Heibi.4251 Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 As of late there is at least one guild using this Rune in WvW as a primary means of gaming the system. The guild has at least 10-20 players running this rune. The golems are there to soak up damage(considering AOEs hit random players in the area) and they have CC. This rune is vastly overpowered for WvW. 60 second lifespan 50,000 health and a 600 damage per second with CC on a 60 second cooldown. You have a golem with CC that does more damage per second than any player CC out there. Imagine 20 players using constant CC that you don't have to worry about reviving because they'll just respawn automatically because you're in combat. These golems make that guild almost unstoppable. Whole map queues can't kill them. With their golems constantly respawning they have more "players" than a map queue in their zerg. Please take a serious look at either banning its use in WvW or changing it's stats massively. 3-4 minute cooldown, 30 second lifespan, 5000 to10,000 health, and no CC(in WvW). Thank you for your time. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veprovina.4876 Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 Just googled it.From the wiki:"This rune is not available in Structured PvP."I wonder why lol. But hey, you have to give props for mad strats haha. Cool idea.What server is this on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heibi.4251 Posted November 14, 2020 Author Share Posted November 14, 2020 Not turning this into a matchup thread. Support said to post it here so the Devs will see it. I removed the guild name who was using it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
primatos.5413 Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 They are too busy figuring out how to monetize alliances..sorry.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawdler.8521 Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 @Heibi.4251 said:Imagine 20 players using constant CCSo a third the CC of a normal zerg? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoftFootpaws.9134 Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 This is kind of like saying "I instantly die if a whole guild uses Battle Maul on me at once". In small group fights, the rune isn't a threat since the golem can't heal, unlike players and Ranger pets, and will be dead in a few seconds. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
God.2708 Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 @"Hannelore.8153" said:This is kind of like saying "I instantly die if a whole guild uses Battle Maul on me at once". In small group fights, the rune isn't a threat since the golem can't heal, unlike players and Ranger pets, and will be dead in a few seconds.?Imagine 20 players usingThis response feels so out of touch, did you actually read the complaint and understand what they were saying? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lare.5129 Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 very nice that some people use it. It make some uniq value for our wvw and fun for people. Should it op or no - no matter. Good, on wvw we not have fair fights anyway and we like it. It is wvw! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jul.7602 Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 The rune is fine, you're being outplayed. The golems have terrible AI, aggro forward and get quickly cleaved out by the enemy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallBarr.2184 Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 Do you have video of it, I would really like to see it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sleepwalker.1398 Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 We fought that group yesterday till they bugged our Bay walls and left and from what i can tell, the hp of golem needs to be shaved off and cooldown increase.Some people in this thread just make assumptions based on their knowledge of rune when haven't fought guilds using this. Few other guilds will catch up onto this and then we'll see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallBarr.2184 Posted November 14, 2020 Share Posted November 14, 2020 Can you heal the golems Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyninja.2954 Posted November 15, 2020 Share Posted November 15, 2020 @"Hannelore.8153" said:This is kind of like saying "I instantly die if a whole guild uses Battle Maul on me at once". In small group fights, the rune isn't a threat since the golem can't heal, unlike players and Ranger pets, and will be dead in a few seconds.Skills have target caps. Large groups rely on distributing damage across multiple targets, thus reducing individual damage and allowing for both more offensive movement as well as support to members.Having golems, or any type of "pet" run alongside you is like buffering the entire group by this golems life. As such a group of 20 players all running this rune are buffering their effective hit points by 20 x 50,000 = 1,000,000 life. Or expressed in a different way, if we assume a players average hit point pool in WvW is around 25k, having these golems tripples the initial EHP of the squad. That's pretty strong for a rune set. The fact the golems can't be healed is trivial, given their internal cooldown of 1 minute. Damage soaked by a golem is not damage taken by a player which is almost equivalent to damage healed (or rather similar to barrier). Or again simply put: the rune provides a 50,000 value barrier every 1 minute, per player, on a persisting moving entity which also attacks. Even worse, the target cap on control conditions and hard crowd control, and the priority of cleanses to players, means these golems will soak up a ton of enemy cc while not being initial targets for cleanses, which all go to players.Not sure how your comment addresses any of these issues. This rune becomes an issue because it scales with number of players and messes with the target cap. In small scale all of these things are non issues because you likely are not hitting the target cap to begin with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lare.5129 Posted November 15, 2020 Share Posted November 15, 2020 @Cyninja.2954 said:That's pretty strong for a rune set.and this is great! why we reason use bad rune? I don't see main line how it can make better or opposite. This is good that people know about runes, wear, and use.I am first 3 years not use any set runes at all, some random runes without any vision.Hope EoD bring from new dungeons same type runes, whit dragon minions, whit birds minions, whit elephant minions, whit panda minions!And dragon > bird, bird > elephant, elephant > panda, and panda > dragon .. oh, it so perfect that we have rune with golem mechanic!Lets be happy that we have this fun on wvw! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lare.5129 Posted November 15, 2020 Share Posted November 15, 2020 can be it dominate rune? I don't think so. But if yes - should I worry ? no. We don't cry that pdps for meta have only scholar rune, and other rune is out of meta, ..so IF we will get one meta rune on wvw - this is also OK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hunkamania.7561 Posted November 15, 2020 Share Posted November 15, 2020 Maybe the guild likes CoE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kovu.7560 Posted November 15, 2020 Share Posted November 15, 2020 Who wants a golem massage?I know I do.Anywho, if folks were concerned about pets soaking up damage, clone spamming mesmers, necro petting zoos and rangers would be the meta. I'm fairly convinced they're not. While I haven't tested it in a while, I'm fairly certain AoE damage prioritizes players over their pets?~ Kovu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Some Call Me Tim.2319 Posted November 15, 2020 Share Posted November 15, 2020 Didn’t know about this rune. Gonna have to give it a try and see how much fun it is. Thanks op. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itsbadcompany.7893 Posted November 15, 2020 Share Posted November 15, 2020 that guild that was in bay last night had at least 5 summoned golems running with them despite they have around 20 people, the overall time that the fight took is roughly around 15mins.So that means it was summoned roughly about 15 times and imagine 5 of those golems are hitting lord while having roughly 50k HP each. And with the currently murderball meta ,the golems just there to soak damage and CC while the group just sitting back and keep on damaging the lord with not much damage done to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jobber.6348 Posted November 15, 2020 Share Posted November 15, 2020 This thread reeks of someone who theorycrafted an idea, thought it was op, and never actually saw it in action before posting such an idea on forums.If this was so Op, 50 man organized zergs would already be using it, but they aren't.It won't work and here's why : they are extremely unreliable, unresponsive, and randomly popped. Its summoning condition is too easily fulfilled, and it is burstable with a force of equal size before it can do any real damage.The sudden presence of 20 of these golems is impossible to be coordinated in a proper zerg v zerg and successfully deployed en masse without some being accidentally summoned early and ruining a potential mass summoning.Besides yu are pulling numbers off wiki page, and if yu actually fought any of these guys, yu will know that their threat range is pathetically small and an enemy force can easily manauver themselves around it with little effort.Also a force all utilizing golem rune will result in alot of them having stat deficiencies which could lead in things like boon duration loss, survivability loss, healing power loss, which might seen negligible in a group v group setting, but if yu actually know how group v group works, people can be picked off one by one and killed VERY FAST.But say, this is actually true and an op strategy : Get us a video of this happening and it beating a force of the same size. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evaknale.4510 Posted November 15, 2020 Share Posted November 15, 2020 You can see it herehttps://www.bilibili.com/video/BV15K411P7Hw?from=search&seid=635796162028958054https://space.bilibili.com/75649367?from=search&seid=17553345973644591226 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlitheSlivier.1908 Posted November 15, 2020 Share Posted November 15, 2020 I believe the correct solution isn't to nerf golem or pets... thats more of a quick bandaid.Instead make AoEs prioritize players first, then pets/npcs. Or even better, make that a toggle option in the Options Menu. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evaknale.4510 Posted November 15, 2020 Share Posted November 15, 2020 If you're leading a team of 50 or more, you can try it. You need to stand at a point and move, and it works when you're entangled with each otherYou need necromancer with as many minions as you canYou need to use the revenant of maklain's minstrel's to remove enemy gains with demonsThen dragonhunter, firebrand, necromancer use superior run of the golemancer; scraper uses superior run of the monk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heibi.4251 Posted November 15, 2020 Author Share Posted November 15, 2020 @Yasai.3549 said:This thread reeks of someone who theorycrafted an idea, thought it was op, and never actually saw it in action before posting such an idea on forums.If this was so Op, 50 man organized zergs would already be using it, but they aren't.It won't work and here's why : they are extremely unreliable, unresponsive, and randomly popped. Its summoning condition is too easily fulfilled, and it is burstable with a force of equal size before it can do any real damage.The sudden presence of 20 of these golems is impossible to be coordinated in a proper zerg v zerg and successfully deployed en masse without some being accidentally summoned early and ruining a potential mass summoning.Besides yu are pulling numbers off wiki page, and if yu actually fought any of these guys, yu will know that their threat range is pathetically small and an enemy force can easily manauver themselves around it with little effort.Also a force all utilizing golem rune will result in alot of them having stat deficiencies which could lead in things like boon duration loss, survivability loss, healing power loss, which might seen negligible in a group v group setting, but if yu actually know how group v group works, people can be picked off one by one and killed VERY FAST.But say, this is actually true and an op strategy : Get us a video of this happening and it beating a force of the same size.No theory involved here. This is based on experience.Sorry, we faced this rune exploit on reset. You have no experience with this build layout. The rune does not take away too much from the zerg. It makes it so they don't need to be concerned about AOE or any direct damage since the golems absorb most of the damage. Not all of the zerg used this rune - but a substantial number does - and tis makes it nigh impossible to defeat them. Unfortunately for you the guild group we faced was HIGHLY coordinated knowing exactly what the rune does. so please stop making asumptions. We fought them last night during reset - I'm fully aware of what the rune exploit can do. Sorry to burst your bubble. We didn't just pull the numbers off the wiki. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shroud.2307 Posted November 15, 2020 Share Posted November 15, 2020 I don't know why people are disagreeing with this. Does no one remember the Fleshreaver meta? That got nerfed for a reason. This is the same thing, lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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