How would you do an "easy mode" in raids?

[Gudradain.3892]

Describe how you would implement "easy mode" in raiding.

For the sake of this discussion, please refrain to comment if all you want to say is that you are against "easy mode" in general. I'm aware that many raiders are opposed to an "easy mode" in raiding, myself included depending how it's implemented, but it's a request that is often coming back and it would be interesting to discuss what would be the best way to do it.

Instead, if you don't like a particular suggestion, describe why you feel that this particular suggestion would be a bad idea.

Thank you

[Infusion.7149]

No enrage.
No LI or rewards other than the unid.
Ability to res people that are full dead (see fractals).

That's about it.

If people are there actually "for the story" as they say, they won't have a problem with this implementation as that is how dungeons used to work (only explorable gives tokens).

Edited May 6, 2021 by Infusion.7149

[Westenev.5289]

Balance it as a single player experience, with one off rewards like a "personal story". Maybe throw in a black lion key at the end or something. If players experience the mechanics (WITHOUT having to watch on youtube), they should be able to better cope with the real thing.

[Firebeard.1746]

So what I think needs to happen is that they form the bridge between KP and actually doing the real thing, kind of like T1 fractals to t4, making training runs unnecessary.

If a new player jumps in the game and doesn't happen to find the communities, all they'll see in NA is a bunch of people asking for KP and them being sold, that's unacceptable.

I think people insisting there's no legendary payoff are not helpful because there's already content that doesn't even require 10 players that will reward them.

I don't think they should be a single player experience.

Though after discussions with trolls in my thread that was supposed to originally be about this, I think there also needs to be more active systems encouraging grouping between experienced and inexperienced players. Because GW2 content tends to be static, people tend to not want to be responsible for teaching it to other people. This becomes problematic when those other people are trying to build groups but can't find them when they can play that content. It basically creates cliques new people will smash into if they don't find that bright happy discord somewhere, and even then, I don't think Anet should build games reliant on the health of discord communities. It's fine if people use them as a resource, but the game should stand on its own.

[skus.4527]

I'd like to see puggable content with essentially the same mechanics as normal mode, but scaled to be more forgiving and expecting maybe yellow gear on average and no voice coms. I like the no enrage timer and res full dead ideas @Infusion.7149 mentioned. There shouldn't be any party wipes for a single player's mistake, though a mechanic that require at least some of the players to perform it to get past is fair. Similar rewards to normal, though somewhat slower progression, and skinned differently if necessary to keep the differentiation between gear sets. There needs to be something enticing, but it doesn't have to be exactly what is available in normal. Stepping from easy to normal should be an experience of 'everything hits harder, and there's a new mechanic or two, but it's basically the same.'

[Infusion.7149]

I like how some people put a confused emoji on my post.
Really? Can't even bother to reply?

@skus.4527 , you wouldn't need to scale it for yellow gear or whatever if enrage timer is gone ; you might need to do updraft on gorseval more often if there's no enrage (have run 10 revenant meme no quickness comp and ran into this) for example. Even if you scale for yellow gear it is meaningless since most of the time the build is what stacks modifiers making it 10x more damage (versus Nomad with no damage traits or something) rather than the gear being the largest factor. Ascended vs exotic is around 5% for weapon.

Right now the only instanced content where you full die is raid + strikes.
Fractals you can just respawn if everyone dies and not start from the beginning (the massive amount of /gg skipping and WvW had led to a huge death count on my guardian and revenant) and Dungeons + DRMs you can use WP.

Expecting a complete overhaul just to make a new mode isn't going to happen realistically. We see this with DRMs CMs and Forging Steel CMs.

[Firebeard.1746]

8 minutes ago, Infusion.7149 said:

Really? Can't even bother to reply?

I'm 100% sure this is going to be the new trolling for people with not enough energy to actually respond, but still want to downvote you in some way.

[Sigmoid.7082]

5 hours ago, Firebeard.1746 said:

Though after discussions with trolls in my thread that was supposed to originally be about this

People who disagree with you are not trolls. 

[maddoctor.2738]

I'll never understand how a "confused" emote is being confused for a downvote... but anyway back on topic.

There is a rather simple way to make an easy mode that I've posted all the way back to the first thread on the topic, take advantage of the multiple phases of the bosses (for those that have them).

 

For example, Vale Guardian is the very first Raid boss released and can be split in 3 phases, with 2 split phases between them. There can be up to 5 different "modes" for this fight, first phase, first split, second phase, second split, kill. The first phase of Vale Guardian is so simple that even first timers in min-maxed gear should be able to beat.

Gorseval can be split in multiple phases easily as well, with the burst phases

Sabetha can be about the add spawns, each add spawn a separate "phase"

Slothasor has only 2 "phases", as the "Shake" ability is added at 50% but nothing else really changes, this one would need some further adjustments.

Matthias has 4 rather clear phases, and the first one isn't especially hard (with the ice patches)

Keep Construct has phases but is a lot trickier because the main wipe mechanic (merging adds) exists on all phases, much like Slothasor this would need further adjustments

Xera has multiple phases, although maybe starting the fight with Xera immediately (skipping the split part) would be preferable because that part takes some coordination to finish. The initial part of the Xera fight is very simple

Cairn is more like Slothasor and Keep Construct, as in no real big mechanical changes over time, most of the mechanics are available from the first minute

Samarog has clear phases, and there is an escalation in difficulty.

Deimos... Deimos is also full of phases, although I'd dare say the very first phase (before the first add) is easier than World Bosses, as there is barely anything to do

 

I dislike and will never agree or support an idea that is about "same mechanics but less severe", as such an idea serves no purpose in my opinion. If you experience mechanics that are supposed to kill you, but instead do damage (any amount) it leads to a different way of dealing with them. This means that the players that will use this easier version to graduate to the normal version will not be ignorant of the mechanics, but instead use/learn THE WORNG tactics, like stacking on Sabetha's flamethrower to outheal the damage instead of moving. On the other hand, fighting the exact same boss, with the exact same mechanics, up to a certain point in the fight, means up to that point you will be 100% experienced and ready to go in the normal version.

 

Same principle can apply to the harder Strike Missions. For example, remove the last phase (with the Orbs) at Whisper of Jormag. Same principle can be used to instead ADD phases to increase the difficulty, espeically to fights that don't have a CM version.

 

Finally we need  to talk about rewards. This version needs to have rewards (a green and a blue isn't a reward) so as to stand on it's own and not be a "stepping stone" for the normal version. The problem here is that normal Raid rewards are garbage, unless you are in a perfect static that can clear them fast, or you are selling Raids. This means, the rewards of this easier mode will be absolutely attrocious since it stands to reason that the easy mode will have less rewards than the normal version (makes no sense otherwise), so the rewards of the normal version need to be increased (by a lot) so as to make room for the reduced rewards of the easier version to be competitive with the content those same players will be interested in.

 

And I know they could add a legendary armor reward (but much slower) but that's not really enough. That would only put a time limit on the content, once players get it, they will abandon it. The content needs good/competitive liquid rewards, and the only way for that to happen is for normal Raids to get increased rewards.

[Astralporing.1957]

@maddoctor.2738Perhaps all that would need to be done to turn the normal mode into an easy one is to add "save points" at certain phases - you wipe, you don't get back to beginning, but to the checkpoint just after the last major phase you cleared. Something would need to be done about the enrage timer, i guess, but otherwise it should be enough. With this approach, you might actually not even need to remove any phases at all. And it would definitely also be good for those that truly might want to use that mode for real training - they would be able to keep training on the phase they have problems with, without needing to repeat all the previous one with each fail.

Edited May 7, 2021 by Astralporing.1957

[Juan.6124]

18 hours ago, Infusion.7149 said:

No enrage.
No LI or rewards other than the unid.
Ability to res people that are full dead (see fractals).

That's about it.

If people are there actually "for the story" as they say, they won't have a problem with this implementation as that is how dungeons used to work (only explorable gives tokens).

How does this help anyone when everyone is dead?

[Infusion.7149]

3 hours ago, maddoctor.2738 said:

Finally we need  to talk about rewards. This version needs to have rewards (a green and a blue isn't a reward) so as to stand on it's own and not be a "stepping stone" for the normal version. The problem here is that normal Raid rewards are garbage, unless you are in a perfect static that can clear them fast, or you are selling Raids. This means, the rewards of this easier mode will be absolutely attrocious since it stands to reason that the easy mode will have less rewards than the normal version (makes no sense otherwise), so the rewards of the normal version need to be increased (by a lot) so as to make room for the reduced rewards of the easier version to be competitive with the content those same players will be interested in.

Let's not bend the truth here, the rewards aren't worse than WvW unless you wipe every time and if you do unranked PVP or ATs you get no progress to the PvP armor and amulet; even if you wipe as long as you do damage you get Magnetite Shards or Gaetling Crystals up to the weekly cap. It's about on par with a world boss that isn't Karka Queen or Ley Line Anomaly as even if you spend two hours in one wing it's going to be ~8g/hour. Wiping in "easy mode" shouldn't give rewards just as fractals or dungeons don't reward wiping and neither do DRMs or strikes. If Astralporing's suggestion of save points at phases (think Twilight Oasis fractal or Sunqua Peak fractal) is taken, then this is especially important.

https://fast.farming-community.eu/instances/raids

Profit breakdown really comes down to the 2g liquid gold and unid (which is exactly what people repeating it for the week get). If the focus is only on legendary armor, then if it is given as a reward for easy mode it needs to be gated at 20+ weeks at minimum as that is what is for WVW/PVP and for second set normally.

Based on the fast farming benchmarks:

• W1 Vale Guardian: Magnetite makes up ~61 silver of the ~3.27 gold, an easy mode would therefore keep ~80% of the current reward
• W1 Spirit Run (not boss encounter): Magnetite makes up ~18 silver of the ~47 silver reward
• W1 Gorseval: Magnetite makes up ~86 silver of the ~3.5 gold, an easy mode would therefore keep ~75% of the reward : minus low chance at the Ghostly Infusion in normal mode
• W1 Sabetha: Magnetite makes up ~1 gold of the ~3.8 gold , an easy mode would therefore keep ~75% of the reward
• W2 Slothasor: Magnetite makes up ~73 silver of the ~3.4 gold , an easy mode would therefore keep ~75% of the reward
• W2 Bandit Trio: Magnetite makes up ~92 silver of the ~3.57 gold , an easy mode would therefore keep ~75% of the reward
• W2 Matthias: Magnetite makes up ~1.23 gold of the ~3.89 gold, an easy mode would therefore keep ~70% of the reward
• W3 Escort: People do this without KP ; magnetite makes up ~61 silver of the ~3.28 gold , an easy mode would therefore keep >80% of the reward
• W3 Keep Construct: magnetite makes up ~92 silver of the ~3.58 gold , an easy mode would therefore keep ~75% of the reward
• W3 Twisted Castle (not boss encounter): magnetite makes up ~31 silver of the ~1.13 gold , an easy mode would keep just under 75% of the reward
• W3 Xera: magnetite makes up ~61 silver of the ~3.28 gold , an easy mode would keep >80% of the reward
• W4 Cairn: magnetite makes up ~61 silver of the ~3.28 gold , an easy mode would keep >80% of the reward
• W4 Mursaat Overseer: magnetite makes up ~80 silver of the ~3.46 gold ,  an easy mode would keep >75% of the rewards
• W4 Samarog: magnetite makes up ~1.04 gold of the ~3.7 gold , an easy mode would keep ~70% of the reward
• W4 Deimos:  magnetite makes up ~1.22 gold of ~3.89 gold, an easy mode would keep ~70% of the reward

For DRMs if you don't do any CMs it's 1/3 reward in terms of the Tyrian Defense seals (instead of three seal drops you get one drop) and the same goes for unids and the random orb/medallion upgrades.

That said, normal mode raid could have rare unids added to it for the repeat chest (or even making it drop twice all the unid for normal and 3x for CM) so that it is worth repeating daily on par with DRMs/strikes. Alt parking generally results in unids , map metas , essence chests, strike chests , Drizzlewood/Dragonfall, Silverwastes , etc all rely on unids and orbs/medallions in some fashion.

@ DirtyDan.4759
Most of the W1-W4 stuff (because generally people are doing it for the legendary armor) don't have something that kills the whole group at once unless you fail something consistently. Also, without enrage you could run something with lower DPS that is safer.
For example VG/Cairn port , Gorseval rampage, Sloth poisons, Narella fire tornado, Matthias poison, Keep Construct circle, Samarog green circle don't instakill. Sabetha flamethrower instakills , Deimos punting you off the platform, Matthias sacrifice, failing to glide in Xera instance, and so do the Samarog spears on the edge but unless everyone is in it that won't be as large an issue if you can res double downed people.

Edited May 7, 2021 by Infusion.7149
Respond to a reply

[mindcircus.1506]

21 hours ago, Gudradain.3892 said:

Describe how you would implement "easy mode" in raiding.

I would:

1. Gather ten competent players

2. Ensure these players were running solid builds that synergized with each other

3. Make sure these players were properly geared

4. Ensure the ten players had taken the time to familiarize themselves with the mechanics via experience or Youtube guides

Easy Mode enabled.

Edited May 7, 2021 by mindcircus.1506

[Firebeard.1746]

2 hours ago, Infusion.7149 said:

Let's not bend the truth here, the rewards aren't worse than WvW unless you wipe every time and if you do unranked PVP or ATs you get no progress to the PvP armor and amulet; even if you wipe as long as you do damage you get Magnetite Shards or Gaetling Crystals up to the weekly cap. It's about on par with a world boss that isn't Karka Queen or Ley Line Anomaly as even if you spend two hours in one wing it's going to be ~8g/hour. Wiping in "easy mode" shouldn't give rewards just as fractals or dungeons don't reward wiping and neither do DRMs or strikes. If Astralporing's suggestion of save points at phases (think Twilight Oasis fractal or Sunqua Peak fractal) is taken, then this is especially important.

https://fast.farming-community.eu/instances/raids

Profit breakdown really comes down to the 2g liquid gold and unid (which is exactly what people repeating it for the week get). If the focus is only on legendary armor, then if it is given as a reward for easy mode it needs to be gated at 20+ weeks at minimum as that is what is for WVW/PVP and for second set normally.

Based on the fast farming benchmarks:

• W1 Vale Guardian: Magnetite makes up ~61 silver of the ~3.27 gold, an easy mode would therefore keep ~80% of the current reward
• W1 Spirit Run (not boss encounter): Magnetite makes up ~18 silver of the ~47 silver reward
• W1 Gorseval: Magnetite makes up ~86 silver of the ~3.5 gold, an easy mode would therefore keep ~75% of the reward : minus low chance at the Ghostly Infusion in normal mode
• W1 Sabetha: Magnetite makes up ~1 gold of the ~3.8 gold , an easy mode would therefore keep ~75% of the reward
• W2 Slothasor: Magnetite makes up ~73 silver of the ~3.4 gold , an easy mode would therefore keep ~75% of the reward
• W2 Bandit Trio: Magnetite makes up ~92 silver of the ~3.57 gold , an easy mode would therefore keep ~75% of the reward
• W2 Matthias: Magnetite makes up ~1.23 gold of the ~3.89 gold, an easy mode would therefore keep ~70% of the reward
• W3 Escort: People do this without KP ; magnetite makes up ~61 silver of the ~3.28 gold , an easy mode would therefore keep >80% of the reward
• W3 Keep Construct: magnetite makes up ~92 silver of the ~3.58 gold , an easy mode would therefore keep ~75% of the reward
• W3 Twisted Castle (not boss encounter): magnetite makes up ~31 silver of the ~1.13 gold , an easy mode would keep just under 75% of the reward
• W3 Xera: magnetite makes up ~61 silver of the ~3.28 gold , an easy mode would keep >80% of the reward
• W4 Cairn: magnetite makes up ~61 silver of the ~3.28 gold , an easy mode would keep >80% of the reward
• W4 Mursaat Overseer: magnetite makes up ~80 silver of the ~3.46 gold ,  an easy mode would keep >75% of the rewards
• W4 Samarog: magnetite makes up ~1.04 gold of the ~3.7 gold , an easy mode would keep ~70% of the reward
• W4 Deimos:  magnetite makes up ~1.22 gold of ~3.89 gold, an easy mode would keep ~70% of the reward

For DRMs if you don't do any CMs it's 1/3 reward in terms of the Tyrian Defense seals (instead of three seal drops you get one drop) and the same goes for unids and the random orb/medallion upgrades.

That said, normal mode raid could have rare unids added to it for the repeat chest (or even making it drop twice all the unid for normal and 3x for CM) so that it is worth repeating daily on par with DRMs/strikes. Alt parking generally results in unids , map metas , essence chests, strike chests , Drizzlewood/Dragonfall, Silverwastes , etc all rely on unids and orbs/medallions in some fashion.

@ DirtyDan.4759
Most of the W1-W4 stuff (because generally people are doing it for the legendary armor) don't have something that kills the whole group at once unless you fail something consistently. Also, without enrage you could run something with lower DPS that is safer.
For example VG/Cairn port , Gorseval rampage, Sloth poisons, Narella fire tornado, Matthias poison, Keep Construct circle, Samarog green circle don't instakill. Sabetha flamethrower instakills , Deimos punting you off the platform, Matthias sacrifice, failing to glide in Xera instance, and so do the Samarog spears on the edge but unless everyone is in it that won't be as large an issue if you can res double downed people.

You get PVP leggie armor mats for losses from ranked if you consistently spam and doing ranked is just a matter of pressing a button. You're bending the truth acting like it's a big deal to do ranked on any level, it's just more toxicity really. there's no need for winning. Wings and neck are the only ones that actually require wins. EVEN SO, you can force people to play with you and occaisionally they'll carry because of the matchmaker. You can't do that for raids.

WvW participation on a level that requires legendaries isn't that bad either, but can take some learning of the game mode. You'll get it eventually either way. The only issue WvW has is that it's painstakingly slow.

Going further, if we're just focused on legendary reward, it's not just LI from raids, you need the collections too, otherwise the LI is worthless, so that means killing all the bosses (sometimes multiple times in the case of envoy IIRC). Twin largos has sub-second level reaction times to one of their dodge mechanics. There are probably people on this earth who do not have the ability to respond to that. I'm sure I could pull a mechanic here or there from the harder bosses that is actually restrictive. Coalescence is probably the more forgiving of the collections, but as it requires the final boss kill, if you're doing the instances on your own progress, you still need to kill everything. While we're talking about the collections, I also want to say it's SUPER annoying that they can require things in a particular order (coalescence) and usually you have to do some special thing to get credit for the kill. I've downed Matt TWICE, which people have claimed is a harder boss, but don't have the vial because I didn't stand in the fountain and do the thing.

So no, it's not equivalent, you still can get some leggies from these other game modes more casually, and you can force people to play with you and sometimes they'll carry you. That's nothing like raiding.

I think you make valid points on raw profit, but raw profit isn't the only thing people will be going for.

Edited May 7, 2021 by Firebeard.1746

[Infusion.7149]

44 minutes ago, Firebeard.1746 said:

You get PVP leggie armor mats for losses from ranked if you consistently spam and doing ranked is just a matter of pressing a button. You're bending the truth acting like it's a big deal to do ranked on any level, it's just more toxicity really. there's no need for winning. Wings and neck are the only ones that actually require wins. EVEN SO, you can force people to play with you and occaisionally they'll carry because of the matchmaker. You can't do that for raids.

WvW participation on a level that requires legendaries isn't that bad either, but can take some learning of the game mode. You'll get it eventually either way. The only issue WvW has is that it's painstakingly slow.

Going further, if we're just focused on legendary reward, it's not just LI from raids, you need the collections too, otherwise the LI is worthless, so that means killing all the bosses (sometimes multiple times in the case of envoy IIRC). Twin largos has sub-second level reaction times to one of their dodge mechanics. There are probably people on this earth who do not have the ability to respond to that. I'm sure I could pull a mechanic here or there from the harder bosses that is actually restrictive. Coalescence is probably the more forgiving of the collections, but as it requires the final boss kill, if you're doing the instances on your own progress, you still need to kill everything. While we're talking about the collections, I also want to say it's SUPER annoying that they can require things in a particular order (coalescence) and usually you have to do some special thing to get credit for the kill. I've downed Matt TWICE, which people have claimed is a harder boss, but don't have the vial because I didn't stand in the fountain and do the thing.

So no, it's not equivalent, you still can get some leggies from these other game modes more casually, and you can force people to play with you and sometimes they'll carry you. That's nothing like raiding.

I think you make valid points on raw profit, but raw profit isn't the only thing people will be going for.

You can't just step into ranked day 1 as you need 20 PVP rank before you even step in there, you can with raiding if you have the gear and people in your guild are willing to take you. Also for ranked you can only duo queue which means you influence 40% of the team not 100% control. That's why people have alts for raiding, but alts for PVP are typically only people that are tryhard PVPers or streamers.

If PVP is "just pressing a button" easy, then people can just go PVP for legendary armor/amulet then?

WVW/PVP both take around 22 weeks , same goes for second set of PVE raid armor.

 

Edited May 7, 2021 by Infusion.7149

[Firebeard.1746]

31 minutes ago, Infusion.7149 said:

You can't just step into ranked day 1 as you need 20 PVP rank before you even step in there, you can with raiding if you have the gear and people in your guild are willing to take you. Also for ranked you can only duo queue which means you influence 40% of the team not 100% control. That's why people have alts for raiding, but alts for PVP are typically only people that are tryhard PVPers or streamers.


WVW/PVP both take around 22 weeks , same goes for second set of PVE raid armor.

I'm not sure why your first point is relevant, it's just more spamming, it's a 1-time startup cost and you never have to pay it again, like gearing up for raids (you can't just step into those either, you need exotics with the appropriate stats).
 

Quote

If PVP is "just pressing a button" easy, then people can just go PVP for legendary armor/amulet then?

Yes and they do. I mean most people not trying at least auto attack. I actually do try, but I have been in teams of all auto-attackers, not sure if they're bots or trolls.
 

 

31 minutes ago, Infusion.7149 said:

WVW/PVP both take around 22 weeks , same goes for second set of PVE raid armor.

In terms of raw materials, yes, but raiding requires collections, which makes them even more prohibitive. It's also astounding to me there's no raid locks in this game with those collections (I have to do the previous bosses AGAIN in order to finish my collection?!). I'd wager people would raid more often if those collections weren't an issue, because once you learn the fight, you're actually earning materials that much faster.

But if you're attacking my painstakingly slow statement about WvW, in terms of raw hours, in order to reach those benchmarks, I think you need 20hrs/week of sPVP at 50% win rate and 40hrs/week of WvW if you're completely new. WvW gets better over time, but after you play ALOT, like you'd already have earned everything ALOT.
 

Edited May 7, 2021 by Firebeard.1746

[Infusion.7149]

1 hour ago, Firebeard.1746 said:

I'm not sure why your first point is relevant, it's just more spamming, it's a 1-time startup cost and you never have to pay it again, like gearing up for raids (you can't just step into those either, you need exotics with the appropriate stats).
 

Yes and they do. I mean most people not trying at least auto attack. I actually do try, but I have been in teams of all auto-attackers, not sure if they're bots or trolls.
 

 

In terms of raw materials, yes, but raiding requires collections, which makes them even more prohibitive. It's also astounding to me there's no raid locks in this game with those collections (I have to do the previous bosses AGAIN in order to finish my collection?!). I'd wager people would raid more often if those collections weren't an issue, because once you learn the fight, you're actually earning materials that much faster.

But if you're attacking my painstakingly slow statement about WvW, in terms of raw hours, in order to reach those benchmarks, I think you need 20hrs/week of sPVP at 50% win rate and 40hrs/week of WvW if you're completely new. WvW gets better over time, but after you play ALOT, like you'd already have earned everything ALOT.
 

Or you could just use the skirmish ticket calculator made by Chieftain Alex which shows that with 10% outnumbered and 0 WVW rank it takes roughly 20 hours to max diamond skirmish track.  https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Special:RunQuery/WvW_skirmish_pip_query?

Not sure how any of this has to do with the topic by the way.

PVP depends on matchups and the time per match.
If you want to finish in 3 seasons you're looking at 6330 pips, which below plat rating is 
(Number of PvP games required) = (Number of PvP pips required) / [(7 * B) + C + (2 * D) + 3]
where B is your win rate 
C is top stats rate , which will be high if you play any form of support ... we'll assume that you just ready up and autoattack so zero
D is near victory, we can assume this to be zero if you always have games that are really mismatched

= 6330 / ((7 * 50%) + 0 + (2*0) +3)
which is just under 974 games

[Sobx.1758]

This thread is about possible ways of actually setting up an easy mode, but apparently people like @Firebeard.1746 are still stuck on derailing the thread into "easier/different lege armor acquisition methods" (and then they'll pretend it's not about that for them). Literally right from his first post in the thread, oof.

 

 

No enrage and checkpoints for each phase sound like decent ideas.

 

Edited May 7, 2021 by Sobx.1758

[Firebeard.1746]

1 hour ago, Sobx.1758 said:

This thread is about possible ways of actually setting up an easy mode, but apparently people like @Firebeard.1746 are still stuck on derailing the thread into "easier/different lege armor acquisition methods" (and then they'll pretend it's not about that for them). Literally right from his first post in the thread, oof.

 

 

No enrage and checkpoints for each phase sound like decent ideas.

 

You clearly missed the point from infusion first:

 

Quote

No LI or rewards other than the unid.

I saw it and responded to him, but didn't want to repeat our scuffle in the same thread, by quoting. You guys talk about legendaries first and it's crazy to me that basically you came into this thread to explicitly attack me by repeating attacks from your other thread. That's against ToS.

And rewards do increase participation, so it can't hurt. It's not about me, or maybe it is on some level, I'd rather be rewarded for PVE content that's  more difficult than the PVP I do, but I guess that's a cardinal sin in your eyes. Both playing for legendaries or demanding similar rewards for effort between game modes.

Edited May 7, 2021 by Firebeard.1746

[Firebeard.1746]

1 hour ago, Infusion.7149 said:

Or you could just use the skirmish ticket calculator made by Chieftain Alex which shows that with 10% outnumbered and 0 WVW rank it takes roughly 20 hours to max diamond skirmish track.  https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Special:RunQuery/WvW_skirmish_pip_query?

Not sure how any of this has to do with the topic by the way.

PVP depends on matchups and the time per match.
If you want to finish in 3 seasons you're looking at 6330 pips, which below plat rating is 
(Number of PvP games required) = (Number of PvP pips required) / [(7 * B) + C + (2 * D) + 3]
where B is your win rate 
C is top stats rate , which will be high if you play any form of support ... we'll assume that you just ready up and autoattack so zero
D is near victory, we can assume this to be zero if you always have games that are really mismatched

= 6330 / ((7 * 50%) + 0 + (2*0) +3)
which is just under 974 games

10% outnumbered uptime sounds high. I'm sure there's been plenty of weeks I've never been at that target. my 40 hours though was a worst-case scenario. Which can happen. It's still generally more than PVP. There's a lot of nuances in that calculator that might never happen in reality.

Edited May 7, 2021 by Firebeard.1746

[Astralporing.1957]

9 hours ago, DirtyDan.4759 said:

How does this help anyone when everyone is dead?

About as well as dungeon story mode did - not at all.

[Astralporing.1957]

7 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

This thread is about possible ways of actually setting up an easy mode, but apparently people like @Firebeard.1746 are still stuck on derailing the thread into "easier/different lege armor acquisition methods" (and then they'll pretend it's not about that for them). Literally right from his first post in the thread, oof.

It's not a derail. It's a feature @Infusion.7149 in his first post in this thread considered to be important enough to be specifically addressed. On top of it, it's practically the only feature of easy mode you concerned yourself with in that other thread, so apparently you did not consider it a derail then. In fact, even now you considered it to be important enough to respond to.

 

Like it or not, discussions about rewards are going to always be part of easy mode discussions. Or discussions about any other game mode.

 

 

Edited May 8, 2021 by Astralporing.1957

[Sobx.1758]

15 hours ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

Like it or not, discussions about rewards are going to always be part of easy mode discussions. Or discussions about any other game mode.

Except it's already on repeat in another thread because certain people don't see the point of talking about any change unless it consists of making legendary armor acquisition easier, so jumping into a new one just to do the same thing that's in old one is even more pointless than before.

 

15 hours ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

On top of it, it's practically the only feature of easy mode you concerned yourself with in that other thread, so apparently you did not consider it a derail then.

On top of it, that's a lie. But if someone keeps bringing it back as if repeating it brings anything new, then I'll keep repeating the same answers because apparently that's constructive.

Or is it only valid when people you agree with do that?

 

Quote

In fact, even now you considered it to be important enough to respond to.

 

Broad comment about a post: "your post is offtopic, stop derailing the thread"

@Astralporing.1957 : well if you referred to that post, it means you care about its contents!

 

Yup, nice logic over there.

 

 

 

Edited May 8, 2021 by Sobx.1758

[mindcircus.1506]

Some of ya'll need to use the new ignore function instead of measuring peepees in multiple threads as if the Developers care how big you claim to be.

[Firebeard.1746]

1 hour ago, mindcircus.1506 said:

Some of ya'll need to use the new ignore function instead of measuring peepees in multiple threads as if the Developers care how big you claim to be.

I'm on the fence about you, but this is good advice.