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Problem: Players wanted/asked for pvp content.
Reason: Anet wants to do PVE content.
Action: Anet makes the characters feel terrible in pvp, trashes balance.
Solution: If no one plays pvp no one will ask for pvp content.

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Just a friendly reminder that:

- sPvP players asked for trait procs to be nerfed and that's why they don't crit.

- sPvP players asked for invuln trait proc to be nerfed and that's why there are so many 300s ICD traits.

- sPvP players asked for a blanket nerf to damage in competitive and that's why the balance is what it is right now.

90% of the changes to balance are initiated from the sPvP subforum, 5% can be attributed to WvW and the last 5% to PvE.

 

There is plenty of PvP modes:

  1. sPvP (conquest, 3v3, 2v2, deathmatch... etc.),
  2. WvW,
  3. Activities (southsun survival, crab toss, keg brawl),
  4. Mini game (Belcher's bluff),
  5. Races (sanctum sprint, Griffon race...),
  6. Festival activities (lunatic inquisition, reaper's rumble, bell choir ensemble, snowball mayhem, dragonball arena...)

And I'm almost sure that EoD will add even more variety to this amount. Even if the "PvP players" disregard it because it's not yet another conquest map that nobody will welcome due to fps/mechanism... etc.

 

The various PvP modes are there, players encouraged to do them through the daily system. Heck! there are even arena in the guild halls where you can duel if you feel it's not enough.

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More like: pvp was kind of abandoned for a while, pvp community got really small because many left, it is not worth it to do many frequent changes for a small community. Although, they actually did do quite a lot of things for pvp in the past but way too late. Those changes were needed at launch. If i was a pvp dev (if such even exist, i actually doubt it) i wouldn't know how to convince management to give me budget for proper pvp team/development in current state of things.

Edited by Cynz.9437
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4 hours ago, Cynz.9437 said:

If i was a pvp dev (if such even exist, i actually doubt it) i wouldn't know how to convince management to give me budget for proper pvp team/development in current state of things.

I'd argue that PvP and also WvW, competitive content in general, actually needs the least effort so it's not like they'd need a huge budget anyway. But if they could manage to achieve an enjoyable baseline then a lot of people (at least those who don't completely reject competitive content) would have an opportunity to spend their game time without constant dev input.

PvE content gets stale pretty quickly and story is usually only replayable to a certain extent. If this content is "used up" for the majority of the players the devs have to add new stuff or they will otherwise quit and maybe come back later (which is not a bad thing tbh, it gets bad when people don't come back for new stuff).

Ideally new stuff gets added at the same pace as a specific part of the players are consuming it. But this just doesn't work with story content at all as development time is always a hell of a lot bigger than the time needed to consume. So focusing the amount of resources on Living Story/World was to me a major mistake they somehow didn't fix to this day.

But establishing an enjoyable sPvP or WvW environment would help a lot of players and small communities/guilds better bridge the time between story/pve content releases. So being able to keep a large portion of the playerbase busy with little effort spent is just a good economic decision for Anet as a business but sPvP simply is not in a spot where this is possible and Anet refuses to put in even the bare minimum of effort.

 

sPvP is not inherently unenjoyable for the majority of people either, it's just how Anet handles things. To some extent I also blame the community tbh because they are undenyably toxic af and claiming the game to be dead/dying on every possible occassion in youtube comments, reddit, twitch streams,... is not particularly helpful in catching new players either.  Nobody wants to ride a dead horse so painting this picture publicly is harmful. But this doesn't relief the pressure on Anet for neglecting their game modes to me, quite the opposite actually.

I mean, I don't know a lot of people who play LoL or Dota2 because of the astonishing story mode or PvE content and I don't remember them actually adding a lot of new content, just skins and chars so people can buy more skins for them as well (it works for a lot of genres like shooters, strategy, etc as well, I'm just picking MOBAs here because I think they are actually fairly comparable to GW2 sPvP). 
Despite them being purely competitive games they have massive successes, even among the casual audiences - LoL more so than Dota2 but still. So arguing that sPvP doesn't fit the philosophy of gw2 or doesn't match its target audience or anything is just wrong in my opinion.

Edited by DoomNexus.5324
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4 hours ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

Just a friendly reminder that:

- sPvP players asked for trait procs to be nerfed and that's why they don't crit.

- sPvP players asked for invuln trait proc to be nerfed and that's why there are so many 300s ICD traits.

- sPvP players asked for a blanket nerf to damage in competitive and that's why the balance is what it is right now.

90% of the changes to balance are initiated from the sPvP subforum, 5% can be attributed to WvW and the last 5% to PvE.

 

There is plenty of PvP modes:

  1. sPvP (conquest, 3v3, 2v2, deathmatch... etc.),
  2. WvW,
  3. Activities (southsun survival, crab toss, keg brawl),
  4. Mini game (Belcher's bluff),
  5. Races (sanctum sprint, Griffon race...),
  6. Festival activities (lunatic inquisition, reaper's rumble, bell choir ensemble, snowball mayhem, dragonball arena...)

And I'm almost sure that EoD will add even more variety to this amount. Even if the "PvP players" disregard it because it's not yet another conquest map that nobody will welcome due to fps/mechanism... etc.

 

The various PvP modes are there, players encouraged to do them through the daily system. Heck! there are even arena in the guild halls where you can duel if you feel it's not enough.

Nobody asked for invuln traits to be nerfed to 300s CD. Why are you trying to pin that on PvP players? And nobody asked for a blanket nerf to damage. A reduction in power-creep, sure, but not a ham-fisted blanket nerf to everything.

 

It's like, you ask me to wash your car, so I do it by throwing it in the sea, and when you complain I go "bUt YoU wAnTeD mE tO wAsH iT"

Edited by Ragnar.4257
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1 minute ago, Ragnar.4257 said:

Nobody asked for invuln traits to be nerfed to 300s CD. Why are you trying to pin that on PvP players?

 

It's like, you ask me to wash your car, so I do it by throwing it in the sea, and when you complain I go "bUt YoU wAnTeD mE tO wAsH iT"

I asked for a nerf on those traits, but not 300 seconds. More like 120 seconds.

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4 hours ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

There is plenty of PvP modes:

  1. sPvP (conquest, 3v3, 2v2, deathmatch... etc.),
  2. WvW,
  3. Activities (southsun survival, crab toss, keg brawl),
  4. Mini game (Belcher's bluff),
  5. Races (sanctum sprint, Griffon race...),
  6. Festival activities (lunatic inquisition, reaper's rumble, bell choir ensemble, snowball mayhem, dragonball arena...)

When people talk about PvP in GW2 it's pretty much always sPvP tho.
So out of those 6 things you've mentioned it boils down to the first one. Not because the other options are not good or anything, they are just irrelevant in this context. 
And even the stuff you've listed for sPvP is not correct. Apart from conquest there is no ranked mode or AT for any other mode. 3v3, 2v2, etc are not even accessible outside their respective 2-week window every few months either. And that's the part where people are complaining. It would already be a huge improvement to sPvP if we had the stuff from the recent Special Tournament event all the time but we don't (yet.. I'm still hopeful they add this stuff permanently).
 

 

4 hours ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

Even if the "PvP players" disregard it because it's not yet another conquest map that nobody will welcome due to fps/mechanism... etc.

 

The various PvP modes are there, players encouraged to do them through the daily system. Heck! there are even arena in the guild halls where you can duel if you feel it's not enough.

It's not that we only want another conquest map, quite the opposite actually.  I mean a new map or two would be highly appreciated but conquest has been essentially the same for 9 years. Without any variety to ranked whatsoever. Other modes are in the game but practically not playable and that's the main issue. Being able to play Stronghold from time to time is extremely helpful for me because I like the game mode. But even Stronghold feels a bit like a waste of time because there's no progression for basically anything other than the reward track. Not for the season rewards and not for any important achievement, nothing relevant. Like.. I'm not asking for new rewards or anything but not getting existing rewards just because I play the more enjoyable version of the very same game mode just leaves a sour taste. I don't want to choose between fun and progression, I want both at the same time and I think it's not something I should have to choose between in a game.

 

Regarding the guild hall arenas.. They use PvE balance which is even more scuffed than PvP balance..
I don't know why I have to say this at this point but I want to have a good quality time in a video game, I don't play it because my life would be boring without it. And GW2 has always had great potential and is also a good game so people naturally want it to be at its best. It's not bashing the devs for being incompetent, we just see the potential that's there (especially since it was in a better shape in the past) and are sad to see it wasting away.

Edited by DoomNexus.5324
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6 minutes ago, DoomNexus.5324 said:

I'd argue that PvP and also WvW, competitive content in general, actually needs the least effort so it's not like they'd need a huge budget anyway. ...

 

Do you know a budget of a small patch with few number tweaks? We can only guess (design, development, testing, rollout). It is not little and can be invested into skin design for example. Let's be honest, PvP community doesn't want just some number tweaks on few spells. Many things need complete redesign to make pvp somehow enjoyable. You would need dedicated team to keep balance in check but also make sure that it won't get boring after a while - that is actually expensive. You named LoL as an example - they do have whole teams for such purpose.

It is hard to compare LoL to GW2 because those game were created with different purpose in mind. GW2 is an RPG on first place, LoL is a pvp game.

GW2 lives of roleplaying (and i don't mean people sitting in the bar in DR typing things in brackets, i mean people making characters, running through zones pretending being pokemon masters, killing bosses in raids so they can have some shiney armor etc.), the majority does not play the game for pvp. If Anet deleted pvp all together today, GW2 would still have decent population.

 

LoL lives off pvp. It has nothing else. That is why LoL has whole teams dedicated to combat and balance only - because it is only thing that will keep people in the game. If no new characters or spell changes happened over the years, LoL would be dead.

 

Don't get me wrong, I really wish this game had better pvp and that game mode would have gotten more attention. However realistically investing a lot of money into some feature of an OLD game just won't happen. I am honestly surprised they even made the split between pvp and pve spells.

 

My point was just to disagree with OP post claiming that Anet doesn't want to deal with pvp. I truly believe that some devs at company are interested in this game mode but can only do so much.

 

 

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3 minutes ago, Cynz.9437 said:

Do you know a budget of a small patch with few number tweaks? We can only guess (design, development, testing, rollout). It is not little and can be invested into skin design for example. Let's be honest, PvP community doesn't want just some number tweaks on few spells. Many things need complete redesign to make pvp somehow enjoyable. You would need dedicated team to keep balance in check but also make sure that it won't get boring after a while - that is actually expensive. You named LoL as an example - they do have whole teams for such purpose.

I obviously don't know the specifics from ArenaNet but I'm a software engineer myself and am involved in game development too, so I think I'm fairly confident with some rough estimates. At least estimating effort for thing A in comparison to thing B or C, not exact monetary values. And yes I fully agree, if Anet wanted to actually achieve a good baseline they'd definitely spend a bit of resources but that's just because they've basically neglected the game mode for an eternity.
If I never ever maintain my house for decades I shouldn't be surprised if I have to suddenly spend a small fortune on restaurations. But if it's in good shape I don't have to spend nearly as much for maintaining it.
Regarding the skin design argument.. It does make sense on paper but that's not how it actually works. It doesn't scale indefinitely since there's a diminishing return and without a sufficiently enjoyable game to back it up nobody will want to buy skins anymore.

 

4 minutes ago, Cynz.9437 said:

It is hard to compare LoL to GW2 because those game were created with different purpose in mind. GW2 is an RPG on first place, LoL is a pvp game.

GW2 lives of roleplaying (...) the majority does not play the game for pvp. If Anet deleted pvp all together today, GW2 would still have decent population.

I don't agree with the first statement. sPvP was an integral component of GW2's design in the beginning and a big chunk of the original team were hardcore PvP players. Heck they even tried to establish GW2 in the ESL. I don't buy the "GW2 is not designed to be competitive"-argument. It drifted away, which is the worst part to the entire story because a lot of the original players still want it to succeed and there's just no good alternative out there. Nothing that beats GW2's sPvP system. Otherwise every PvP player would've already left the game and play something else.
And the second statement is just a self-constructed phenomenon. If Anet drives away the majority of the playerbase of a game mode it's just natural for the game mode to lose influence. If Anet didn't kitten up the game mode and didn't simply neglect glaring issues while ESL was a thing we wouldn't have this discussion now and the "low population"-argument wouldn't be a thing.

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1 hour ago, Ragnar.4257 said:

Nobody asked for invuln traits to be nerfed to 300s CD. Why are you trying to pin that on PvP players? And nobody asked for a blanket nerf to damage. A reduction in power-creep, sure, but not a ham-fisted blanket nerf to everything.

 

It's like, you ask me to wash your car, so I do it by throwing it in the sea, and when you complain I go "bUt YoU wAnTeD mE tO wAsH iT"

 

Let me repharse it: sPvP players ask for invuln proc traits to be removed of the game because it was qualified as "unskillful" and "unfair", that's why ANet put a 300s CD on them at a time when the dev team was unavailable and thus they could only make "number change".

 

Everyday, on this subforum, people ask for skills, traits, amulets and even whole professions to be removed from the game. It come back biting at them afterward with useless overnerfed traits, that's what I meant.

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26 minutes ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

 

Let me repharse it: sPvP players ask for invuln proc traits to be removed of the game because it was qualified as "unskillful" and "unfair", that's why ANet put a 300s CD on them at a time when the dev team was unavailable and thus they could only make "number change".

 

Everyday, on this subforum, people ask for skills, traits, amulets and even whole professions to be removed from the game. It come back biting at them afterward with useless overnerfed traits, that's what I meant.

A good case of 'careful what you wish for!'

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3 hours ago, Shao.7236 said:

I asked for a nerf on those traits, but not 300 seconds. More like 120 seconds.

 

Everyone's askin for nerfs i've seen folks say nerf ele nerf this and that complaining about mist form onyx skin and other stuff and overload air and folks constantly complained about warrior, which is why it got nerfed so hard.

 

Just look at how hard mesmers got hit with the nerf bat.


Sometimes people speak logically, but its fairly obvious a lot don't know what they are talking about and don't understand what the problem is, like asking for all stealth to be nerfed won't solve the issues with thief, because their moves are very mobile.

 

Nerfing Necromancer staff won't get rid of the issues with scourge, just hinder a support weapon.

 

Edited by Axl.8924
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8 hours ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

Just a friendly reminder that:

- sPvP players asked for trait procs to be nerfed and that's why they don't crit.

- sPvP players asked for invuln trait proc to be nerfed and that's why there are so many 300s ICD traits.

- sPvP players asked for a blanket nerf to damage in competitive and that's why the balance is what it is right now.

90% of the changes to balance are initiated from the sPvP subforum, 5% can be attributed to WvW and the last 5% to PvE.

 

There is plenty of PvP modes:

  1. sPvP (conquest, 3v3, 2v2, deathmatch... etc.),
  2. WvW,
  3. Activities (southsun survival, crab toss, keg brawl),
  4. Mini game (Belcher's bluff),
  5. Races (sanctum sprint, Griffon race...),
  6. Festival activities (lunatic inquisition, reaper's rumble, bell choir ensemble, snowball mayhem, dragonball arena...)

And I'm almost sure that EoD will add even more variety to this amount. Even if the "PvP players" disregard it because it's not yet another conquest map that nobody will welcome due to fps/mechanism... etc.

 

The various PvP modes are there, players encouraged to do them through the daily system. Heck! there are even arena in the guild halls where you can duel if you feel it's not enough.

Just a friendly reminder that its developers choice to implement things, if something was asked for and introduced that is no excuse for that thing being kitten, there is difference between reducing TTK and turning a game into a bunker infested shithole for a year and more.
Here we go, Imma ask for 100% removal of all CC. So if this kitten ever gets implemented make sure to blame me and not the amazing developer who decided to put it into the game.
BTW
devs dont give a kitten enough to explain or give excuses so I dont see a reason why would you.

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I believe the root problem all these years is upper management has never looked at the game objectively.
GuildWars Original has a style/feel that suits PvE content very well, no matter how you spin PvP there it feels limited due to the playable character platform, WvW would still be kinda off(neat though)if spun into GW1.
GuildWars2 has an entirely different playable character system(more plat-former) that inherently suits PvP well, and carried sPvP/WvW through years of neglect, but PvE won't age as well in GW2 as GW1, won't survive neglect, jumping puzzles maybe fun but everything including JP's are same stuff different day, the same mechanics used 1000 times each.

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3 hours ago, Stand The Wall.6987 said:

the moral of the story is to stop asking for changes cuz anet is either too extreme or the changes are too underwhelming. stop trying to make the game better, stop hoping for a better tomorrow, stop life.

I don't know... there are still warrior mains. So, obviously Anet needs to nerf warrior more.

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Devs: Works in an industry infamously riddled with crunch. Probably not the type of person with free time to invest into an MMO while balancing work and life. 

 

Also Devs: Decides to compensate for lack of knowledge by garnering feedback from the community about what they like/dislike. What they would like to see changed

 

The community: https://imgur.com/a/Q6gefoq

 

Devs: follows community advice

 

The community: Stoopid! You should know better than to listen to what I say!

 

 

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2 hours ago, Kuma.1503 said:

Devs: Works in an industry infamously riddled with crunch. Probably not the type of person with free time to invest into an MMO while balancing work and life. 

 

Also Devs: Decides to compensate for lack of knowledge by garnering feedback from the community about what they like/dislike. What they would like to see changed

 

The community: https://imgur.com/a/Q6gefoq

 

Devs: follows community advice

 

The community: Stoopid! You should know better than to listen to what I say!

 

 

 

But they are not following the advice of pvpers. 

 

Often changes that happen get backlash because it was not what was requested.

 

They are not in tune, or they are following the discord mafia advice, which only has their own "precious" status in mind.

 

The community ask to end one shots, specifically....and they were known as thief, mes, and ranger.....nope blanket 33% damage reduction and no more damage on hard cc.....

 

That's not listening.....that's like just doing whatever they want, and whatever because it's their game, but they can't blame the community for that.

 

 

Thing is, the community has noticed res is too string with this Feb 2020 patch, and we say it's too strong....

 

Did they nerf it?

 

Nope, added sigil of transference. 

 

They are literally going opposite.

 

 

Esports died to the bunker and flashy but boringly long team fight metas.

 

Conquest should have several elements to to be focused on to be successful.....

 

 

Noooooooo,

 

 

Let's just make games 60-80% necros.

 

 

Which is also being talked about for 1.5 years.....

 

 

Still a problem....they literally listen to very small advice.

 

Just because a patch might hit one thing that was asked for, if you look, they always add in some weird other balancing that pretty much negates it.

 

If anything, this group of devs often goes the opposite direction of the community, or disguises divergence with false accommodation.

 

 

Case in point, even though people were mostly happy with scourge gone, it is back and possible worse than ever because virtually without counter or equal lb for lb.

 

Don't you dare try to pin this ss on the community, they only part of the community to blame are the ones who can actually make change.....

 

 

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3 minutes ago, Crab Fear.1624 said:

 

But they are not following the advice of pvpers. 

 

Often changes that happen get backlash because it was not what was requested.

 

They are not in tune, or they are following the discord mafia advice, which only has their own "precious" status in mind.

 

The community ask to end one shots, specifically....and they were known as thief, mes, and ranger.....nope blanket 33% damage reduction and no more damage on hard cc.....

 

That's not listening.....that's like just doing whatever they want, and whatever because it's their game, but they can't blame the community for that.

 

 

Thing is, the community has noticed res is too string with this Feb 2020 patch, and we say it's too strong....

 

Did they nerf it?

 

Nope, added sigil of transference. 

 

They are literally going opposite.

 

 

Esports died to the bunker and flashy but boringly long team fight metas.

 

Conquest should have several elements to to be focused on to be successful.....

 

 

Noooooooo,

 

 

Let's just make games 60-80% necros.

 

 

Which is also being talked about for 1.5 years.....

 

 

Still a problem....they literally listen to very small advice.

 

Just because a patch might hit one thing that was asked for, if you look, they always add in some weird other balancing that pretty much negates it.

 

If anything, this group of devs often goes the opposite direction of the community, or disguises divergence with false accommodation.

 

 

Case in point, even though people were mostly happy with scourge gone, it is back and possible worse than ever because virtually without counter or equal lb for lb.

 

Don't you dare try to pin this ss on the community, they only part of the community to blame are the ones who can actually make change.....

 

 

 

What? Patches often hit *multiple things* that are talked about. 

 

Here is a non-comprehensive list of things that, at one point, were hot topics on the forms post Feb 2020, and were nerfed shortly after.

 

Fire Weaver

  • Burning significnatly reduced
  • Cooldowns increased
  • Barrier reduced
  • Obsidian Flesh went through several reworks/nerfs
  • Sustain reduced

 

Condi Rev

  • Reduced sustain by targeting shield skills and various traits
  • Resistance uptime heavily nerfed
  • Torment application nerfed
  • Banish enchantment cost increased
  • Protection duration on Glint reduced
  • Jallis stability nerfed which hits core condi rev

 

 

Rez traits (contrary to popular belief, these have been nerfed.)

 

  • Arcane restoration: 7% per pulse --> 1% per pulse. This killed the ambulence staff ele build
  • Ritual of life 4% --> 1% per pulse 
  • Transfusion 2% per pulse --> 1% per pulse
  • Related: Ele rez glyph + mist form bug fixed

 

Firebrand

  • Boon durations reduced
  • Mantras nerfed, power added to final charge
  • Heal mantra gutted
  • Tome skill base heal nerfed. Coefficients slightly increased (net nerf)
  • Symbol radius nerf
  • Symbol heal trait nerfed

 

Renegade

  • Seven shot nerfed
  • Charged mists: 25 bonus energy --> 10 bonus energy
  • Vindication might generation nerfed (This was huge)
  • Rune of speed nerfed largely because of renegade
  • Cele amulet removed because of renegade
  • Soulcleave icd added
  • Shiro port cooldown increased (also affects herald)

 

Holosmith

  • Holo leap cooldown 2 seconds -> 4 seconds
  • Corona burst might generation reduced
  • Hard light areana cooldown 30 seconds --> 50 seconds. Field duration 8 seconds --> 4 seconds. Bonus heat duration 4 seconds --> 2 seconds
  • Grenades nerfed several times (also hits core and scrapper)
  • Mortar kit 2-4 coefficients reduced. Flash shell cooldown increased. 

 

 

All of these are just off the top of my head. These were all hot topics on the forums, and each got hit, often times to an positive response of "Thanks for hitting the right things" Or "Good targeted nerfs, but not enough. Nerf this next".

 

I don't know why but people here seem to have either vert short memory or very selective memory because they will happily cherry pick scenarios where the devs did not do what the community wanted and use that as evidence for why the game is failing when there is an easily confirmable patch history that shows the exact opposite.  

 

 

 

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30 minutes ago, Kuma.1503 said:

 

What? Patches often hit *multiple things* that are talked about. 

 

Here is a non-comprehensive list of things that, at one point, were hot topics on the forms post Feb 2020, and were nerfed shortly after.

 

Fire Weaver

  • Burning significnatly reduced
  • Cooldowns increased
  • Barrier reduced
  • Obsidian Flesh went through several reworks/nerfs
  • Sustain reduced

 

Condi Rev

  • Reduced sustain by targeting shield skills and various traits
  • Resistance uptime heavily nerfed
  • Torment application nerfed
  • Banish enchantment cost increased
  • Protection duration on Glint reduced
  • Jallis stability nerfed which hits core condi rev

 

 

Rez traits (contrary to popular belief, these have been nerfed.)

 

  • Arcane restoration: 7% per pulse --> 1% per pulse. This killed the ambulence staff ele build
  • Ritual of life 4% --> 1% per pulse 
  • Transfusion 2% per pulse --> 1% per pulse
  • Related: Ele rez glyph + mist form bug fixed

 

Firebrand

  • Boon durations reduced
  • Mantras nerfed, power added to final charge
  • Heal mantra gutted
  • Tome skill base heal nerfed. Coefficients slightly increased (net nerf)
  • Symbol radius nerf
  • Symbol heal trait nerfed

 

Renegade

  • Seven shot nerfed
  • Charged mists: 25 bonus energy --> 10 bonus energy
  • Vindication might generation nerfed (This was huge)
  • Rune of speed nerfed largely because of renegade
  • Cele amulet removed because of renegade
  • Soulcleave icd added
  • Shiro port cooldown increased (also affects herald)

 

Holosmith

  • Holo leap cooldown 2 seconds -> 4 seconds
  • Corona burst might generation reduced
  • Hard light areana cooldown 30 seconds --> 50 seconds. Field duration 8 seconds --> 4 seconds. Bonus heat duration 4 seconds --> 2 seconds
  • Grenades nerfed several times (also hits core and scrapper)
  • Mortar kit 2-4 coefficients reduced. Flash shell cooldown increased. 

 

 

All of these are just off the top of my head. These were all hot topics on the forums, and each got hit, often times to an positive response of "Thanks for hitting the right things" Or "Good targeted nerfs, but not enough. Nerf this next".

 

I don't know why but people here seem to have either vert short memory or very selective memory because they will happily cherry pick scenarios where the devs did not do what the community wanted and use that as evidence for why the game is failing when there is an easily confirmable patch history that shows the exact opposite.  

 

 

 

I cherry picked the biggest most important cherries.

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32 minutes ago, Kuma.1503 said:

 

What? Patches often hit *multiple things* that are talked about. 

 

Here is a non-comprehensive list of things that, at one point, were hot topics on the forms post Feb 2020, and were nerfed shortly after.

 

Fire Weaver

  • Burning significnatly reduced
  • Cooldowns increased
  • Barrier reduced
  • Obsidian Flesh went through several reworks/nerfs
  • Sustain reduced

 

Condi Rev

  • Reduced sustain by targeting shield skills and various traits
  • Resistance uptime heavily nerfed
  • Torment application nerfed
  • Banish enchantment cost increased
  • Protection duration on Glint reduced
  • Jallis stability nerfed which hits core condi rev

 

 

Rez traits (contrary to popular belief, these have been nerfed.)

 

  • Arcane restoration: 7% per pulse --> 1% per pulse. This killed the ambulence staff ele build
  • Ritual of life 4% --> 1% per pulse 
  • Transfusion 2% per pulse --> 1% per pulse
  • Related: Ele rez glyph + mist form bug fixed

 

Firebrand

  • Boon durations reduced
  • Mantras nerfed, power added to final charge
  • Heal mantra gutted
  • Tome skill base heal nerfed. Coefficients slightly increased (net nerf)
  • Symbol radius nerf
  • Symbol heal trait nerfed

 

Renegade

  • Seven shot nerfed
  • Charged mists: 25 bonus energy --> 10 bonus energy
  • Vindication might generation nerfed (This was huge)
  • Rune of speed nerfed largely because of renegade
  • Cele amulet removed because of renegade
  • Soulcleave icd added
  • Shiro port cooldown increased (also affects herald)

 

Holosmith

  • Holo leap cooldown 2 seconds -> 4 seconds
  • Corona burst might generation reduced
  • Hard light areana cooldown 30 seconds --> 50 seconds. Field duration 8 seconds --> 4 seconds. Bonus heat duration 4 seconds --> 2 seconds
  • Grenades nerfed several times (also hits core and scrapper)
  • Mortar kit 2-4 coefficients reduced. Flash shell cooldown increased. 

 

 

All of these are just off the top of my head. These were all hot topics on the forums, and each got hit, often times to an positive response of "Thanks for hitting the right things" Or "Good targeted nerfs, but not enough. Nerf this next".

 

I don't know why but people here seem to have either vert short memory or very selective memory because they will happily cherry pick scenarios where the devs did not do what the community wanted and use that as evidence for why the game is failing when there is an easily confirmable patch history that shows the exact opposite.  

 

 

 

Also, you pointed out damage, after th patch right?

 

Look at the list.....

 

Not what the community asked.

 

RES TRAITS.....SCOURGE......TRAPPER RUNE. ..

 

holy cow, this is the real focus, what did they do?

 

 

Only to prove me right, thanks.

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Considering the new expansion will bring a ton of old and new players back/to the game it would be crazy to ignore PvP. PvP the game mode that cost f all in upkeep, it has the most replayability of anything in a game, the players create the content themselves. All you do is provide the maps and PvP structure. 

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33 minutes ago, Crab Fear.1624 said:

Also, you pointed out damage, after th patch right?

 

Look at the list.....

 

Not what the community asked.

 

RES TRAITS.....SCOURGE......TRAPPER RUNE. ..

 

holy cow, this is the real focus, what did they do?

 

 

Only to prove me right, thanks.

 

I literally mentioned res trait nerfs in my post. 🤦‍♂️

 

And yes, people did complain about things dealing too much damage after the Feb patch dropped. People asking for the things to get nerfed to the detriment of the game is kind of the entire point of my post...

 

Scourge has also been hit recently, both directly and indirectly. The changes weren't enough naturally. Perhaps damage is too low in comparison to how durable scourges are...

 

Perhaps some of the previous nerfed listed (as well as several unlisted such as the nerfs to rune of resistance and nerf to burn DH both of which were helping keep necro in check to an extent. Both being nerfs the community asked for.) might have something to do with that. 

 

Just because the devs haven't caved and nerfed the most recent things people are complaining about. That doesn't just magically negate the many times they did in the past. 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Kuma.1503
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