Jump to content
  • Sign Up

Does Marksmanship has the worst minor traits in the game?


Panncakez.1290

Recommended Posts

On 7/13/2021 at 11:07 AM, Teratus.2859 said:

I think i'd prefer it to refresh on hitting 5 targets with Lead the Wind because it rewards playing optimally to the strengths of this particular trait.
The better you play, the more opening strikes you can take advantage of, but it's circumstantial just like the piercing arrows aspect of the trait is as well.

 

I mean, it's better than nothing. But it goes away from what Anet was trying to do when they made weapon traits have an effect even when not using the related weapon (which is why Lead the Wind should also have its range requirement lowered to 1000 range, at least).

 

A free Opening Strike every 9 second isn't better than engies refreshing Explosive Entrance from dodge rolling. They could make it only apply to stealth that you apply to yourself, and not stealth from allies. Thief works the same with some of its traits.

 

It doesn't conflict with Remorseless because a huge part of the Remorseless effect is the damage modifier used in combination with a burst skill, while longbow doesn't really utilize the guaranteed crit that well. Yeah, you could go into stealth, swap to GS and get that guaranteed Maul crit, but Remorseless would still do it better.

Edited by Lazze.9870
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 7/11/2021 at 6:53 PM, DeceiverX.8361 said:

If you meant that there's base damage or something which is how I interpreted "flat" damage to mean, read this, as such a thing doesn't exist:

Why would you imagine the impossible meaning next to a likely meaning? Honestly, why would your mind go there?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What about these minor traits:

 

Adept: "You and your pet inflict vulnerability with opening strike. You get opening strike with your first strike when entering combat or change weapon. "

Alternative:

Adept: "You and your pet inflict vulnerability with opening strike. You get opening strike every 5 seconds."

 

Master: "Your projectiles become destroyed instead of reflected."

 

Grandmaster: "When you get opening strike, you get 2 stacks unblockable for 5 seconds"

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

From my point of view all ranger traitlines needs a serious rework, the traitlines have been receiving random traits  some good other no so much but definitely totally disconnected from the traitline theme and with very little synergy within the traitline.

 

Returning the removed trait Predator's_Instinct would be a good solution if reduce the cripple duration and iCD, and instead applying the cripple directly, the pet's next attack would cause the cripple instead. 

"The pet's next attack applies cripple when the ranger hits foes under the health threshold" It would restore some synergy with the pet. 

  • Precise Strike: because it is merged with opening strike, here we could find a minor to work with projectiles. Farsighted would be a good candidate here. 

 

Being an strike-focused traitline more changes would be welcomed, like moving  Spotter Furious Grip and Vicious_Quarry to this traitline, it is very wonky to have an strike damage GM in a condition traitline (skirmish)  . 

Spotter should become a minor and selfish meaning the effect should only impact the ranger and it's pet companion . 

 

Ranger by default should not be able to share any boons or buffs with anybody else than the pet but the pet should be always included as such  Fortifying Bond effect should become baseline to the ranger. That means all the skills by default should be selfish including Call of the WildResounding Timbre, Spirit passive buffs, etc...

 

The ability to share those buffs should come from traits in Nature Magic traitline as that should be the support traitline, making the player to have to pick between group support or other utilities (meaningful choice) . As such to share Spotter buff, Spirits passives, Boons applied to self, etc with the group it would need the traitline. There could be trait even to share the passives from the signets in a short radius. 

 

Druid could extend that utility making the ranger to be able to share more with the group by moving Nature's Vengeance (with some rebalance) to replace Ancient Seeds, there there is a connection between Druid and core and cementing the support role of the druid without significantly changing the mechanics of the class ( a druid would still pick NM-Druid in raids as it would be looking to share the Spirit passives plus the additional boons )  while at the same time giving a meaningful option against Grace of the Land.

Not to mention Ancient seeds needs to be deleted from the game. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 hours ago, anduriell.6280 said:

Being an strike-focused traitline more changes would be welcomed, like moving  Spotter Furious Grip and Vicious_Quarry to this traitline, it is very wonky to have an strike damage GM in a condition traitline (skirmish) 

 

That's not how it is though. Marksmanship is strike damage and CC focused, with Signet traits thrown in there (this might be the worst part of the traitline, aside for minors not refreshing if not for 1/3 GMs). Skirmishing is a precision/crit and condition line. Moving Vicious Quarry and Spotter to Marksmanship is gonna completely clutter up Marksmanship.

 

It's not wonky to run skirmishing on a power build at all. You got two choices in every tier that works completely fine on a power build. I'd even say 3 in the GM slot because Light on your Feet buff stronger on a power build than on any condi build without shortbow. And all three minors are fine too.

 

Nature Magic should be a better support traitline. Completely disagree with the way you want to do it though. I don't see the point of any of it.

23 hours ago, anduriell.6280 said:

That means all the skills by default should be selfish including Call of the WildResounding Timbre, Spirit passive buffs, etc...

That's one solid way of killing a class.

Edited by Lazze.9870
  • Confused 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Lazze.9870 said:

Every 5th second is too much.

 

Making the minors longbow focused is a big no-no-.

my adept and grandmaster minor traits are for every weapon (except staff, which is unblockable). The master is for every distance weapon (except staff).

 

And i don't think that every 5 seconds is too much for a minor trait of a class with >50% projectile weaponskills, which can easily be reflected by so many skills, are blocked by much more skills and can be dodged by every class. It is just 2 hits in 5 seconds, if you use a block/reflection.

 

But btw: The traitline is called "markmansship". Of course it is projectile-focused.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Aleksander Suburb.4287 said:

my adept and grandmaster minor traits are for every weapon (except staff, which is unblockable). The master is for every distance weapon (except staff).

 

And i don't think that every 5 seconds is too much for a minor trait of a class with >50% projectile weaponskills, which can easily be reflected by so many skills, are blocked by much more skills and can be dodged by every class. It is just 2 hits in 5 seconds, if you use a block/reflection.

 

But btw: The traitline is called "markmansship". Of course it is projectile-focused.

Your suggestions are all about buffing mindless pew pew gameplay. Reflect immunity would even be useless for competent players and only valuable for bad ones. That's just terrible design, and so is an excess amount of unblockable. Tower rangers and Xv1 gankers certainly don't need any buffs whatsoever, let alone at the expense of actually fun and viable builds that require at least a minimum amount of brain.

Edited by UmbraNoctis.1907
  • Confused 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, Lazze.9870 said:

It's not wonky to run skirmishing on a power build at all. You got two choices in every tier that works completely fine on a power build. I'd even say 3 in the GM slot because the Light on your Feet buff is tronger on a power build than on a condi build. And all three minors are fine too.

 

Light on Your Feet is stronger on a power build than a condi build....say what now? 

 

Putting aside the fact that it is specifically for shortbow; which I don't know why anyone would take on a power build, why would you ever consider it over vicious quarry when power builds are extremely fury dependent? 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 hours ago, Aleksander Suburb.4287 said:

But btw: The traitline is called "markmansship". Of course it is projectile-focused.

 

Irrelevant. There is one projectile focused trait, the longbow trait. It is a power focused traitline for both burst and sustained dps, with some CC, might generation and signet utility added to it. It shouldn't be tailored to projectile based damage.

 

The name is just a name. It made more sense back when there were like 4-5 different traits for the bows. The name is a leftover from the original Guild Wars, the same way Thief's Deadly Arts is (which was about assassin hexes and debuffs, and nothing to do poison and power damage like it is in GW2).

 

Edit: how is this confusing?

Edited by Lazze.9870
  • Confused 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

 

Light on Your Feet is stronger on a power build than a condi build....say what now? 

 

Putting aside the fact that it is specifically for shortbow; which I don't know why anyone would take on a power build, why would you ever consider it over vicious quarry when power builds are extremely fury dependent? 

 

Light on your Feet BUFF. You know, the one that gives you power damage on dodge.

 

Of course, you'd be stupid to pick it over quickdraw or vicious quarry for anything else than a shortbow build.

Edited by Lazze.9870
  • Confused 1
  • Sad 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Lazze.9870 said:

 

Light on your Feet BUFF. You know, the one that gives you power damage on dodge.

 

Of course, you'd be stupid to pick it over quickdraw or vicious quarry for anything else than a shortbow build.

 

It's also the one that gives condition damage and increases condition duration on dodge...

 

I guess my confusion is why would one want to use shortbow in a power build? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 hours ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

I guess my confusion is why would one want to use shortbow in a power build? 

The buff to celestial set . In a celestial-ish build Shortbow is scary damage wise. 

 

For pvp is no good because it doesn't bring the utility needed (because of the side requirement to actually do any damage) but otherwise  the damage is there. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 hours ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

It's also the one that gives condition damage and increases condition duration on dodge...

 

No. The dodging buff from Light on your Feet increases power damage and condition duration. The buff doesn't give you condition damage. Same as Oppressive Superiority.

 

You're taking a statement out of context and providing wrong information on top of that.

 

I said there is nothing about Skirmishing that makes it wonky to run in a power build. 2/3 traits in every tier can work in a power build. Then I added that even Light on Your Feet has some use (because of the power buff it gives), so technically all 3 GM traits "work". It's obviously the worst choice, but I get why you're confused when you don't follow the conversation.

 

15 hours ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

I guess my confusion is why would one want to use shortbow in a power build? 

 

That was a general statement about using LoYF for anything else than a shortbow build. I didn't specify what kind of shortbow build.

Edited by Lazze.9870
Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, Lazze.9870 said:

 

No. The dodging buff from Light on your Feet increases power damage and condition duration. The buff doesn't give you condition damage. Same as Oppressive Superiority.

 

You're taking a statement out of context and providing wrong information on top of that.

 

I said there is nothing about Skirmishing that makes it wonky to run in a power build. 2/3 traits in every tier can work in a power build. Then I added that even Light on Your Feet has some use (because of the power buff it gives), so technically all 3 GM traits "work". It's obviously the worst choice, but I get why you're confused when you don't follow the conversation.

 

 

That was a general statement about using LoYF for anything else than a shortbow build. I didn't specify what kind of shortbow build.

 

I mean if we're being pedantic LoYF is an effect not a buff lol, but I get your overall point now.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

I mean if we're being pedantic LoYF is an effect not a buff lol, but I get your overall point now.  

 

Well, an effect that buffs. Anything that puts an icon on your bar and provides "improved anything" could be called a buff in my book. But, yes, pedantic.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 7/19/2021 at 5:24 PM, Aleksander Suburb.4287 said:

What about these minor traits:

 

Adept: "You and your pet inflict vulnerability with opening strike. You get opening strike with your first strike when entering combat or change weapon. "

Alternative:

Adept: "You and your pet inflict vulnerability with opening strike. You get opening strike every 5 seconds."

 

Master: "Your projectiles become destroyed instead of reflected."

 

Grandmaster: "When you get opening strike, you get 2 stacks unblockable for 5 seconds"

 

TDLR:  i want to be carried w/o punishment.

Why?

- I can see that problematic if used in soulbeast.

Note SB can reach 15k with several 8k-10k after it on tanky toons.

- Those changes also means Rangers not getting  punished for being bad as well.

- Rangers have good quickness support that could be a bit broken as well.

- Btw openeing strike means 1st time u atack that target, there is only one 1st time 🙂

Edited by Aeolus.3615
  • Haha 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 7/20/2021 at 9:47 AM, Lazze.9870 said:

Irrelevant. There is one projectile focused trait, the longbow trait. It is a power focused traitline for both burst and sustained dps, with some CC, might generation and signet utility added to it. It shouldn't be tailored to projectile based damage.

reinforcing your point really.  Single focus lines owuld be really bad and marksmanship is more than a power line, thankfully.

 

Marksmanship is a decent defensive line.  Signets - movement, regen, toughness, invuln on a pathway to DPS options bow or general damage or big hit damage.  Our mixed message weapons make fury and straight damage growth percentages give DPS boosts to condition builds as well and might stacking via crit can get opened elsewhere and benefits condition builds (Giving value to controlled fury spikes).  Last line is power strike based line but then strike damage is part of every condition build as well due to weapon design and with predators onslaught modestly beneficial still to a condition build compared to the other two.  It's a different build these days that builds signets for defense so the offensive package has time to unload.  And signets are pretty good for getting your damage stacked and then getting distance for them to work.  Marksman line can have 2 signet of stones to work within.

 

We as players are min maxxers predominantly especially us on message boards along with theory crafters.   Specializations appear conducted to enable multiple play styles including those that may not be numerically perfect.  One dimensional skill lines would be very bad for game play and enjoyment.  

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 hours ago, Aeolus.3615 said:

 

TDLR:  i want to be carried w/o punishment.

Why?

- I can see that problematic if used in soulbeast.

Note SB can reach 15k with several 8k-10k after it on tanky toons.

- Those changes also means Rangers not getting  punished for being bad as well.

- Rangers have good quickness support that could be a bit broken as well.

- Btw openeing strike means 1st time u atack that target, there is only one 1st time 🙂

By your reasonings Remorseless is a bug, we should open a thread requesting Anet to fix it. 🤔

I like to see that build which can do that constant damage and what you understand for "tanky toons", and how 6 seconds quickness in a 50s CD is considered "good support" . 

 

I find funny this subforum seems to have some permanent residents always crying nerfs for the profession. 

 

Edited by anduriell.6280
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...