One change to nerf all necros in PvP

[Arheundel.6451]

At this point any nerf to necros would cause a 2nd flood of biblical proportions....the amount of salty tears we'd see would be legendary. Our hands are tied, both for the devs and the community...or what's left of it, there are so many necromancers and guardians now that any nerf would be met with a massive backlash and outrage.

 

Nerfing a necro is not as simple as nerfing an ele, like nobody but those few cats still playing it, give a kitten if ele get nerfed out of the game....on the other hand, necro, you have dogs, cats and even squirrels playing it

 

If you just go as far and nudge this class...you drown into a salty lake soon after. Well jokes aside, people should really lower their expectations to a bare minimum because guardian and necromancer will never stop being the powerhouses they are now.

 

The playerbase is too concentrated on these 2 professions alone, any impairing nerf will simply never happen

Edited July 21, 2021 by Arheundel.6451

[ZDragon.3046]

11 hours ago, kybraga.7103 said:

I mean, honestly?

 

CPC isn't that bad. It recently came into the meta because they wanted to anti-nades, now we have Prot Holo to prevent Thieves from backcapping while the team is busying trying to kill the Support Guard x Scourge combo.

 

I personally find it hilarious since I always used CPC on Scourge lol!

Necro 4 ever doomed to be the damage soaking profession that is only allowed to damage soak should they ever get or use something that is not letting the enemy get free hits in then its a problem. 

 

CpC is fine at most make the cloud visual a little more vibrant or darker so its easier to spot. It does not need to be removed or nerfed mechanically. It could be something like thief's smoke ring which was considerably more oppressive with the rate it blinded players standing inside it while also destroying projectiles but cpc not even that strong.

 

Imo scourge is not even a problem necromancers biggest problems at the moment are the minion master traits particularly that one that shuffles conditions between the caster the minions and enemy players the minions hit. Res potential on scourge is something else people take issue with and even this "nerf cpc" could be a misguided target at just trying to tone scourge down in general.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

Nerf CPC is certainly misguided. It isn't what is causing Necros to overperform in competitive play. I've said my piece on it in. Nerf Shroud damage reduction, add cast times to scourge F2-F5 (maybe not F5 since it is the 'shroud' for scourge). That and delete Blood Bank and return Vampiric Wells. Buff MH Dagger, poor thing's been dead for so long that Rigor Mortis has set in.

[Vinny.7260]

1 hour ago, ZDragon.3046 said:

Necro 4 ever doomed to be the damage soaking profession that is only allowed to damage soak should they ever get or use something that is not letting the enemy get free hits in then its a problem. 

 

CpC is fine at most make the cloud visual a little more vibrant or darker so its easier to spot. It does not need to be removed or nerfed mechanically. It could be something like thief's smoke ring which was considerably more oppressive with the rate it blinded players standing inside it while also destroying projectiles but cpc not even that strong.

 

Imo scourge is not even a problem necromancers biggest problems at the moment are the minion master traits particularly that one that shuffles conditions between the caster the minions and enemy players the minions hit. Res potential on scourge is something else people take issue with and even this "nerf cpc" could be a misguided target at just trying to tone scourge down in general.

I think people are targeting CPC because it's what is preventing most of the meta damage dealers from shutting them down. 

 

Nades can't passthrough it so the Holosmith has to go Melee, but the Scourge can stack barrier, drop Ghastly, or WoC and shutdown the boon-based setup. There's also the fact CPC inflicts Weakness per pulse and depending on the matchup, the Scourge can have permanent Protection as well. 

 

Renegade can't passthrough it because Shortbow is all about projectiles, except for SB4/SB5. Renegade also can't use Jalis without risk of strengthening the Scourge due to Stability, can't CC because of anti-projectile, etc. 

 

Then people want to use, honestly gimmicky, things like Signet of the Hunt on Sic' 'Em Soulbeast but have the risk of no cooldowns, but it totally can kill off a Scourge if done right because the 10 unlockable attacks can add up to quite a bit of damage, plus using LB5. 

 

There's DE, which people also want to use, but CPC prevents the juicy 222, dodge, 1 combo. 

 

There's also FA Weaver which can actually get through CPC because Air/Fire 3, Air 2, Fire/Fire 3, Fire 2, etc. Issue with FA Weaver is that, "oh nooooo it's too squishy."

 

I think if I were to do anything at all to CPC it'd be remove the Weakness since Tempest with Swirling Winds can get focused down by Staff on Renegade + Impossible Odds, Holosmith can chase down with Sw3, Sw2, and Forge 2, Forge 3, and Forge Autos. 

 

People don't like CPC because it gets rid of the original Weakness Scourge had of ranged specs being able to just one shot. 

 

I'd target Harbinger's Shroud's end barrier to grant less but scale more with Healing Power and halve Last Rites Healing Power granted. They can get a free 450 just for being below 50%. (Which Harbinger's Shroud scales from HEAVILY.)

 

What do I know though, I'm a filthy Elementalist Main. 😜

[Crab Fear.1624]

1 hour ago, kybraga.7103 said:

I think people are targeting CPC because it's what is preventing most of the meta damage dealers from shutting them down. 

 

Nades can't passthrough it so the Holosmith has to go Melee, but the Scourge can stack barrier, drop Ghastly, or WoC and shutdown the boon-based setup. There's also the fact CPC inflicts Weakness per pulse and depending on the matchup, the Scourge can have permanent Protection as well. 

 

Renegade can't passthrough it because Shortbow is all about projectiles, except for SB4/SB5. Renegade also can't use Jalis without risk of strengthening the Scourge due to Stability, can't CC because of anti-projectile, etc. 

 

Then people want to use, honestly gimmicky, things like Signet of the Hunt on Sic' 'Em Soulbeast but have the risk of no cooldowns, but it totally can kill off a Scourge if done right because the 10 unlockable attacks can add up to quite a bit of damage, plus using LB5. 

 

There's DE, which people also want to use, but CPC prevents the juicy 222, dodge, 1 combo. 

 

There's also FA Weaver which can actually get through CPC because Air/Fire 3, Air 2, Fire/Fire 3, Fire 2, etc. Issue with FA Weaver is that, "oh nooooo it's too squishy."

 

I think if I were to do anything at all to CPC it'd be remove the Weakness since Tempest with Swirling Winds can get focused down by Staff on Renegade + Impossible Odds, Holosmith can chase down with Sw3, Sw2, and Forge 2, Forge 3, and Forge Autos. 

 

People don't like CPC because it gets rid of the original Weakness Scourge had of ranged specs being able to just one shot. 

 

I'd target Harbinger's Shroud's end barrier to grant less but scale more with Healing Power and halve Last Rites Healing Power granted. They can get a free 450 just for being below 50%. (Which Harbinger's Shroud scales from HEAVILY.)

 

What do I know though, I'm a filthy Elementalist Main. 😜

Cpc didn't always block projectiles.

 

It has seen several balances over the years, and we are at a point in the game where it is time to look at It again.

 

It has almost 33% uptime for shutting down melee and projectile on a node sized area.

 

You guys are not fooling anyone into thinking that cpc is not a large part of the necro problem.

 

Every single necro bar you see has this skill.

 

 

It is even more laughable.

 

The animation needs stronger visual cues, the cool down needs to go up to 40 seconds and duration needs to go down to 5 secs.

 

This necro is the only one, is ruining competitive game modes.

 

Players say want variety and yet we see 60-80% necros even in the highest of tier play.

 

😆

[Vinny.7260]

16 minutes ago, Crab Fear.1624 said:

Cpc didn't always block projectiles.

 

It has seen several balances over the years, and we are at a point in the game where it is time to look at It again.

 

It has almost 33% uptime for shutting down melee and projectile on a node sized area.

 

You guys are not fooling anyone into thinking that cpc is not a large part of the necro problem.

 

Every single necro bar you see has this skill.

 

 

It is even more laughable.

 

The animation needs stronger visual cues, the cool down needs to go up to 40 seconds and duration needs to go down to 5 secs.

 

This necro is the only one, is ruining competitive game modes.

 

Players say want variety and yet we see 60-80% necros even in the highest of tier play.

 

😆

Let's compare Swirling Winds real quick:

 

360 Radius, 0.5s cast time, 30s cooldown, 6s duration, and built into a mainstream offhand weapon, gets reduced just for going Air traitline. 

 

Let's compare Corrosive Poison Cloud:

 

240 Radius, 0.5s cast time, 30s cooldown, 8s duration, requires taking a utility slot to use. Pulses Weakness and Poison for short durations, requires taking Curses to reduce the cooldown, inflicts Weakness on self.

 

I don't see where you're saying it's a problem. 

 

Literally only Blood Scourge uses this right now. Core Necromancer has no value in using it and loses damage FOR using it. Reaper doesn't use it because it's not useful for Reaper in any way. You're better off going Wurm, Walk, Armor. 

 

Core uses Wurm, Walk, Ring, but sometimes Armor instead of Ring depending on the matchup.

 

Scourge uses CPC, Walk, and WoC. (Sometimes Trail of Anguish instead of Walk.) 

 

Scourge has ONE stun break. 

 

CPC is not the problem. CPC has been able to do this for 6+ years and suddenly it's OP.

 

Please play Scourge yourself, you'll be able to find the problem with it rather than CPC rather quickly. There's a reason why I suggested what I did. 

Edited July 21, 2021 by kybraga.7103
Typos because phone.

[Crab Fear.1624]

39 minutes ago, kybraga.7103 said:

Let's compare Swirling Winds real quick:

 

360 Radius, 0.5s cast time, 30s cooldown, 6s duration, and built into a mainstream offhand weapon, gets reduced just for going Air traitline. 

 

Let's compare Corrosive Poison Cloud:

 

240 Radius, 0.5s cast time, 30s cooldown, 8s duration, requires taking a utility slot to use. Pulses Weakness and Poison for short durations, requires taking Curses to reduce the cooldown, inflicts Weakness on self.

 

I don't see where you're saying it's a problem. 

 

Literally only Blood Scourge uses this right now. Core Necromancer has no value in using it and loses damage FOR using it. Reaper doesn't use it because it's not useful for Reaper in any way. You're better off going Wurm, Walk, Armor. 

 

Core uses Wurm, Walk, Ring, but sometimes Armor instead of Ring depending on the matchup.

 

Scourge uses CPC, Walk, and WoC. (Sometimes Trail of Anguish instead of Walk.) 

 

Scourge has ONE stun break. 

 

CPC is not the problem. CPC has been able to do this for 6+ years and suddenly it's OP.

 

Please play Scourge yourself, you'll be able to find the problem with it rather than CPC rather quickly. There's a reason why I suggested what I did. 

You only need one stun break when your f bar is instant cast.

 

No one is doing enough damage to you to matter, and in that one break, dropping this skill negates any setup from any range on you.

 

This needs a huge nerf.

 

Huge.

[Vinny.7260]

2 minutes ago, Crab Fear.1624 said:

You only need one stun break when your f bar is instant cast.

 

No one is doing enough damage to you to matter, and in that one break, dropping this skill negates any setup from any range on you.

 

This needs a huge nerf.

 

Huge.

Again, CPC isn't the problem here. 

 

The user is being smart or just spamming. 

 

Requiring a bit of thinking is the fun of fighting tankier things in my mind. 

 

If you're a Ranger, use your pet to pressure them while being ranged, Merge and cast Sic' Em, make them panic cast their CPC, LB5, unmerge, wait for CPC to end, One Wolf Pack, LB2. 

 

CPC is a defensive utility being defensive. Heavens no! How dare this work! Scourge is the problem. 

 

Nerf Last Rites Healing Power, reduce base amount of barrier granted by Harbinger's Shroud, increase scaling with Healing Power. 

 

Scourge gets 950 Healing Power being >50%. 

[Arheundel.6451]

2 hours ago, kybraga.7103 said:

Let's compare Swirling Winds real quick:

 

360 Radius, 0.5s cast time, 30s cooldown, 6s duration, and built into a mainstream offhand weapon, gets reduced just for going Air traitline. 

 

Let's compare Corrosive Poison Cloud:

 

240 Radius, 0.5s cast time, 30s cooldown, 8s duration, requires taking a utility slot to use. Pulses Weakness and Poison for short durations, requires taking Curses to reduce the cooldown, inflicts Weakness on self.

 

I don't see where you're saying it's a problem. 

 

Literally only Blood Scourge uses this right now. Core Necromancer has no value in using it and loses damage FOR using it. Reaper doesn't use it because it's not useful for Reaper in any way. You're better off going Wurm, Walk, Armor. 

 

Core uses Wurm, Walk, Ring, but sometimes Armor instead of Ring depending on the matchup.

 

Scourge uses CPC, Walk, and WoC. (Sometimes Trail of Anguish instead of Walk.) 

 

Scourge has ONE stun break. 

 

CPC is not the problem. CPC has been able to do this for 6+ years and suddenly it's OP.

 

Please play Scourge yourself, you'll be able to find the problem with it rather than CPC rather quickly. There's a reason why I suggested what I did. 

What weakness supposed to do to a condi spec exactly?

[Vinny.7260]

Just now, Arheundel.6451 said:

What weakness supposed to do to a condi spec exactly?

Reduce Endurance Regeneration by -50%. 😞

[Arheundel.6451]

Just now, kybraga.7103 said:

Reduce Endurance Regeneration by -50%. 😞

I don't think you understand what I am saying.....

[Vinny.7260]

1 minute ago, Arheundel.6451 said:

I don't think you understand what I am saying.....

Oh! You're referring to the self-inflicted Weakness. It actually does hurt the Scourge if they're not careful and don't have a cleanse. Sure, it has a max duration of 10s but it can hurt the sustain if they're not thinking. Self-inflicted conditions are intended to be a balance to allow for a skill to be more powerful, think of Blood is Power, Epidemic, etc. The trait Master of Corruption adds an additional condition to make it more risky but rewards you with a lower cooldown. 

 

Additionally, Scourges are currently playing Avatar's (Power/Precision/Vitality/Healing Power) because the meta currently has A LOT of condition damage hate. It's part of why Valkyrie Ranger can get around so well right now. 

 

 

[Crab Fear.1624]

33% uptime for melee and projectile negation on a node sized area that also poisons.

 

Look at that.....

 

How is this not strong?

 

How is it not a huge part of the problem?

 

 

It is.

 

Arguing back with long paragraphs and hiding that there is not really an argument is not defense.

 

My first sentence is cased closed.

 

 

Duration 5s, CD 40s, add green smoke.

 

This is the minimum to make it fair. 

[Vinny.7260]

1 hour ago, Crab Fear.1624 said:

33% uptime for melee and projectile negation on a node sized area that also poisons.

 

Look at that.....

 

How is this not strong?

 

How is it not a huge part of the problem?

 

 

It is.

 

Arguing back with long paragraphs and hiding that there is not really an argument is not defense.

 

My first sentence is cased closed.

 

 

Duration 5s, CD 40s, add green smoke.

 

This is the minimum to make it fair. 

I'd explain myself more but I can't use paragraphs.

 

CPC won't hit Scourge where it matters. Nothing will change with that. This isn't covering our rears, it's just not the right move. 

[Crab Fear.1624]

1 hour ago, kybraga.7103 said:

I'd explain myself more but I can't use paragraphs.

 

CPC won't hit Scourge where it matters. Nothing will change with that. This isn't covering our rears, it's just not the right move. 

 

Scourge will take an entire rework, and making barriers so weak will take away from the flavor of the class.

 

If the skill is not a problem, then why is it not slot optional when taking a scourge?

 

This truly is the one change that can make them far less tanky.

 

And, since no other necro uses the skill according to your testimony, then taking it away from the class that it using it, makes a lot of sense.

 

It is better than completely dumstering the class, spec which is what I personally would do, delete it from the game I mean.

 

 

(and for those that want to remove smoke screen, im fine with that, completely fine.)

[ZDragon.3046]

7 hours ago, Crab Fear.1624 said:

You only need one stun break when your f bar is instant cast.

 

No one is doing enough damage to you to matter, and in that one break, dropping this skill negates any setup from any range on you.

 

This needs a huge nerf.

 

Huge.

Mesmer would like to have a word with you then it has 3 different skills on its Fskill bar that are all instant and can instantly flip a fight while they are stunned. by the way

Why are you not asking for mesmer nerfs based on this same argument?

I'll tell you way because its not the problem. 

 

Maybe you should try using a melee setup that handles scourges better? But its too much for you to deviate from what you are use too right BETTER YET what about other classes that have the ability to negate your ranged burst by like BLOCKING? or GOING INVISABLE or INVUNERABLE or other methods of PROJECTILE DISTRUCTION. 

 

You are literally singling 1 skill with pretty bad reasoning.

Edited July 21, 2021 by ZDragon.3046

[Unknown.6851]

The only way I can see them nerfing CPC, would be to also nerf swirling winds, to also nerf smokescreen, to also nerf all of the revenant anti projectile fields too. What about guardian bubbles? Let’s axe those too.

[Crab Fear.1624]

1 hour ago, ZDragon.3046 said:

Mesmer would like to have a word with you then it has 3 different skills on its Fskill bar that are all instant and can instantly flip a fight while they are stunned. by the way

Why are you not asking for mesmer nerfs based on this same argument?

I'll tell you way because its not the problem. 

 

Maybe you should try using a melee setup that handles scourges better? But its too much for you to deviate from what you are use too right BETTER YET what about other classes that have the ability to negate your ranged burst by like BLOCKING? or GOING INVISABLE or INVUNERABLE or other methods of PROJECTILE DISTRUCTION. 

 

You are literally singling 1 skill with pretty bad reasoning.

Blocks have tells and short duration.

 

Stealth  is still damage  tracked if channeled before stealth is cast.

 

Invuln is short duration with big tell.

 

 

Also, the uptime cooldown ration for those is much more reasonable.

 

Stealth being the exception for uptime, but damage reveals and now the defense is gone....also you can't cap while Stealth or invuln.

 

 

Mesmer has f bars aligned with class design, scourge is taking necro design and getting the best part of mesmer.....that's wack design logic.

 

 

CPC is not aligned with the current balance of the game with changes to all other classes design massively in 2020, and it has went unchanged since 2019.

 

It needs a higher cooldown, shorter duration, and better visuals.

 

 

 

 

[Crab Fear.1624]

6 minutes ago, noobfest.2180 said:

The only way I can see them nerfing CPC, would be to also nerf swirling winds, to also nerf smokescreen, to also nerf all of the revenant anti projectile fields too. What about guardian bubbles? Let’s axe those too.

Smoke screen is due for a nerf.

 

What else does Swirling Winds due other than block projectiles and look like a giant whirlwind?

 

 

 

Do these other skills really bring so much?

 

 

The lol of this game. 🤣

 

[ZDragon.3046]

8 hours ago, Crab Fear.1624 said:

Blocks have tells and short duration.

I mean they kind of dont  you pretty much hard read a blocks activation there is no tell as almost all of them are instant activations. You hitting the person and seeing the word blocked is not a tell. A tell is an animation that comes before the effect is activated.

8 hours ago, Crab Fear.1624 said:

 

Stealth  is still damage  tracked if channeled before stealth is cast.

My point is that scourge does not have it

8 hours ago, Crab Fear.1624 said:

 

Invuln is short duration with big tell.

Also not really tells for this they just activate instantly in most cases especially mesmer's as it can be activated "WHILE STUNNED"

8 hours ago, Crab Fear.1624 said:

 

Also, the uptime cooldown ration for those is much more reasonable.

Because THEY ARE STRONGER imagine an invuln lasting 10s and having a 40s cd 

You do understand that invulnerability means you cant be harmed by any damage effects or mechanics while projectile destruction does nothing against mele damage or gound targeted abilities right? The difference in defensive strength is why the uptime is much different. If cpc is going to have the same uptime as distortion, daggerstorm, or renewed focus it better make me immune to all types of incoming damage if you can agree to that then ill agree with the uptime nerf. The fact that i even had to type this should let you know how silly your comparisons sounds here.

8 hours ago, Crab Fear.1624 said:

Mesmer has f bars aligned with class design, scourge is taking necro design and getting the best part of mesmer.....that's wack design logic.

So scourge cant have bars with class design but mesmer can?

Where is my distortion? 

Where are my instant blinks?

Where are my insanely high speed shatter burst level dps?

What part of mesmer is the best that necro got?

Because it has F skills that are instant?

Thief has this 

Guardian has this

Mesmer has this

Even core necro and reaper technically have it through shroud activation

More examples you have yet to complain about btw which means the instant f skills are not the problem

 

8 hours ago, Crab Fear.1624 said:

 

CPC is not aligned with the current balance of the game with changes to all other classes design massively in 2020, and it has went unchanged since 2019.

There ARE a ton of skills that didnt get changed in 2019 and 2020 across all classes and many of them are the things that are currently used as ranged viability btw.  So if you want to change everything based on the fact that it was not changed then dont forget to cull all that ranged burst at the same time so that they are "aligned with the current balance of the game."

8 hours ago, Crab Fear.1624 said:

 

It needs a higher cooldown, shorter duration, and better visuals.

 

Better visual is fair the rest not so much based on everything else you've said. 

I would suggest you learn how to use other ranged options that are not specifically projectiles the game has plenty of them and cpc will do nothing to stop those types of attacks.

 

Till then im done with this conversation I assume this has just ben another thread to pull peoples legs but i wanted to see for myself as its been a while. Its been a pleasant exchange and reminder to why i shouldn't take you seriously even after all this time. 🙂

[Crab Fear.1624]

5 hours ago, ZDragon.3046 said:

I mean they kind of dont  you pretty much hard read a blocks activation there is no tell as almost all of them are instant activations. You hitting the person and seeing the word blocked is not a tell. A tell is an animation that comes before the effect is activated.

My point is that scourge does not have it

Also not really tells for this they just activate instantly in most cases especially mesmer's as it can be activated "WHILE STUNNED"

Because THEY ARE STRONGER imagine an invuln lasting 10s and having a 40s cd 

You do understand that invulnerability means you cant be harmed by any damage effects or mechanics while projectile destruction does nothing against mele damage or gound targeted abilities right? The difference in defensive strength is why the uptime is much different. If cpc is going to have the same uptime as distortion, daggerstorm, or renewed focus it better make me immune to all types of incoming damage if you can agree to that then ill agree with the uptime nerf. The fact that i even had to type this should let you know how silly your comparisons sounds here.

So scourge cant have bars with class design but mesmer can?

Where is my distortion? 

Where are my instant blinks?

Where are my insanely high speed shatter burst level dps?

What part of mesmer is the best that necro got?

Because it has F skills that are instant?

Thief has this 

Guardian has this

Mesmer has this

Even core necro and reaper technically have it through shroud activation

More examples you have yet to complain about btw which means the instant f skills are not the problem

 

There ARE a ton of skills that didnt get changed in 2019 and 2020 across all classes and many of them are the things that are currently used as ranged viability btw.  So if you want to change everything based on the fact that it was not changed then dont forget to cull all that ranged burst at the same time so that they are "aligned with the current balance of the game."

Better visual is fair the rest not so much based on everything else you've said. 

I would suggest you learn how to use other ranged options that are not specifically projectiles the game has plenty of them and cpc will do nothing to stop those types of attacks.

 

Till then im done with this conversation I assume this has just ben another thread to pull peoples legs but i wanted to see for myself as its been a while. Its been a pleasant exchange and reminder to why i shouldn't take you seriously even after all this time. 🙂

 

You are defending an over tuned skill, and changing the argument.

 

I am glad you will stop conversing, as you have said not one true or accurate point.

 

CPC needs a cooldown increase, a duration decrease, and a better visuals.

 

Suggested:

 

40, 5, and green smoke.

[Crab Fear.1624]

Blocks have clear animations, and they are literally holding a shield up, or aegis in on their icon bar.

 

 

Stealth does not prevent damage, channels are tracked, and you can not capture.

 

 

Invuln changes the character animation, puts them in an odd stance, has blur in icon bar,, or shrinks them to the size of a brownie.

 

 

These are VERY CLEAR visuals, or there is very serious drawbacks.

 

 

In CPC, you won't have to worry about projectiles, and melee get the worst damage reduction. Also, poison about, so now you Healing is hampered.

 

It last 8 secs, and has only 30 sec cd. I don't believe anyone runs the trait for it, so that's just the standard edition.

 

The effects, benefits,  and up versus downtime are out of line with the game.

 

Maybe other skills need a pass, but they are not standing out like this one, feel free to suggest.

 

 

 

 

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

Crab Fear has chosen a hill coated in CPC to die on it seems.

[Vancho.8750]

On 7/21/2021 at 2:28 PM, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Nerf CPC is certainly misguided. It isn't what is causing Necros to overperform in competitive play. I've said my piece on it in. Nerf Shroud damage reduction, add cast times to scourge F2-F5 (maybe not F5 since it is the 'shroud' for scourge). That and delete Blood Bank and return Vampiric Wells. Buff MH Dagger, poor thing's been dead for so long that Rigor Mortis has set in.

Touching how shroud works isn't good idea, for one it might break WvW somehow on the other when the burst meta comes back core and reaper will be sucking dirt. Touching the reduction would just end up like the defense line nerfs on warrior, it will just add more issues and I think it is hardcoded to how it works, easier solution to nerf survivability on core and reaper is to nerf the Worm port cooldown since the damage reduction doesn't mean much if you cant escape. Basically it is not broken and it doesn't need fixing, it is fine mechanic, good for teamfights and not so good for sidenodes.   

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

6 minutes ago, Vancho.8750 said:

Touching how shroud works isn't good idea, for one it might break WvW somehow on the other when the burst meta comes back core and reaper will be sucking dirt. Touching the reduction would just end up like the defense line nerfs on warrior, it will just add more issues and I think it is hardcoded to how it works, easier solution to nerf survivability on core and reaper is to nerf the Worm port cooldown since the damage reduction doesn't mean much if you cant escape. Basically it is not broken and it doesn't need fixing, it is fine mechanic, good for teamfights and not so good for sidenodes.   

If the Burst meta comes back then the shroud dmg reduction would have to be reset as well. I only recommend that change in regards to this lower damage meta. I also make that recommendation both as someone who plays a reaper and someone who fights against reapers/core necros and am well aware of what the repercussions would be.

The bigger underlying issue is that there is no real caps on how much % added damage someone can do, nor is there a real cap on the % reduced damage someone can attain.