About The New Forum Emoji Reactions - Just As Bad As The Old Thumbs Up Or Thumbs Down Vote [Merged]

[Danikat.8537]

I thought it was against the rules to use more than one account on the forum? Which isn't to say it doesn't happen, but I thought if you knew someone was doing that you could report them and one or both accounts could get warnings or banned from posting.

 

Of course people could try to disguise it by pretending to be different people, but if their posting habits don't give them away then admins can check IP addresses, active times and things like that to identify accounts being used by the same person. (The longest I'm aware of someone getting away with it on a forum where I was a moderator was 6 months and that was mostly because the admin who normally ran those checks was sick and not active.)

[JustTrogdor.7892]

12 minutes ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

 

You guys aren't getting it.

 

There are TOS rules against trolling and derailing and spamming and attacks and harassment. These rules apply to text responses, but apparently not emojis. There is something wrong there.

 

So maybe they should just remove them all, positive and negative, if some people are going to be so concerned with them.  Like in your example where you think people are using multiple accounts to give a negative emoji,  they could do the same to give their own post positive ones when they disagree with you.   So would you be agreeable to that or do you just want positive reactions?

 

Anyway I don't see an emoji as some kind of harassment but that's because as I said, most reasonable people will evaluate the post based on its content.   If someone wants to log in to 100 accounts and give my post 100 frown faces oh well.  In my opinion they are just wasting their time.  But you are certainly entitled to your own feelings about emojis.  I just disagree that it is a problem. 

 

 

[Sonderm.4639]

On 5/2/2021 at 3:38 AM, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

People are logging into their alt accounts to stack negative post response emojis vs. people they are arguing with.

 

IE: Someone doesn't like your suggestion, so they log into their alt accounts and make sure to spam as many laugh or confused emojis as they can to make sure what you said looks bad. As much is obvious that this is going on when the new notification system shows you that you've somehow received 5 or 6 confused faces in the time span of 2 minutes, when there were no responses at all to your post several hours before or several hours after.

 

[snip]

 

Having a simple system where you click "Like" if you like it or don't click "Like" if you don't like it, is better. The worst they can do is just not click like.

If I play along with your alt-account theory for the sake of the discussion: if you are just want to allow positive reactions, people on alt-accouts might just as well mass-like a post that disagrees with you. It's basically the same effect.

On the other hand, I notice on other platforms, there is a certain set of people who cannot fathom that the opinions they hold may not be as self-evidently true as they think they are. Everyone one disagreeing with them is then automatically a "Russian bot".

On the topic of emote-reactions in general: It's a discussion forum. In real life discussions we communicate both verbally and non-verbally. If this is considered harassment now something is seriously wrong IMO.

As a final point. People considering writing a toxic reply instead now may click on an emote which is easily ignored, thus defusing some discussions.

 

[choon.6308]

Well, here is another band aid solution. If you are using an adblocker like let's say ublock on the chrome, you can use the "block element" feature and select the reactions bar and block it. It hides the reaction bar on all pages.

[mindcircus.1506]

1 hour ago, Blude.6812 said:

Wouldn't mind having a dunce cap emoji to use for topics that have been discussed and rejected/accepted. I am sure most could here could name those topics. But I am quite happy to have more emotes here. A thumbs down would be welcome too.

Agree. I would welcome a thumbs down (and a dunce hat) emote as well.

 

But it's not like these emoji's impact anything like a thumbs down on reddit impacts a post/thread's visibility.

[mindcircus.1506]

Duplictae

Edited May 6, 2021 by mindcircus.1506

[MrForz.1953]

The things people get upset by these days. 

 

If whatever you say is pertinent, it will speak for itself, if it attracts a gaggle of emojis for some reason the post will just get more attention.

Edited May 6, 2021 by MrForz.1953

[Epsilon Indi.2031]

On 5/1/2021 at 8:38 PM, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

People are logging into their alt accounts to stack negative post response emojis vs. people they are arguing with.

 

IE: Someone doesn't like your suggestion, so they log into their alt accounts and make sure to spam as many laugh or confused emojis as they can to make sure what you said looks bad. As much is obvious that this is going on when the new notification system shows you that you've somehow received 5 or 6 confused faces in the time span of 2 minutes, when there were no responses at all to your post several hours before or several hours after.

 

This is as bad as that old "thumbs up or thumbs down system" that eventually was removed for the same reason of people just spamming thumbs down from several alts to make a post look bad. These kinds of systems do nothing but propagate a lot of unnecessary toxicity in the forum.

 

The emoji responses need to be removed for this reason.

 

Having a simple system where you click "Like" if you like it or don't click "Like" if you don't like it, is better. The worst they can do is just not click like.

How do you know these are alt accounts and your ideas aren't just bad?

[Dawdler.8521]

There seems to be no "like stats" on the new one... which makes their visibility meaningless on grander scale (you cant "sad vote" an account, just a post). This forum only count posts from what I can see, unless I missed it.

 

So the emotes are pointless.

Edited May 6, 2021 by Dawdler.8521

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

1 hour ago, jokke.6239 said:

 And I also (in my opinion) feel like the mob mentality can hurt a discussion/debate.

 

Absolutely.

 

This is why creating propaganda is the meta tactic in politic fields. Fabricating bandwagon support is also key for all commercialism.

[SoulGuardian.6203]

On 5/6/2021 at 4:39 PM, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

 

🔱😅😢😞❤

Edited September 14, 2021 by SoulGuardian.6203
Misspell

[Cuks.8241]

I prefer the like/dislike options. "Thanks" is also OK. Easy and clear meaning. I don't mind the dislike button, nothing wrong with people expressing dislike. It's life, people will disagree, deal with it.

These emojis are strange though. Especially the "thanks" one. Thanks, here's a trophy 

 

[MrForz.1953]

23 minutes ago, SoulGuardian.6203 said:

Precisely.

Very well put.

That's how brands orchestrate subtle ways to divert the attention of the consumer, so in order to disagree/reject the opposition's ideas/brand and accept theirs.

Some people don't realise how easily influenced the majority are.

Ofcourse a forum isn't like a presidential campaign, but in essence the same rule applies here.

Why? 

Popularity, ego inflation, respect, etc... you name it.

It's a blasted forum about a video game. I can't argue about that practice elsewhere, but do you think you really need to dig that deep in here? I get it, we aren't free, we are influenced by millions of different factors pushing us into various directions. However, does it matter to you that much in the context of an in-game debate that people may end up not agreeing with you at a first glance and follow a trend because a desperate person may have cheated their way to enable more negative reactions? Do the people passing by deserve to understand if their attention span is that limited anyways?

 

By all means, remove any form of reaction in this forum, it's fine either way, but it really stems from a petty complaint.

Edited May 6, 2021 by MrForz.1953

[SoulGuardian.6203]

7 minutes ago, MrForz.1953 said:

It's a blasted forum about a video game. I can't argue about that practice elsewhere, but do you think you really need to dig that deep in here? Does it matter to you that much in this context that people don't agree with you at a first glance because a desperate person may have cheated their way to enable more negative reactions? Do the people passing by deserve to understand if their attention span is that limited anyways?

It's not my post.

But yes, I do agree with OP to a certain extent.

A healthy argument can be constructive.

But when people use several accounts to downvote you and try to ridicule you, then yes it is classed as a form of bullying and I do strongly disagree with it.

In that occasion it is the person doing that that cannot deal with disagreement and not me or some other poster.

 

Perhaps no, I don't need to go this deep.

But how do you know that there aren't accounts here from the competition trying to get players away from GW2?

Yes, it is just a videogame. But it is an industry that brings millions in revenue.

To you it's just a videogame. 

To the devs it is their bread winner.

 

Edited May 6, 2021 by SoulGuardian.6203

[MrForz.1953]

25 minutes ago, SoulGuardian.6203 said:

It's not my post.

But yes, I do agree with OP to a certain extent.

A healthy argument can be constructive.

But when people use several accounts to downvote you and try to ridicule you, then yes it is classed as a form of bullying and I do strongly disagree with it.

In that occasion it is the person doing that that cannot deal with disagreement and not me or some other poster.

 

Both persons can't deal with the disagreement in that case. Also, would it even phase you if the post I just quoted was riddled with confused emojis? 

 

25 minutes ago, SoulGuardian.6203 said:

Perhaps no, I don't need to go this deep.

But how do you know that there aren't accounts here from the competition trying to get players away from GW2?

Yes, it is just a videogame. But it is an industry that brings millions in revenue.

To you it's just a videogame. 

To the devs it is their bread winner.

 

That's... quite the context here. If we're jumping right on the wellbeing of the devs. How does one even get players away from GW2? Constant doomsaying through multiple accounts? Wouldn't that be... too obvious? 

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

4 hours ago, The Greyhawk.9107 said:

When you say "full account" I presume you mean people that have a fully paid account as apposed to the free to play version, correct?  Not sure how I feel about that.

From the Forums Code of Conduct:

 

Forum Membership

Your game account and forum account are linked. While anyone is welcome to read the forums, only someone whose paid game account is in good standing and has accepted this Forums Code of Conduct can enjoy the privilege of forum participation, including posting and providing reactions to posts.

 

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/legal/the-forums-code-of-conduct/

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

3 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

 

They do though. Most of the veteran players in this game care more than people seem to realize about patch changes. Most of them have access to several full paid accounts from people who have come and gone over the years who left them passwords ect ect. Some people also go out of their way to purchase multiple accounts under their own name for several in-game reasons. When these types of players see a suggestion they don't like and they want to make sure it looks stupid, they will go onto several accounts to spam negativity towards that thread/user. They will often use those alt accounts in actual written responses, to make it look like the alts are supporting their counter argument to the OP, all the while making the alts seem as if they think the OP is just stupid for even bringing up the suggestion or comment. They also do this when they want to make their own suggestions look GOOD. Just log into alts and act like a bunch of people showed up to support an idea.

 

To those of you who have never noticed this activity in just about every single forum on the internet, you really need to start paying attention to the obvious.

Posting on more than one account is against Forum Code of Conduct, so if you have proof, you can use the 'Report' feature. 

[SoulGuardian.6203]

2 minutes ago, MrForz.1953 said:

 

Both persons can't deal with the disagreement in that case. Also, would it even phase you if the post I just quoted was riddled with confused emojis? 

 

That's... quite the context here. If we're jumping right on the wellbeing of the devs. How does one even get players away from GW2? Constant doomsaying through multiple accounts? Wouldn't that be... too obvious? 

1 - I don't think that me personally would be much bothered by confused face emojis.

I'd probably even laugh at it.

 

2 - I obviously have no evidence to make such a statement. But I wouldn't be suprised if that happened. It's an hypothesis. 

How many times do forums and servers get serious attacks, including the Huge Sony Playstation server!?

I think it's all relevant.

Debatable however, but relevant nevertheless. 

 

There could be several reasons why people do it. Could be merely because of ego, to lack of communication skills, or any other; trying to create a toxic community in order to drive people away.

It's feasible, or can you not fathom the possibility?

 

[Super Hayes.6890]

4 hours ago, JustTrogdor.7892 said:

My opinion is that most reasonable people will evaluate a post based on its content and not care about what little pictures might be at the bottom of it.   I understand a lot of people might only want validation.  But really I don't think a frown face or what ever is something to get worked up over if someone puts one as a reaction to a post.  But that's just me.

It's not just you. Frankly, more negative emojis should be available. People should think before they post and not care if there are some people that may not like their opinion. This is a forum for discussions after all. We don't come here to sing kumbaya together. We come here to discuss. I'm so tired of the extreme aversion to anything that might be construed as negative. Here's a piece of news everyone: Someone will disagree with you at some point.

[sewenewes.4176]

On 5/2/2021 at 2:48 AM, Donari.5237 said:

The "sad" one is more iffy to me, I can see it genuinely used when someone posts about losing a loved one that played the game,

 

The absolute state of humanity. Reacting to someone's grief with stickers. I'm not saying the internet was a mistake but it sure did a number on the socialization of newer generations. Case in point: the original poster who considers emojis harrasment.

 

4 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

There are TOS rules against trolling and derailing and spamming and attacks and harassment. These rules apply to text responses, but apparently not emojis.

 

We are headed for extinction.

[Omega.6801]

I'm fine with the emojis and there should even be more, actually negativs to disprove of a post. Imho, either have both, positive and negative, or have nothing at all. Having only the positives felt very synthetic, fake, crafted.

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

2 hours ago, MrForz.1953 said:

It's a blasted forum about a video game. I can't argue about that practice elsewhere, but do you think you really need to dig that deep in here? 

 

As an adult consumer with a credit card who has fed this company probably upwards of 900.00 USD over the past 9 years, yeah I kind of take my feedback seriously when it can make or break patch suggestions in a game I have invested money into.

 

This is ultimately the point in what I am saying. If there is a thread on class balance where someone has posted that "Said given class is grossly overperforming in said given mode right now" we could have 9 different people post on that topic and agree with the OP statement for feedback, to let devs know that something is wrong and it needs to be fixed. However, all it takes is 1 person with several alts who wants things to stay the same, to stage a forum event that looks like several other individuals are showing up to argue with the 9 people who supported the OP post, 10 including the author of the thread. This makes the situation look like there is an argument within the community, as if there were some widely skewed opinions on balance and that the people who wanted change need to "l2p" or "git gud", when in reality there are actually 10 people completely agreeing on everything concerning what needs to be changed, and only 1 person is disagreeing.

 

Emojis can exasperate this problem because they don't even require posted feedback. With written feedback, you begin seeing trails of evidence as to who is alting on the several accounts. However with just emojis, a person can show up and drop a single response to those 10 people who are agreeing upon a well written suggestion and say something like: "This thread is hilarious. You guys need to stop QQing and l2p" and then proceed to log into the alts and click several likes and thank you trophies on that comment, to make it look like a large portion of the community feels that same way. Then he proceeds to click several cry emojis on the OP post to rub it in.

 

^ This is confusing feedback for even dev teams. It is possible that the 1 person doing that may actually be enough to halt any changes, or at least seriously delay the timeframe in which something is tended to. Those of you who do not understand why this is a problem in any setting, online, offline, IRL, w/e, need to read up a little bit on how propaganda works and why allowing people to do this, removes the true majority voice from a community.

 

1 hour ago, Inculpatus cedo.9234 said:

Posting on more than one account is against Forum Code of Conduct, so if you have proof, you can use the 'Report' feature. 

 

Of course I don't have proof. I can't read IPs or anything like that. But sometimes things are obvious. Unfortunately, something being as obvious as isn't enough to claim proof: "This one alt account has ONLY EVER made posts that are in response to supporting this one particular main account. It has never made a single post that was not showing up to that one main account's threads to support them directly. Both accounts also make the same exact spelling/grammar errors. The alt account always signs in about 30 seconds after the main account makes a post response arguing with someone else." <- Look at how obvious it is to tell that this is the same person. But it isn't enough to get someone banned and it's quite a hassle for a single person to Erin Brokovich around trying to compile evidence against someone. I shouldn't have to do that.

 

The answer is more simple to remove emoji spam which is being unnoticed and untended to when it is being used in TOS breaking ways. Again, they pay attention to snarky written responses, but not emoji reactions, and emoji reactions can definitely be used in snarky ways to fuel someone's agenda to halt up a good suggestion. Without emojis, people can't stack negative responses against a statement. The worst they can do is chose to not click like. <- This is just a cleaner and less toxic system.

 

I'll say it again, I take my feedback seriously for anything I've invested money into. What I'm saying in this thread is a lot less about QQ forum hurt, and a lot more about making sure my feedback as a consumer with a credit card has a fair chance to be heard & taken seriously.

 

[Ashen.2907]

There is nothing inherently toxic about expressing disagreement or disapproval of a topic or point being made (by emoji or otherwise). If one lacks the fortitude to handle others disliking their ideas they should probably not be expressing them in a public venue. 

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

5 minutes ago, Ashen.2907 said:

There is nothing inherently toxic about expressing disagreement or disapproval of a topic or point being made (by emoji or otherwise). If one lacks the fortitude to handle others disliking their ideas they should probably not be expressing them in a public venue. 

 

Read the thread.

 

This isn't about wah wah wah QQ.

 

This is about not admitting propaganda which alters the true course of actual real feedback.

[Danikat.8537]

2 hours ago, Super Hayes.6890 said:

It's not just you. Frankly, more negative emojis should be available. People should think before they post and not care if there are some people that may not like their opinion. This is a forum for discussions after all. We don't come here to sing kumbaya together. We come here to discuss. I'm so tired of the extreme aversion to anything that might be construed as negative. Here's a piece of news everyone: Someone will disagree with you at some point.

Those two points seem contradictory to me. If they don't (and shouldn't) care what other people think of their opinion why should they think before posting?

 

What should they be thinking about other than the point they want to make and how it might be recieved by other people?

 

37 minutes ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

Of course I don't have proof. I can't read IPs or anything like that. But sometimes things are obvious.

 

Treat it like reporting people in the game. You don't need to have that level of detail because the forum admins will be able to get it themselves, you just need to call attention to the accounts which they need to check.

 

(Although bear in mind it might turn out that they are genuinely seperate people. I've seen that happen more than once, both when I used to moderate various forums and when I've been the one accused of being someone else's sock puppet account. I have, apparently, at various times been another poster's account made exclusively to argue with them in ways they could easily counter to make themselves look smarter, my boyfriends fake internet girlfriend, a member of staff pretending to be a fan of their own game and most memorably a musicians fake Twitter account created to have private conversations with their band member while ignoring the person who made this claim's constant demands for attention. (That last one is especially absurd because if you want a private conversation with your friend why would you have it on Twitter?)