M1 Apple Silicon Client ? Where is it ?

[hobotnicax.7918]

@Ashantara.8731 said:

@hobotnicax.7918 said:Times are changing, ARM is pushing hard into the desktop and laptop market, and

Apple will lead the way. And we all know what happens when Apple does something new... others initially laugh, but then quickly follow.

:sweat_smile: Ridiculous claim.

OK... remember this when ARM chips have 25-30% of the desktop market in a few years.

[Sobx.1758]

@hobotnicax.7918 said:

@Linken.6345 said:Apple and big player in gaming dont go together

Prepare to be proven wrong in the following year or two ;)

Isn't it great when people try to use their hypothetical hopes for the future as an argument? :)

[Supercluster.7159]

I also believe that RISC processors will be the norm for desktop computers in the future. It may take years but I believe it will come.

[hobotnicax.7918]

@Sobx.1758 said:

@hobotnicax.7918 said:

@Linken.6345 said:Apple and big player in gaming dont go together

Prepare to be proven wrong in the following year or two ;)

Isn't it great when people try to use their hypothetical hopes for the future as an argument? :)

I mean... Nvidia must be dumb af to had bought ARM for 40b dollars then, hypothetical hopes and all.And Microsoft giving haste to Windows 10 ARM development is probably pointless as well.Apple going all out on ARM CPUs to replace almost their whole PROFESSIONAL line of computers along with consumer line.

But they must have hypothetical hopes for the future. These are irrelevant companies, right? - not like that they more or less shaped the modern computing era or anything like that.

[Sobx.1758]

@hobotnicax.7918 said:

@Sobx.1758 said:

@hobotnicax.7918 said:

@Linken.6345 said:Apple and big player in gaming dont go together

Prepare to be proven wrong in the following year or two ;)

Isn't it great when people try to use their hypothetical hopes for the future as an argument? :)

I mean... Nvidia must be dumb af to had bought ARM for 40b dollars then, hypothetical hopes and all.And Microsoft giving haste to Windows 10 ARM development is probably pointless as well.Apple going all out on ARM CPUs to replace almost their whole PROFESSIONAL line of computers along with consumer line.

But they must have hypothetical hopes for the future. These are irrelevant companies, right? - not like that they more or less shaped the modern computing era or anything like that.

Too bad that has nothing to do with your previous posts :(And I'm sure you weren't just apple fanboing for the past x years either just like you do now, right? :D

[Sobx.1758]

@hobotnicax.7918 said:

@Sobx.1758 said:

@hobotnicax.7918 said:

@Sobx.1758 said:

@hobotnicax.7918 said:

@Linken.6345 said:Apple and big player in gaming dont go together

Prepare to be proven wrong in the following year or two ;)

Isn't it great when people try to use their hypothetical hopes for the future as an argument? :)

I mean... Nvidia must be dumb af to had bought ARM for 40b dollars then, hypothetical hopes and all.And Microsoft giving haste to Windows 10 ARM development is probably pointless as well.Apple going all out on ARM CPUs to replace almost their whole PROFESSIONAL line of computers along with consumer line.

But they must have hypothetical hopes for the future. These are irrelevant companies, right? - not like that they more or less shaped the modern computing era or anything like that.

Too bad that has nothing to do with your previous posts :(And I'm sure you weren't just apple fanboing for the past x years either just like you do now, right? :D

What in my previous posts doesn't say the same thing as I'm saying now? Please, enlighten me.

Maybe read what you were answering to and what I've quoted. ARM cpus aren't equivalent to apple computers and you're randomly jumping between the two. :(

[voltaicbore.8012]

@"Sobx.1758" said:

Maybe read what you were answering to and what I've quoted. ARM cpus aren't equivalent to apple computers and you're randomly jumping between the two. :(

Maybe that's true, but in the context of this discussion I think it's forgivable. After all, the reason Mac client is being dropped like a poop-stained rock is because of ARM incompatibility, so for the purposes of discussing GW2 and ARM, we might as well be discussing GW2 and Mac.

As for the x86 vs ARM situation, I think x86 has been very, very slowly and incrementally losing out to ARM over the past decade or so. That slow defeat is probably why a lot of us currently think it's ridiculous to think of a major shift towards ARM in desktop-grade devices, but I can see it happening. There are a lot of reasons (both technological and corporate) as to why that slow defeat is happening, but arguably that's true for almost any technology shift. I think the battle will ultimately be determined by how many developers are willing to quickly retool (or write entirely new) applications to work natively on ARM, and if enough of the big players make the move to ARM I'm certain the software will simply follow.

Again, I'm not claiming that ARM is actually "better" in all the ways that matter, or that hitching our wagon to RISC is a wiser long-term decision than figuring out how to better manage CISC development. All I'm saying is that the constellation of factors like licensing-but-not-fabrication model, price, power consumption, a general consumer shift to crappier yet somehow more expensive devices (thanks, Steve Jobs), and Qualcomm's successful lockout of Intel from the mobile market essentially put ARM in a place where it can (and IMO likely will) win a significant market share.

Thankfully, I don't think GW2 will live long enough to regret not jumping on board ARM. That also means I think ANet 100% made the right call to keep GW2 out of ARM without hemming and hawing about it. I think by the time most GW2-capable devices are ARM instead of x86, the game might well be in maintenance mode and x86 emulation on ARM will hopefully be advanced enough to keep the game playable at a high level.

[Sobx.1758]

@voltaicbore.8012 said:

@"Sobx.1758" said:

Maybe read what you were answering to and what I've quoted. ARM cpus aren't equivalent to apple computers and you're randomly jumping between the two. :(

Maybe that's true, but in the context of this discussion I think it's forgivable. After all, the reason Mac client is being dropped like a poop-stained rock is because of ARM incompatibility, so for the purposes of discussing GW2 and ARM, we might as well be discussing GW2 and Mac.

No, it's not, because it's not apple exclusive and if/when it becomes the norm, it won't be equivalent to "apple owning x% of the market", suddenly being "gaming friendly" or whatever you've tried to claim there. You're talking about two different things and claim one proves the other, but it doesn't, all while disregarding apple practices from the past and present. And yes, that is exactly what currently makes it "hypothetical hopes for the future".

Maybe you're not an apple fanboy, sure, I don't know you so I shouldn't make this assumption. But that's pretty much how you behave in this thread imo, so I might have easly misjudged. :D

[TheQuickFox.3826]

Please consider installing Windows. Mac has never been the best choice for gaming. Yes, mac has many aspects in which it is far better than MS Windows, but being a great gaming platform is not one of them. And never was.

[voltaicbore.8012]

@Sobx.1758 said:

@voltaicbore.8012 said:

@Sobx.1758 said:

Maybe read what you were answering to and what I've quoted. ARM cpus aren't equivalent to apple computers and you're randomly jumping between the two. :(

Maybe that's true, but in the context of this discussion I think it's forgivable. After all, the reason Mac client is being dropped like a poop-stained rock is because of ARM incompatibility, so for the purposes of discussing GW2 and ARM, we might as well be discussing GW2 and Mac.

No, it's not, because it's not apple exclusive and if/when it becomes the norm, it won't be equivalent to "apple owning x% of the market", suddenly being "gaming friendly" or whatever you've tried to claim there. You're talking about two different things and claim one proves the other, but it doesn't, all while disregarding apple practices from the past and present. And yes, that is exactly what

currently

makes it "hypothetical hopes for the future".

Maybe you're not an

apple fanboy

, sure, I don't know you so I shouldn't make this assumption. But that's pretty much how you behave in this thread imo, so I might have easly misjudged. :D

That was the first time I've posted in this thread, I think you're confusing me with @"hobotnicax.7918". We do have the same avatar, I guess lol. Not sure you read the rest of my post, either.

I personally have never, and will never, purchase a Mac. Ever. I can't stand the idea of paying that much for inferior hardware, and joining that group of users. I mean, just look at most of the threads. Mac users seem so conditioned into thinking that compatibility problems = "whaaaaaa I need to buy a new machine?!?!?!" Yeah, not me.

I don't even particularly like ARM/RISC, and think we'd be looking at a much different situation if Intel actually iterated properly on Atom and found a market for it. I see the ARM/x86 battle as somewhat parallel to the old VHS/Betamax format war back in the day. The technically inferior - but non-exclusive, licensable, and cheaper - option eventually caught up to the technically superior rival.

@TheQuickFox.3826 said:Please consider installing Windows. Mac has never been the best choice for gaming. Yes, mac has many aspects in which it is far better than MS Windows, but being a great gaming platform is not one of them. And never was.

I sincerely agree. This is likely the best long-term solution for most current Mac users. Apple is not shy about straight bricking the several-thousand-dollar machines its users buy. In contrast, there are still people who can run Windows XP to this day and function.

[Sobx.1758]

@voltaicbore.8012 said:

@Sobx.1758 said:

@voltaicbore.8012 said:

@Sobx.1758 said:

Maybe read what you were answering to and what I've quoted. ARM cpus aren't equivalent to apple computers and you're randomly jumping between the two. :(

Maybe that's true, but in the context of this discussion I think it's forgivable. After all, the reason Mac client is being dropped like a poop-stained rock is because of ARM incompatibility, so for the purposes of discussing GW2 and ARM, we might as well be discussing GW2 and Mac.

No, it's not, because it's not apple exclusive and if/when it becomes the norm, it won't be equivalent to "apple owning x% of the market", suddenly being "gaming friendly" or whatever you've tried to claim there. You're talking about two different things and claim one proves the other, but it doesn't, all while disregarding apple practices from the past and present. And yes, that is exactly what

currently

makes it "hypothetical hopes for the future".

Maybe you're not an

apple fanboy

, sure, I don't know you so I shouldn't make this assumption. But that's pretty much how you behave in this thread imo, so I might have easly misjudged. :D

That was the first time I've posted in this thread, I think you're confusing me with @"hobotnicax.7918". We

do

have the same avatar, I guess lol. Not sure you read the rest of my post, either.

lmao, yup -I've noticed the same avatar, didn't pay attention to the nickname and assumed it's the same person continuing. :no_mouth:

But still what I wrote there stays all the same for me. I don't think it's exactly "forgivable", because these are two separate claims and what he answered there isn't really directly supporting his previous claims. Simply being based on arm probably isn't enough to make apple gaming friendly all of the sudden, not to mention about being leading power in that direction.Yes, I've read the rest of that post as well and it just made me confused why he would suddenly go from claiming he's certain it'll happen to changing his opinion to "maybe it will maybe it won't", but decided it's not even worth digging deeper into. Now it makes a bit more sense to me :D

[commops.7164]

My my, colorful conversation. I come back 3 months later and remain hopeful. Thank you all for chiming in, very good points from all sides, perspectives here. I remain hopeful, would love to get off that nVidia 2080 / i9 desktop I am on ... we'll see what happens as we move further into 2021.

[commops.7164]

@Linken.6345 said:Apple and big player in gaming dont go together

True, but times are changing. People want to spend less, do more ... Intel and nVidia domination won't last forever either. That said, look at AMD in recent days ... they have a fair chance, let us see what happens. I am giving them (Apple) the full 2 years for the transition.

[commops.7164]

@anduriell.6280 said:Doesn't work in Roseta?

~25 to 30 fps, on a good day. That being an M1 8GB mini. My MBP 13 M1 w/16G may do slightly better, we'll see.

[commops.7164]

@voltaicbore.8012 said:

@Sobx.1758 said:

@voltaicbore.8012 said:

@Sobx.1758 said:

Maybe read what you were answering to and what I've quoted. ARM cpus aren't equivalent to apple computers and you're randomly jumping between the two. :(

Maybe that's true, but in the context of this discussion I think it's forgivable. After all, the reason Mac client is being dropped like a poop-stained rock is because of ARM incompatibility, so for the purposes of discussing GW2 and ARM, we might as well be discussing GW2 and Mac.

No, it's not, because it's not apple exclusive and if/when it becomes the norm, it won't be equivalent to "apple owning x% of the market", suddenly being "gaming friendly" or whatever you've tried to claim there. You're talking about two different things and claim one proves the other, but it doesn't, all while disregarding apple practices from the past and present. And yes, that is exactly what

currently

makes it "hypothetical hopes for the future".

Maybe you're not an

apple fanboy

, sure, I don't know you so I shouldn't make this assumption. But that's pretty much how you behave in this thread imo, so I might have easly misjudged. :D

That was the first time I've posted in this thread, I think you're confusing me with @"hobotnicax.7918". We

do

have the same avatar, I guess lol. Not sure you read the rest of my post, either.

I personally have never, and will never, purchase a Mac. Ever. I can't stand the idea of paying that much for inferior hardware, and joining that group of users. I mean, just look at most of the threads. Mac users seem

so

conditioned into thinking that compatibility problems = "whaaaaaa I need to buy a new machine?!?!?!" Yeah, not me.

I don't even particularly like ARM/RISC, and think we'd be looking at a much different situation if Intel actually iterated properly on Atom and found a market for it. I see the ARM/x86 battle as somewhat parallel to the old VHS/Betamax format war back in the day. The technically inferior - but non-exclusive, licensable, and cheaper - option eventually caught up to the technically superior rival.

@TheQuickFox.3826 said:Please consider installing Windows. Mac has never been the best choice for gaming. Yes, mac has many aspects in which it is far better than MS Windows, but being a great gaming platform is not one of them. And never was.

I sincerely agree. This is likely the best long-term solution for most current Mac users. Apple is not shy about straight bricking the several-thousand-dollar machines its users buy. In contrast, there are still people who can run Windows XP to this day and function.

Indeed, they're doing just that to their own line up of $30-55K Mac Pro video editing machines made in Austin, TX :'( :o

[Linken.6345]

@commops.7164 said:

@Linken.6345 said:Apple and big player in gaming dont go together

True, but times are changing. People want to spend less, do more ... Intel and nVidia domination won't last forever either. That said, look at AMD in recent days ... they have a fair chance, let us see what happens. I am giving them (Apple) the full 2 years for the transition.

How do spend less and mac go together?

[snh.7091]

I feel I have to express my discontent with their decision, as someone who’s moving to the Mac from Windows - I think this is a bad move, but an expected one.

One of the reasons they are not porting is this game is old. Guess what, WoW was made ready for Mac the moment the M1 was released, and WoW is much older than GW2 or ESO or other titles in this category with such a lifespan, so ANet using the “our game is old” argument is just not a good enough reason.

Another reason is money. Well, if they took better turns and devised better monetary strategies this wouldn’t be a problem.

There are many great titles running on the Mac and if anything, I see the M1 as an innovation, a step into the right direction, and I think developers should consider the possibilities this brings to the table, not shun it.

I, for one, don’t see myself buying another windows computer over GW2. It simply isn’t the title that would be worth it, not with the direction it’s taking—and that it hasn’t seen quality improvements, particularly in the WvW department for years now.

[Qida.5648]

@Inoki.6048 said:I feel I have to express my discontent with their decision, as someone who’s moving to the Mac from Windows - I think this is a bad move, but an expected one.

One of the reasons they are not porting is this game is old. Guess what, WoW was made ready for Mac the moment the M1 was released, and WoW is much older than GW2 or ESO or other titles in this category with such a lifespan, so ANet using the “our game is old” argument is just not a good enough reason.

Another reason is money. Well, if they took better turns and devised better monetary strategies this wouldn’t be a problem.

There are many great titles running on the Mac and if anything, I see the M1 as an innovation, a step into the right direction, and I think developers should consider the possibilities this brings to the table, not shun it.

I, for one, don’t see myself buying another windows computer over GW2. It simply isn’t the title that would be worth it, not with the direction it’s taking—and that it hasn’t seen quality improvements, particularly in the WvW department for years now.

Well.. whatever the reason, they knew they can get away with it.

Because they know for Old Intel Macs, people can still bootcamp or virtualize. On M1 Macs and any future Macs, it's powerful enough to emulate and virtualize. So basically Mac users can still play the game.. if they have the will to load up Windows 10 in parallels / crossover / etc etc.

Anyway, that's how I deal with old games.. lock them up in Windows XP / 7 / 10 virtual machines, like Diablo 2, navyfield..

[hobotnicax.7918]

Oh look, Path of exile will provide native M1 support in the near future... a game from 2013.

[Linken.6345]

@hobotnicax.7918 said:Oh look, Path of exile will provide native M1 support in the near future... a game from 2013.

Great for that arpg that dont give anet the founds to do it for their mmo tho.

[hobotnicax.7918]

@Linken.6345 said:

@hobotnicax.7918 said:Oh look, Path of exile will provide native M1 support in the near future... a game from 2013.

Great for that arpg that dont give anet the founds to do it for their mmo tho.

Apparently they don't have funds for anything really. Rehashed content and utter neglect of pvp modes.

[hobotnicax.7918]

On 2/9/2021 at 5:12 PM, Ashantara.8731 said:

😅 Ridiculous claim.

 

https://www.reuters.com/technology/intel-debates-buyout-sifive-bolster-chip-technology-against-arm-source-2021-06-10/

 

Oh look... 😂

 

Apple about to release a 10 core CPU + 16 or 32 core GPU in a few days... Intel and co are sweating.

 

[anduriell.6280]

On 3/31/2021 at 4:50 PM, hobotnicax.7918 said:

Oh look, Path of exile will provide native M1 support in the near future... a game from 2013.

Any old RPGs have reworked their engines at some point, it is required at this point if they want to provide logetivity to their game. 

 

Not updating their engine can only mean only one thing: Anet is not thinking into continue actively developing the game. 

 

Maybe EoD is the last bang before dissapear into the oblivion. Who knows. 

[Kanok.3027]

4 hours ago, anduriell.6280 said:

Any old RPGs have reworked their engines at some point, it is required at this point if they want to provide logetivity to their game. 

 

Not updating their engine can only mean only one thing: Anet is not thinking into continue actively developing the game. 

 

Maybe EoD is the last bang before dissapear into the oblivion. Who knows. 

Very misleading. From what I understand, a couple of them have converted, because they are extremely popular even to this day, but it's barely a handful of them. As for others, players are telling other players to use other software to get their games to work on the new silicone. This is just spreading misinformation and doom saying.

[Janann of Avalon.1850]

Any ideas then when I will be able to play GW2 on my new 24 iMac with M1 chip, apple lists it as being playable game on their site