Thoughts on new warrior changes?

[Telgum.6071]

• I love the rifle changes but I'm not sure about the rest. For raids you can't go berserker+phalanx anymore since you 100% need to get doubled banners. Big nerf on Peak Performance. Huge nerf on Axe Mastery.

 

I'm still not sure about the Spellbreaker changes, but I'm 100% going to play D/D + Rifle after the patch to try.

Edited April 30, 2021 by Telgum.6071

[DKRathalos.9625]

The Balance patch is mostly about nerfing warrior which I dunno why? Warrior need b u f f s instead of nerfs.

Edited April 30, 2021 by DKRathalos.9625

[Infusion.7149]

I have no idea why they think Berserker is in a good place. The only time you would think it is in a decent place is if you only PVE. Besides that, there is an impending nerf to banners in PVE , meaning more kittenkittenin's pieces will be required due to the loss of 100 precision off Doubled Stankittenrds.

In WVW you need to have supports or essentially you are a sitting duck once you are in Berserk mode and a worse-off warrior while out of Berserk mode. I suppose there will be more Gunflame memes after the patch briefly.

In PVP there isn't any way to drop out of Berserk mode either so people can just kite you while you're in Berserk mode and ignore you while you are out of it.

edit: the forum filter is insanely restrictive , but you know what I mean if you think of precision pieces you swap in for berserker's

Edited April 30, 2021 by Infusion.7149
forum filter edited my post even though I listed a stat combo...

[Obtena.7952]

Losing 42 ferocity from the off hand equipped axe is not even close to be considered a 'huge nerf' ... so let's calm down here. The bigger nerf is Rifle losing adrenaline recharge. The rest of the Rifle changes are fluff. 

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

11 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Losing 42 ferocity from the off hand equipped axe is not even close to be considered a 'huge nerf' ... so let's calm down here. The bigger nerf is Rifle losing adrenaline recharge. The rest of the Rifle changes are fluff. 

AA will pierce, so that is potentially 5 adrenaline per shot, along with 5 potential might (more with forceful greatsword taken). The new explosive shell had no numbers listed so we can only speculate on whether it is fluff or not.

[Obtena.7952]

4 minutes ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

AA will pierce, so that is potentially 5 adrenaline per shot, along with 5 potential might (more with forceful greatsword taken). The new explosive shell had no numbers listed so we can only speculate on whether it is fluff or not.

Well, I'm dubious about the changes to rifle because plugging away at 1200 with a piercing rifle AA isn't exactly my idea of engaging gameplay, even though the changes encourage ranged camping. I mean, getting adrenaline and accessing burst faster is a thing that gets you BACK into melee play. The changes for rifle seem to encourage a THIS or THAT choice instead of a swapping for utility and situation response. 

Edited April 30, 2021 by Obtena.7952

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

3 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Well, I'm dubious about the changes to rifle because plugging away at 1200 with a piercing rifle AA isn't exactly my idea of engaging gameplay, even though the changes encourage ranged camping. I mean, getting adrenaline and accessing burst faster is a thing that gets you BACK into melee play. The changes for rifle seem to encourage a THIS or THAT choice instead of a swapping for utility and situation response. 

If you really want adrenaline then take Furious, or Merciless Hammer. You'll never complain about adrenaline gain ever again.

[cryorion.9532]

Underwhelming balance patch given that we waited for so long. What happened to 300 second CD traits? Pretty sad that the balance team haven't done anything about it for more than a year. Is Spellbreaker buff a bad joke? Let's wait another half a year for another 5-10% buff, because waiting is fun (/s).

 

I am looking forward mostly to new rifle skill (even though I have some doubts it will be gamechanger) and Marching Orders CD reduction to 10 seconds, which could be interesting with the Martial Cadence trait, 3 second weapon skill CD reduction every 10 seconds sounds pretty good as first impression. But everything else is a joke, seriously. Small bukitten and nerfs, some make me question balance team's competence.

 

Banner nerf is hilarious, it doesn't solve anything right now, just makes Discipline traitline even more mankittentory if you want to support 10 people (and most meta builds if not all already pick the trait in Discipline anyway...). So basically just nerf to non-Discipline builds that are much much less used anyway. BIG (/s). I guess they were a bit afraid that suddenly people start using banners in PvP/WvW with their light fields and it would be too strong, having banner bukitten for 10 people around for "free". 

I don't understand why balance team didn't split the trait instead, doubled stats bonus part in Discipline and increasing number of targets part into Tactics. So if warrior wants to support more people, they have to lower their dps by going Tactics, which would make sense. So many questions...

 

Oh also, rip Peak Performance buff. What they did with this trait since its introduction is beyond disgusting (Spellbreaker d a m a g e buffed btw 🤡)

Edited April 30, 2021 by cryorion.9532
"kittenmage" and "buffed" words changed to kitten

[Obtena.7952]

20 minutes ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

If you really want adrenaline then take Furious, or Merciless Hammer. You'll never complain about adrenaline gain ever again.

Well, let's be careful here. I'm not complaining about a lack of adrenaline in general ... I'm talking about adrenaline being a way to integrate Rifle with other builds that are primarily melee-based on a warrior. 

 

 

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

1 minute ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Well, let's be careful here. I'm not complaining about a lack of adrenaline in general ... I'm talking about adrenaline being a way to integrate Rifle with other builds that are primarily melee-based on a warrior. 

 

 

And now you can get 5 adrenaline per AA shot instead of 3. If you take Furious that can be up to 10 adrenaline per shot. Pew Pew 3 times into a group or zoo necro and you have full adrenaline.

[Obtena.7952]

I would rather have 3 for sure instead of maybe max 5 and minimum 1. I will wait and see how it plays out before pkittening further judgement. 

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

5 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

I would rather have 3 for sure instead of maybe max 5 and minimum 1. I will wait and see how it plays out before pkittening further judgement. 

The current 3 is only 2 guaranteed and 1 if they have vulnerability, and that is with Crack Shot. This will be 1-5 adrenaline without Crack Shot, and 2-10 with Furious.

But you are right in that waiting and seeing prior to judgment is a good call.

[Fueki.4753]

Rifle should have just gotten a flat kittenmage buff instead of what they will get now.

 

The banner nerfs are just that: nerfs.

What's the point of Warriors dropping light fields anyway? Guardians already cover that and those are (almost literally) everywhere.

Great Fortitude is fine the way it is now.

 

There's no need to take away that extra bit of health that helped me survive over-tuned mechanics. This is a straight nerf to this trait for every average player choosing it.

 

Axe Mastery and Peak Performance were fine the nerfs are completely unjustified.

 

I really don't see the point of the Spellbreaker changes. They won't make me play it.

They should have given kittenggers are straight kittenmage buff instead of this conditional stuff.

 

The one change to Tactics I want to "see", the removal of that ugly particle effect isn't happening either.

They should at least hide it when the weapons are sheathed, like Aegis and Elementalists' Attunements!

 

All in all, Warrior will get substantially worse for me to play.

But those changes aren't meant to make professions better for average players like me anyway.

Edited April 30, 2021 by Fueki.4753

[DeceiverX.8361]

1 hour ago, Infusion.7149 said:

I have no idea why they think Berserker is in a good place. The only time you would think it is in a decent place is if you only PVE.

There's your answer.

Look at the notes holistically.  Aside from boon/condi being addressed as a problem the rest makes nearly no impact to the PvP modes with pretty much none of the otherwise massive balance issues really being addressed.

[Grand Marshal.4098]

Not going to rant about the warrior changes, when anet wants warriors to leave discipline (in pve at least) and basically make it mandatory with this patch for high edn content.

 

I'll rant about how we are going to become food to condi builds. We could sustain with cleanses and a strong source of resistance in competetive but now? Featherfoot Grace, Zerker stance and Revenge Counter all  will simply counter non-damaging stuff. On top of that, anet not knowing what revesre balance is, preferred to buff condi builds more.

 

They also believe zerker is more viable than spellbreaker ig /shrug (pve obv).

 

They also think the 'buffs' spb got will make up for primal bursts 🤪🤪🤪

 

Finally let's sit down and talk about the current alternative to resistance and how warrior can benefit from it by using defense (the subpar line) for a 15 sec icd retal/resolution buff and how imminent threat requires you to be on spellbreaker. 

 

I suppose, it's Cleansing Ire and passive resolution or you'll be dead. Time to start running defense/discipline/x 

 

Mending and Shakke it Off will be also a must have, since you got no resistance to carry a burst or escape a condi bomb. That's cool...

 

Cull the weak dmg increase poggers?!?!?!

 

P.S. I look forward to using the rifle though. Time for MMR synergy for rifle finally.

 

Edited April 30, 2021 by Grand Marshal.4098

[felix.2386]

1 hour ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

If you really want adrenaline then take Furious, or Merciless Hammer. You'll never complain about adrenaline gain ever again.

do you have idea what you talking about, i played rifle in plat+ level.

and not random wvw braindead level.

 

first of all, furious is condition grand master trait and rifle is power, 

second of all for merciless hammer, tell me how you gonna CC some one from range with rifle without already have 30 adrenaline to go berserk and rifle is a ranged weapon.

 

your comment has 0 thought behind it, it hurts my brain.

 

also before i could ignore taking signet of fury because i can get 30 adrenaline in a fair speed, so i can actually take competitive utility to compete in actual plat+ level or even save headbutt for actual good interrupts.

 

and pierce hardly ever pierce anything at all, it needs a very high concentration of enemies to even pierce as it is a very thin line.

specially in spvp where there's only 5 enemies. this is essentially an PvE only change. given no thought in pvp.

 

and really, it is a patch made for pve only from this single line.

"Berserker has been in a great place with strong support, power, and condition builds that are successful in all content"

clearly, wvw and pvp isnt included in "all content"

 

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

19 minutes ago, felix.2386 said:

do you have idea what you talking about, i played rifle in plat+ level.

and not random wvw braindead level.

 

first of all, furious is condition grand master trait and rifle is power, 

second of all for merciless hammer, tell me how you gonna CC some one from range with rifle without already have 30 adrenaline to go berserk and rifle is a ranged weapon.

 

your comment has 0 thought behind it, it hurts my brain.

 

also before i could ignore taking signet of fury because i can get 30 adrenaline in a fair speed, so i can actually take competitive utility to compete in actual plat+ level or even save headbutt for actual good interrupts.

 

and pierce hardly ever pierce anything at all, it needs a very high concentration of enemies to even pierce as it is a very thin line.

specially in spvp where there's only 5 enemies. this is essentially an PvE only change. given no thought in pvp.

 

and really, it is a patch made for pve only from this single line.

"Berserker has been in a great place with strong support, power, and condition builds that are successful in all content"

clearly, wvw and pvp isnt included in "all content"

 

That was a global statement on Adrenaline gain but for kicks and giggles, yes Furious buffs your condi damage, but the adrenaline gain is on any critical hit, which still benefits Rifle even though it is power. Merciless Hammer works with rifle butt just fine. That and it will cause Gunflame to give you 10 Adrenaline which can be used for Decapitate or Arc Divider on weapon swap.

 

There is plenty of thought there, so kindly rub two brain cells together before projecting on others.

 

You are right though that this balance patch is clearly leaving the competitive modes to fester.

[Psycoprophet.8107]

Don't argue with him Lee, befriend him so he stays in his (this) class sub forum instead of going over to thief subform claiming to be a thief player yet only asking for nerfs.

[Blumpf.2518]

The biggest nerf is the banner trait nerf, decreasing banner bonus from +100% to +50% for the warrior.

This means you lose precision and you wont have the 100% critchance with banners+fury+spotter anymore so you must adjust gear and switch some items from berserker to assassin, which is another dps loss.

 

The good thing about the balance change is the improved tactic traitline.

This improves the Core Warrior, who is a great supporter and performs really good in raids.

As Berserker you cant take Tactics, cause you absolutely need the Strength+Discipline traitlines and Tactic+Discipline+Berserker and no Strength Traitline is a huge DPS loss. But Core Warrior can take Strength+Tactics+Discipline

 

Atm. im playing Core Warrior in raids ( http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PKABcelnlZwQYdMOGJO2SdLLA-zxQYhonQfH6yp0iQICFQFSgWGB2aWkfZD-e ) and its really good there. At the Golem the Berserker does more DPS, but under realistic raid circumstances the Core Warrior can do the same DPS but offers more support cause ofd the empower allies trait.

 

[RedShark.9548]

On 4/30/2021 at 8:22 PM, cryorion.9532 said:

Underwhelming balance patch given that we waited for so long. What happened to 300 second CD traits? Pretty sad that the balance team haven't done anything about it for more than a year. Is Spellbreaker buff a bad joke? Let's wait another half a year for another 5-10% buff, because waiting is fun (/s).

 

I am looking forward mostly to new rifle skill (even though I have some doubts it will be gamechanger) and Marching Orders CD reduction to 10 seconds, which could be interesting with the Martial Cadence trait, 3 second weapon skill CD reduction every 10 seconds sounds pretty good as first impression. But everything else is a joke, seriously. Small bukitten and nerfs, some make me question balance team's competence.

 

Banner nerf is hilarious, it doesn't solve anything right now, just makes Discipline traitline even more mankittentory if you want to support 10 people (and most meta builds if not all already pick the trait in Discipline anyway...). So basically just nerf to non-Discipline builds that are much much less used anyway. BIG (/s). I guess they were a bit afraid that suddenly people start using banners in PvP/WvW with their light fields and it would be too strong, having banner bukitten for 10 people around for "free". 

I don't understand why balance team didn't split the trait instead, doubled stats bonus part in Discipline and increasing number of targets part into Tactics. So if warrior wants to support more people, they have to lower their dps by going Tactics, which would make sense. So many questions...

 

Oh also, rip Peak Performance buff. What they did with this trait since its introduction is beyond disgusting (Spellbreaker d a m a g e buffed btw 🤡)

Ppl wont use banners in wvw for a measly lightfield that stays for 5 seconds and has 90s cd lol. And the buffs from banners are not good enough to justify removing other skills

[DKRathalos.9625]

Well nobody use banners (except Elite for executing) in WvW because it's a place where the fight is extremely mobile, it's not like raiding/fractal when you hit boss in 1 place or small arena.
This changes clearly didn't thought of WvW situation.

[Dadnir.5038]

17 hours ago, RedShark.9548 said:

Ppl wont use banners in wvw for a measly lightfield that stays for 5 seconds and has 90s cd lol. And the buffs from banners are not good enough to justify removing other skills

 

Banner's advantage is that they grant "free" stats which have a significant enough impact in organized group in PvE to make this utility a "must have". ANet's dev shaving those stats again and again has always been a bad way to try to remove this impact.

 

The light field is either a good joke (since the warrior isn't thematically linked to "light") or a foreshadow of warrior's next e-spec. Either way it's poor design.

[Grand Marshal.4098]

I suppose it goes without saying that banners will never get reworked if this is the path Anet chooses to follow. Which is a kitten shame.

Also can we talk about how they think Zerker is a good support, but all it's support comes  from Core Warrior and simply adds dmg to it to compensate?

 

With that in mind, they could easily have altered Zerker even a bit. It's not like Savage Instinct stunbreaks you and your allies around you to be a more proper support..

 

Finally, they chose to put light fields on banners, instead of 1 stack of on-cast stability which greatly benefits competetive play with banners (even as a meme), given how you most probably lack stunbreaks if you got full banners.

[cryorion.9532]

I just realized (thanks to one video pointing this out) that the Attacker's Insight change is worded with "additional" stats buff. If that is the case, then it can give up to 475 power and ferocity bonus and 250 precision (PvE). Old maximum bonus was 225 power and ferocity. Which means 250 more power and ferocity stats.That is quite significant and could bring mace/axe + axe/dagger spellbreaker dps build back (or a new variation that can upkeep all 5 AI stacks). Now this would be really nice.

For some reason, I thought it was just increase from 45 stat per stack to 50. Not sure why is the new stat bonus number so arbitrary (95 for power and ferocity and not simply 100), makes me think that the wording in patch notes is just misleading and it will be just 50 for power and ferocity instead of 95.

EDIT: nvm, reading is hard, spb buffs are still garbage

Edited May 6, 2021 by cryorion.9532

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

27 minutes ago, cryorion.9532 said:

I just realized (thanks to one video pointing this out) that the Attacker's Insight change is worded with "additional" stats buff. If that is the case, then it can give up to 475 power and ferocity bonus and 250 precision (PvE). Old maximum bonus was 225 power and ferocity. Which means 250 more power and ferocity stats.That is quite significant and could bring mace/axe + axe/dagger spellbreaker dps build back (or a new variation that can upkeep all 5 AI stacks). Now this would be really nice.

For some reason, I thought it was just increase from 45 stat per stack to 50. Not sure why is the new stat bonus number so arbitrary (95 for power and ferocity and not simply 100), makes me think that the wording in patch notes is just misleading and it will be just 50 for power and ferocity instead of 95.

 

 

Wait a minute...

"Attacker's Insight: Each stack of the Insight effect now grants an additional 50 power, precision, and ferocity at level 80 in PvE. Each stack now grants an additional 35 power, precision, and ferocity in PvP and WvW. Previously each stack granted 45 power and ferocity."

 

I can see the confusion here... It is either implying that each stack adds an additional 50 power/precision/ferocity baseline or it is implying that these are in addition to the amount normally gained. It isn't clear because they've left out what these stats are in addition to.

In the event, and I hope this is the case, that you are right then yeah 475 power and ferocity plus 250 (pve) is a lot more dps. In WvW/PvP it would 400 power and 400 ferocity with 175 precision. That is a kitten ton more stats. That's like 14% increased DPS on a Berserker's amulet.

 

My own reading, and I think most people's reading, was that the new values are 50 per in PvE and 35 per in competitive. If not then AI is going to be giving beast stats.