WvW Grenade Scrapper Build - Easy DPS, Great Stab, Nice Barrier... Toxic for WvW?

[Baine.9650]

I've been trying out the WvW Grenade Scrapper and honestly, it's been overtuned. 

A great example of what roaming is mostly like on Grenade Scrapper: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JwqEW8wPkek

I can get barriers covering over 40% of my health during my burst, and 3 - 5 stab when I'm spamming grenade kit.

My grenade kit is hitting for 11k-13k on full crits with full dps runes but I don't even feel squishy at all. Infact, I've been in situations where against clearly unoptimized toons, I've 1v4 or 1v5 and killed every single opponent with grenade kit spam.

When  I approach zerg tails, it's mostly just up buff, kit, grenades. I don't really have to bother with my sword rotation. 

It's fun to play but I can't imagine how horrible is it to play against it. There's minimal counterplay and as long as the opponent isn't an equally 1-shotty/meta build, they don't really stand a chance. I've also been seeing most roamers either use Grenade Scrapper, Condi Rev, Oneshot theif, Confusion Mes and I'm just worried about the toxicity of the gamemode when every roamer is just basically trying to one-shot each other (and if you're not meta, tough luck matey).

Gear standardization is preventing most of this from happening in PvP and I'm wondering if it's time to do the same for WvW. We have full ascended/legendary veterans running around against full exotic toons thinking it's good enough when in reality they're missing out on probably 25~33% of their dps and worse, ~15% of their total stats after including utilities.

Worried about the uneven playing field and how toxic it's making T1/T2 WvW. Is it time for gear/stats standardization across all PvP modes? It seems fair to do so. There's a plus point also where it makes WvW much more competitive overall and gives newcomers at least a fighting chance.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

Is this the meme 1-shot build or some other build? The meme build dies when a gust of wind hits it even with all the barrier.

[Baine.9650]

This is just the standard WvW marauder Grenade scrapper build abusing explosive entry amongst other skills you can find on metabattle. It's REALLY effective

[anduriell.6280]

It is a little bit obnoxious, it can one shot anybody while being tanky. It needs to setup the OH thou so it's not that bad. Also colides with healing scrapper so most players preffer the squad version so it's not like there are many. 

 

So personally i would keep an eye on them but i would not touch them yet. 

[Dawdler.8521]

10 minutes ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Is this the meme 1-shot build or some other build? The meme build dies when a gust of wind hits it even with all the barrier.

Its not that weak. Its tankier than any "normal" non-glass due to the barriers and build design.

 

That said, despite its strength if someone is getting killed 1v4+ they are getting outplayed. 2v1 is always winnable assuming equal builds and/or skill.

Edited June 10, 2021 by Dawdler.8521

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

1 hour ago, Dawdler.8521 said:

Its not that weak. Its tankier than any "normal" non-glass due to the barriers and build design.

 

That said, despite its strength if someone is getting killed 1v4+ they are getting outplayed. 2v1 is always winnable assuming equal builds and/or skill.

Nah, the meme build I'm talking about is full zerker + scholar. Guaranteed to down someone out of stealth, but dies a gentle breeze.

 

 

1 hour ago, Baine.9650 said:

This is just the standard WvW marauder Grenade scrapper build abusing explosive entry amongst other skills you can find on metabattle. It's REALLY effective

MKay, so not full on meme then. I've seen instagib scrappers use Static Discharge, Aim-Assisted Rocket, Rocket, and Grenade Barrage to do the gank before. Lot of different ways to do it really, but Grenade Barrage is always the key.

[Dawdler.8521]

2 hours ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Nah, the meme build I'm talking about is full zerker + scholar. Guaranteed to down someone out of stealth, but dies a gentle breeze.

Thats like saying a permastealth thief dies to a gentle breeze.

 

While true in many ways, the reality is that there actually exist good players that doesnt and is able to use it to its full potential. This is amazing new info I know but thats how it is.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

5 minutes ago, Dawdler.8521 said:

Thats like saying a permastealth thief dies to a gentle breeze.

 

While true in many ways, the reality is that there actually exist good players that doesnt and is able to use it to its full potential. This is amazing new info I know but thats how it is.

Very true. But the scrapper's I've seen running these builds weren't good players.

[Infusion.7149]

That has nothing to do with scrapper and everything to do with grenade kit.

There is RNG on grenade barrage and also it is projectile on all of the kit. That's why you only see it when roaming really , bomb kit and flamethrower are usually used in group gameplay.

Some of the players taking huge amounts of damage might be wearing greens/blues so it is best to verify any speculation in Armistice Bastion or in the new improved EotM arena.

Edited June 10, 2021 by Infusion.7149

[aiinseinn.5914]

sry for my stupidness, i cant find ur build on metabattle

Edited June 10, 2021 by aiinseinn.5914

[Gotejjeken.1267]

Yeah, of course the forums doesn't want this touched.  Engi has been a 'bad player with easy win buttons' for a long, long time now.  

[Zizou.2358]

I was oneshot few times by Overheat, but that's some new kitten. 

[Infusion.7149]

12 minutes ago, Rukasu.3097 said:

I was oneshot few times by Overheat, but that's some new kitten. 

You mean Photon Blasting Module (PBM)? That's a true gimmick build.

[choovanski.5462]

5 hours ago, Baine.9650 said:

I've been trying out the WvW Grenade Scrapper and honestly, it's been overtuned. 

When  I approach zerg tails, it's mostly just up buff, kit, grenades. I don't really have to bother with my sword rotation. 

 

scrapper? sword rotation?

 

alright homes

 

sure you weren't killed by this build?

[MrForz.1953]

Did you really have to pretend to wreck people with the very class you're complaining about, OP?

Edited June 10, 2021 by MrForz.1953

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

1 hour ago, Infusion.7149 said:

That has nothing to do with scrapper and everything to do with grenade kit.

There is RNG on grenade barrage and also it is projectile on all of the kit. That's why you only see it when roaming really , bomb kit and flamethrower are usually used in group gameplay.

Some of the players taking huge amounts of damage might be wearing greens/blues so it is best to verify any speculation in Armistice Bastion or in the new improved EotM arena.

No. You can intagib people in full ascended Marauder gear with the right scrapper build put of stealth. Even after the Feb2020 patch.

[XenesisII.1540]

Gais.. all "overperforming" "overpowered" "broken" "one shot" "one combo" builds are just "meme" "gimmick" builds that "no one" uses, please stop asking for nerfs, we need these builds for the baddies to be competitive.

[Zizou.2358]

1 hour ago, Infusion.7149 said:

You mean Photon Blasting Module (PBM)? That's a true gimmick build.

I never played Engi so idk. Basically we had a smallscale battle, I was full marauder scourge. When I checked combat log, that holo hit me first by some skills for like 1-2k and then BOOM 18k Overheat. 

[Infusion.7149]

4 minutes ago, Rukasu.3097 said:

I never played Engi so idk. Basically we had a smallscale battle, I was full marauder scourge. When I checked combat log, that holo hit me first by some skills for like 1-2k and then BOOM 18k Overheat. 

It's PBM then. 5.0 coefficient unsplit
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Photonic_Blasting_Module

---

Also the original poster's assessment is 100% incorrect. This discussion would not be happening if grenades were using the PvP split instead of PvE coefficients.

Edited June 10, 2021 by Infusion.7149

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

I'll say that I don't want the PvP gear system in WvW. I like the gear freedom we have here.

 

If anything Anet needs to finish their half-baked Feb2020 nerfs instead of leaving things like nades and pbm over tuned.

 

Then give CCs back their damage (reduced by 33% like everything else).

[Sleepwalker.1398]

3 hours ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

Yeah, of course the forums doesn't want this touched.  Engi has been a 'bad player with easy win buttons' for a long, long time now.  

But they keep getting nice updates..like

free 2-3k damage just for touching someone with explosive entrance

barrier

superspeed

quickness

Edited June 10, 2021 by Sleepwalker.1398
PS. the 1 shot build will be popular during no downstate

[Shroud.2307]

Conditions kill it. It also often has no stunbreaks, although high Stability uptime.

It's a difficult fight for most Power builds because it has such high Barrier application, Stability, and access to Superspeed which make it difficult to kite, but it has terrible Condition cleanse and is heavily reliant on the projectiles of Grenades. Things like Dragonhunter, Fresh Air Weaver, or even a variant of Revenant with Planar Protection (create a bubble that blocks projectiles when using a healing skill) can be an equally difficult fight for the Scrapper.

It isn't a build without counters or one that requires a build specifically designed to counter it. It's just low effort and oppressive against a lot of common roaming builds.

Also, the discussion of converting WvW stats to the PvP system has been had many, many times. Myself and many others would straight up quit the game if this happened.
For myself, build crafting is one of my favorite things to do. If I were limited to the handful of Amulets that PvP has, I'd be done. WvW instantly becomes boring to me because I can't play things I've hand crafted, and that's a huge part of what makes me enjoy it.

[Baine.9650]

11 hours ago, Shroud.2307 said:

Conditions kill it. It also often has no stunbreaks, although high Stability uptime.

It's a difficult fight for most Power builds because it has such high Barrier application, Stability, and access to Superspeed which make it difficult to kite, but it has terrible Condition cleanse and is heavily reliant on the projectiles of Grenades. Things like Dragonhunter, Fresh Air Weaver, or even a variant of Revenant with Planar Protection (create a bubble that blocks projectiles when using a healing skill) can be an equally difficult fight for the Scrapper.

It isn't a build without counters or one that requires a build specifically designed to counter it. It's just low effort and oppressive against a lot of common roaming builds.

Also, the discussion of converting WvW stats to the PvP system has been had many, many times. Myself and many others would straight up quit the game if this happened.
For myself, build crafting is one of my favorite things to do. If I were limited to the handful of Amulets that PvP has, I'd be done. WvW instantly becomes boring to me because I can't play things I've hand crafted, and that's a huge part of what makes me enjoy it.

I think a system that upscales people to a certain stat amount would work in this case. To be honest the amulet system in pvp is very limiting - I was imagining a full inventory system with swappable runes/amulets, with weapon damage all made consistent if we're talking wishlist.

The lowest effort way to make this would be to simply fix weapon damage to lvl 80/ascended no matter what weapon you're wielding, and then fix stats to scale up to as if you're wearing an ascended stat piece in your slot, as long as the slot item is a lvl 80 exotic. 

[Spartacus.3192]

I used to run grenade scrapper in wvw roaming but after the May patch to kinetic stabilizers i have way less access to stability that i used it. TBH its not as good as it was pre patch. Its still good just not crazy good. Personally i've switched to Renegade for a bit and been enjoying that much more. 

[Zizou.2358]

The AMX guys don't run troll Engi builds without purpose. So forgiving, nearly uncatchable with stealth and rocket boots. They can be jumped by whole zerg and still manage to survive.