New path to legendary armor?

[Astralporing.1957]

3 minutes ago, Quench.7091 said:

They could aim for the map currency system of HoT. The meta was good for chests, but the side events were great for keys to open those chests. Those chests contained the currency.

They could also add a token to some bosses/metas, with a daily (or better weekly) cap on those tokens.

[Forum Moderator.6104]

Sobx.1758 and Firebeard.1746, leave each other alone and focus on the topic at hand. If this thread is only interested in debating other users and not the topic, we will lock it.

 

-Leto

[Astralporing.1957]

23 minutes ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

Yes, of course they want to cater to their player bases' needs and wants, but they can't please everyone.

Indeed. They can't. So, they should stop trying to, and decide whom they want to please. And whether it is realy worthy to still keep trying to please a group of players they already admitted is now so small it no longer warrants any resource allocation.

Edited July 20, 2021 by Astralporing.1957

[Tails.9372]

28 minutes ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

Yes, of course they want to cater to their player bases' needs and wants, but they can't please everyone.

 

Within the context of the thread: sure they can. As I said earlier they can easily make an overarching set based on general gamemode participation. The main ones who wouldn't be "pleased" with such an approach wouldn't be the target audience anyway so their displeasurement on that matter is mostly irrelevant.

 

 

28 minutes ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

That want needs to be based on reason

 

No it doesn't. The want of the player doesn't need a justification. The only ones who need a reasoning here are the devs for which a commonly expressed "want" of the community is already a reason in and of itself if it can be implemented in a way that aligns with their goal to keep players engaged with the game.

 

Edited July 20, 2021 by Tails.9372

[Sobx.1758]

18 minutes ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

They could also add a token to some bosses/metas, with a daily (or better weekly) cap on those tokens.

So like https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Gift_of_Dedication and (maybe) https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Provisioner_Token that are required for current pve armor?

Edited July 20, 2021 by Sobx.1758

[Eloc Freidon.5692]

On 7/19/2021 at 11:16 AM, yann.1946 said:

Technically pvp and wvw count as distinct modes. 

They're both competitive game play that require playing against other players. If they are distinct enough to be considered different game modes, then so would Raids and Fractals also be considered distinct enough.

Edited July 20, 2021 by Eloc Freidon.5692

[Sobx.1758]

On 7/18/2021 at 9:59 PM, Obtena.7952 said:

Yup, and if it's a reward people can't get because it's not content they want to do, they are less engaged with the game. I don't know why anyone would think there isn't a miss with. 

btw:

On 7/12/2021 at 10:26 PM, Obtena.7952 said:

I don't think 'making GW2 about the players' necessarily means we will have a path to legendaries that excludes game elements we won't want to do. It's not Burger King ... we don't get it 'our way'. 

 

I really see little reason to change any of how legendaries are obtained ... they just aren't that big a deal to most people and have little impact on how most people play the game anyways. If I was Anet and wanted to make GW2 more about the players, I would GIVE players reasons to care more about getting legendaries.  

So I'm just wondering... what's with the sudden change of heart?

[ArchonWing.9480]

43 minutes ago, Tails.9372 said:

 

Within the context of the thread: sure they can. As I said earlier they can easily make an overarching set based on general gamemode participation. The main ones who wouldn't be "pleased" with such an approach wouldn't be the target audience anyway so their displeasurement on that matter is mostly irrelevant.

 

 

 

No it doesn't. The want of the player doesn't need a justification. The only ones who need a reasoning here are the devs for which a commonly expressed "want" of the community is already a reason in and of itself if it can be implemented in a way that aligns with their goal to keep players engaged with the game.

 

 

So should they just give me every legendary then?

[Asum.4960]

36 minutes ago, Eloc Freidon.5692 said:

They're both competitive game play that require playing against other players. If they are distinct enough to be considered different game modes, then so would Raids and Fractals also be considered different game modes.

 

PvE, WvW (PvPvE) and sPvP literally have balance differences between each other because they are such different and distinct gamemodes. 

I'm really not sure how in your mind standardised competitive 5v5 arena PvP is the same gamemode as 50vs20 castle sieges with catapults and arrow carts going at each other in PvE gear - or anywhere close in similarity to fighting AI in PvE with different difficulty, mechanical complexity and scale are to each other.  

Edited July 20, 2021 by Asum.4960

[Tails.9372]

6 minutes ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

So should they just give me every legendary then?

 

Is giving you "every legendary" a desire commonly expressed by the community that also increases general player engagement with the game?

[blp.3489]

Isn't legendary armor without a special skin basically a Quality of Life item?  Why deny QoL to the largest group of players, those that mostly or exclusively play OW content?

[ArchonWing.9480]

2 minutes ago, Tails.9372 said:

 

Is giving you "every legendary" a desire commonly expressed by the community that also increases general player engagement with the game?

 

You don't know it isn't. People do want legendaries.

 

Point is, if we don't need any justification for anything, then why not demand it?

[ShadowbaneX.6273]

I think it's a great idea! If you can get weapons from basic PvE content, you should be able to get armour and probably trinkets as well.

 

I've been playing since Pre-Launch and I spent most of that time in PvE. It's only with the change that stopped participation decaying (Nov 2018) that I got into WvW, and even then, it was mainly for a quick daily. It's only been in the past 12-15 months where I put a significant amount of time into the game, both WvW and Fractals and made some legendaries. If it wasn't for the events of the past year, I'd likely have a pretty barren Armoury.

 

As it is, my armour is pretty well stocked, but if it wasn't, I would have loved being able to get a set of Legendary Armour that didn't require WvW/PvP or Raids and I think other people should have that opportunity.

Edited July 21, 2021 by ShadowbaneX.6273

[Tails.9372]

2 minutes ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

You don't know it isn't.

 

I don't need to "know" everyone's opinion on that matter. The fact that pretty much no one asks for it is telling enough.

 

3 minutes ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

Point is, if we don't need any justification for anything, then why not demand it?

 

Sure you can "demand" anything but your point is rather misplaced here as I also already said you shouldn't expect them to act on it unless it's something that can be aligned with A-Nets interests which is actually the case for the topic of the thread but not so much for the counter example you brought up.

[Asum.4960]

3 minutes ago, blp.3489 said:

Isn't legendary armor without a special skin basically a Quality of Life item?  Why deny QoL to the largest group of players, those that mostly or exclusively play OW content?

The biggest hurdle for that is that Anet set a precedent with Legendaries. 

On a fundamental level, I absolutely disagree with how incredibly difficult and tedious their acquisition, and in many cases horrendous their value (esp for Weapons, Runes and Trinkets), is. 

 

Obsidian and Prestige Armor in GW1 was imo executed a lot better as purely prestige options, rather than giving players advanced game functionality. Unfortunately, thanks to the onset of microtransactions and cosmetics being a big part of that, purely cosmetic rewards lost their functionality as huge long term investment driving factor as they can't compete with ever shinier and fancier store instant gratification items. 

So they needed to add functionality/QoL to them to keep them as valid longterm engaging/player retaining goals.

 

Now that is not a decision they can easily go back to as suddenly giving out easy access Legendaries on a large scale would invalidate literally years of effort and (surely in many cases even RL money) investment of thousands of players, generating a lot more negative buzz and player blowback than established and known low access to that QoL for the average player does. 

[ArchonWing.9480]

9 minutes ago, Tails.9372 said:

 

I don't need to "know" everyone's opinion on that matter. The fact that pretty much no one asks for it is telling enough.

 

 

I'm not "no one", so you're already wrong.

 

Considering you are speaking about "a commonly expressed "want" of the community is already a reason in and of itself if it can be implemented in a way that aligns with their goal to keep players engaged with the game. ", I think you really should try.

 

Or maybe you shouldn't be speaking on behalf of the community or what it once based on what you just happened to read, and speak for yourself instead.

 

All it takes is 1 person disagreeing with you to disprove you. I could probably bring about most of my guild that would want free legendaries too.

 

As a member of this community, I would greatly appreciate that.

Edited July 20, 2021 by ArchonWing.9480

[Obtena.7952]

1 hour ago, Sobx.1758 said:

btw:

So I'm just wondering... what's with the sudden change of heart?

None. The fact that Anet is missing out because they aren't engaging all players with legendary assets has nothing to do with how I think legendaries should be obtained.

 

I think I've already been clear in the thread that I don't care about leg. armor because I'm already committed to Ascended armors ... BUT, I can see why Anet should care about how many players are engaged with assets they develop and why other players do care about options to interact with those those assets in the game.

 

See, that's the difference between me and you. Even though I don't think we should have all these extra ways because Leg. armor just isn't that big a deal to most people, I can appreciate why what I think it's not the determining factor in how the game is implemented or what is best for the game, Anet or its players. In otherwords, I can actually support a suggestion that differs from my personal opinion from an objective POV.

Edited July 20, 2021 by Obtena.7952

[blp.3489]

I didn't mean to suggest that you just give them out, only that it doesn't make sense to me to require people to play game modes they don't want to in order to obtain them.  The WvW legendary armor doesn't require significant skill, just a lot of play time that needs to be concentrated in short periods to get past the paltry number of tickets you get in the early chests.

[Tails.9372]

18 minutes ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

I'm not "no one", so you're already wrong.

 

Do you have an actual point or are you just grasping for straws? The "pretty much" already takes you into account here even though the seriousness of this request is more than questionable.

 

18 minutes ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

Or maybe you shouldn't be speaking on behalf of the community or what it once based on what you just happened to read, and speak for yourself instead.

 

All it takes is 1 person disagreeing with you to disprove you.

 

I never claimed to "speak on behalf of the community" that one is entirely on you. Also, whether you like it or not but the fact that this topic is brought up so often is indeed indicative for a common want of the community. You saying "I dissagree" does not "prove" anything I said wrong.

Edited July 20, 2021 by Tails.9372

[ArchonWing.9480]

16 minutes ago, Tails.9372 said:

 

Do you have an actual point or are you just grasping for straws? The "pretty much" already takes you into account here even though the seriousness of this request is more than questionable.

 

 

I never claimed to "speak on behalf of the community" that one is entirely on you. Also, whether you like it or not but the fact that this topic is brought up so often is indeed indicative for a common want of the community. You saying "I dissagree" does not "prove" anything I said wrong.

 

I mean you're the one that said

 

The only ones who need a reasoning here are the devs for which a commonly expressed "want" of the community is already a reason in and of itself if it can be implemented in a way that aligns with their goal to keep players engaged with the game.

 

How do you know what these things are?

 

But what I do know is that Anet has more information on this than either you or I (whatever you're read online does not reflect the playerbase), so maybe the current system is the best, regardless of you or me liking it.

 

It's worked for almost 9 years, and there are lots of people wearing legendaries.

 

As for my point? Well, you sorta quoted like one sentence out of context  from me initially, so there wasn't really much to discuss there.

Edited July 20, 2021 by ArchonWing.9480

[Obtena.7952]

10 minutes ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

 

It's worked for almost 9 years, and there are lots of people wearing legendaries.

 

Let's go down this path ... just what is 'lots' here ... because I don't know many people that have leg. armor. How do you conclude it works? What is your metric for assessing it has 'worked' for 9 years? What does it even mean to say 'it works' and how is that related to the fact that Anet's ultimate goal is to entice people to play the game and spend money on gems?

 

 

Edited July 20, 2021 by Obtena.7952

[ArchonWing.9480]

4 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Let's go down this path ... just what is 'lots' here ... because I don't know many people that have leg. armor. How do you conclude it works? What is your metric for assessing it has 'worked' for 9 years?

 

I said legendaries; not legendary armor, though.

 

And that was from experience, just by interacting in Lion's Arch and people I play with. I mean, are you implying that Anet doesn't know what their player base wants after so many years?

Edited July 20, 2021 by ArchonWing.9480

[Obtena.7952]

4 minutes ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

 

I said legendaries; not legendary armor, though.

 

And that was from experience, just by interacting in Lion's Arch. I mean, are you implying that Anet doesn't know what their player base wants after so many years?

OK that's fair, but we are talking about armor in this thread here. 

 

 ... and yes, I think we have LOTS of evidence to suggest Anet has fouled up delivering what GW2 player base wants after this many years. One of those evidence would be just how few people engage content to obtain Leg. armor. So few in fact that they couldn't justify introducing even ONE new raid in the last two+ years now?

 

 

Edited July 20, 2021 by Obtena.7952

[ArchonWing.9480]

9 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

OK that's fair, but we are talking about armor here. 

 

And yes, I think we have LOTS of evidence to suggest Anet has fouled up delivering what it's player base wants after this many years. 

 

I don't disagree with you.  I just think legendary acquisition works on fairly sound principles inferred by its mechanics. And legendaries in general seemed popular enough for me to think a lot of people enjoyed doing it. I'm not saying it's perfect, of course.

 

I'm only against thinking that someone knows what the community at large thinks based on online postings, as they are not the base at all, vocal minority and all.

 

That's just my point of view; honestly I don't run into much negativity in-game besides when stuff goes really wrong, if from a pve point of view. But even in so-called wvw toxic land, a lot of people are still having fun. That suggests to me that they do know what players want.... sometimes and better than you or me.

 

Edit: And what I have never seen, is anyone being like "If only I had legendary armor, we could clear this more easily!"

Edited July 20, 2021 by ArchonWing.9480

[Astralporing.1957]

2 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

So like https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Gift_of_Dedication and (maybe) https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Provisioner_Token that are required for current pve armor?

Well, yes, something like Gift of Dedication can work (even if not exactly what i had in mind), but not the Provisioner tokens - honestly, I'd be happy if anet replaced those with something better designed. I never liked those - i know that they are meant to be both a mat sink and a time gate, but surely there is a way of doing that in a less aggravating way...

Still, what i really thought of was some sort of LI equivalent, but for non-instanced content, and with a weekly cap that is smaller than all possible sources of obtaining it. Some tokens you get for doing a certain general type of content, that you can get from many sources, with a daily cap on each source (most likely once per day per each source) and additional weekly cap on top of it.

Edited July 20, 2021 by Astralporing.1957