A call out to the people who decide about links in EU for upcomming relink on Friday.

[Leaa.2943]

This is actually gonna be about WvW in EU. NA do not suffer the same way as EU is now so please keep this in mind. In EU right now we have 5 tiers. NA also had 5 tiers long ago but they removed that so that all hosts in NA have a link. For some reason and i am not gonna add all the ideas we WvW players have about this, but for some reason tier 5 is kept in EU and every relink 3 host ends up with no link and kept closed and pushed down to tier 5 and stay there for 60 days.  Being closed is always bad, being closed in tier 5 is absolutely utterly terrible. You as a server can not do anything about your situation at all. You are hard stuck there for 60 days. 

 

What you can do then is to move to another server and this happens frequently and again most of the WvW players have ideas about why this is done in EU every relink, but was fixed in NA. Gonna leave the why out because we never got it confirmed. But i can tell you how this have effected WvW in EU for the last years. Because about a year or more back we had so many host servers that was full and then there was also many very high and high and very few medium. Now it is the other way around. 4 servers are set to full. 3 of them are questinable if they really are full. And then there is the one that had two really full servers together and if that one server really is full we will figure out on relink. Probably not. 

 

Ok moving on. Links when they were comming out was told to us to be a way for people on servers with small population to have a better chance of a good WvW. This is not how it turned out in EU. Because in EU links are wrecking WvW and what was hosts and with population enough jumps in and out of link, not link, link, not link. And then there are the hosts that where most of the population just move off their server and a large part just quit the game if they dont get a link at all. And then there are the servers who just suffers for 60 days and their WvW i terrible in the way that links was at the start. So the linking is creating more problems then it solve and at this point there are so many players who left or got tired over having to pay to have fun in WvW or suffer for 60 days not having fun in WvW. 

 

So links now have fun in WvW because they always have a populated WvW all whilst hosts are taking the hits and being forced to play without and just feeling misserble. On relink we all sit in discord/TS and pray that we wont be that server this time.

 

Now to the ending. Arena Net you fixed this for NA. There is no tier 5 and all hosts have a link. But in EU you just smash our WvW to pieces and it gets worse for every period. Could you please look in to the situation in EU and try to figure out how you can fix it. And please dont randomly give links and push 3 hosts to the bottom. Give our WvW life again, please put in some times and thoughts how you can solve this for us. 

[XenesisII.1540]

Fixed what for NA? NA went straight to 4 tiers from 8 when links started 5 years ago.

EU went down to 5 then 4 then back to 5. Didn't people complain when they moved EU to 4 tiers like a year ago?

Dragonbrand would like to have a word with you being stuck in tier 4 for 60 days.

Links aren't always better, I've been on two different links in a row that have had their host sunk to t4 the past two relinks.

The current four full servers in EU are in tiers 1-3, none in t5.

NA currently has 11 full servers, was 13 not long ago, 8 very high, 5 high, 0 medium.... talk about having little choices at all.

NA will always be screwed up because time zones are not taken into account.

EU will always be screwed up because of language barriers.

Lastly, Anet will always screw up because they had no clue how bad this three server matches run by a point system in and out of the game mode ruled by time zones would become. Finally they had a plan which they can't seem to execute, but will probably end up badly anyways if it even comes out anytime before 2049. At this point, with the games age, we're lucky they even bother with relinks still.

 

[Junkpile.7439]

Outnumbered buff every map 24/7 incoming. At least i get max tickets faster. 🥳

[Anaide.8251]

18 hours ago, Leaa.2943 said:

This is actually gonna be about WvW in EU. NA do not suffer the same way as EU is now so please keep this in mind. In EU right now we have 5 tiers. NA also had 5 tiers long ago but they removed that so that all hosts in NA have a link. For some reason and i am not gonna add all the ideas we WvW players have about this, but for some reason tier 5 is kept in EU and every relink 3 host ends up with no link and kept closed and pushed down to tier 5 and stay there for 60 days.  Being closed is always bad, being closed in tier 5 is absolutely utterly terrible. You as a server can not do anything about your situation at all. You are hard stuck there for 60 days. 

 

What you can do then is to move to another server and this happens frequently and again most of the WvW players have ideas about why this is done in EU every relink, but was fixed in NA. Gonna leave the why out because we never got it confirmed. But i can tell you how this have effected WvW in EU for the last years. Because about a year or more back we had so many host servers that was full and then there was also many very high and high and very few medium. Now it is the other way around. 4 servers are set to full. 3 of them are questinable if they really are full. And then there is the one that had two really full servers together and if that one server really is full we will figure out on relink. Probably not. 

 

Ok moving on. Links when they were comming out was told to us to be a way for people on servers with small population to have a better chance of a good WvW. This is not how it turned out in EU. Because in EU links are wrecking WvW and what was hosts and with population enough jumps in and out of link, not link, link, not link. And then there are the hosts that where most of the population just move off their server and a large part just quit the game if they dont get a link at all. And then there are the servers who just suffers for 60 days and their WvW i terrible in the way that links was at the start. So the linking is creating more problems then it solve and at this point there are so many players who left or got tired over having to pay to have fun in WvW or suffer for 60 days not having fun in WvW. 

 

So links now have fun in WvW because they always have a populated WvW all whilst hosts are taking the hits and being forced to play without and just feeling misserble. On relink we all sit in discord/TS and pray that we wont be that server this time.

 

Now to the ending. Arena Net you fixed this for NA. There is no tier 5 and all hosts have a link. But in EU you just smash our WvW to pieces and it gets worse for every period. Could you please look in to the situation in EU and try to figure out how you can fix it. And please dont randomly give links and push 3 hosts to the bottom. Give our WvW life again, please put in some times and thoughts how you can solve this for us. 

saw that bandwagoning already started on EU, fun times.

[Leaa.2943]

18 hours ago, XenesisII.1540 said:

Fixed what for NA? NA went straight to 4 tiers from 8 when links started 5 years ago.

EU went down to 5 then 4 then back to 5. Didn't people complain when they moved EU to 4 tiers like a year ago?

Dragonbrand would like to have a word with you being stuck in tier 4 for 60 days.

Links aren't always better, I've been on two different links in a row that have had their host sunk to t4 the past two relinks.

The current four full servers in EU are in tiers 1-3, none in t5.

NA currently has 11 full servers, was 13 not long ago, 8 very high, 5 high, 0 medium.... talk about having little choices at all.

NA will always be screwed up because time zones are not taken into account.

EU will always be screwed up because of language barriers.

Lastly, Anet will always screw up because they had no clue how bad this three server matches run by a point system in and out of the game mode ruled by time zones would become. Finally they had a plan which they can't seem to execute, but will probably end up badly anyways if it even comes out anytime before 2049. At this point, with the games age, we're lucky they even bother with relinks still.

 

People did complain because they gave two links to a already high populated server. At this point in EU there are very few full servers so how far do you have to think to realise ok i don't have to give the highest populated servers the highest populated links. At this points all of us in EU know what servers and links works with eachother and not. We all know what server will abandone their server if they get the "wrong host" or no link and kept closed. It is very predictable, so Arena Net should be able to predict this too unless they don't use the dart method to distrubute links. They should really have even more info then we do and yet we can predict what servers need the more pulated and what servers can surive with the less populated. 

 

And that is why i made the post in the first place, to remind about EU and the bad state. 

 

Oh and yeah you nailed it pretty good there with your fix of NA. NA have hosts and each host have link. There is never a server with no link because again they fixed it back then. So why do EU have to have 3 servers with no link, instead of just removing tier 5 as they did in NA. 

Edited May 27, 2021 by Leaa.2943
Missplaced the word host with link

[XenesisII.1540]

1 hour ago, Leaa.2943 said:

People did complain because they gave two links to a already high populated server. At this point in EU there are very few full servers so how far do you have to think to realise ok i don't have to give the highest populated servers the highest populated links. At this points all of us in EU know what servers and links works with eachother and not. We all know what server will abandone their server if they get the "wrong host" or no link and kept closed. It is very predictable, so Arena Net should be able to predict this too unless they don't use the dart method to distrubute links. They should really have even more info then we do and yet we can predict what servers need the more pulated and what servers can surive with the less populated. 

 

And that is why i made the post in the first place, to remind about EU and the bad state. 

 

Oh and yeah you nailed it pretty good there with your fix of NA. NA have hosts and each host have link. There is never a server with no link because again they fixed it back then. So why do EU have to have 3 servers with no link, instead of just removing tier 5 as they did in NA. 

 

I dunno about EU situation, so I won't comment deeply on that, I just think the language barrier holds back some servers from being linked, especially if a super link will be created, which had happened a few times on NA with BG getting links when they probably shouldn't have.

 

Again I don't know the full EU situation, I don't know if that's happened or not, but that language restriction doesn't apply to NA at all so it's much easier for them to match servers..... as to that it's still pretty terrible in NA a lot of times too, so no, there's no "fix" there, there are full servers on NA that wonder why they're full as well, it all comes down to over night coverage too that people tend to ignore.

 

I don't believe anet plays wvw much, so no I don't believe they would have more information on what's going on on all servers, players do because they talk to each other regularly. Anet looks at numbers and that's it. In the end, no matter what they do, there's always going to be someone unhappy about the situation, to the day they finally just get rid of links and let people play wherever they want, or alliance..... yeah not gonna happen...

 

 

 

 

 

[Leaa.2943]

1 hour ago, XenesisII.1540 said:

 

I dunno about EU situation, so I won't comment deeply on that, I just think the language barrier holds back some servers from being linked, especially if a super link will be created, which had happened a few times on NA with BG getting links when they probably shouldn't have.

 

Again I don't know the full EU situation, I don't know if that's happened or not, but that language restriction doesn't apply to NA at all so it's much easier for them to match servers..... as to that it's still pretty terrible in NA a lot of times too, so no, there's no "fix" there, there are full servers on NA that wonder why they're full as well, it all comes down to over night coverage too that people tend to ignore.

 

I don't believe anet plays wvw much, so no I don't believe they would have more information on what's going on on all servers, players do because they talk to each other regularly. Anet looks at numbers and that's it. In the end, no matter what they do, there's always going to be someone unhappy about the situation, to the day they finally just get rid of links and let people play wherever they want, or alliance..... yeah not gonna happen...

 

 

 

 

 

The restrictions on the national servers was removed and can be paired with international servers. So it is not a issue and i obviously thought they did so to try and fix WvW in EU but it did not happen yet. 

[XenesisII.1540]

18 minutes ago, Leaa.2943 said:

The restrictions on the national servers was removed and can be paired with international servers. So it is not a issue and i obviously thought they did so to try and fix WvW in EU but it did not happen yet. 

 

Free pairing on international servers sure, but the other half are still national and you still have the restriction of pairing nationals of another language do they not? Which still limits who they can pair servers with. Most of the international servers are on the higher end of the population list.

 

Now a question on this, should they just get rid of all the language restrictions when pairing?

Would people be fine with triple links? because that's always been complained about in NA.

[Dawdler.8521]

It wouldnt surprise me the slightest if deso get relinked with wsr because Anet is Anet. Has anyone counted the amount of 2nd/3rd skirmishes over 2 months?

[SFShinigami.1572]

It was something like 4 or 5 weeks before Deso/WSR lost a single skirmish.

 

It was mildly stupid pairing made 1000x worse by some people transferring back into WSR just before linking(and unaware it was coming) and then a huge bandwagon immediately after.

[kamikharzeeh.8016]

despite what people say, it wasn't a that problematic link. deso is a high ppt mass population server with a lot of alts. but needs the link to have people doing the fighting as well, otherwise the whole machine does barely work.  we came unlinked to what, tier 3 ?

 

with those who normally don't enjoy doing a lot more ppt than usual, from what i remember. having any link without a fighting comp, it would be just a huge ppt-cloudmachinery.

 

the links with Arborstone and WSR been pretty decent for it to even work. like, over half of the serverlinks are completely dysfunctional.

 

the population imbalance across every single server / serverlink is completely another issue. way more difficult to sort out than just limiting transfers.

[Grand Marshal.4098]

One thing is for sure, Piken doesn't want to face Deso. Of all the times we fought them, at some points eventually, they were feeding kills 😂

Edited May 28, 2021 by Grand Marshal.4098

[Drascious.5714]

It's been absolutely miserable on Underworld the entire past 2 months aside from the event week where we finally had some numbers to prop us up. No matter how effective we have been, we have eventually been ground down time and time again by superior numbers. It says it all when there are barely queues on reset and even during the event it was quite easy to get onto EBG most of the time. I don't know how anyone can think that EU is ok with unlinked servers, the only thing propping elona reach and barach bay up a little better is their language designations meaning they have quite a focussed population whereas Underworld is just another English server so as soon as the last links came out we lost a massive amount of people instantly. Took us less than a month to go from full to medium pop. 

 

If they are going to keep some servers unlinked with 5 tiers then they need to block server transfers in the first  2 and last 2 weeks of a link, it would stop the bandwagoning and allow servers to stabilise a bit better under their own steam. It would also avoid the annoying situation of as soon as a low pop server gets a good link they get immediately crowded out by the bandwagons who create massive queues for the first reset preventing the server loyal players from benefitting from the link as easily.

 

The links mean nothing if the parameters that decide them are immediately nullified by server transfers before they even go through. 

[Pharaohz.3470]

Well, EU WvW has a huge lack of players. At every relink 1 server is overstacked. Language link restriction is useless since everyone from everywhere transfer to the big overstacked server. We can't blame people for doing that, they just want to play the WvW game mode.

For weeks / months now when you  check T2/T3/T4/T5 at the moment they are all dead all daylong. It's not normal to get less than 40 players spread on 4 maps and half of them are afk waiting for a zerg that will never come until prime time, just for few hours. It's ridiculous. (Same thing on T1, AM / Gandara play at prime time only and not for so long)

This is not what i expect from World Vs World. I don't want to wait 9pm to play the game, it's borring. Some servers play less to avoid T1 due to the lack of players and it's gonna be the same thing after the next relink.

 

 

[Luthan.5236]

The same stuff as always will happen: Servers without link will get a link now. Some other big ones will get to be without a link. And instead of enjoying the fights the people that are just there for rewards will leave the server without link to go to another one with link - expecting to be in a stronger team to have it easier to farm.

 

That is how boring WvW is - nobody wants to even take it serious and fight for "their" server anymore. Only removing links completely or introducing fixed links (without re-linking) might change it I guess.

 

Though - on a side note - Baruch (used to be a lot stronger) seems to have joined us (I am on Underworld since release) recently in T5 ... so even the strong server where all the Spanish gathered without hopping to other servers where it is "easier" cause others have a link ... is not as strong as usually anymore.

 

My guess: The overall population of WvW is dropping even more. No wonder ... considering that it is the weakest game mode. (PvE the strongest and then PvP ... and WvW is last.)

[Zyreva.1078]

31 minutes ago, Turgon.2091 said:

Well, EU WvW has a huge lack of players. At every relink 1 server is overstacked. Language link restriction is useless since everyone from everywhere transfer to the big overstacked server. We can't blame people for doing that, they just want to play the WvW game mode.

Except being on a overstacked server is the worst thing for someone who actually "wants to play the WvW game mode".

Looking for easymode gameplay is the only reason to stack.

 

31 minutes ago, Turgon.2091 said:

For weeks / months now when you  check T2/T3/T4/T5 at the moment they are all dead all daylong. It's not normal to get less than 40 players spread on 4 maps and half of them are afk waiting for a zerg that will never come until prime time, just for few hours. It's ridiculous. (Same thing on T1, AM / Gandara play at prime time only and not for so long)

This is not what i expect from World Vs World. I don't want to wait 9pm to play the game, it's borring. Some servers play less to avoid T1 due to the lack of players and it's gonna be the same thing after the next relink.

 

EU will always be relative "dead" outside of prime time, that's just the nature of having mostly players from very few different time zones. That being said, there is absolutely no need for a huge amount of players to have good action in WvW. The real problem is, that there are too many players that only want to run around in a huge blob and refuse to play when they would actually have to use their brain a little bit more.

[Widmo.3186]

Deso/wsr is just a funny link and matchup. I dont know about ques on this server, but on average populated server you meet like groups of 1-4 players while roaming. When facing deso youre happy when you can fight 1v6, theres just so many players all the time that theres no point moving anywhere further without group. I happily open 1v4 fights because those are (depending on enemy specs) doable, but even those are rare cuz after few seconds another 4 ppl appear. Neither zerglings nor roamers want to be in T1, you would have to pay mexicans or sth to match this population XD

[Edward H Angle.1407]

Just combine NA and EU together for better coverage

[Custodio.6134]

3 minutes ago, Edward H Angle.1407 said:

Just combine NA and EU together for better coverage

won´t happen for 2 reasons: 

1. EU and NA run on totally different data centers. you can´t just combine those into one. 
2. ever tried to play on NA-servers from EU or vice versa? You will get higher latency by nature (there´s nothing you can do about that) and tbh: we already have quite high pings and/or bad server-response-times already within the regions. That would also go up by a lot. 

[RisingDaewn.8703]

Relinks are a joke at this point, cause Anet has no idea how to choose good links, how small the population is in the EU right now and how to control the imbalances in population and prevent players stacking on one or two servers , even during the Linking Period.

 

I'm just looking forward to the chance of the Fairweather population who stacked on T1 server(s); to stack elsewhere for once, because the Relinks have become mostly predictable at this point too.

 

Quote

t's been absolutely miserable on Underworld the entire past 2 months aside from the event week where we finally had some numbers to prop us up.

 

I'm sure everyone was surprised Underworld and Piken got a link after that because of our dominant they were, but what was predictable was that most of the links were the same two months ago, which killed some communities.

 

The last time they shrunk EU to Four Tiers, was also when Deso and UW dominated T1 too, after being linked to BT which was stacked back in 2019 and early 2020, but then they went to Five Tiers after that.

Edited May 28, 2021 by CrimsonNeonite.1048

[Pharaohz.3470]

5 hours ago, UmbraNoctis.1907 said:

Except being on a overstacked server is the worst thing for someone who actually "wants to play the WvW game mode".

Looking for easymode gameplay is the only reason to stack.

 

It's not easy mode it's World Vs World. Stop thinking WvW is only for smallscale fight. It's not working, people wants to zerg.

 

5 hours ago, UmbraNoctis.1907 said:

EU will always be relative "dead" outside of prime time, that's just the nature of having mostly players from very few different time zones. That being said, there is absolutely no need for a huge amount of players to have good action in WvW. The real problem is, that there are too many players that only want to run around in a huge blob and refuse to play when they would actually have to use their brain a little bit more.

 

That was not the case years ago, we were more. And again deadzone out of prime time because lack of player. There is too many servers, it's time to delete some of them or something else. Bwahahaha make the Zerg great again.

[Bristingr.5034]

1 minute ago, Turgon.2091 said:

It's not easy mode it's World Vs World. Stop thinking WvW is only for smallscale fight. It's not working, people wants to zerg.

Not really. On Reset, our server broke into about 6-7 different groups on one map and was VERY effective. We zerged up when needed, but for most of the night, it allowed the havocs to really hurt them on the control of the map side of things.

[Zyreva.1078]

50 minutes ago, Turgon.2091 said:

 

It's not easy mode it's World Vs World. Stop thinking WvW is only for smallscale fight. It's not working, people wants to zerg.

 

Yea right, i'm sure chasing arround 5 players with 30+ and PvDooring empty towers is a great challenge and WvW gameplay at it's peak ...

 

50 minutes ago, Turgon.2091 said:

That was not the case years ago, we were more. And again deadzone out of prime time because lack of player. There is too many servers, it's time to delete some of them or something else. Bwahahaha make the Zerg great again.

The alternative to empty worlds at off-times are hour long queues at prime-time with many players being unable to play at all.

[Junkpile.7439]

Only 3 maps have outnumbered. 🙃

[Pharaohz.3470]

3 hours ago, UmbraNoctis.1907 said:

Yea right, i'm sure chasing arround 5 players with 30+ and PvDooring empty towers is a great challenge and WvW gameplay at it's peak ...

 

If there were more people on every servers it wouldn't be like that.

 

3 hours ago, UmbraNoctis.1907 said:

The alternative to empty worlds at off-times are hour long queues at prime-time with many players being unable to play at all

 

Maybe if everyone didn't go to the same server, the queue would be shorter. Here I am talking about an increase in the global population of the WvW and we need it.

Even tonight at prime time,  reset / relink, there is almost no queue on Dzago/fow and same thing  on Deso.