thief is literally the most broken BS class in the game in conquest

[felix.2386]

daredevil D/P thief is literally the most broken BS class in the game in conquest currently.

and is agreed by all top EU players including thief mains, except maybe one thief bias.

 

kitten, do something anet, this is literally the most BS spec that is meta right now.

whenever i see enemy has thief and i do not, do i really have to either play thief myself or play DH and hope the fact that enemy thief's braindead?

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

It's just Smoke Screen.

 

Smoke Screen is allowing way too much cheesy cheese lately.

[Crab Fear.1624]

This is a very vague post.

 

I won't say they are not broke, or otherwise anymore.

 

Tell us, what exactly is the issue now?

 

 

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

37 minutes ago, felix.2386 said:

daredevil D/P thief is literally the most broken BS class in the game in conquest currently.

and is agreed by all top EU players including thief mains, except maybe one thief bias.

 

kitten, do something anet, this is literally the most BS spec that is meta right now.

whenever i see enemy has thief and i do not, do i really have to either play thief myself or play DH and hope the fact that enemy thief's braindead?

 

*combine_chuckle.mp3*

Edited June 5, 2021 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[Axl.8924]

Here we go again cries for thief nerf with vagueness.

 

You cannot delete smoke screen or all stealth without giving lots of heavy armor to a thief.

 

It also defeats the purpose of playing  a thief.

 

 

Edited June 5, 2021 by Axl.8924

[Touchme.1097]

I am sorry, you can't reasonable ask the nerf on something that is part of a profession's design philosophy like stealth. You can learn how to counterplay thieves. Expecting 1v1 as an example of balancing stuff is not appropriate because in PvP you are always playing with allies in your team.

[Jumpel.3972]

Maybe Thief is OP but you can't stack it like Scourge in a team. That say it all for me

[Widmo.3186]

Im really sad that I cannot post images on forum anymore, my usual Cato the elder quote is waiting...

Lets go back to s/d meta so ppl instead of crying about stealth can start crying about teleports

[Kaizen.3804]

 

*laughs in scourge*

Edited June 5, 2021 by Keitaro Dragonheart.9047

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

It really is just Smoke Screen.

 

The duration at 7s is too long and the radius is too big. Thieves used to have a moment of vulnerability when they'd bottom out init, but with Smoke Screen it creates a very long reset point that during that reset, the Thief is nigh invulnerable and you can't stop it from happening.

 

According to historical Thief balance in GW2, the Thief's reset should be being forced to disengage, not to be able to stand in someone's face while spamming blinds and taking a node while resetting.

[Zizou.2358]

47 minutes ago, Widmo.3186 said:

Im really sad that I cannot post images on forum anymore, my usual Cato the elder quote is waiting...

That one about Carthage but you replace Carthage with Anet? Kekw

[Widmo.3186]

1 minute ago, Rukasu.3097 said:

That one about Carthage but you replace Carthage with Anet? Kekw

Even better 
https://imgur.com/a/ADkEfh9

[Khalisto.5780]

Unfun to play against 10/10 most of it due to stealth and blindness spam

 

I dont lile the way balance goes but i think +1 iniciative cost for heartseeker would do it and +10 secs smoke screen cd

[Quadox.7834]

no it isnt

[Touchme.1097]

1 hour ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

It really is just Smoke Screen.

 

The duration at 7s is too long and the radius is too big. Thieves used to have a moment of vulnerability when they'd bottom out init, but with Smoke Screen it creates a very long reset point that during that reset, the Thief is nigh invulnerable and you can't stop it from happening.

 

According to historical Thief balance in GW2, the Thief's reset should be being forced to disengage, not to be able to stand in someone's face while spamming blinds and taking a node while resetting.

7 seconds of stealth is too long on thief? Mesmer has a stealth with a longer base duration than that and it's not a thief, if you are having a hard time in PvP get a team mate to support you. PvP is not a 1vs1 game mode.

Edited June 5, 2021 by Touchme.1097

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

16 minutes ago, Touchme.1097 said:

7 seconds of stealth is too long on thief? Mesmer has a stealth with a longer base duration than that and it's not a thief, if you are having a hard time in PvP get a team mate to support you. PvP is not a 1vs1 game mode.

 

Did I say anything about stealth? I said Smoke Screen.

 

Read what the skill does Smoke Screen - Guild Wars 2 Wiki (GW2W)

 

There is too much nigh invulnerable mechanical combo play centered around this one skill.

Edited June 5, 2021 by Trevor Boyer.6524

[Jumpel.3972]

2 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

It really is just Smoke Screen.

From my exp on ranked, I don't see that much D/P thief with smoke screen. Furthermore, good thief I see never use it but i'm at Gold3/Plat1 not Plat3/Legend

[Myror.7521]

The real problem with thief is daredevil and its 3 dodge/energy Bar. It get thief too mutch of mobility. Nerf that and give thief a bit more damage instead and we are absolute fine.

[Touchme.1097]

1 hour ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

 

Did I say anything about stealth? I said Smoke Screen.

 

Read what the skill does Smoke Screen - Guild Wars 2 Wiki (GW2W)

 

There is too much nigh invulnerable mechanical combo play centered around this one skill.

Thank you, I couldn't find those information on the wiki so I thought the problem the OP had with thief was stealth.

The ability you mentioned has a 45 seconds CD from last patch in PvP, it pulses for 7 seconds every 1 seconds and the thief is still targetable, I don't see where the problem is, simply keep the thief away from you for the whole duration to waste its CD, nothing broken here. The 3 dodges are part of the DD design philosophy, can't change that. Thief is about evades and blindness is a necessary tool to justify the lowest base hp in the game mixed with medium armor.

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

Just now, Touchme.1097 said:

Thank you, I couldn't find those information on the wiki so I thought the problem the OP had with thief was stealth.

The ability you mentioned has a 45 seconds CD from last patch in PvP, it pulses for 7 seconds every 1 seconds and the thief is still targetable, I don't see where the problem is, simply keep the thief away from you for the whole duration to waste its CD, nothing broken here. The 3 dodges are part of the DD design philosophy, can't change that. Thief is about evades and blindness is a necessary tool to justify the lowest base hp in the game mixed with medium armor.

The problem with smoke screen is it enables an awful degenerate blind spamming side node build when paired with certain traits in shadow arts. Its one of the most un-interactive builds that has ever been in the game.

 

Its not the sole issue of that build but its a big part of it.

Edited June 5, 2021 by Paradoxoglanis.1904

[felix.2386]

you guys can laugh in scourge in your gold games, but until you actually get good and play in any game higher then plat 2, you have no idea. you can't find any thief in your gold games, because any thief with a hand that can press buttons are in higher rating.

there were 4 thief in top 10 last conquest season in NA, never forget.

Edited June 5, 2021 by felix.2386

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

1 hour ago, Touchme.1097 said:

Thank you, I couldn't find those information on the wiki so I thought the problem the OP had with thief was stealth.

The ability you mentioned has a 45 seconds CD from last patch in PvP, it pulses for 7 seconds every 1 seconds and the thief is still targetable, I don't see where the problem is, simply keep the thief away from you for the whole duration to waste its CD, nothing broken here. The 3 dodges are part of the DD design philosophy, can't change that. Thief is about evades and blindness is a necessary tool to justify the lowest base hp in the game mixed with medium armor.

 

You are seriously not understanding what veterans are capable of doing with Smoke Screen.

 

If you are on NA and want to see quite exactly what is wrong with Smoke Screen, go duel @Valhor.9056 or you can organize a time vs. me on my condi version of Valhor's build. I'm not even trying to make example of you here, I'm being 100% serious. Unless you are a p2'ish player, you won't even be able to land strikes against these build structures because of how much sheer blind there is. No exaggeration.

Edited June 5, 2021 by Trevor Boyer.6524

[felix.2386]

12 minutes ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

 

You are seriously not understanding what veterans are capable of doing with Smoke Screen.

 

If you are on NA and want to see quite exactly what is wrong with Smoke Screen, go duel @Valhor.9056 or you can organize a time vs. me on my condi version of Valhor's build. I'm not even trying to make example of you here, I'm being 100% serious. Unless you are a p2'ish player, you won't even be able to land strikes against these build structures because of how much sheer blind there is. No exaggeration.

his build is meme anyway, i'm talking about the meta build.

his build is counter able, even tho it's cheesy strong 1v1, you can still play around it, it's only a side noder after all and doesnt keep point 

side noder bruiser builds are always the easiest to play around with and the less carry capable role in conquest compared to roamer.

 

d/p on the other hand it's pure oppressive.

 

that's why d/p is meta and not valhor's 1v1 build. it's not thief is weak in 1v1, just the fact that d/p is literally god in organized tournament and carrying noobs.

Edited June 5, 2021 by felix.2386

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

Just now, felix.2386 said:

his build is meme anyway, i'm talking about the meta build.

his build is counter able, even tho it's cheesy strong 1v1, you can still play around it, it's only a side noder after all and doesnt keep point 

side noder bruiser builds are always the easiest to play around with and the less carry capable role in conquest compared to roamer.

 

d/p on the other hand it's pure oppressive.

 

that's why d/p is meta and not valhor's 1v1 build. it's not thief is weak in 1v1, just the fact that d/p is literally god in organized tournament and carrying noobs.

A lot of teams dont even run thief in the MaT anymore, rev has been filling its role for a while now. It kind of sounds like you just dont like getting +1ed by daredevil and dont know how to play around d/p.

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

10 minutes ago, felix.2386 said:

his build is meme anyway, i'm talking about the meta build.

his build is counter able, even tho it's cheesy strong 1v1, you can still play around it, it's only a side noder after all and doesnt keep point 

side noder bruiser builds are always the easiest to play around with and the less carry capable role in conquest compared to roamer.

 

d/p on the other hand it's pure oppressive.

 

that's why d/p is meta and not valhor's 1v1 build. it's not thief is weak in 1v1, just the fact that d/p is literally god in organized tournament and carrying noobs.

 

Well primarily it's Smoke Screen, due to what I already explained here:

 

4 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

The duration at 7s is too long and the radius is too big. Thieves used to have a moment of vulnerability when they'd bottom out init, but with Smoke Screen it creates a very long reset point that during that reset, the Thief is nigh invulnerable and you can't stop it from happening.

 

According to historical Thief balance in GW2, the Thief's reset should be being forced to disengage, not to be able to stand in someone's face while spamming blinds and taking a node while resetting.

 

But then upon this, adding bleed damage to Short Bow #1 is turning out to be a bad idea. Lately good thieves, I'm talking the best thieves,  spam Short Bow 1 which is actually dealing meaningful damage now, and they get to stay at range where they are safe as well, while they maintain/refresh all init in the process. <- These methods to keep on pressure while freely rebuilding init seems to be the source of why they are so strong right now. This new pressure added to SB#1 spam from bleeds is a bit too much ability to maintain DPS pressure while refreshing init completely, especially in conjunction with how Smoke Screen is also providing this safe method to refresh init without needing to disengage.

 

The problem is that due to these 2 new aspects within Thief builds, thieves don't actually need to dart in and out like a fly anymore to avoid vulnerable moments. Now they can just pressure into combats with staying presence like a Guard or something, and that's pushing the parameters of what Thieves are able to do, a bit over the top.