The Rapidfire One Wolf Pack Easymode Nonsense Is So Broken

[Jski.6180]

The unblock-able part the only real op effect. They need to make it an set number of shots not a duration OR just make it a "non reflecable" but still very much stoppable (where you cant shot them back at the ranger but the shot is still stopped).

[Faolain.2374]

24 minutes ago, Lazze.9870 said:

I read very well what you said, you just don't seem to get why it matters that you can't pack all those tools into one build.

 

Imagine being so kitten at the game that you classify the soulbeast pull+immob + axe 5 "broken". Axe 5 roots the user. That's why it is okay for it to hit hard. Dodge the pull and the ranger sits like a duck doing you no harm.

 

Again with the reading man, its becoming tedious. I never said axe 5 was broken, I listed it as a hard hitting skill amongst all the other hard hitting skills, because that is indeed what is it. But since this seems to have hit a nerve I shall indulge.

 

Whirling Defense as stated hits hard, is always paired with quickness and has a 5.28 scaling which is higher than most skills with a similar "rooted" condition. Hundred Blades for example has a scaling of 2.8 and 3 targets and basically always requires Bull's rush. As I mentioned, because of this scaling, this is the only weapon which bunker soulbeast can use to get a cheesy high burst and decent damage. Higher than some power builds I'd imagine.

 I have seen minstrel soulbeast bots take multiple people from like 80% to 0, with the OWP + Axe 5. If you're on Eu go check out the one on Gandara its quite funny to watch to be honest. Regardless of if they were noobs or not, the damage on it is not really justifiable since there are plenty of ways to set up the burst on ranger.

 

37 minutes ago, Lazze.9870 said:

Druid is a kittening meme. Ancient Seed shouldn't exist, but put that aside and you have the WORST SUPPORT SPEC IN PVP/WVW. Speaking about things things that are sticking out, imagine if Anet gave half as much care about this spec as they have done with scrapper over the years. Then maybe it would be a decent support spec and not a kittening root meme.

 

 Yes

 

38 minutes ago, Lazze.9870 said:

Sheer denial? Speak for yourself. I have literally just told you that I'm fine with range nerf on LB, nerfing Dolyak Stance and removing Ancient Seeds. But that wouldn't be enough for you, would it? Gotta nerf the damage on a rooted skill as well because you can't dodge the immob.

 

no that'd pretty much be enough for me, because with Longbow nerfed, i'd say 80% of rangers would just stop playing.

 

 

The funny thing about ranger is its always the good rangers that are the first to point out how broken it is, yet all the bad ones playing these meme builds are the ones scratching their heads saying its weak.

[schokelmei.8271]

Solution: Make it unblockable and let reflects hit with the same damage modifiers the ranged class uses.

[Gotejjeken.1267]

31 minutes ago, Faolain.2374 said:

 

Again with the reading man, its becoming tedious. I never said axe 5 was broken, I listed it as a hard hitting skill amongst all the other hard hitting skills, because that is indeed what is it. But since this seems to have hit a nerve I shall indulge.

 

Whirling Defense as stated hits hard, is always paired with quickness and has a 5.28 scaling which is higher than most skills with a similar "rooted" condition. Hundred Blades for example has a scaling of 2.8 and 3 targets and basically always requires Bull's rush. As I mentioned, because of this scaling, this is the only weapon which bunker soulbeast can use to get a cheesy high burst and decent damage. Higher than some power builds I'd imagine.

 I have seen minstrel soulbeast bots take multiple people from like 80% to 0, with the OWP + Axe 5. If you're on Eu go check out the one on Gandara its quite funny to watch to be honest. Regardless of if they were noobs or not, the damage on it is not really justifiable since there are plenty of ways to set up the burst on ranger.

 

What ways exactly are there to setup this 'burst' on X/A outside of prelude lash?

 

Also, you do realize what 'burst' means right? And that Whirling Defense is a channeled skill? As an object lesson, Maul is a burst--can you spot the difference between Maul and Whirling Defense?

 

Is Rapid Fire with quickness also a 'burst' to you? 🤔

[Faolain.2374]

34 minutes ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

 

What ways exactly are there to setup this 'burst' on X/A outside of prelude lash?

 

Also, you do realize what 'burst' means right? And that Whirling Defense is a channeled skill? As an object lesson, Maul is a burst--can you spot the difference between Maul and Whirling Defense?

 

Is Rapid Fire with quickness also a 'burst' to you? 🤔

Are you telling me rangers lack creativity as well as skill now?  Maybe the skill exactly one to the left of axe 5???? other sources of immobilise? Other sources of cc??? A good iboga pull, jaracanda roots, merged knock downs? I believe hyena is the best pet for it in a group setting no? Honestly take your pick. And yes before our insightful friend points out, I am aware you can not have all of these at one time but you can stack 4 on a normal build quite easy.

 

 In the scenario of playing a build that does no damage outside of axe 5, then i would indeed call axe 5 that build's burst yes.

If rapid fire is killing my mount and taking my hp to 30% in the space of 3 seconds then again, yes. I would call any skill with significant burst damage a burst, yes. Obviously.

Edited June 22, 2021 by Faolain.2374

[Gotejjeken.1267]

6 minutes ago, Faolain.2374 said:

Are you telling me rangers lack creativity as well as skill now?  Maybe the skill exactly one to the left of axe 5???? other sources of immobilise? Other sources of cc??? A good iboga pull, jaracanda roots, merged knocked? I believe hyena is the best pet for it in a group setting no? Honestly take your pick. And yes before our insightful friend points out, I am aware you can not have all of these at one time but you can stack 4 on a normal build quite easy.

 

 In the scenario of playing a build that does no damage outside of axe 5, then i would indeed call axe 5 that build's burst yes.

If rapid fire is killing my mount and taking my hp to 30% in the space of 3 seconds then again, yes. I would call any skill with significant burst damage a burst, yes. Obviously.

 

You want people to use path of scars as a legitimate CC skill? I'd actually love to see anyone set up a path of scars pull into a whirling defense with any success. 

 

What we call that is reaching--I can 'take my pick' and tell you that none of what you named is effective for setting up whirling defense. 

 

Like Jacaranda...you want to immob someone, run over to them, stand still, and whirl on em? I guess since you apparently play against a lot of bots on your server this might work well?

 

Channeled skills are also not bursts even if they do high damage.  Worldly impact is a burst because it can do 6k to you and you can't react to it if the ranger times it right.  None of that has anything in common with trying to setup some memes with OH axe.  

 

 

[Faolain.2374]

3 minutes ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

 

You want people to use path of scars as a legitimate CC skill? I'd actually love to see anyone set up a path of scars pull into a whirling defense with any success. 

 

What we call that is reaching--I can 'take my pick' and tell you that none of what you named is effective for setting up whirling defense. 

 

 

 

 

I gave you 6 suggestions and none of them are considered ways to set up a single skill? Excuse me?

Not effective or  just require some degree of skill to use them?

 

5 minutes ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

Like Jacaranda...you want to immob someone, run over to them, stand still, and whirl on em? I guess since you apparently play against a lot of bots on your server this might work well?

 

 Erm jaracanda is primarily melee, just use it when you're also in melee range??? 

 

7 minutes ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

Channeled skills are also not bursts even if they do high damage.  Worldly impact is a burst because it can do 6k to you and you can't react to it if the ranger times it right.  None of that has anything in common with trying to setup some memes with OH axe.  

..So Rapid fire, Arc divider, Whirling axes etc are not burst skills?

[Zyreva.1078]

1 hour ago, Faolain.2374 said:

Whirling Defense as stated hits hard, is always paired with quickness and has a 5.28 scaling which is higher than most skills with a similar "rooted" condition. Hundred Blades for example has a scaling of 2.8 and 3 targets and basically always requires Bull's rush. As I mentioned, because of this scaling, this is the only weapon which bunker soulbeast can use to get a cheesy high burst and decent damage. Higher than some power builds I'd imagine.

 I have seen minstrel soulbeast bots take multiple people from like 80% to 0, with the OWP + Axe 5. If you're on Eu go check out the one on Gandara its quite funny to watch to be honest. Regardless of if they were noobs or not, the damage on it is not really justifiable since there are plenty of ways to set up the burst on ranger.

 

HB has a modifier of 3,6 - and is an absolute garbage skill. Warrior's axe 5 has a 5.6 mod btw, so numbers like this aren't something ranger exclusive.

I've run into at least 2 ranger bots on gandara, and they are both free kills. If anyone dies to them (or anything minstrel tbh), they are playing worse than bots and that skill level shouldn't be the focus of balance.

 

Atm the big dmg on whirling defense is the only reason to use offhand axe (axe 4 is garbage). Nerf the dmg by any significant amount and the weapon becomes not worth using at all, which leaves lb/gs as only good - and imo the most boring and certainly the one, that players complain the most about - power dps option for slb. Is that really desireable?

 

@Gotejjeken.1267

Burst does not equal "single hit" skill.

 

Edited June 22, 2021 by UmbraNoctis.1907

[Gotejjeken.1267]

15 minutes ago, UmbraNoctis.1907 said:

Burst does not equal "single hit" skill.

 

Thought EU were the persnickety ones about language but ok...here we go:  

 

The definition of burst is: "an instance of breaking or splitting as a result of internal pressure or puncturing; an explosion."  

 

A 5-second channel is not a burst because you can walk out or dodge part of it and avoid most of the damage.  A burst happens all at once, you avoid all of it, or none of it.

 

Which is why channels IRL are called 'hails' usually--i.e. a 'hail of gunfire' to describe a massive amount of bullets coming towards someone or something.  Or you know, hail storm--lotta ice pellets coming at you very fast.  

[Gotejjeken.1267]

25 minutes ago, Faolain.2374 said:

Erm jaracanda is primarily melee, just use it when you're also in melee range??? 

 

2/3'ds of Jacaranda's offensive skills are useable at 1200 range...this is melee? I'm starting to wonder if there is a language barrier here or if I'm being trolled?

Edited June 22, 2021 by Gotejjeken.1267

[Zyreva.1078]

10 minutes ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

A 5-second channel is not a burst because you can walk out or dodge part of it and avoid most of the damage.  A burst happens all at once, you avoid all of it, or none of it.

 

We aren't talking about 5-second channels here tho.

In games burst is usually loosely defined as "a lot of dmg within a short time frame". Ofc "a lot" and "short time" are relative, but quite appropriate for what can be done with skills like rapid fire or axe 5.

[Gotejjeken.1267]

4 minutes ago, UmbraNoctis.1907 said:

 

We aren't talking about 5-second channels here tho.

In games burst is usually loosely defined as "a lot of dmg within a short time frame". Ofc "a lot" and "short time" are relative, but quite appropriate for what can be done with skills like rapid fire or axe 5.

 

It's true 5 seconds was a bit hyperbole; we're talking about 2-3 second channels here; quickness usually ran to--*gasp* speed up the channel time.  

 

That is, burst is pretty clearly defined...it happens in an almost instant (i.e. not seconds) time frame.  Thief burst from stealth to do 5-6k damage, mesmer clone shatters are bursts that do high damage, necros have explosions that do high damage...

 

Rapid fire and axe 5 are in no way bursts, because they can be nerfed by increasing channel time without touching overall damage.  Or with slow, if anet would ever expand that past primarily mesmer.  

[Faolain.2374]

20 minutes ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

 

2/3'ds of Jacaranda's offensive skills are useable at 1200 range...this is melee? I'm starting to wonder if there is a language barrier here or if I'm being trolled?

oh trust me I don’t think it’s a language barrier which is the issue here 😂😂 

 

You realise that the range on the jacaranda “auto attack” is 200 range? How much closer do you want it?

The pet will only stop being in melee range to cast call lightening every 10 seconds which is a 3/4 cast time, the rest of the time the pet is hugging the enemy player. When the roots have a 1s cast time and are 900 range this should be easy enough to land right? Considering the pet is practically in melee range like 90% of the time. 
 

Also isn’t jacaranda like top 4 pets? 

[Faolain.2374]

37 minutes ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

 

Thought EU were the persnickety ones about language but ok...here we go:  

 

The definition of burst is: "an instance of breaking or splitting as a result of internal pressure or puncturing; an explosion."  

 

A 5-second channel is not a burst because you can walk out or dodge part of it and avoid most of the damage.  A burst happens all at once, you avoid all of it, or none of it.

 

Which is why channels IRL are called 'hails' usually--i.e. a 'hail of gunfire' to describe a massive amount of bullets coming towards someone or something.  Or you know, hail storm--lotta ice pellets coming at you very fast.  

 

7 minutes ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

 

It's true 5 seconds was a bit hyperbole; we're talking about 2-3 second channels here; quickness usually ran to--*gasp* speed up the channel time.  

 

That is, burst is pretty clearly defined...it happens in an almost instant (i.e. not seconds) time frame.  Thief burst from stealth to do 5-6k damage, mesmer clone shatters are bursts that do high damage, necros have explosions that do high damage...

 

Rapid fire and axe 5 are in no way bursts, because they can be nerfed by increasing channel time without touching overall damage.  Or with slow, if anet would ever expand that past primarily mesmer.  

either you’re over thinking this or everyone that has ever played this game has been wrong in what is a burst. Tough call 

[Zyreva.1078]

21 minutes ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

 

It's true 5 seconds was a bit hyperbole; we're talking about 2-3 second channels here; quickness usually ran to--*gasp* speed up the channel time.  

 

That is, burst is pretty clearly defined...it happens in an almost instant (i.e. not seconds) time frame.  Thief burst from stealth to do 5-6k damage, mesmer clone shatters are bursts that do high damage, necros have explosions that do high damage...

 

Rapid fire and axe 5 are in no way bursts, because they can be nerfed by increasing channel time without touching overall damage.  Or with slow, if anet would ever expand that past primarily mesmer.  

Almost instant 5-6k dmg (your definition of burst) is absolutely something that can be done with rf or axe 5. Also multi clone shatters don't always hit all at the same time and the dmg from a single clone isn't that high. So no burst skills? Does not make much sense.

[Gotejjeken.1267]

13 minutes ago, UmbraNoctis.1907 said:

Almost instant 5-6k dmg (your definition of burst) is absolutely something that can be done with rf or axe 5. Also multi clone shatters don't always hit all at the same time and the dmg from a single clone isn't that high. So no burst skills? Does not make much sense.

 

Have a video of this? It better be done in about 3/4 a second akin to something like worldly impact.  

 

36 minutes ago, Faolain.2374 said:

Also isn’t jacaranda like top 4 pets? 

 

The fact you type things like this tells me you spend more time on the forums posting in 'ranger is OP' topics than actually playing the game (let alone the actual class).

Edited June 22, 2021 by Gotejjeken.1267

[Faolain.2374]

4 minutes ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

 

The fact you type things like this tells me you spend more time on the forums posting in 'ranger is OP' topics than actually playing the game (let alone the actual class).

Oh so jacaranda isn’t used at all? 

[Gotejjeken.1267]

Just now, Faolain.2374 said:

Oh so jacaranda isn’t used at all? 

 

Anything can be used. 

 

Jacranda isn't one of the most effective pets; immob builds are best suited for druid and you are better off with hard CC pets than jacranda which takes forever to use its skills, and on power SB you are pretty much going to be running smokescale or bird. 

 

I'm sure there are meme builds that use jacranda though, there are always meme builds somewhere.  

 

In general, I think people were using it before due to call lightning having a high potential for spike damage? Haven't encountered this much anymore myself, with quickness and superspeed its easy to run circles around the thing.  

 

 

[Zyreva.1078]

2 hours ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

 

Have a video of this? It better be done in about 3/4 a second akin to something like worldly impact. 

http://i.postimg.cc/SNRv69ns/gw051.jpg

 

3 hits for 7k+ dmg - with quickness it takes about half a second. That's without OWP which could push the numbers further. It was a glass vs glass scenario, yes, but i wasn't pushing the numbers to the limits. More is possible.

Edited June 22, 2021 by UmbraNoctis.1907

[Shroud.2307]

Man, I tell you, the increase in Soulbeasts during the No Downed State event is significant enough to say what people think of this spec.

Yesterday against AR I don't think there was a single fight at or below 20v20 without at least 8 Rangers on each side. There was a time where a few of us were scrapping around for 30 minutes or so and AR's group of 15ish was comprised of at least 10 Rangers.

And yes I realize the irony of this as a Maguuman, by no means am I not aware of our high Ranger population, but particularly during this event I've noticed a huge increase in people playing it. 

I'm not going to repeat all of what I said earlier in this thread, so to be clear I'm not joining any of the pitch fork mob here. But the amount of people dusting off their Soulbeasts for this event speaks volumes for how effective it is at doing what it does, which is spiking people down from a safe distance.

[dank.3680]

26 minutes ago, Shroud.2307 said:

There was a time where a few of us were scrapping around for 30 minutes or so and AR's group of 15ish was comprised of at least 10 Rangers.

Yeah I noticed that. That group was actually 9 rangers 2 engi and 1 ele. Got boring real quick.

Edited June 23, 2021 by dank.3680

[schokelmei.8271]

11 hours ago, dank.3680 said:

Yeah I noticed that. That group was actually 9 rangers 2 engi and 1 ele. Got boring real quick.

 

That's called optimized ganking. Basically almost the setup I'd run with my guild in that case. 4 SB, 1 Scrapper would be our setup. Just press "strg+T", delete someone, go Invis, next target, etc.

Great gameplay, so much skill, much wow.

[ArchonWing.9480]

On 6/23/2021 at 11:14 AM, Shroud.2307 said:

Man, I tell you, the increase in Soulbeasts during the No Downed State event is significant enough to say what people think of this spec.

Yesterday against AR I don't think there was a single fight at or below 20v20 without at least 8 Rangers on each side. There was a time where a few of us were scrapping around for 30 minutes or so and AR's group of 15ish was comprised of at least 10 Rangers.

And yes I realize the irony of this as a Maguuman, by no means am I not aware of our high Ranger population, but particularly during this event I've noticed a huge increase in people playing it. 

I'm not going to repeat all of what I said earlier in this thread, so to be clear I'm not joining any of the pitch fork mob here. But the amount of people dusting off their Soulbeasts for this event speaks volumes for how effective it is at doing what it does, which is spiking people down from a safe distance.

 

But, on the other hand, very few reflects. I would expect people to run earth aura share eles everywhere but nope.

 

I did see a Ventari rev though. That was funny.

Edited June 25, 2021 by ArchonWing.9480

[reddie.5861]

On 6/13/2021 at 2:26 PM, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

This is a common misconception.

 

They aren't pressing 1 key bro, they are burning their entire kit outside of the heal utility to deal that damage.

 

Dodge roll and then get aggressive. They got nothing left on a glass cannon build after they whiff a full burst for about 30s - 60s.

what u on about, u dont need whole skill set, like i have said to you before, sic em does nothing its wolf pack doing all kitten.
u dont need any skills to do this dmg. u just hit em with auto hits and see if they dodge twice or used some kitten u wanted em to trigger and off u go free kill.

[Shroud.2307]

1 hour ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

 

But, on the other hand, very few reflects. I would expect people to run earth aura share eles everywhere but nope.

 

I did see a Ventari rev though. That was funny.

Everyone was too busy on the Soulbeast meme train to be offering any support.

I was playing Power Scrapper a few times when things got too crazy. Was funny sometimes seeing the absolute arrow storm of projectiles coming at me when my bubble was up. Didn't stop the smart ones from using OWP + Signet of the Hunt when they got sick of me though, lol.