Our New Mesmer Elite Specialization: The Virtuoso

[Jokubas.4265]

The Bad:

My initial reaction was a fair amount of disappointment. The new F skills mirror the Shatters quite closely, we're getting another one handed weapon, and even the name is misleading. It feels like more of the same in a lot of the places that the Mesmer forums have been critiquing for years (it also fails to address any issues I've had with Elite Specializations as a whole that have me disillusioned over them as expansion features).

 

The Good:

After getting to see the actual footage (I missed the stream when it was live), my opinion has changed somewhat. In a lot of ways, this looks like what I've personally wanted out of Mesmer for quite some time now: less gimmicks, just attacking in a fancy way. I'm hoping this might be my new spec and it looks like a lot of fun to play around with (though how survivability turns out could be a deal-breaker).

 

The Ugly:

What just plain weirds me out is thinking about how this relates to the Mesmer as a whole. I've started to want something simpler out of Mesmer because the gimmicks just haven't worked for me. How I've dealt with that is by just embracing the Shatters and going all out on them. Virtuoso looks right up my alley because in a lot of ways, this looks like a Spec that is meant to revolve around the F skills (since the blades do not have a life outside of launching). However, making a spec about the F skills just makes the awkward role the Shatters fill for the rest of the profession stand out even more.

Edited July 28, 2021 by Jokubas.4265

[Zoser.7245]

13 minutes ago, Stand The Wall.6987 said:

hey op where did you get this info?

The whole video:

 

Have fun 😉

 

45:36 for the mesmer specialization.

Edited July 27, 2021 by Zoser.7245

[Daniel Handler.4816]

1 hour ago, Sodeni.6041 said:

block can be avoided easily by various skills. 3s distortion with a HUGE cooldown, taken away from f4. also, f4 can't be activated without a dagger unlike core mesmer or mirage so that's a nerf as well. the heal seems good but will most likely be nerfed. It has 0 mobility, 0 condi removal apart from getting rid of 1 condi with the heal (lol) and applies no potent buffs or condis, no stunbreak.

ALSO every attack is a projectile, good luck fighting against reflects or blocks, especially in wvw.

 

Chrono has no distortion, mobility, or condi cleanse except for its heal skill. 

Trait lines make a difference.

[Rainbow Dragon.7268]

Still disappointed  i can't use my "the dreamer" legendary shortbow on mesmer XD  before mirage and virtuoso were announced i was hoping for it and now this, my  dreams are  "shattered" again XD  o well i'm a condi player so mirage main for life it seems. XD power build's are so boring.

[Daniel Handler.4816]

34 minutes ago, Zoser.7245 said:

I was editing. Yes it's in F1 and F2 skills so i have my doubts that if it will be stacked... or is something more and some changes in the Domination trait line including Mental Anguish will be done.

 

it doesn't seem like illusion traits are proccing on blade skills (no bleed on crit from sharper images)

 

im wondering if blade skills are supposed to proc shatter traits, in the same way all shade skills count as f1. maybe with a grandmaster.
 

like illusion, domination, virtuso rain of swords would be an aoe pulsing boon removal, vulnerability, and torment

Edited July 28, 2021 by Daniel Handler.4816

[Zoser.7245]

44 minutes ago, Jokubas.4265 said:

The Bad:

My initial reaction was a fair amount of disappointment. The new F skills mirror the Shatters quite closely, we're getting another one handed weapon, and even the name is misleading. It feels like more of the same in a lot of the places that the Mesmer forums have been critiquing for years (it also fails to address any issues I've had with Elite Specializations as a whole that have me disillusioned over them as expansion features).

 

I have to agree in the feeling of more of the same with F kills. Even is no clones are there... Are more of the same.  Sadly is what it is... Another very curious thing is, well, knowing other games and being familiar with them...  When i watched the "Rain of Swords" skill............. LOL   Is not that the 2nd Ability (Ice) of Merlin in the Smite game?  XD    Is difficult today to be original but it was like... LOL  XD  I watched that before hehehe.

 

I'm still peding to watch the whole video.  I can't understand the fishing thing...  it will be a lot more profitable(gems and real money) and socially  better to add housing above fishing....  And boats having mounts?  OK, ok that is an offtopic but well. I hope they still have some surprises for the future...  

 

Anyways, i'm happy to watch that the game still have support and a bright future. The release of GW2 on Steam should help too. Ironically the pandemic plus the holidays now , etc, helped in the transition time.  With luck we will have a bigger population next year.

Edited July 28, 2021 by Zoser.7245

[Me Games Ma.3024]

From what I've seen I really luke this spec. We now have the set of main hand weapons complete. 

Power Melee Sword -- Range Dagger

Condi Melee Axe -- Range Scepter

So the decision to give us a ranged dagger makes a lot of sense! I also really like the theme of storing phantasmal weapons to unleash in a single hughe blow and again it makes sense that our new shatters are single target only. From what I've seen F1 damage doesn't downscale damage per blade like mind wrack does with clones so get ready for bursting!

The virtuoso seems to really fix aome of the problems mesmers had for ages by reducing the amount of AI damage to the minimum of spawning a phantasm per weapon set.

The fact that you can build up stacks of blades on one and unload them onto another opponent is also something that I really look foreward to. For gamemodes like fractals this means prestacking the heck out of the new distortion utility 😎

The ridiculous amountnof elite skill damage may actually bring us backbinto the dubgeon meta where bosses usually die within seconds so that's another thing I look foreward to. 

While the elite looks like it shoots projectiles we will have to see if that is really the case. I suspect that it actually doesn't count as a projectile similar to the rev's hammerskill. If thisbis the case there's gonna be a nerf coming for wvw-virtuosos 😀

 

Finally a few things that I'd like to throw out there:

* F2 can hit the same target 5 times. With illusions and dueling that is 30 stacks of confusion. 

* F3 is a single target projectile, how will it interact with Master of Fragmentation? Piercing?

* Does making a blade count as "creating an illusion" for traits? If so, does the distortion utility trigger these traits 5 times?

[Puck.3697]

7 hours ago, Sodeni.6041 said:

players clearly asked for a minstrel, its all over the forums

 

i'd say this is a exaggeration.. we had one concept done for a Bard styled class and it had a Population who wanted it to be real, Alot of people wanted different things. but the biggest demand was actually a Mesmer with 0 Clones in all honesty..

[Hobyrimvrahms.6910]

6 minutes ago, Daddy.8125 said:

 

i'd say this is a exaggeration.. we had one concept done for a Bard styled class and it had a Population who wanted it to be real, Alot of people wanted different things. but the biggest demand was actually a Mesmer with 0 Clones in all honesty..

Gonna agree. It has been years since players asked for resources that won't be cleaved out by random AoE/skills.

[Za Shaloc.3908]

Looks pretty cool IMO. Animations are gorgeous. Doesn't seem to be too much creativity behind its actual gameplay design but I'm a sucker for daggers and wanted a clone-free spec, so will probably play the hell out of it.

[glenndevis.8327]

Honestly after watching the Virtuoso clip a few times and thinking more about it...

We really can't know for sure how it's going to end up until we see traits.

 

I like clones but honestly I think not having clones for 1 spec really doesn't bother me. On the contrary it may be kinda refreshing as a mesmer.

 

But my one and only big problem is that for having Mesmers entire mechanic changed from clones to the blades, the bladesongs are way too similar to shatters effect wise.

 

It's just once again going to be spawning "clones" (blades) with clone spawning abilities and spending them with F buttons based on what effect u need at the moment.

 

I hoped to see something completely different for their F buttons or see different interactions between bladesongs & other abilities. But once again, maybe traits will change up the shatters/bladesongs to have quite different effects or uses. Or maybe they just work or play quite differently in general.

Gnna have to wait & see.

Edited July 28, 2021 by glenndevis.8327

[Bast.7253]

I'm just disappointed that yet again we're left with a mainhand and the same tired old off-hands. Why does spellbreaker get dual daggers and mesmer repeatedly get one-handed weapons?

How different is the spec really going to feel when you're just temporal curtaining people into your burst, or pistol 5'ing people for a stun and then bursting, or blocking with sword.

Yeehaw. I'm fine with daggers but ultimately it just seems like a pretty boring spec that gets rid of clones to alleviate the people that have been complaining about how they can't tell who the "real" mesmer is for years. Yay, we have an incredibly easy telegraphed shatter skill that's even easier to dodge with probably a fraction of the survivability we had with chrono outside of a block and distortion utility.

I don't know. Feels pretty uninspired to me. "Breaking away fromt he core mechanic of the class" would mean a lot more if the shatters were drastically different and the difference in gameplay was more than just 3 weapon skills with one mainhand weapon. 

 

[Salt Mode.3780]

So I might get a lot of hate for saying this but here is the issue with this e-spec.

 

First off the shatters : aside from being ranged there is nothing new to it.

Utilities :

- There is no stun break on any of them nor is there any mobility (FYI the Blade Renewal is a 60 second CD channel skill which is basically distortion put into utility.)

- NONE of them aside from Blade Renewal that is a 60 sec CD offers any blade charges.

- The AoE utility is lackluster even in comparison to actual weapon AoE skills. 

- The elite is an absolute joke (basically a worse version of rapid fire on a 75 sec CD) EXTREMELY TELEGRAPHED and it doesn't even focus on target.

 

It goes back to when has there been a spec where mesmer utility (PvP/WvW) was used more then its core utilities?

Most build use mantras, blink, signet of midnight, decoy, mirror images....until mirage was released illusionary ambush. 

Elite: Mass invis, Jaunt (Even moa form has seen more play then gravity well)

 

The only thing that is good is the heal which I am not going to be surprised if they increased the CD or nerf the base healing.

 

Yes the fact that this e-spec doesn't use clones doesn't solve the problem of having to use dueling trait for the purpose of getting more clones/blades. 

 

This spec might be super good in PvE but then again PvE works either way it doesn't need much to perform well.

Edited July 28, 2021 by Salt Mode.3780

[Puck.3697]

31 minutes ago, Salt Mode.3780 said:

So I might get a lot of hate for saying this but here is the issue with this e-spec.

 

First off the shatters : aside from being ranged there is nothing new to it.

Utilities :

- There is no stun break on any of them nor is there any mobility (FYI the Blade Renewal is a 60 second CD channel skill which is basically distortion put into utility.)

- NONE of them aside from Blade Renewal that is a 60 sec CD offers any blade charges.

- The AoE utility is lackluster even in comparison to actual weapon AoE skills. 

- The elite is an absolute joke (basically a worse version of rapid fire on a 75 sec CD) EXTREMELY TELEGRAPHED and it doesn't even focus on target.

 

It goes back to when has there been a spec where mesmer utility (PvP/WvW) was used more then its core utilities?

Most build use mantras, blink, signet of midnight, decoy, mirror images....until mirage was released illusionary ambush. 

Elite: Mass invis, Jaunt (Even moa form has seen more play then gravity well)

 

The only thing that is good is the heal which I am not going to be surprised if they increased the CD or nerf the base healing.

 

Yes the fact that this e-spec doesn't use clones doesn't solve the problem of having to use dueling trait for the purpose of getting more clones/blades. 

 

This spec might be super good in PvE but then again PvE works either way it doesn't need much to perform well.

 

u forget another major thing.

 

THis means we wont get punished for targets dying anymore.. as the stacks are on us and not against a target anymore.

 

imho it looks pretty cool.. and gives Mesmer a opportunity to have a fully ranged DPS Specc... which is something this game lacks massively.

[Salt Mode.3780]

1 minute ago, Daddy.8125 said:

 

u forget another major thing.

 

THis means we wont get punished for targets dying anymore.. as the stacks are on us and not against a target anymore.

 

imho it looks pretty cool.. and gives Mesmer a opportunity to have a fully ranged DPS Specc... which is something this game lacks massively.

u dont know that the daggers wont be gone after using a shatter on a dying target its not a refund its still going to be used.

[JazzXman.7018]

6 hours ago, Konrad Curze.5130 said:

I think it looks like shhhhht, and only getting a main hand instead of both mh/oh or a 2h sucks real bad.

oh well, and least it wasnt just an offhand, that'd have been even more insulting

 

I like mesmer precisely for the clones mechanic, and imho making the only profession thats different just like the others is actually a step backwards, not forward

 

coupled with everything else shown, Im actually thinking that for the first time in over a decade I might actually drop GW 

yep thanks for that short version. finally someone else who does understand.

 

but well played devs. at least you now cutted the basic mes mechanic already before release (deleting instant shatters but keeping up the setup need, so double delay/cast on shatters literally)  then compensate with high dmg numberes (maybe also some op traits, we will see) you then can (when enough money was earned) easy number tweak nerf in most parts, since the mechanic cut happend already. no need to co-work with pve skill team bc of mes for another few years. 

 

at least this time we know what we will get before we buy it, not like mirage gets its mechanic contradicted with a low effort one dodge nerf 2 years after release. fair i guess, also still well hidden so barely anyone gets the hoax. while all biased mesmer haters are happy (that should ring your alarm bells actually).

 

also instead of rly finding new mechanics that fits to the mesmer class and create a new mesmer spec with new mesmery mechanics all "creativity" is lit to mix classes up and turn mesmer into an engi/ warrior hybrid instead getting unique mesmer themed mechanics. so in the end its an xpac wihtout a real mesmer elite but with a new or better old profession with some recycled basic mechanics of other classes with new names, colour and some flashy animations (they are not bad tho but...also hello visual clutter) prob the gems store skin team did as a side work.

 

also cant wait for the miss miss miss projectile gameplay we enjoy on staff and scepter already. and the slowed down chain cast gameplay. at least we are free from the usual mesmer hate of newbies and such ppl. stuff that all mesmer haters complained about got removed. f4 now is a block (happy daredevil and necro rupts), distortion is a channel and locks out other skill uses, no clones to get confused by. also mesmer dont need to care for good clone positioning anymore, the high skilled fast paced setup and shatter-weapon-combo gameplay got removed. mesmer is now grandma friendly in its new gameplay speed yay. even a first day gw2 player now will understand what happens around him when facing a mes first time without the need to get some knowledge about the class. and it can be played with skill clicking since you have muchas time inbetween all the cast skill chaining.

prob a good decision for a casual game with players not willing to do the effort to understand a class that is less mainstream and has bit more complicated and different mechanics which are easy to counterplay the moment you know how, after a little time/effort investment.

 

spec is maybe bit better for wvw zergfights but even in bigger gvgs playing backline mes with clones is no problem and in pvp also in teamfights there was no issue to keep clones alive long enough when you know how to position them and when to create them. ofc the powercreeped aoe spam made it harder for the mes (but hey, we play mesmer for the skill challenge or not?) while making it easier for the enemy to counterplay it with just random aoe spam but that is an gamewide balance issue and instead of deleting clones and turn the spec into another profession and have a casual friendly no mesmer spec xpac, just finally balance the game well and reduce braindead nonreactive aoe spam would be the better way. instead we add even more aoe spam now also on the new profession "pink wrengi"

 

maybe the spec will be fun to play tho, most likely easier to play and easier to play against and way slower (hello casual game again) but i doubt i will ever call it a mesmer. and if no other class gets mesmers basic mechanics as elite then it will be the day where the mes class is not part of an expansion... when you thought it cant get worse for mesmer after no ip chrono and one dodge mirage... 

 

enjoy fishing guys o/

 

 

Edited July 28, 2021 by JazzXman.7018

[Daishi.6027]

inb4 PvP going "Virt Mesmer OP; plz nerf" while the other elite specs are performing better.

inb4 50% nerfs to some aspect of the class.

inb4 projectiles miss just from targets walking.

inb4 power builds get destroyed again.

inb4 game just gets a metric ton of reflection.

inb4 mandatory dueling and domination, while elite line doesn't offer enough to make a solid build.

inb4 might as well just play thief.

Edited July 28, 2021 by Daishi.6027

[JazzXman.7018]

2 minutes ago, Daishi.6027 said:

inb4 PvP going "Virt Mesmer OP; plz nerf" while the other elite specs are performing better.

inb4 50% nerfs to some aspect of the class.

inb4 projectiles miss just from targets walking.

inb4 power builds get destroyed again.

lol yeah the future doesnt look bright either. 

[SkinnyT.5382]

I like this new Spec. I love my Mesmer but never liked the clone system. Mesmer in gw1 used to be battle managers/controllers, and I was hoping in gw2 it would be the same but with very visual effects, but instead we just got copies of or character  standing around waiting for us to kill them off.

 

On top of that; the fact that we only got the one main hand dagger is really exhaustively frustrating. Why do we always get less skills than everyone else? Also the skill we did get for this spec seemed a little one note; but I would have to play to see.

 

Quite honestly , I'm just praying for a profession overhaul that bring other specs more in line with this one. Phantasms are fine as they are, but clone should only be a few specific skills in my opinion, and they should have a more significant impact in battle.

[Shade.8971]

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Virtuoso's_Insignia

The only reference I could find in GW1.

[XenesisII.1540]

1 hour ago, Daishi.6027 said:

inb4 PvP going "Virt Mesmer OP; plz nerf" while the other elite specs are performing better.

inb4 50% nerfs to some aspect of the class.

inb4 projectiles miss just from targets walking.

inb4 power builds get destroyed again.

inb4 game just gets a metric ton of reflection.

inb4 mandatory dueling and domination, while elite line doesn't offer enough to make a solid build.

inb4 might as well just play thief.

 

I'm actually surprised it didn't just start right off the bat with one dodge.

[JazzXman.7018]

31 minutes ago, XenesisII.1540 said:

 

I'm actually surprised it didn't just start right off the bat with one dodge.

actually it does tho just in a different way. they delete instant shatters without also deleting the higher setup need that balanced out the instant shatter strenght. its lit a nerf to mesmers basic mechanics double up the delay/ casttime for shatters, dumbing and slowing down the gameplay. they delete all basic core mes defining mechanics (clones and instant shatters) and turn it into another profession so we have an xpac without a mes spec in the end. we will get broken dmg at start to sell the xpac and then will get number tweaked after some time. so they already prepared to do another only number tweak pvp nerf and avoid a cooperation with pve skill team for mesmer purposes by cutting the mechanic right from start this time in a way i just dislike as much as the one dodge nerf. but bc i feel like since around 3 years there is no dev left with clue about mes, they just listen to unknowledgeable and biased forum and discord complains. what is pretty rip for a hard to understand class that is less mainstream and a noobkiller so get a lot of undeserved hate from unexperienced players and from players who have clearly no clue about mes aswell even tho they pretend to.

[Lincolnbeard.1735]

Like people said landing a new shatter will be difficult since the windup is enormous. To add to that, based on the numbers on damage I would say IP is gone on Virt, so no f3 to f1 burst.

[RabbitUp.8294]

9 hours ago, Zoser.7245 said:

It looks like a PvE dps specializacion.  Well, maybe more a raid one, as in hardcore PvE content, when you solo hard thing without clones, it means that you are focused but "The Virtuoso" lacks of sustain, like Mirage, but also without the evades...  It will be a free kill in hardcore content, in PvP too and WvW with the projectile hate plus the lack of mobility that is another handicap.  Even its distortion utility roots him in exchange of recharge its dagger stacks.  Blink and portal will not save you more than once and being focused you will always killed. It's a matter of have a bit of patience, force its block and distortion and kill it as it lacks of mobility and sustain. Meanwhile you can heal its dps while waiting the right momment with other professions/specializations.  

 

The distortion doesn't root, it's the same as the guardian elite, you channel it, but you can move.

 

It also has a 3 sec block on a 30s cooldown, on top of everything else mesmer has, it will be fine.

[Pomdepin.7068]

I globally liked the theme of the elite, but also have some major gripes :

 

- Only MH dagger is lackluster, please give us an OH as well.

- F1-4 skills are copy-paste of clone shatters. If the spec is power dmg, the confusion shatter must go away for a new original power related one. Doesn't have to be pure damage, be creative !

- dagger skills seem kind of boring with bad animations (please make an original GS-like animation for it!). Maybe give it a mobility skill ?

- also don't like the name Virtuoso but I could live with it.

 

As for tuning and skill effects, we'll have to see since it can heavily rely on traits.

My main concern is the blade mechanic which is really too similar to shatters in its effects. Give it some CC, useful conditions, special effects or something with more flavour !