June 8th patch for revs:

[Axl.8924]

Revenant

Legendary Demon Stance

• Embrace the Darkness: Reduced the duration of applied torment from 5.5 seconds to 5 seconds in PvE only.

Devastation

• Destructive Impulses: Bonus damage for having an off-hand weapon equipped has been reduced from 5% to 2.5% in PvE only.

[LucianTheAngelic.7054]

MORE misguided power rev nerfs aimed at nerfing condi rev.  There was NO NEED for "% All Damage" in Devastation in the first place and now they're continually nerfing Devastation because of it....

Very poor and not well thought out balance decisions

Edited June 8, 2021 by LucianTheAngelic.7054

[ArthurDent.9538]

kittening joke, kitten anet balance team you all suck donkey sick.

[Thornwolf.9721]

Like I said its renegade or bust, they are at this point are dumpstering shiro. Like the traitline is slowly becoming a joke and Kalla gives more as well much of the same as it does; Core and Herald got hit by this meanwhile Renegade is still fine. "Shortbow go pew, pew, pew". 

At this stage why not rename the revenant to renegade, get rid of the rest of the class and just make renegade the class? Because that is what it feels your intention is.

Edited June 8, 2021 by Thornwolf.9721

[Shao.7236]

Seeing "Legendary Demon Stance" and it was a mistake to have my hopes up for cleaning up the mess all of these changes have done. Clearly not. Dead stance with nothing to make sense out of.

[otto.5684]

I want to remind Anet that Herald exists... it is not good in pve yet keep getting kittening nerfed cuz Anet is failing to balance renegade. 

[Vasdamas Anklast.1607]

I love how some revenant section residents went from constructive posts to "kitten you anet" over couple of years.
This place is an echo chamber.


UPD: here is slightly too optmistic assumption. These nerfs are aimed at new spec rather than current meta.
And I wish I could say Anet has clearer vision than us kek

Edited June 9, 2021 by Vasdamas Anklast.1607

[LucianTheAngelic.7054]

1 hour ago, Vasdamas Anklast.1607 said:

UPD: here is slightly too optmistic assumption. These nerfs are aimed at new spec rather than current meta.
And I wish I could say Anet has clearer vision than us kek

These nerfs are absolutely aimed at Devastation Condi Ren, but that is possible that they're aimed at the new spec.  However, if that's the case then they should just tone down the new spec a bit instead of nerfing Core, Herald, and Ren as well.  It's just bad decisions regardless

Edited June 9, 2021 by LucianTheAngelic.7054

[Thornwolf.9721]

36 minutes ago, Vasdamas Anklast.1607 said:

I love how some revenant section residents went from constructive posts to "kitten you anet" over couple of years.
This place is an echo chamber.


UPD: here is slightly too optmistic assumption. These nerfs are aimed at new spec rather than current meta.
And I wish I could say Anet has clearer vision than us kek

My optimism in anything but them force feeding us some weeaboo legend (Togo or Nika) is low. If it ain't norn and it ain't unique then its hardly worth this; And we have no clue when the expansion is coming out. So the nerfs are unwarranted and is effecting EVERYTHING but the target. So take your optimism elsewhere, I won't stand to have this "Oh well its for the betterment of you" kind of mantra. No. You don't remove or nerf something you tone it down, this knee jerk reaction crud is how you get people to quit your game.

[Katary.7096]

I am guessing that their next attempt, to get condition Renegade to pick Invocation over Devastation, is a nerf to Assassin's Presence?

[Aeolus.3615]

12 hours ago, otto.5684 said:

I want to remind Anet that Herald exists... it is not good in pve yet keep getting kittening nerfed cuz Anet is failing to balance renegade. 

 

Anet stated some time ago that Herald would be support'ish wich imo is where they need to kinda QoL it a bit arround :)

IMO for sure we m8 be getting some pure  DPS elite spec that can be paired well with shiro!

Its th eonly explenation why Anet has not touched much of it.

Edited June 9, 2021 by Aeolus.3615

[otto.5684]

4 minutes ago, Aeolus.3615 said:

 

Anet stated some time ago that Herald would be support'ish wich imo is where they need to kinda QoL it a bit arround 🙂

IMO for sure we m8 be getting some pure  DPS elite spec that can be paired well with shiro!

Its th eonly explenation why Anet has not touched much of it.

What type of support is it? It does not provide enough might, alacrity or quickness. No stability. The healing allies is primarily not from it. 

 

It skills design and talent is primarily for power dps. If it supposed to work as support what it needs is not QoL improvements, not even redesign, but basically what the hell is it support to be.

[Aeolus.3615]

3 hours ago, otto.5684 said:

What type of support is it? It does not provide enough might, alacrity or quickness. No stability. The healing allies is primarily not from it. 

 

It skills design and talent is primarily for power dps. If it supposed to work as support what it needs is not QoL improvements, not even redesign, but basically what the hell is it support to be.

 

Yup prety much that still Anet stated it as a support (GlintCare lol), imo even on that Anet need to QoL it, the only heal that herald has is the passive 1.2k regen for 10 players on pve and  have it for five players outside pve, and regen is a meh boon.

I could say that kinda reminds the paragon support for gw1 gvg make alies move faster while recovering health with the ticks from regen but compared with what other offer.... Herald  feels incompelte outside some gimicks runing wich resolves arrount stacking might and fury to swap for a shiro burst or 1 skill elemental blast for condi users... 

 

random tougths:

-shield 5 need to have some sorta team def even if it keeps rooting the caster.

-make herald F2 make facets affect 10 players for +1pip for each active facet that could balance the abuse of facets up for 10)

-Shield 4 could get a slightly CD reduction maybe. 12 sec?

Edited June 9, 2021 by Aeolus.3615

[Thornwolf.9721]

29 minutes ago, Aeolus.3615 said:

 

Yup prety much that still Anet stated it as a support (GlintCare lol), imo even on that Anet need to QoL it, the only heal that herald has is the passive 1.2k regen for 10 players on pve and  have it for five players outside pve, and regen is a meh boon.

I could say that kinda reminds the paragon support for gw1 gvg make alies move faster while recovering health with the ticks from regen but compared with what other offer.... Herald  feels incompelte outside some gimicks runing wich resolves arrount stacking might and fury to swap for a shiro burst or 1 skill elemental blast for condi users... 

 

random tougths:

-shield 5 need to have some sorta team def even if it keeps rooting the caster.

-make herald F2 make facets affect 10 players for +1pip for each active facet that could balance the abuse of facets up for 10)

-Shield 4 could get a slightly CD reduction maybe. 12 sec?

Thats not a bad Idea, make it work like a "Paragon". I'd be pretty ok with that; Make its facets more focused around team support/amping others and make it work with ventari. Glint was more of a "support" type of character in the fluff anyhow, and she was only ever directly involved when required.

Which makes me hopeful that maybe the next spec will make use of some of themes from the dervish, not the dervish itself but the idea of shifting into a new form to gain power. Maybe removing legend swapping in favor of a mechanic that causes energy to change you as it builds up, and once it hits one hundred you become some different aspect of the legend? (Shiro, becomes shiro-kin or maybe gets an outline of his envoy self and the skills change to represent his envoy powers a bit?)

I just really want a nornbear legend, having svanir would be pretty sweet especially if you could legit "Become the nornbear"

[Lighter.5631]

all i see is they are making the next elite spec power guaranteed now.

[Aeolus.3615]

1 hour ago, Thornwolf.9721 said:

Thats not a bad Idea, make it work like a "Paragon". I'd be pretty ok with that; Make its facets more focused around team support/amping others and make it work with ventari. Glint was more of a "support" type of character in the fluff anyhow, and she was only ever directly involved when required.

Which makes me hopeful that maybe the next spec will make use of some of themes from the dervish, not the dervish itself but the idea of shifting into a new form to gain power. Maybe removing legend swapping in favor of a mechanic that causes energy to change you as it builds up, and once it hits one hundred you become some different aspect of the legend? (Shiro, becomes shiro-kin or maybe gets an outline of his envoy self and the skills change to represent his envoy powers a bit?)

I just really want a nornbear legend, having svanir would be pretty sweet especially if you could legit "Become the nornbear"

 

 

For sure will be something towards cantha im betting on GS lengend toon  or daggers maybe vizu/nika or some other assassin boss from cantha.

 

1 minute ago, Lighter.5631 said:

all i see is they are making the next elite spec power guaranteed now.

 

 

Yep pretty much always had that feeling since atm what is lackin is a pure dps spec.

 

Edited June 9, 2021 by Aeolus.3615

[Lighter.5631]

and glint was never supposed to be dps any way, it is support

and it is top pug spec alone with heal scourge, both carry pug groups hard, but not speed record meta,

but i believe herald is part of 3 raid speed record now? correct me if im wrong.

stabilize boon for pug groups.

it's gonna be up in hardstuck website in pug category i believe, so people will finally wake up.

instead of looking at meta speed record comp which they can not play properly.

 

Edited June 9, 2021 by Lighter.5631

[Thornwolf.9721]

1 hour ago, Aeolus.3615 said:

 

 

For sure will be something towards cantha im betting on GS lengend toon  or daggers maybe vizu/nika or some other assassin boss from cantha.

 

 

Yep pretty much always had that feeling since atm what is lackin is a pure dps spec.

 

100% the legend wont be of cantha, it might reference the overall narrative in some way but will not be linked to the region. Neither of our E-specs prior were; Kalla represented fighting tyranny which has been a theme all the way through Icebrood saga. (Balthazar, Kralk, Joko, Bangar, Jormag) All of which were about subjugation and control which Kalla and renegades theme was designed to give the vibe of fighting against that through guerilla warfare.


Glint represented the coming of aurene, and the story to follow. Hence why it was called "Herald" It was basically there as a hint of the coming over-arching narrative and even hinting at kralk in many ways. But she had nothing to do with the jungle outside of aurene and tarrir but even then it wasn't like she was native to maguuma.  Kalla had literally NOTHING to do with elona, you could argue it was hinting at both the charr civil war and the olmakhaan but thats debatable.  A-net told us why they chose kalla and it was linked to the narrative.

Assuming that they continue this trend, which I believe they will. We are in store for either a Norn or Asuran legend. Because both could be used to great extents for the plot and have at least one major hero and one major villain to choose from.
 

1. The asuran legend would either be about going against tradition, for the betterment of everyone. OR it could be about the risks needed for expansion in a changing world, despite ones pre-conceived notions of reality. In all likely hood it would be Snaff or Zinn(I think his name is) who created the inquest.
2. The norn could either be about how power corrupts the best (Svanir, and his connection to corruption via a thirst for power directly linking to the emperor and even shiro's stories.) Or Asgeir which would be about fighting to preserve ones people, heirtage and legacy from a larger than life threat despite the uncertainty. Also could be based around the spirits of the wild, and how their tether to tyria is bound just like ours is bound to the fate of the dragons. 
   
   
   Plus we ALREADY have shiro, who is a canthan legend. I REALLY doubt they'd do another because thats his theme and he is the well one of the most legendary of their known characters. Nika would overlap too much, Togo would bring too much that fits with what renegade became. Vizu/Saint Viktor would have little to do with the narrative outside of the fact they are luxon and kurzick but that doesn't make them prime targets. Kanaxai could work but they explicitly stated in guild wars 1 that he was not connected to the mist, and was a demon born of tyria. Urgoz might work but the issues is we have two legends that feature similar-ish themes. Mallyx would make another demon stance unlikely, and urgoz might in theme mesh well in appearance with ventari but that also might step on druids toes a tad. I personally think we are likely to see duel daggers, and some form of norn legend. They fit the region and tone, even though not native to that place and they could be meshed to fit the future narrative very well. Asgeir and Svanir BOTH were and end of their respective cycles; As was Jora to some extent. Zinn was the beginning of the inquest, and since it says a "cycle reborn" I could see him being utilized too. Id be disappointed if they went with some generic canthan, just to force an oriental theme but they couldn't of been bothered to give us varesh or turai in elona? Turai being especially grievous because he was SUCH a big deal in elona.
   
   
   Hell we could of gotten a druid spirit In hot if they went with the region of the world? But we got Glint. Which Glint herself would of fit WAAAAY better in PoF seeing as its her region AND it all had to do with her legacy. So I feel like while its wishful thinking, we are going to get a wild card. Hell if the leaks are correct we will be getting this...
    
   Spoiler

   Revenant:
   This spec was very weird. It was a Naga legend ( I guess Luxon inspired), but I never heard of it ( and was unable to find anything about on the wiki afterwards either). The legend showed up as ‘Legendary Raider’. It used dual daggers, but I am not sure ( Nobody really wanted to try it out and by the time I got to it we only had 10 minutes left, so it was mostly some quick running around). It was however a power dps based legend that got access to so much stealth that I was surprised this wasn’t a thief spec. Numbers seemed good, but the gameplay felt a bit off still ( plenty of evading and float if I remember it right).

    

[Janitsu.6284]

13 hours ago, otto.5684 said:

What type of support is it? It does not provide enough might, alacrity or quickness. No stability. The healing allies is primarily not from it. 

 

It skills design and talent is primarily for power dps. If it supposed to work as support what it needs is not QoL improvements, not even redesign, but basically what the hell is it support to be.

Herald gives:

-incoming boon duration

-life steal

-fury

-protection

-might

-swiftness

-regen

The spec has seen usage in records and everything.

[Vasdamas Anklast.1607]

"So take your optimism elsewhere" I'm as a matter of fact, I've seen enough evidence over the years to know for sure it's not the case. Hence I said "I wish".

In the end it's all a waste of time.
 

[Thornwolf.9721]

1 hour ago, Janitsu.6284 said:

Herald gives:

-incoming boon duration

-life steal

-fury

-protection

-might

-swiftness

-regen

The spec has seen usage in records and everything.

And yet it still pales in comparison to what the rest of the cast, and renegade do. Doesn't feel very "Elite" to me. 

[Janitsu.6284]

24 minutes ago, Thornwolf.9721 said:

And yet it still pales in comparison to what the rest of the cast, and renegade do. Doesn't feel very "Elite" to me. 

Well, not everything needs to be viable and BiS everywhere. Spb, DD, DE, Scrapper, tempest and reaper suffer from similar problems.

 

And it doesn't pale in comparison. It's been used in records solely for the reason that it can give these boons and multiple unique buffs. 

[Thornwolf.9721]

1 hour ago, Janitsu.6284 said:

Well, not everything needs to be viable and BiS everywhere. Spb, DD, DE, Scrapper, tempest and reaper suffer from similar problems.

 

And it doesn't pale in comparison. It's been used in records solely for the reason that it can give these boons and multiple unique buffs. 

Whatever you say.

[LucianTheAngelic.7054]

10 hours ago, Janitsu.6284 said:

Well, not everything needs to be viable and BiS everywhere. Spb, DD, DE, Scrapper, tempest and reaper suffer from similar problems.

 

And it doesn't pale in comparison. It's been used in records solely for the reason that it can give these boons and multiple unique buffs. 

It's been used only in the Samarog record.  If it's been used in others (which it hasn't) please provide links and evidence.  A class being meta on one fight between both Fractals and Raids isn't a good metric of how well a class is doing. 

Also I'm with you on Spellbreaker, Reaper, and somewhat Scrapper (no one is saying every class besides Herald is doing great, a few others have issues that should be addressed too), but DD, DE, and Tempest all have extremely viable off-meta builds that are far better than Herald in terms of DPS (or both dps and support in the case of Tempest).  DD and DE are/were both meta on multiple bosses for a time as well and continue to provide high level damage output, much moreso than Herald's pathetic 30k.  Those three are particularly bad examples when comparing to Herald. 

[ArthurDent.9538]

9 hours ago, Janitsu.6284 said:

Well, not everything needs to be viable and BiS everywhere. Spb, DD, DE, Scrapper, tempest and reaper suffer from similar problems.

 

And it doesn't pale in comparison. It's been used in records solely for the reason that it can give these boons and multiple unique buffs. 

It is important to know why it was used in those records which were for sloth, samarog, and deimos. For sloth + samarog, it was mainly used for staff 5 cc since those bosses both have multiple large defiance bars and large hitboxes that need to be broken both quickly and frequently so a pretty niche use. Deimos use was even more niche where it was to give alacrity to an NPC instead of the rest of the squad so that the NPC can use his super overpowered skill an extra time. In every one of these cases a second renegade would be better except that herald can replace the boons that druid would normally provide as they drop druid and run basically no heal comp which is pretty hard to do especially now that soulcleave is dead. So yeah it's meta in a few places but if you don't need absurd amount of cc or the ability to buff an NPC with alacrity it's just a very poor man's druid.