finally got the wings after maybe 27 keys, upon equipping them i immediately dropped about 20 frames. had been having random FPS issues before this too but thought it was just the new half of Drizzlewood causing it...

[Kron.2351]

We did a lot more testings with my guild and this issue really affects game experience hard!Single mesmer using this backpack cause FPS drops by 10-30 depends of system configuration for most people game become just unplayable because their FPS drops below 10 sometimes. We can't force all people stop using that backpack which result in slideshows for big number of users whether it is open world, wvw or instance content.How can we address this issue to ArenaNet? I already have two proposals how it can be fixed, which described in my earlier post: https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/111366/vermilion-wings-and-other-auras-and-skins-result-in-huge-fps-drops-in-all-game-modes#latest1) Some king of optimization (but I doubt that this is possible or easy to implement in short time)2) Add options to disable player auras\effects\back-items-skins like it done to armor and weapon glamour (this option will be the best in my opinion as it will help most number of people either in open world or WvW, there are a lot of other items which cause FPS drops and can't be disabled or hided)We are getting more glamour each patch but no real optimizations which we really need now!

[Josiah.2967]

@"Kron.2351" said:We did a lot more testings with my guild and this issue really affects game experience hard!Single mesmer using this backpack cause FPS drops by 10-30 depends of system configuration for most people game become just unplayable because their FPS drops below 10 sometimes. We can't force all people stop using that backpack which result in slideshows for big number of users whether it is open world, wvw or instance content.How can we address this issue to ArenaNet? I already have two proposals how it can be fixed, which described in my earlier post: https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/111366/vermilion-wings-and-other-auras-and-skins-result-in-huge-fps-drops-in-all-game-modes#latest1) Some king of optimization (but I doubt that this is possible or easy to implement in short time)2) Add options to disable player auras\effects\back-items-skins like it done to armor and weapon glamour (this option will be the best in my opinion as it will help most number of people either in open world or WvW, there are a lot of other items which cause FPS drops and can't be disabled or hided)We are getting more glamour each patch but no real optimizations which we really need now!

Thank you for taking the time to test. It is always great to have more data!

Regarding option 1, if my theory is correct, this should be relatively easy to do. The only items that use the new flame effect which cause the issue is the Incarnate Flame and the Vermilion Wings. These two items cause huge performance issues when compared to all other options. Simply changing that flame effect to the old way of doing flames or the primeval effect could accomplish a similar (most wouldn't recognize the difference) look for the back piece. We already have other back pieces that use those effects without any performance issues.

In my opinion, they should never use the new flames in their current state.

[CaptainCaptain.8904]

I drop a ton of frames when using these, love the look though :(

[Malus Bloodthirst.4923]

Same issue here with Incarnate Flame skin. Normally I get around 30-40 constant FPS on "best appearance" settings with my bootcamped Macbook Pro 16, even in difficult environments with many players (okay... 25 in full metas). However, as soon as I mount up I lose like 5-10 FPS and when I make fast movements such as quickly changing direction and dashing twice in a row it drops for a while to around 15 FPS. I have to set Shaders to low, this gives me around 60 FPS, with drops to 20-30 when using the skin and doing some quick movements. It ruins my feeling from the skin so much that I prefer the normal skyscale. With normal skyscale there are no drops no matter what crazy movements I do. It's like I can literally see "okay, now there's a TON of flame/smoke particles to be computed" when the lags happen. Please do sth about this - reduce the visual effect or introduce a setting which can reduce/disable it.

[Josiah.2967]

To make matters worse, this is really hurting everyone. I had 8 people use the wings as a test, and I lost 20 frames when I did not have the wings equipped. When they changed their backpack, the frames went backup.

I see people reporting lower framerates; however, we can prove the new wings are a huge culprit in recent performance issues. It is so bad we will not let anyone use them in Raids.

When will Arenanet acknowledge the issue?

[keenedge.9675]

I have the wings and have noticed no difference on a i3770, nVidia960FTW.Remember AMD graphics is not the end-all. They inherited ATI + Cardinal crummy code.

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

Note, the performance drop with these wings and the Skyscale doesn't occur on DXVK, and I imagine not on dx12pxy either (though untested). This means its something about how modern graphics cards are handling the DX9 shaders for the skins.

The devs really need better testing environments, it seems.

[Zaraki.5784]

Seriously wt f! How can a back piece cause this much harm to self and others?

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

@keenedge.9675 said:I have the wings and have noticed no difference on a i3770, nVidia960FTW.Remember AMD graphics is not the end-all. They inherited ATI + Cardinal crummy code.

I also have no performance drops from the Wings. In fact, sometimes my FPS goes up. (GTX 1050)

[TheAgedGnome.7520]

(i5-9600K 3.7GHz & nVidia GTX1660)

With ~63 fps with no back item, I notice that displaying the vermillion wings will drop fps to ~47-50 if I am zoomed in somewhat close to the back of my character. If I am zoomed out (i.e., far behind my character), then the fps does not drop. Interestingly, if I am zoomed in close to the front of my character, then the fps is ~58-60 with the wings displayed.

For a comparison, the Wyrm's Breath Cape, despite having animation, does not affect my fps at all.

[Kron.2351]

I recorded one more video:

Problem exists and it still here, I did more tests with my guild mates who have this wings and results are similar, I can create more videos later if needed, system configuration doesn't matter every setup experience fps drops.

[Kron.2351]

Today I did few raids on my chrono with this wings and everyone complain that they had unusual FPS drops but almost no one guess that it was because of wings.People just unaware that just skin can result in such big issue. Here screen from my last raid where one person was aware about this problem. So it seems many people experience this problem but don't know that root cause JUST Shiny SKIN!