Almost giving up this game Mode

[Salt Mode.3780]

What are you even talking about????? Condi mesmer aka mirage lost ALOT of pressure when losing that one dodge, condi necros, thieves, condi rangers can dish out more sustained condis then mirage can after nerfs. The fact that you say higher then ranger on weapon skill with same stat is COMPLETELY FALSE, do you know how much a ranger can do with GS and Longbow? What is that comparison....

[Tseison.4659]

And I’m just sitting with my popcorn laughing at the basic knowledge people have with Mesmers in WvW lol.... can people just wait until we “hopefully” get something better and buffs come EoD? Thanks...

[Veprovina.4876]

@"Salt Mode.3780" said:What are you even talking about????? Condi mesmer aka mirage lost ALOT of pressure when losing that one dodge, condi necros, thieves, condi rangers can dish out more sustained condis then mirage can after nerfs. The fact that you say higher then ranger on weapon skill with same stat is COMPLETELY FALSE, do you know how much a ranger can do with GS and Longbow? What is that comparison....

Some people just hate mesmers and are digging really deep to prove that Mesmers are OP so that Anet nerfs us some more so that they don't have to deal with fighting a Mesmer. But the harsh truth is that, yes, mesmer can be bursty, but only top players with a lot of luck can pull that off, that's not the true state of the profession. The average players can't even make a dent in even the glassiest of professions because of the nerfs. And in this game, the skilled players get punished for being good with the mesmer, which in turn extra screws the average players - ultimately making them unable to do anything. On the flip side - a really bad Firebrand player can just easily beat pretty much anyone without even trying that much.And even with the burst, everyone else can just outheal it on full zerk with no healing power, and spam 2-3 weapon skills to get the mesmer when they deplete all their cooldowns for that one burst.

It's never about facts. It's always about "mesmers are bullkitten, nerfnerfnernfernfenenfenrenfenfenfr" so i don't have to fight one.

[ArchonWing.9480]

Maybe don't look to daily camp flippers for your fights?

[Yasai.3549]

@Veprovina.4876 said:Newsflash - Mesmers have nothing left to give.

They can be reworked into another Profession.

[Veprovina.4876]

@Yasai.3549 said:

@Veprovina.4876 said:Newsflash - Mesmers have nothing left to give.

They can be reworked into another Profession.

Yeah, i'm sure that would be super popular with the Mesmer community! :tongue:

[manu.7539]

Is it a discussion about mesmer? Bah nvm, just saying, I'm a main weaver and when I play mes (I rarely do), it feels just too easy. Just smashing the keyboard randomly and peoples die to clones while I watch them safely away! Honestly, clones+stealthing+ easy disengage... easy stuff :p

[Salt Mode.3780]

@manu.7539 said:Is it a discussion about mesmer? Bah nvm, just saying, I'm a main weaver and when I play mes (I rarely do), it feels just too easy. Just smashing the keyboard randomly and peoples die to clones while I watch them safely away! Honestly, clones+stealthing+ easy disengage... easy stuff :p

haha clearly you are explaining how a weaver is played not mesmer minus the stealth part cuz I also play weaver and mash buttons and kill stuff just too ez

[Baldrick.8967]

'almost giving up'....some people are really slow learners. Most people quit the game mode years ago when it became obvious it has been left to rot.

[bigo.9037]

LMAOO at ranger having less damage than Mesmer. core ranger can hit about 10k Rapidfire if traited properly, soulbeast can easily hit 20k. then add sicem for an extra 5k dmg on your rapidfire.

oh, and then there’s OWP, which easily multiplies your rapidfire dmg by about 1.75 if you don’t cast anything else.

multiple times a day my soulbeast takes someone from MOUNTED full hp, to down, to cleaved DEAD in about 3-5 seconds. and all i gotta do is press like 6 buttons. sicem, OWP, PBS, rapidfire, smoke assault, swap to GS and use Maul + worldly impact and they are cleaved. this is against anyone running marauder or similar, with no protection uptime.

the problem in this game is the bell curve. if you imagine the lower end of the bell curve being the smallest amount of damage dealt to players because they are tanky. it doesn’t make any sense that i can instagib marauder players in 1.5 seconds, but be literally unable to kill scrappers, tempests and firebrands on PURE dmg traits and gear. the tanks must go. i’d rather play in a fast paced meta where i have to be quick to avoid death. we already have mounts making it too ez to avoid fights against everything except ranger who can pew pew you off mount, so why do we allow players to be insanely tanky on top of that?

the only exception to high dmg i’ve had in this game is DE cus they have too much stealth. 1shot mesmer can also be problematic but not because of their dmg (cus it’s hard to pull off) but because they can stealth for a rather long time beforehand, making you unaware they even exist before you’re dead. but this goes for anything with too much stealth. ranger LB range could be capped at 1400 or 1300 to the even the playing field there too.

Buff mesmer.

[manu.7539]

@Salt Mode.3780 said:

@"manu.7539" said:Is it a discussion about mesmer? Bah nvm, just saying, I'm a main weaver and when I play mes (I rarely do), it feels just too easy. Just smashing the keyboard randomly and peoples die to clones while I watch them safely away! Honestly, clones+stealthing+ easy disengage... easy stuff :p

haha clearly you are explaining how a weaver is played not mesmer minus the stealth part cuz I also play weaver and mash buttons and kill stuff just too ez

yeah sure... clearly "stuff "= ambiant creature in ur scenario haha

[bigo.9037]

@manu.7539 said:

@Salt Mode.3780 said:

@manu.7539 said:Is it a discussion about mesmer? Bah nvm, just saying, I'm a main weaver and when I play mes (I rarely do), it feels just too easy. Just smashing the keyboard randomly and peoples die to clones while I watch them safely away! Honestly, clones+stealthing+ easy disengage... easy stuff :p

haha clearly you are explaining how a weaver is played not mesmer minus the stealth part cuz I also play weaver and mash buttons and kill stuff just too ez

yeah sure... clearly "stuff "= ambiant creature in ur scenario haha

yea when i go play new class for the first time and i kill an invader rank i don’t pretend the class is easy.

[Salt Mode.3780]

@manu.7539 said:

@Salt Mode.3780 said:

@manu.7539 said:Is it a discussion about mesmer? Bah nvm, just saying, I'm a main weaver and when I play mes (I rarely do), it feels just too easy. Just smashing the keyboard randomly and peoples die to clones while I watch them safely away! Honestly, clones+stealthing+ easy disengage... easy stuff :p

haha clearly you are explaining how a weaver is played not mesmer minus the stealth part cuz I also play weaver and mash buttons and kill stuff just too ez

yeah sure... clearly "stuff "= ambiant creature in ur scenario haha

Yea if you count yourself as one sure ambient creatures lets go with that.

[manu.7539]

@Salt Mode.3780 said:

@manu.7539 said:

@Salt Mode.3780 said:

@manu.7539 said:Is it a discussion about mesmer? Bah nvm, just saying, I'm a main weaver and when I play mes (I rarely do), it feels just too easy. Just smashing the keyboard randomly and peoples die to clones while I watch them safely away! Honestly, clones+stealthing+ easy disengage... easy stuff :p

haha clearly you are explaining how a weaver is played not mesmer minus the stealth part cuz I also play weaver and mash buttons and kill stuff just too ez

yeah sure... clearly "stuff "= ambiant creature in ur scenario haha

Yea if you count yourself as one sure ambient creatures lets go with that.

oh well, so many died to an ambient creature then.. guess u just discredit urself.. again :o

[Salt Mode.3780]

I dont understand how that would discredit myself but alright sure whatever helps you stay alive I guess.

[Gotejjeken.1267]

@bigo.9037 said:LMAOO at ranger having less damage than Mesmer. core ranger can hit about 10k Rapidfire if traited properly, soulbeast can easily hit 20k. then add sicem for an extra 5k dmg on your rapidfire.

oh, and then there’s OWP, which easily multiplies your rapidfire dmg by about 1.75 if you don’t cast anything else.

multiple times a day my soulbeast takes someone from MOUNTED full hp, to down, to cleaved DEAD in about 3-5 seconds. and all i gotta do is press like 6 buttons. sicem, OWP, PBS, rapidfire, smoke assault, swap to GS and use Maul + worldly impact and they are cleaved. this is against anyone running marauder or similar, with no protection uptime.

the problem in this game is the bell curve. if you imagine the lower end of the bell curve being the smallest amount of damage dealt to players because they are tanky. it doesn’t make any sense that i can instagib marauder players in 1.5 seconds, but be literally unable to kill scrappers, tempests and firebrands on PURE dmg traits and gear. the tanks must go. i’d rather play in a fast paced meta where i have to be quick to avoid death. we already have mounts making it too ez to avoid fights against everything except ranger who can pew pew you off mount, so why do we allow players to be insanely tanky on top of that?

the only exception to high dmg i’ve had in this game is DE cus they have too much stealth. 1shot mesmer can also be problematic but not because of their dmg (cus it’s hard to pull off) but because they can stealth for a rather long time beforehand, making you unaware they even exist before you’re dead. but this goes for anything with too much stealth. ranger LB range could be capped at 1400 or 1300 to the even the playing field there too.

Buff mesmer.

Ah yes, Sic Em + OWP the glass meme build that only works against the unaware. I fought one of these recently, ran into a camp and let the guards do most of the work as the other ranger didn't have any self-protection. But you said it yourself, anything with protection uptime pretty much nullfies this build once you add toughness / vit stats into the mix as well. There's also reflects, barrier, etc. Once you miss that initial rapid fire, you're out. It's too one dimensional for my liking tbh.

Anyway, the problem with your 'live fast die fast' meta is thieves. One shot from stealth is a lot easier to do than meme SB builds are, and can escape a lot better. Actually you explain this in your last paragraph about DE's and that's AFTER the big damage nerf patches.

We've had buffed mesmer though and it was a lot, lot worse than you're currently 'OP' SB build. Stealth, clones, confusion / torment spam, teleports--they were practically unkillable and for all the wrong reasons. Condi mesmer is something I still find here and there, it just doesn't 1-shot shatter bomb me from stealth anymore.

The overall problem is anet seems unsure of what they want to do. Either everything is unified and all classes can do everything or every class has a specific role and has dedicated hard counters. The game is in the middle of this, where most classes have access to pretty much every mechanic there is and also have specific intended roles / tradeoffs and soft-counters. Any change from here is going to be fundamental 'big bang' approach and I'm guessing this is why it's taken so long to do, as those typically cause waves in the community.

[Salt Mode.3780]

@"Gotejjeken.1267" said:

Ah yes, Sic Em + OWP the glass meme build that only works against the unaware. I fought one of these recently, ran into a camp and let the guards do most of the work as the other ranger didn't have any self-protection. But you said it yourself, anything with protection uptime pretty much nullfies this build once you add toughness / vit stats into the mix as well. There's also reflects, barrier, etc. Once you miss that initial rapid fire, you're out. It's too one dimensional for my liking tbh.

Anyway, the problem with your 'live fast die fast' meta is thieves. One shot from stealth is a lot easier to do than meme SB builds are, and can escape a lot better. Actually you explain this in your last paragraph about DE's and that's AFTER the big damage nerf patches.

We've had buffed mesmer though and it was a lot, lot worse than you're currently 'OP' SB build. Stealth, clones, confusion / torment spam, teleports--they were practically unkillable and for all the wrong reasons. Condi mesmer is something I still find here and there, it just doesn't 1-shot shatter bomb me from stealth anymore.

The overall problem is anet seems unsure of what they want to do. Either everything is unified and all classes can do everything or every class has a specific role and has dedicated hard counters. The game is in the middle of this, where most classes have access to pretty much every mechanic there is and also have specific intended roles / tradeoffs and soft-counters. Any change from here is going to be fundamental 'big bang' approach and I'm guessing this is why it's taken so long to do, as those typically cause waves in the community.

First off you might be mistaken because mirage typically cannot "BURST" condi bomb you that is the job of Condi Chrono. Mirage is a ramp up style of condi build up which you will need 3 clone uptime. Yea 2 dodge condi mirage was oppressive if you decide to fight it same as Core Condi necro or Condi druid, basically any condi builds.After the one dodge mirage nerf condi mirage can hardly ramp up the dmg without it being cleansed off right away. Either dodge for dmg or dodge to avoid dmg.2nd of all Boonbeast poses a much bigger threat then the "sic em glass build" because they can do dmg not only with longbow but with greatsword as well. Cuz honestly its much easier to deal with sicem pew pew rangers then it is a boonbeast.

I dont know if you are speaking in sPvP platform or WvW platform.

[bigo.9037]

@Gotejjeken.1267 said:

@bigo.9037 said:LMAOO at ranger having less damage than Mesmer. core ranger can hit about 10k Rapidfire if traited properly, soulbeast can easily hit 20k. then add sicem for an extra 5k dmg on your rapidfire.

oh, and then there’s OWP, which easily multiplies your rapidfire dmg by about 1.75 if you don’t cast anything else.

multiple times a day my soulbeast takes someone from MOUNTED full hp, to down, to cleaved DEAD in about 3-5 seconds. and all i gotta do is press like 6 buttons. sicem, OWP, PBS, rapidfire, smoke assault, swap to GS and use Maul + worldly impact and they are cleaved. this is against anyone running marauder or similar, with no protection uptime.

the problem in this game is the bell curve. if you imagine the lower end of the bell curve being the smallest amount of damage dealt to players because they are tanky. it doesn’t make any sense that i can instagib marauder players in 1.5 seconds, but be literally unable to kill scrappers, tempests and firebrands on PURE dmg traits and gear. the tanks must go. i’d rather play in a fast paced meta where i have to be quick to avoid death. we already have mounts making it too ez to avoid fights against everything except ranger who can pew pew you off mount, so why do we allow players to be insanely tanky on top of that?

the only exception to high dmg i’ve had in this game is DE cus they have too much stealth. 1shot mesmer can also be problematic but not because of their dmg (cus it’s hard to pull off) but because they can stealth for a rather long time beforehand, making you unaware they even exist before you’re dead. but this goes for anything with too much stealth. ranger LB range could be capped at 1400 or 1300 to the even the playing field there too.

Buff mesmer.

Ah yes, Sic Em + OWP the glass meme build that only works against the unaware. I fought one of these recently, ran into a camp and let the guards do most of the work as the other ranger didn't have any self-protection. But you said it yourself, anything with protection uptime pretty much nullfies this build once you add toughness / vit stats into the mix as well. There's also reflects, barrier, etc. Once you miss that initial rapid fire, you're out. It's too one dimensional for my liking tbh.

Anyway, the problem with your 'live fast die fast' meta is thieves. One shot from stealth is a lot easier to do than meme SB builds are, and can escape a lot better. Actually you explain this in your last paragraph about DE's and that's AFTER the big damage nerf patches.

We've had buffed mesmer though and it was a lot, lot worse than you're currently 'OP' SB build. Stealth, clones, confusion / torment spam, teleports--they were practically unkillable and for all the wrong reasons. Condi mesmer is something I still find here and there, it just doesn't 1-shot shatter bomb me from stealth anymore.

The overall problem is anet seems unsure of what they want to do. Either everything is unified and all classes can do everything or every class has a specific role and has dedicated hard counters. The game is in the middle of this, where most classes have access to pretty much every mechanic there is and also have specific intended roles / tradeoffs and soft-counters. Any change from here is going to be fundamental 'big bang' approach and I'm guessing this is why it's taken so long to do, as those typically cause waves in the community.

@Gotejjeken.1267 said:

@bigo.9037 said:LMAOO at ranger having less damage than Mesmer. core ranger can hit about 10k Rapidfire if traited properly, soulbeast can easily hit 20k. then add sicem for an extra 5k dmg on your rapidfire.

oh, and then there’s OWP, which easily multiplies your rapidfire dmg by about 1.75 if you don’t cast anything else.

multiple times a day my soulbeast takes someone from MOUNTED full hp, to down, to cleaved DEAD in about 3-5 seconds. and all i gotta do is press like 6 buttons. sicem, OWP, PBS, rapidfire, smoke assault, swap to GS and use Maul + worldly impact and they are cleaved. this is against anyone running marauder or similar, with no protection uptime.

the problem in this game is the bell curve. if you imagine the lower end of the bell curve being the smallest amount of damage dealt to players because they are tanky. it doesn’t make any sense that i can instagib marauder players in 1.5 seconds, but be literally unable to kill scrappers, tempests and firebrands on PURE dmg traits and gear. the tanks must go. i’d rather play in a fast paced meta where i have to be quick to avoid death. we already have mounts making it too ez to avoid fights against everything except ranger who can pew pew you off mount, so why do we allow players to be insanely tanky on top of that?

the only exception to high dmg i’ve had in this game is DE cus they have too much stealth. 1shot mesmer can also be problematic but not because of their dmg (cus it’s hard to pull off) but because they can stealth for a rather long time beforehand, making you unaware they even exist before you’re dead. but this goes for anything with too much stealth. ranger LB range could be capped at 1400 or 1300 to the even the playing field there too.

Buff mesmer.

Ah yes, Sic Em + OWP the glass meme build that only works against the unaware. I fought one of these recently, ran into a camp and let the guards do most of the work as the other ranger didn't have any self-protection. But you said it yourself, anything with protection uptime pretty much nullfies this build once you add toughness / vit stats into the mix as well. There's also reflects, barrier, etc. Once you miss that initial rapid fire, you're out. It's too one dimensional for my liking tbh.

Anyway, the problem with your 'live fast die fast' meta is thieves. One shot from stealth is a lot easier to do than meme SB builds are, and can escape a lot better. Actually you explain this in your last paragraph about DE's and that's AFTER the big damage nerf patches.

We've had buffed mesmer though and it was a lot, lot worse than you're currently 'OP' SB build. Stealth, clones, confusion / torment spam, teleports--they were practically unkillable and for all the wrong reasons. Condi mesmer is something I still find here and there, it just doesn't 1-shot shatter bomb me from stealth anymore.

The overall problem is anet seems unsure of what they want to do. Either everything is unified and all classes can do everything or every class has a specific role and has dedicated hard counters. The game is in the middle of this, where most classes have access to pretty much every mechanic there is and also have specific intended roles / tradeoffs and soft-counters. Any change from here is going to be fundamental 'big bang' approach and I'm guessing this is why it's taken so long to do, as those typically cause waves in the community.

after RF they have nothing??? my mauls routinely hit in the quintuple digits (10k or more). i have hit over 14k mauls without needing an interrupt first. soulbeast also has the ability to get 66% damage reduction for 6 or 9 seconds depending on your traits.

just because you met a newbie ranger playing a build doesn’t mean the entire build is a meme. try fighting a good one.by this logic, do you think any class is OP when you meet player who’s significantly better than you??

yes ofc SA thief beats ranger, but SA thief currently beats everything, except maybe nades scrapper.

[jahaan.1405]

I have only recently begun to play WvW and am still trying to figure things out. For the first twenty or twenty five ranks I was dying ten to fifteen times an hour. Mostly because of my lack of understanding things, partly because of higher level players just wanting some points by jumping newbs. I've watched every video I can find to try to learn and they claim all sides are equal and any failures by your side are poor leadership. Really?! It seems to me that the other two servers have a strict rule of join the group, communicate and follow our rules or get the boot. (I have only come across two players that will do this on my server.) They somehow manage to get every player on the map to rally to defend a castle or tower while we struggle to take it. Can you teleport large numbers of players to your aid??? The few large scale fights that seem even and are fun are few and far between. Now, in the last week I have been seeing more Gold, Platinum and Diamond players roaming around just toying with beginning players. Isn't there a way to have levels of maps to avoid this? I go back and forth between roaming alone and playing with my guild, which has few members right now. I'm still trying to figure out which build works well for me. I've seen so many suggestions and I don't have the time nor the money to waste on just out and out buying better armor and weapons. Any constructive suggestions would be helpful. Thank you.

[bigo.9037]

@jahaan.1405 said:I have only recently begun to play WvW and am still trying to figure things out. For the first twenty or twenty five ranks I was dying ten to fifteen times an hour. Mostly because of my lack of understanding things, partly because of higher level players just wanting some points by jumping newbs. I've watched every video I can find to try to learn and they claim all sides are equal and any failures by your side are poor leadership. Really?! It seems to me that the other two servers have a strict rule of join the group, communicate and follow our rules or get the boot. (I have only come across two players that will do this on my server.) They somehow manage to get every player on the map to rally to defend a castle or tower while we struggle to take it. Can you teleport large numbers of players to your aid??? The few large scale fights that seem even and are fun are few and far between. Now, in the last week I have been seeing more Gold, Platinum and Diamond players roaming around just toying with beginning players. Isn't there a way to have levels of maps to avoid this? I go back and forth between roaming alone and playing with my guild, which has few members right now. I'm still trying to figure out which build works well for me. I've seen so many suggestions and I don't have the time nor the money to waste on just out and out buying better armor and weapons. Any constructive suggestions would be helpful. Thank you.

lol you don’t need money$ to get armor.anyways, what people mean when they say maps are balanced is that the maps themselves don’t provide any significant benefit to either side. what matters is how many players and guilds each server has on it and how often they play.

you might be playing at a time when the guilds on your server are not online, maybe they play at a different time of the day, and thus you will feel like enemy blob is bigger.

but keep an eye out in teamchat, maybe your team is just on a different map.

[Gotejjeken.1267]

@Gotejjeken.1267 said:

@bigo.9037 said:LMAOO at ranger having less damage than Mesmer. core ranger can hit about 10k Rapidfire if traited properly, soulbeast can easily hit 20k. then add sicem for an extra 5k dmg on your rapidfire.

oh, and then there’s OWP, which easily multiplies your rapidfire dmg by about 1.75 if you don’t cast anything else.

multiple times a day my soulbeast takes someone from MOUNTED full hp, to down, to cleaved DEAD in about 3-5 seconds. and all i gotta do is press like 6 buttons. sicem, OWP, PBS, rapidfire, smoke assault, swap to GS and use Maul + worldly impact and they are cleaved. this is against anyone running marauder or similar, with no protection uptime.

the problem in this game is the bell curve. if you imagine the lower end of the bell curve being the smallest amount of damage dealt to players because they are tanky. it doesn’t make any sense that i can instagib marauder players in 1.5 seconds, but be literally unable to kill scrappers, tempests and firebrands on PURE dmg traits and gear. the tanks must go. i’d rather play in a fast paced meta where i have to be quick to avoid death. we already have mounts making it too ez to avoid fights against everything except ranger who can pew pew you off mount, so why do we allow players to be insanely tanky on top of that?

the only exception to high dmg i’ve had in this game is DE cus they have too much stealth. 1shot mesmer can also be problematic but not because of their dmg (cus it’s hard to pull off) but because they can stealth for a rather long time beforehand, making you unaware they even exist before you’re dead. but this goes for anything with too much stealth. ranger LB range could be capped at 1400 or 1300 to the even the playing field there too.

Buff mesmer.

Ah yes, Sic Em + OWP the glass meme build that only works against the unaware. I fought one of these recently, ran into a camp and let the guards do most of the work as the other ranger didn't have any self-protection. But you said it yourself, anything with protection uptime pretty much nullfies this build once you add toughness / vit stats into the mix as well. There's also reflects, barrier, etc. Once you miss that initial rapid fire, you're out. It's too one dimensional for my liking tbh.

Anyway, the problem with your 'live fast die fast' meta is thieves. One shot from stealth is a lot easier to do than meme SB builds are, and can escape a lot better. Actually you explain this in your last paragraph about DE's and that's AFTER the big damage nerf patches.

We've had buffed mesmer though and it was a lot, lot worse than you're currently 'OP' SB build. Stealth, clones, confusion / torment spam, teleports--they were practically unkillable and for all the wrong reasons. Condi mesmer is something I still find here and there, it just doesn't 1-shot shatter bomb me from stealth anymore.

The overall problem is anet seems unsure of what they want to do. Either everything is unified and all classes can do everything or every class has a specific role and has dedicated hard counters. The game is in the middle of this, where most classes have access to pretty much every mechanic there is and also have specific intended roles / tradeoffs and soft-counters. Any change from here is going to be fundamental 'big bang' approach and I'm guessing this is why it's taken so long to do, as those typically cause waves in the community.

after RF they have nothing??? my mauls routinely hit in the quintuple digits (10k or more). i have hit over 14k mauls without needing an interrupt first. soulbeast also has the ability to get 66% damage reduction for 6 or 9 seconds depending on your traits.

just because you met a newbie ranger playing a build doesn’t mean the entire build is a meme. try fighting a good one.by this logic, do you think any class is OP when you meet player who’s significantly better than you??

yes ofc SA thief beats ranger, but SA thief currently beats everything, except maybe nades scrapper.

Have a roaming vid? Curious to see the opponents you are facing.

Boon ranger isn't new--it's been a thing since they introduced boon copying on WHaO. The 'broken' part is SB with Dolyak stance and to some extent Second Skin--if/when they nerf those, you will see SB start to take more defensive gear again. That is, those two skills do not make the build (or spec) 'good' to me--still has all of the buggy ranger mechanics and lynchpins on an overtuned skill / trait.

For the Mesmer discussion I wasn't referring to a specific specialization, just mesmer in general has been toned down several times due to the tools it has. Mesmer, unlike Ranger, actually has more than a one dimensional playstyle; Ranger has been 'meta' at LB/GS for a very long time because the class as a whole is extremely one dimensional.

[bigo.9037]

@Gotejjeken.1267 said:

@Gotejjeken.1267 said:

@bigo.9037 said:LMAOO at ranger having less damage than Mesmer. core ranger can hit about 10k Rapidfire if traited properly, soulbeast can easily hit 20k. then add sicem for an extra 5k dmg on your rapidfire.

oh, and then there’s OWP, which easily multiplies your rapidfire dmg by about 1.75 if you don’t cast anything else.

multiple times a day my soulbeast takes someone from MOUNTED full hp, to down, to cleaved DEAD in about 3-5 seconds. and all i gotta do is press like 6 buttons. sicem, OWP, PBS, rapidfire, smoke assault, swap to GS and use Maul + worldly impact and they are cleaved. this is against anyone running marauder or similar, with no protection uptime.

the problem in this game is the bell curve. if you imagine the lower end of the bell curve being the smallest amount of damage dealt to players because they are tanky. it doesn’t make any sense that i can instagib marauder players in 1.5 seconds, but be literally unable to kill scrappers, tempests and firebrands on PURE dmg traits and gear. the tanks must go. i’d rather play in a fast paced meta where i have to be quick to avoid death. we already have mounts making it too ez to avoid fights against everything except ranger who can pew pew you off mount, so why do we allow players to be insanely tanky on top of that?

the only exception to high dmg i’ve had in this game is DE cus they have too much stealth. 1shot mesmer can also be problematic but not because of their dmg (cus it’s hard to pull off) but because they can stealth for a rather long time beforehand, making you unaware they even exist before you’re dead. but this goes for anything with too much stealth. ranger LB range could be capped at 1400 or 1300 to the even the playing field there too.

Buff mesmer.

Ah yes, Sic Em + OWP the glass meme build that only works against the unaware. I fought one of these recently, ran into a camp and let the guards do most of the work as the other ranger didn't have any self-protection. But you said it yourself, anything with protection uptime pretty much nullfies this build once you add toughness / vit stats into the mix as well. There's also reflects, barrier, etc. Once you miss that initial rapid fire, you're out. It's too one dimensional for my liking tbh.

Anyway, the problem with your 'live fast die fast' meta is thieves. One shot from stealth is a lot easier to do than meme SB builds are, and can escape a lot better. Actually you explain this in your last paragraph about DE's and that's AFTER the big damage nerf patches.

We've had buffed mesmer though and it was a lot, lot worse than you're currently 'OP' SB build. Stealth, clones, confusion / torment spam, teleports--they were practically unkillable and for all the wrong reasons. Condi mesmer is something I still find here and there, it just doesn't 1-shot shatter bomb me from stealth anymore.

The overall problem is anet seems unsure of what they want to do. Either everything is unified and all classes can do everything or every class has a specific role and has dedicated hard counters. The game is in the middle of this, where most classes have access to pretty much every mechanic there is and also have specific intended roles / tradeoffs and soft-counters. Any change from here is going to be fundamental 'big bang' approach and I'm guessing this is why it's taken so long to do, as those typically cause waves in the community.

after RF they have nothing??? my mauls routinely hit in the quintuple digits (10k or more). i have hit over 14k mauls without needing an interrupt first. soulbeast also has the ability to get 66% damage reduction for 6 or 9 seconds depending on your traits.

just because you met a newbie ranger playing a build doesn’t mean the entire build is a meme. try fighting a good one.by this logic, do you think any class is OP when you meet player who’s significantly better than you??

yes ofc SA thief beats ranger, but SA thief currently beats everything, except maybe nades scrapper.

Have a roaming vid? Curious to see the opponents you are facing.

Boon ranger isn't new--it's been a thing since they introduced boon copying on WHaO. The 'broken' part is SB with Dolyak stance and to some extent Second Skin--if/when they nerf those, you will see SB start to take more defensive gear again. That is, those two skills do not make the build (or spec) 'good' to me--still has all of the buggy ranger mechanics and lynchpins on an overtuned skill / trait.

For the Mesmer discussion I wasn't referring to a specific specialization, just mesmer in general has been toned down several times due to the tools it has. Mesmer, unlike Ranger, actually has more than a one dimensional playstyle; Ranger has been 'meta' at LB/GS for a very long time because the class as a whole is extremely one dimensional.

mesmer uses nearly entire utility bar to pull off a burst, has to time everything right, and even then they have less damage than soulbeast using owp, sicem, PBS and rapidfire that requires no timing.

please tell me how that makes sense? does mesmer have some kinda hidden sustain or hidden utility they can bring that makes up for their lack of damage and sustain?

for the record, soulbeast pretty decent amount of depth to it as well. it may be easy to pull off high damage but playing it high level isn’t just spamming the same rotations btw

[Gotejjeken.1267]

@bigo.9037 said:

@Gotejjeken.1267 said:

@Gotejjeken.1267 said:

@bigo.9037 said:LMAOO at ranger having less damage than Mesmer. core ranger can hit about 10k Rapidfire if traited properly, soulbeast can easily hit 20k. then add sicem for an extra 5k dmg on your rapidfire.

oh, and then there’s OWP, which easily multiplies your rapidfire dmg by about 1.75 if you don’t cast anything else.

multiple times a day my soulbeast takes someone from MOUNTED full hp, to down, to cleaved DEAD in about 3-5 seconds. and all i gotta do is press like 6 buttons. sicem, OWP, PBS, rapidfire, smoke assault, swap to GS and use Maul + worldly impact and they are cleaved. this is against anyone running marauder or similar, with no protection uptime.

the problem in this game is the bell curve. if you imagine the lower end of the bell curve being the smallest amount of damage dealt to players because they are tanky. it doesn’t make any sense that i can instagib marauder players in 1.5 seconds, but be literally unable to kill scrappers, tempests and firebrands on PURE dmg traits and gear. the tanks must go. i’d rather play in a fast paced meta where i have to be quick to avoid death. we already have mounts making it too ez to avoid fights against everything except ranger who can pew pew you off mount, so why do we allow players to be insanely tanky on top of that?

the only exception to high dmg i’ve had in this game is DE cus they have too much stealth. 1shot mesmer can also be problematic but not because of their dmg (cus it’s hard to pull off) but because they can stealth for a rather long time beforehand, making you unaware they even exist before you’re dead. but this goes for anything with too much stealth. ranger LB range could be capped at 1400 or 1300 to the even the playing field there too.

Buff mesmer.

Ah yes, Sic Em + OWP the glass meme build that only works against the unaware. I fought one of these recently, ran into a camp and let the guards do most of the work as the other ranger didn't have any self-protection. But you said it yourself, anything with protection uptime pretty much nullfies this build once you add toughness / vit stats into the mix as well. There's also reflects, barrier, etc. Once you miss that initial rapid fire, you're out. It's too one dimensional for my liking tbh.

Anyway, the problem with your 'live fast die fast' meta is thieves. One shot from stealth is a lot easier to do than meme SB builds are, and can escape a lot better. Actually you explain this in your last paragraph about DE's and that's AFTER the big damage nerf patches.

We've had buffed mesmer though and it was a lot, lot worse than you're currently 'OP' SB build. Stealth, clones, confusion / torment spam, teleports--they were practically unkillable and for all the wrong reasons. Condi mesmer is something I still find here and there, it just doesn't 1-shot shatter bomb me from stealth anymore.

The overall problem is anet seems unsure of what they want to do. Either everything is unified and all classes can do everything or every class has a specific role and has dedicated hard counters. The game is in the middle of this, where most classes have access to pretty much every mechanic there is and also have specific intended roles / tradeoffs and soft-counters. Any change from here is going to be fundamental 'big bang' approach and I'm guessing this is why it's taken so long to do, as those typically cause waves in the community.

after RF they have nothing??? my mauls routinely hit in the quintuple digits (10k or more). i have hit over 14k mauls without needing an interrupt first. soulbeast also has the ability to get 66% damage reduction for 6 or 9 seconds depending on your traits.

just because you met a newbie ranger playing a build doesn’t mean the entire build is a meme. try fighting a good one.by this logic, do you think any class is OP when you meet player who’s significantly better than you??

yes ofc SA thief beats ranger, but SA thief currently beats everything, except maybe nades scrapper.

Have a roaming vid? Curious to see the opponents you are facing.

Boon ranger isn't new--it's been a thing since they introduced boon copying on WHaO. The 'broken' part is SB with Dolyak stance and to some extent Second Skin--if/when they nerf those, you will see SB start to take more defensive gear again. That is, those two skills do not make the build (or spec) 'good' to me--still has all of the buggy ranger mechanics and lynchpins on an overtuned skill / trait.

For the Mesmer discussion I wasn't referring to a specific specialization, just mesmer in general has been toned down several times due to the tools it has. Mesmer, unlike Ranger, actually has more than a one dimensional playstyle; Ranger has been 'meta' at LB/GS for a very long time because the class as a whole is extremely one dimensional.

mesmer uses nearly entire utility bar to pull off a burst, has to time everything right, and even then they have less damage than soulbeast using owp, sicem, PBS and rapidfire that requires no timing.

please tell me how that makes sense? does mesmer have some kinda hidden sustain or hidden utility they can bring that makes up for their lack of damage and sustain?

for the record, soulbeast pretty decent amount of depth to it as well. it may be easy to pull off high damage but playing it high level isn’t just spamming the same rotations btw

I'd like to see a SB played at a high level to begin with--not that WvW has anything resembling 'high level' in it really.

From my own experience, the depth options are limited due to the pet AI / selection (we have what, four viable pets) and were limited even more once pet swap was removed in combat. Now it's run a 'meta' pet and do the same standard range rotation, if it doesn't work and they aren't melee then reset. If they are melee try the GS rotation. If all fails usually dolyak stance, block with GS, swoop with GS and swoop with bird to your nearest structure.

[bigo.9037]

@Gotejjeken.1267 said:

@bigo.9037 said:

@Gotejjeken.1267 said:

@Gotejjeken.1267 said:

@bigo.9037 said:LMAOO at ranger having less damage than Mesmer. core ranger can hit about 10k Rapidfire if traited properly, soulbeast can easily hit 20k. then add sicem for an extra 5k dmg on your rapidfire.

oh, and then there’s OWP, which easily multiplies your rapidfire dmg by about 1.75 if you don’t cast anything else.

multiple times a day my soulbeast takes someone from MOUNTED full hp, to down, to cleaved DEAD in about 3-5 seconds. and all i gotta do is press like 6 buttons. sicem, OWP, PBS, rapidfire, smoke assault, swap to GS and use Maul + worldly impact and they are cleaved. this is against anyone running marauder or similar, with no protection uptime.

the problem in this game is the bell curve. if you imagine the lower end of the bell curve being the smallest amount of damage dealt to players because they are tanky. it doesn’t make any sense that i can instagib marauder players in 1.5 seconds, but be literally unable to kill scrappers, tempests and firebrands on PURE dmg traits and gear. the tanks must go. i’d rather play in a fast paced meta where i have to be quick to avoid death. we already have mounts making it too ez to avoid fights against everything except ranger who can pew pew you off mount, so why do we allow players to be insanely tanky on top of that?

the only exception to high dmg i’ve had in this game is DE cus they have too much stealth. 1shot mesmer can also be problematic but not because of their dmg (cus it’s hard to pull off) but because they can stealth for a rather long time beforehand, making you unaware they even exist before you’re dead. but this goes for anything with too much stealth. ranger LB range could be capped at 1400 or 1300 to the even the playing field there too.

Buff mesmer.

Ah yes, Sic Em + OWP the glass meme build that only works against the unaware. I fought one of these recently, ran into a camp and let the guards do most of the work as the other ranger didn't have any self-protection. But you said it yourself, anything with protection uptime pretty much nullfies this build once you add toughness / vit stats into the mix as well. There's also reflects, barrier, etc. Once you miss that initial rapid fire, you're out. It's too one dimensional for my liking tbh.

Anyway, the problem with your 'live fast die fast' meta is thieves. One shot from stealth is a lot easier to do than meme SB builds are, and can escape a lot better. Actually you explain this in your last paragraph about DE's and that's AFTER the big damage nerf patches.

We've had buffed mesmer though and it was a lot, lot worse than you're currently 'OP' SB build. Stealth, clones, confusion / torment spam, teleports--they were practically unkillable and for all the wrong reasons. Condi mesmer is something I still find here and there, it just doesn't 1-shot shatter bomb me from stealth anymore.

The overall problem is anet seems unsure of what they want to do. Either everything is unified and all classes can do everything or every class has a specific role and has dedicated hard counters. The game is in the middle of this, where most classes have access to pretty much every mechanic there is and also have specific intended roles / tradeoffs and soft-counters. Any change from here is going to be fundamental 'big bang' approach and I'm guessing this is why it's taken so long to do, as those typically cause waves in the community.

after RF they have nothing??? my mauls routinely hit in the quintuple digits (10k or more). i have hit over 14k mauls without needing an interrupt first. soulbeast also has the ability to get 66% damage reduction for 6 or 9 seconds depending on your traits.

just because you met a newbie ranger playing a build doesn’t mean the entire build is a meme. try fighting a good one.by this logic, do you think any class is OP when you meet player who’s significantly better than you??

yes ofc SA thief beats ranger, but SA thief currently beats everything, except maybe nades scrapper.

Have a roaming vid? Curious to see the opponents you are facing.

Boon ranger isn't new--it's been a thing since they introduced boon copying on WHaO. The 'broken' part is SB with Dolyak stance and to some extent Second Skin--if/when they nerf those, you will see SB start to take more defensive gear again. That is, those two skills do not make the build (or spec) 'good' to me--still has all of the buggy ranger mechanics and lynchpins on an overtuned skill / trait.

For the Mesmer discussion I wasn't referring to a specific specialization, just mesmer in general has been toned down several times due to the tools it has. Mesmer, unlike Ranger, actually has more than a one dimensional playstyle; Ranger has been 'meta' at LB/GS for a very long time because the class as a whole is extremely one dimensional.

mesmer uses nearly entire utility bar to pull off a burst, has to time everything right, and even then they have less damage than soulbeast using owp, sicem, PBS and rapidfire that requires no timing.

please tell me how that makes sense? does mesmer have some kinda hidden sustain or hidden utility they can bring that makes up for their lack of damage and sustain?

for the record, soulbeast pretty decent amount of depth to it as well. it may be easy to pull off high damage but playing it high level isn’t just spamming the same rotations btw

I'd like to see a SB played at a high level to begin with--not that WvW has anything resembling 'high level' in it really.

From my own experience, the depth options are limited due to the pet AI / selection (we have what, four viable pets) and were limited even more once pet swap was removed in combat. Now it's run a 'meta' pet and do the same standard range rotation, if it doesn't work and they aren't melee then reset. If they are melee try the GS rotation. If all fails usually dolyak stance, block with GS, swoop with GS and swoop with bird to your nearest structure.

so while you block you get hit with unblockable, what’s your point? all classes have “ideal situation rotations” as well as cookie cutter sustain rotations if you’re under heavy pressure. but how you diverge from that rotation to play mindgames with your opponent that matters. cus if everyone uses the same rotation it would be too easy to kill people, but clearly there is a difference in the way people play and thus seperates the bad from the good from the better etc.