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HoT = Dark Souls ? Casual Gamer perspective.


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Edit: This post is to voice a percentage of player base's opinion(may it be a minority, majority, or even just me) on HoT including mine. I have nothing less than love for the game Devs and the community. I have been playing for 2-3 years atleast, and have played some GW1 back in the day. Im not just throwing shade on the HoT content. I am trying to voice my opinion and my experience in a straightforward manner.

Alright, so i just finished up my online classes and studies for my upcoming third year exams and I sit to do my daily completion of a legendary, going on for weeks now. As you can understand, i don't have more than maybe 2-3 hours to play at best. Completion of Eternity and other core legendary weapons took time, but atleast it was doable without frustration and having "fun". When it comes to HoT, I don't know what i am even doing. I am trying to go around the map 90% of the time trying not to die because the floor minion mobs are so OVERPOWERED. I have been playing the game for 2 years, and i have avoided HoT every chance i got because of the same exact reasons i am about to mention.

  1. Its very hard to see, hate the map design and how dark it is in 70% of the places.
  2. Lags way too much on my mid end laptop.
  3. Floor mobs are wayy too overpowered and feel like boss mobs.
  4. Hence because of the same reason above, VERY hard to level up the masteries.
  5. Why do masteries you ask? Because there are wayy too many hero points and other aspects of the completion of HoT, which require doing them. Which sucks.
  6. I can't Solo 50% of the hero points, being a max reaper.
  7. WAIT, I NEED TO DO A ADRENALINE MASTERY TO DO A HERO POINT WHICH CONSUMES MY LIFE WHEN I EAT BACON? WHEN MY LIFE POOL IS 22k??
  8. I actually start to rage(sorry for caps above) playing guild wars 2, which is 90% of the time fun, except when i play HoT.
  9. And due to the above reasons i mentioned above, I actually can feel better playing DARK SOULS than HoT.

I also get why they would be reluctant to nerf the mobs more and bring some player driven balance , but atleast 50% if not more gamers are casual on gw2 and want to play not to rage but to have a good time, i don't mind taking months to get my legendary, BUT ATLEAST let the process be fun. I don't want to get grabbed by a rip off stegosaurus while i'm on my raptor and get 2 shot with 22k health. Any balance, related to player level, or player-online time based balance on mobs, a bit more lighting in HoT maps, a bit more of anything. I get HoT is a very old expansion and that Cantha is coming. But atleast respect your players who are trying their hardest to stick to the game and trying to voice their opinions for a change. And of-course please try providing it. Alright! Back to returning to a checkpoint which takes me halfway across the map from the hero point i just died on, and try to re attempt it with broken armor, because there is no repair station nearby, and i don't have a million repair canisters because i'm a casual.

Edit: I realized they have nerfed the difficulty once, i can't imagine what the mobs were like.Edit: I get where most of you all are coming from, But as i said, its my opinion and many other casual gamers opinion on the content. Leading to a player driven balance, not a balance for everyone.

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Sounds like you want a game with gear progression so that you can outgear any obstacles you happen to come across. GW2 is not the game for you as all of the progression in expansion content is (player

HoT has already been nerfed once. As a casual gamer, I still struggle through it, but I am capable enough to not get in too far over my head in these maps. Personally, I do not enjoy the challenges in HoT, but am glad that it fills a niche for other players who do enjoy it.

@"AdamWarlord.6782" said:But atleast respect your players who are trying their hardest to stick to the game and trying to voice their opinions for a change.I think that you will find these "players" to be in a very small minority when it comes to HoT. Anet did listen. They nerfed it and the content that has followed HoT isn't near the same level of difficulty. Perhaps you might consider moving on from HoT maps and returning once you have a better grasp of your characters' skills/abilities?

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@sitarskee.5738 said:Mobs were stronger back in the days, they were already nerfed. Plus we have mounts now. Please don't make this game a game for kids difficulty wise.

Thats exactly why i mentioned, there should be a balanced perspective on mobs difficulty as per the player's play time or something more intuitive. Of-course im sure you play the game more than a casual gamer ans you think as you stated. But from a person who hardly has time to relax in a day and do some legendary completion. Dying 10 times and running back to the same hero point takes most of the time away. Thats just an example of the many things that could happen. I heard they were much stronger, but in my view thats just absurd. I do know one person's opinion can't match with many other people, and its hard to satisfy all, im jsut making sure that there is still a thought process going towards player based balancing.

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@"kharmin.7683" said:I think that you will find these "players" to be in a very small minority when it comes to HoT. Anet did listen. They nerfed it and the content that has followed HoT isn't near the same level of difficulty. Perhaps you might consider moving on from HoT maps and returning once you have a better grasp of your characters' skills/abilities?

I just played with a squad of 8 to complete one hero point. balthazar in Auric Basin, and all of them had a problem with the maps. so it ccleasrly isn't a minority or it was just a coincidence that 8 out of 8 people happen to believe the same.And yep Arenanet does listen, i was just raging when i mentioned that, i shall remove it. I hadn't known if they had actually nerfed the mobs.

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HoT is easy as hell with mounts now. Please don't water it down even further, beta HoT was a blast, the mobs were actually smart, dodged, counterattacked and punished. Now it's ok i guess but there is barely any challenge with all the powercreep we have.Please for the love of god, don't nerf any mobs in this game. If anything, buff them.

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@AdamWarlord.6782 said:

@"kharmin.7683" said:I think that you will find these "players" to be in a very small minority when it comes to HoT. Anet did listen. They nerfed it and the content that has followed HoT isn't near the same level of difficulty. Perhaps you might consider moving on from HoT maps and returning once you have a better grasp of your characters' skills/abilities?

I just played with a squad of 8 to complete one hero point. balthazar in Auric Basin, and all of them had a problem with the maps. so it ccleasrly isn't a minority or it was just a coincidence that 8 out of 8 people happen to believe the same.8 players does not a significant sample size make. "clearly isn't a minority"? I'd wager you could run that HP again at different times of the day / night and find completely different results. I've done that same HP multiple times to help other players and haven't seen or heard the grief that you mention.

Just my experience. Yours was different. Doesn't mean that the maps need the adjustments that you are advocating. /shrug

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Just my experience. Yours was different. Doesn't mean that the maps need the adjustments that you are advocating. /shrug

Exactly my point. Most casual players don't have time to play the same thing over and over. I don't want to turn this into an argument, but a productive mutual understanding of how everyone's experiences are different, and IF arenanet could come up with something which is more of an individual based balance. And i would say 8 random players, on a game, all having a similar opinion is atleast something to look at.

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@AdamWarlord.6782 said:

@"kharmin.7683" said:

Just my experience. Yours was different. Doesn't mean that the maps need the adjustments that you are advocating. /shrug

Exactly my point. Most casual players don't have time to play the same thing over and over. I don't want to turn this into an argument, but a productive mutual understanding of how everyone's experiences are different, and IF arenanet could come up with something which is more of an individual based balance. And i would say 8 random players, on a game, all having a similar opinion is atleast something to look at.

I'm not trying to make an argument. I just don't want Anet to make changes based on your very limited experience. They don't need to look at things based on 8 random players out of the millions of players that they have.

If you want Anet to come up with something "which is more of an individual based balance", then what do you propose? GW2 is, after all, an MMO and even though much of it can be played solo, I don't believe that it is Anet's intent that it be played that way. Besides, if you want individual based balance, how would that work?

I'm just not fully understanding your point. It seems to me that you have difficulty with HoT content, but have not suggestions for how Anet might adjust it solely for you?

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I'm not trying to make an argument. I just don't want Anet to make changes based on your very limited experience. They don't need to look at things based on 8 random players out of the millions of players that they have.

If you want Anet to come up with something "which is more of an individual based balance", then what do you propose? GW2 is, after all, an MMO and even though much of it can be played solo, I don't believe that it is Anet's intent that it be played that way. Besides, if you want individual based balance, how would that work?

I'm just not fully understanding your point. It seems to me that you have difficulty with HoT content, but have not suggestions for how Anet might adjust it solely for you?

Its 8/8 is what i mentioned, obviously there are more than 8 if u look at the million player base, obviously.

As for the whole point of the post, its to voice MY OPINION and a few other i know , and to let them know few of their customers, have an issue with the game design, i'm not a developer, not yet atleast. I suggested a path for development, IF it can be taken, i'm not demanding, I'm requesting. I hope you understand. No other MMO, as far as my knowledge is, did the region based balancing by having a level limit like in GW2. And that was brilliant! If they could have come up with that, I'm sure if they are committed towards a change in balancing of HoT, The game Devs, not me, but the game Devs who developed everything else, can come up with something.

I'm nothing less than love towards the Devs of this game and the community. And i Have been playing this game for a while for me to be voicing any of my opinions, and i don't see why another player has to have a problem with the experience of a player to voice their opinion. I have paid for the game and so have you.

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i'm casual as hell and I could finish al of HoT (still got some achievements and other non story stuff to do though)you can do it :)the hardest thing is now hero points I guess . that need a group to do them, and there might be less people to play that content now.

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Calling yourself a casual ain't no excuse. If you can't do it then it's not for you. You're not good enough to make that legendary.

I just hate people who see problems everywhere but not in them. You're bad, you have to change - not the environment for you so you can be less bad.

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@"AdamWarlord.6782" said:

I'm not trying to make an argument. I just don't want Anet to make changes based on your very limited experience. They don't need to look at things based on 8 random players out of the millions of players that they have.

If you want Anet to come up with something "which is more of an individual based balance", then what do you propose? GW2 is, after all, an MMO and even though much of it can be played solo, I don't believe that it is Anet's intent that it be played that way. Besides, if you want individual based balance, how would that work?

I'm just not fully understanding your point. It seems to me that you have difficulty with HoT content, but have not suggestions for how Anet might adjust it solely for you?

Its 8/8 is what i mentioned, obviously there are more than 8 if u look at the million player base, obviously.

As for the whole point of the post, its to voice MY OPINION and a few other i know , and to let them know few of their customers, have an issue with the game design, i'm not a developer, not yet atleast. I suggested a path for development, IF it can be taken, i'm not demanding, I'm requesting. I hope you understand. No other MMO, as far as my knowledge is, did the region based balancing by having a level limit like in GW2. And that was brilliant! If they could have come up with that, I'm sure if they are committed towards a change in balancing of HoT, The game Devs, not me, but the game Devs who developed everything else, can come up with something.

I'm nothing less than love towards the Devs of this game and the community. And i Have been playing this game for a while for me to be voicing any of my opinions, and i don't see why another player has to have a problem with the experience of a player to voice their opinion. I have paid for the game and so have you.

I didn't see where you suggested a path for development. It just seems to me that you are complaining about the difficulty level of HoT and that's about it. Regardless, sure you can voice your opinion but to me it doesn't appear any different than the other threads of complaints of HoT. If you have some solution, and I'm not asking for developer-level knowledge here, then propose it. Otherwise, your post comes off as nothing more than just another HoT complaint.

Sorry if this offends; that is not my intention.

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Personally as a low-average skilled player, I find HoT just right. I prob die more in PoF to be honest with some of the higher hp mobs and long aggro ranges. It is certainly not even remotely close to being compared to Dark Souls

HoT was nerfed once to counter some of the difficulty, but I don't think it warrants further changes and there has been considerably less feedback about the difficulty since. There needs to be an acceptance that an MMO has to balance around an enormous gulf in player skills and whilst I can understand the argument that story should cater for the lower end of the skill spectrum, open world should not.

Mordrem made me up my game from where I was - trying out new skills and approaches to problems. Where a game is doing that I believe the game is doing its job correctly.

I'm not in favour of further nerfing across the board because I don't think it needs it and the wider playerbase seems quite happy with the status quo on this one, however I don't think it is unreasonable that things like hero points, some non-meta group content (across all areas of the game) could be scaled better to a lowered population.

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@kharmin.7683 said:

I'm nothing less than love towards the Devs of this game and the community. And i Have been playing this game for a while for me to be voicing any of my opinions, and i don't see why another player has to have a problem with the experience of a player to voice their opinion. I have paid for the game and so have you.

I didn't see where you suggested a path for development. It just seems to me that you are complaining about the difficulty level of HoT and that's about it. Regardless, sure you can voice your opinion but to me it doesn't appear any different than the other threads of complaints of HoT. If you have some solution, and I'm not asking for developer-level knowledge here, then propose it. Otherwise, your post comes off as nothing more than just another HoT complaint.

Sorry if this offends; that is not my intention.

Dont worry, I am just having a friendly discussion, no offense taken. But you just contradicted yourself. I thought u said, i was the only one with the problem? If there are complaints about HoT everywhere, then maybe... just maybe there is a problem for a larger spectrum of people than you think?

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@Randulf.7614 said:Personally as a low-average skilled player, I find HoT just right. I prob die more in PoF to be honest with some of the higher hp mobs and long aggro ranges. It is certainly not even remotely close to being compared to Dark Souls

HoT was nerfed once to counter some of the difficulty, but I don't think it warrants further changes and there has been considerably less feedback about the difficulty since. There needs to be an acceptance that an MMO has to balance around an enormous gulf in player skills and whilst I can understand the argument that story should cater for the lower end of the skill spectrum, open world should not.

Mordrem made me up my game from where I was - trying out new skills and approaches to problems. Where a game is doing that I believe the game is doing its job correctly.

I'm not in favour of further nerfing across the board because I don't think it needs it and the wider playerbase seems quite happy with the status quo on this one, however I don't think it is unreasonable that things like hero points, some non-meta group content (across all areas of the game) could be scaled better to a lowered population.

I agree with what you are saying. Although i'm not just stating about just the mobs. Mobs are hard for me atleast, may it be i'm bad, i'm halfway across the globe, or whatever, but in the end, i get 2 shot by a roaming stegosaurus thing. PoF makes it fun for me atleast because its bright open and has a good application of map commodity placement, just my opinion. But yeah, what i can't especially get over is, its humanely impossible for me to do some hero points in HoT, they are sooo hard. It just becomes so much more frustrating when no player is available to help you at the time you are playing.

True an MMO must have a balance with satisfying as much as possible player base, but without voicing your concerns and opinions isn't wrong. Dark Souls obviously was a joke tho lol xD.

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@AdamWarlord.6782 said:

I'm nothing less than love towards the Devs of this game and the community. And i Have been playing this game for a while for me to be voicing any of my opinions, and i don't see why another player has to have a problem with the experience of a player to voice their opinion. I have paid for the game and so have you.

I didn't see where you suggested a path for development. It just seems to me that you are complaining about the difficulty level of HoT and that's about it. Regardless, sure you can voice your opinion but to me it doesn't appear any different than the other threads of complaints of HoT. If you have some solution, and I'm not asking for developer-level knowledge here, then propose it. Otherwise, your post comes off as nothing more than just another HoT complaint.

Sorry if this offends; that is not my intention.

Dont worry, I am just having a friendly discussion, no offense taken. But you just contradicted yourself. I thought u said, i was the only one with the problem? If there are complaints about HoT everywhere, then maybe... just maybe there is a problem for a larger spectrum of people than you think?

There aren't complaints about HoT everywhere. Most of the very few we still see on the forums come from people who skip all the content before and jump straight in (yours being the exception). GW2 is a learning curve that peaks somewhere around PoF/LS4 imo and HoT/LS3 is naturally very different from what comes before. If HoT was to be nerfed, everything after would have to be as well, because the entire game pretty much stays close to that level with some small jumps in difficulty later.

Basically where HoT is now is where the game is now outside of core

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@sitarskee.5738 said:Calling yourself a casual ain't no excuse. If you can't do it then it's not for you. You're not good enough to make that legendary.

I just hate people who see problems everywhere but not in them. You're bad, you have to change - not the environment for you so you can be less bad.

It isn't an excuse, its a fact. Not everyone can ignore tasks in real life and sit infront of a monitor and play games for hours. And as for i'm bad, not good enough to get legendary.... idk what to say, grow up mate?

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@Randulf.7614 said:

I'm nothing less than love towards the Devs of this game and the community. And i Have been playing this game for a while for me to be voicing any of my opinions, and i don't see why another player has to have a problem with the experience of a player to voice their opinion. I have paid for the game and so have you.

I didn't see where you suggested a path for development. It just seems to me that you are complaining about the difficulty level of HoT and that's about it. Regardless, sure you can voice your opinion but to me it doesn't appear any different than the other threads of complaints of HoT. If you have some solution, and I'm not asking for developer-level knowledge here, then propose it. Otherwise, your post comes off as nothing more than just another HoT complaint.

Sorry if this offends; that is not my intention.

Dont worry, I am just having a friendly discussion, no offense taken. But you just contradicted yourself. I thought u said, i was the only one with the problem? If there are complaints about HoT everywhere, then maybe... just maybe there is a problem for a larger spectrum of people than you think?

There aren't complaints about HoT everywhere. Most of the very few we still see on the forums come from people who skip all the content before and jump straight in. GW2 is a learning curve that peaks somewhere around PoF/LS4 imo and HoT/LS3 is naturally very different from what comes before. If HoT was to be nerfed, everything after would have to be as well, because the entire game pretty much stays close to that level with some small jumps in difficulty later.

Basically where HoT is now is where the game is now outside of core

Yeah i get what you are saying. Its true, there have to be a lot of changes made and it would be time consuming, and with Cantha coming, i just don't want them to do the same what they did with HoT. And, tbh its already pretty late to be asking for changes in HoT. The post might be considered just a rant or another complaint, but it gives me a bit of a relief that i atleast talked about it in the forums.

If its possible or not, can only be decided by the Devs in the end tho.

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@AdamWarlord.6782 said:

I'm nothing less than love towards the Devs of this game and the community. And i Have been playing this game for a while for me to be voicing any of my opinions, and i don't see why another player has to have a problem with the experience of a player to voice their opinion. I have paid for the game and so have you.

I didn't see where you suggested a path for development. It just seems to me that you are complaining about the difficulty level of HoT and that's about it. Regardless, sure you can voice your opinion but to me it doesn't appear any different than the other threads of complaints of HoT. If you have some solution, and I'm not asking for developer-level knowledge here, then propose it. Otherwise, your post comes off as nothing more than just another HoT complaint.

Sorry if this offends; that is not my intention.

Dont worry, I am just having a friendly discussion, no offense taken.Thanks. Sometimes written words on a forum don't come across as intended.But you just contradicted yourself. I thought u said, i was the only one with the problem? If there are complaints about HoT everywhere, then maybe... just maybe there is a problem for a larger spectrum of people than you think?The forums represent a very small sub-set of the entire player base. Also, these complaints to which I refer are from way back pre-nerf. Sure, there are some that crop up more recently but usually those are more due to what Randulf points out:@Randulf.7614 said:There aren't complaints about HoT everywhere. Most of the very few we still see on the forums come from people who skip all the content before and jump straight in (yours being the exception). GW2 is a learning curve that peaks somewhere around PoF/LS4 imo and HoT/LS3 is naturally very different from what comes before. If HoT was to be nerfed, everything after would have to be as well, because the entire game pretty much stays close to that level with some small jumps in difficulty later.
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  1. You don't need a mastery to get the toxic bacon. Take some very cheap food that gives you health every second like mango pie. Costs almost nothing.

HoT isn't as hard as you think it is, you just haven't learned the game. If you're interested in learning and you're on a US server, hit me up in game or here and I can show you how to get through HoT. It's not as bad as you believe it to be, and it's my favorite area of the game.

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@AdamWarlord.6782 said:Yeah i get what you are saying. Its true, there have to be a lot of changes made and it would be time consuming, and with Cantha coming, i just don't want them to do the same what they did with HoT. And, tbh its already pretty late to be asking for changes in HoT. The post might be considered just a rant or another complaint, but it gives me a bit of a relief that i atleast talked about it in the forums.

I highly doubt that the next expansion will feature HoT-like difficulty. PoF toned things down from HoT, which leads me to believe that Anet heard the uproar and designed accordingly.

At least, that's my hope -- one casual gamer to another. :)

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