ranger elite spec icon speculate and theme

[InsaneQR.7412]

On 8/7/2021 at 11:19 PM, lightDestroyer.1265 said:

Nothing can beat the defensive and offensive abilities of GS.  Nobody would use a shield given the state of main hand weapons unless you want the focus of the spec to be condi. 

I disagree.

Sword has great escape capabilities and is fantastic as a defensive weapon and also for mobility and engaging. It would pair nicely with shield in a power spec.

 

GS has the added benefit of CC and blocks which would make it the perfect second weapon set with sword and board.

If we would get shield and it would have additional CC, maybe barrier and blocks, then a defensive Ranger bruiser would easily be doable with GS + sword and board. Mobility would be great on both set, defensive capabilities would be present and CC could also be available.

 

Edit: For the confused: I dont disagree that GS is a great weapon. I disagree that nobody would use shield except in a condi spec. 

 

Edited August 12, 2021 by InsaneQR.7412
Clarifications

[Lazze.9870]

3 hours ago, InsaneQR.7412 said:

I disagree.

Sword has great escape capabilities and is fantastic as a defensive weapon and also for mobility and engaging.

 

GS has the added benefit of CC and blocks.

If we would get shield and it would have additional CC, maybe barrier and blocks, then a defensive Ranger bruiser would easily be doable with GS + sword and board. Mobility would be great on both set, defensive capabilities would be present wnd CC could also be available.

 

Greatsword adds counter-pressure with Maul. Sword combined with a traditional shield would likely provide nothing except overloaded trolling potential.

 

Axe is definetely the better combination. My problem with that is that it would only be slightly different from off-hand dagger approach which the pvp core valkyrie ranger uses now. Pressumaly a block instead of the evade and then whatever the other skill would be instead of Crippling Talon.

 

Ranger has rather poor mainhand options for any new off-hand to be exciting in my opnion. Hammer on the other hand...

[InsaneQR.7412]

49 minutes ago, Lazze.9870 said:

 

Greatsword adds counter-pressure with Maul. Sword combined with a traditional shield would likely provide nothing except overloaded trolling potential.

 

Axe is definetely the better combination. My problem with that is that it would only be slightly different from off-hand dagger approach which the pvp core valkyrie ranger uses now. Pressumaly a block instead of the evade and then whatever the other skill would be instead of Crippling Talon.

 

Ranger has rather poor mainhand options for any new off-hand to be exciting in my opnion. Hammer on the other hand...

 

Its not about pressure its about stalling. Axe would provide no stalling potential while sword grants evades and poison to diminish heals.

If you really would want to go condi you are better off with trailblazer soulbeasts/trapper druids eitherway.

Power based bunker/bruiser is missing from rangers kit, so it would be a reasonable option to be provided.

 

PS: sword provides fantastic sticking potential which is great for harrassment and preventing meaningful team contribution.

Edited August 8, 2021 by InsaneQR.7412

[Lazze.9870]

1 hour ago, InsaneQR.7412 said:

Its not about pressure its about stalling. Axe would provide no stalling potential while sword grants evades and poison to diminish heals.

If you really would want to go condi you are better off with trailblazer soulbeasts/trapper druids eitherway.

Power based bunker/bruiser is missing from rangers kit, so it would be a reasonable option to be provided.

 

PS: sword provides fantastic sticking potential which is great for harrassment and preventing meaningful team contribution.

 

What do you think I was talking about when I said overloaded trolling potential? Stalling with zero counterpressure. Because that is what it is. GS with axe/shield on the other hand would provide the defense axe needs to function, and possibly some hard CCs to create more synergy with Moment of Clarity. Etc.

 

I can't imagine a more BORING weapon combo than ranger sword combined with traditional shield skills, which I with no doubt would bet on Anet giving us. They haven't exactly been creative with druid staff and soulbeast dagger.

 

You know what else is missing from ranger's kit that could be actual fun to play? Hammer. You know what weapon could easily work with a power bruiser spec? Hammer. Some good boinking. If this class gets another sidenode stalling spec, I'm done. You're not gonna run inbetween teamfights with your sword and shield, trust me.

 

PS: there is no need to tell anyone what sword does, sword/dagger has been doing this for years already. Sword/shield would only do it in a different way. Probably in a more potent way, but that doesn't make it fun.

 

PS2: sword had better sticking and harrassment potential with the old auto. Much better. Claming it has great harrassment potential right now is a bit funny to me.

 

PS3:  I don't want shield.

Edited August 8, 2021 by Lazze.9870

[InsaneQR.7412]

@Lazze.9870

 

Oh i can totally understand that hammer would give more use for bruiser specs. But that was not what i was argumenting for.

 

I was argumenting against this:

 

"Nothing can beat the defensive and offensive abilities of GS.  Nobody would use a shield given the state of main hand weapons unless you want the focus of the spec to be condi. "

 

If shield would have traditional shield skills pretty much any power based bunker build would use SW/shield AND GS and would be pretty effective doing so (although not really fun to play against but that was not my argument) and shield would not just be used for condi builds.

 

That hammer would provide better options for a bruiser than a shield is a totally fine argument and that you dont want a shield is understandable as well. But i was not argumenting for shield being better than hammer, i was argumenting that shield would be used by power builds because it would double down on GS strengths and not being excluded because of it. 

 

And if hammer would be a bruiser weapon it would basically double down on GS strengths as well and would thrive for the same reasons.

 

 

 

Edited August 8, 2021 by InsaneQR.7412
Typos

[Lazze.9870]

10 minutes ago, InsaneQR.7412 said:

If shield would have traditional shield skills pretty much any power based bunker build would use SW/shield AND GS and would be pretty effective doing so (although not really fun to play against but that was not my argument) and shield would not just be used for condi builds.

 

That hammer would provide better options for a bruiser than a shield is a totally fine argument and that you dont want a shield is understandable as well. But i was not argumenting for shield being better than hammer, i was argumenting that shield would be used by power builds because it would double down on GS strengths and not being excluded because of it. 

 

It could obviously work on both condi and power. I don't find that part very interesting.

 

I'm reacting to how some people said it would create a good bruiser option for ranger and pair well with sword. I don't think it will, or more importantly, I think it will only make the side noder role stronger (given that the spec otherwise has tools for it, of course). I seriously doubt it will be of any use as a "tank spec".

 

Sword itself to me still feels unfinished and unrefined. Hornet's Sting is too slow, still no full cleave on auto. I honestly kinda hate it in its current state.

Edited August 8, 2021 by Lazze.9870

[serow.6524]

PS: I'm just a casual player, so I'll leave the balance/tradeoff concerns to the ANet class designers to figure out.

 

Here's my guess for the elite spec! Based on the animal face icon, our e-spec is going to be Shapeshifter!

 

Our new e-spec gimmick: Wildshape. Beside the normal pet selection box, we get a wildshape selection box, made of the following choices: Tiger (power damage), Spider (condition damage), Bear (tanking), Moa (Support). We can alter the choice out of combat, and only 1 choice can made at any time. Pressing F5 will cause us to shapeshift (character model replaced) into the chosen form, and our weapon and utilities will be replaced by pet skills following the wildshape's theme. Unlike CA, there's no need to accumulate charge to use, maybe it just uses the 10sec cooldown.

 

Our new e-spec weapon/utilities: Can't think of something, maybe none. We are already getting constant access to 1 new "weapon" and "utility" sets at all times, with 4 (or more) any time out of combat.

 

In essence, my guess is that we are sorta getting the Revenant's Legend system.

[Gotejjeken.1267]

I think the weapon choice matters a lot less than what they do with the pet.  Bruiser spec is going to be pointless if there isn't a pet merge instituted like soulbeast has.  

 

About weapons though, sword would be much better than greatsword if they'd up the auto damage a bit and shorten the activation times of hornet's / monarch's.  As a kiting weapon sword is just better; greatsword has swoop and a block, which isn't enough usually, so soulbeast's run bird.  The rest shakes out, you either get CC with hilt bash or poison with serpent's strike.  The only thing left is maul which without quickness is borderline useless.

 

All that said, not sure shield fits--unless they utilize 'command' abilities and tie it to the shield somehow.  Given pet AI concerns this probably ends badly, but it's a possibility.  

 

Hammer's problem is that bruiser spec is opposite of every other ranger spec.  Druid was obviously made for support with its kiting potential, immobs, heals, etc. but is not a bruiser.  Soulbeast was designed to be a flanker as well because of mainhand dagger--it only gains some sustain through stances, but not enough to stay long.  Not sure what a class enamored with the moon, venoms, and pets really gains from hulk smashing things with a hammer...

[Lazze.9870]

5 hours ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

I think the weapon choice matters a lot less than what they do with the pet. 

 

Depends on your perspective. To me both matters, I want a better WvW spec first and foremost. 

[LadyEden.7519]

6 hours ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

I think the weapon choice matters a lot less than what they do with the pet.

 

Let's just hope they won't nerf it like that did on Soulbeast, which no longer can swap pets in-fight.

[Arrys.7145]

On 8/8/2021 at 7:31 AM, Lazze.9870 said:

 

Greatsword adds counter-pressure with Maul. Sword combined with a traditional shield would likely provide nothing except overloaded trolling potential.

 

Axe is definetely the better combination. My problem with that is that it would only be slightly different from off-hand dagger approach which the pvp core valkyrie ranger uses now. Pressumaly a block instead of the evade and then whatever the other skill would be instead of Crippling Talon.

 

Ranger has rather poor mainhand options for any new off-hand to be exciting in my opinon. Hammer on the other hand...

 

Persuasive, matches what I'm feeling working through weapon combinations right now.  

[lightDestroyer.1265]

On 8/8/2021 at 3:19 PM, InsaneQR.7412 said:

I disagree.

Sword has great escape capabilities and is fantastic as a defensive weapon and also for mobility and engaging.

 

GS has the added benefit of CC and blocks.

If we would get shield and it would have additional CC, maybe barrier and blocks, then a defensive Ranger bruiser would easily be doable with GS + sword and board. Mobility would be great on both set, defensive capabilities would be present wnd CC could also be available.

 

 

Are you seriously comparing sword to greatsword?  Greatsword has much more damage and much more disengage than sword will have. And gs 5 cc is a really good cc with maul refresh, and the block from shield will be a high coop down1 most likely. 

[anduriell.6280]

20 hours ago, Lazze.9870 said:

 

Depends on your perspective. To me both matters, I want a better WvW spec first and foremost. 

Petless ranger must be then. 

25 minutes ago, lightDestroyer.1265 said:

Are you seriously comparing sword to greatsword?  Greatsword has much more damage and much more disengage than sword will have. And gs 5 cc is a really good cc with maul refresh, and the block from shield will be a high coop down1 most likely. 

They are both different weapons, GS is an utility with a dps attack. Sword is more about constant damage, it doesn't work in pvp very well  because the off-hand combinations do not bring any defensive/offensive skills. No, dagger offhand is not a good weapon. No, Axe offhand is neither after the nerf to path of scars. 

 

Sword should see more use if one of the offhands get a proper burst or defensive/mobility skill set.  Warhorn change was a good start such a shame the numbers devs didn't do it right. 

 

[InsaneQR.7412]

2 hours ago, lightDestroyer.1265 said:

Are you seriously comparing sword to greatsword?  Greatsword has much more damage and much more disengage than sword will have. And gs 5 cc is a really good cc with maul refresh, and the block from shield will be a high coop down1 most likely. 

No. I argument for sword being good with a shield because it would be like GS. 

 

I mainly disagreed with the previous comment from Lazze becaus they stated that shield would mainly be used with condi builds. IMO shield would be fantastic on power sword plus GS.

 

[Substance E.4852]

22 hours ago, LadyEden.7519 said:

 

Let's just hope they won't nerf it like that did on Soulbeast, which no longer can swap pets in-fight.

I mean, they're going to though

It's pretty much a given, we have nothing else they can "trade off" unless they make our un-fused damage even worse or somehow nerf the sustain on a class that is built around personal sustain

Anet's gonna kitten up the ranger spec but they're not going to go so far as to make us lose a dodge roll or something to slot it

It'll probably be something like "the pet has extra abilities but you can only slot one" or something. Unless they overhaul the entire pet system at it's core, there's not a lot they can do with it . They can't give it extra damage/stats because pvp players will cry about losing to an AI

Edited August 11, 2021 by Substance E.4852

[Lazze.9870]

16 minutes ago, InsaneQR.7412 said:

I mainly disagreed with the previous comment from Lazze becaus they stated that shield would mainly be used with condi builds. IMO shield would be fantastic on power sword plus GS.

 

I said nothing about conditions, you're mixing it up.

[Lazze.9870]

10 minutes ago, Substance E.4852 said:

Unless they overhaul the entire pet system at it's core, there's not a lot they can do with it .

 

Such a great mechanic, ain't it?

I bet the devs at Anet get excited every time they have to brainstorm elite spec ideas for ranger. /s

[Substance E.4852]

Just now, Lazze.9870 said:

 

Such a great mechanic, ain't it?

I bet the devs at Anet get excited every time they have to brainstorm elite spec ideas for ranger. /s

There's a lot they could so with it as is that would feel fun in PvE but it's near useless in pvp unless they let us teleport it all over the place like a WoW Hunter spamming "Kill Command"

[Lazze.9870]

5 minutes ago, Substance E.4852 said:

There's a lot they could so with it as is that would feel fun in PvE but it's near useless in pvp unless they let us teleport it all over the place like a WoW Hunter spamming "Kill Command"

 

I don't think there is a lot they can do with it even in PvE unless they're willing to strip the entire pet away for something else. 

 

It would just be some boring variation where you still interact with a slow AI.

[Bealis.6023]

Hi, I speculate that ranger could learn the ways of Wardens from Echovald, its very specific, but it would fit nicely.

That could mean some spirit merging, when both you and your pet get a new set of skills that complement each other. In that state you could use your bare hands as a "heavy type" profession.

As for the weapon, I incline more towards a focus, which could also be the icon. Focus could work with the spirit theme. I am not much of a fan of hammers or shields, so I guess thats also a wish 🙂

 

Edited August 11, 2021 by Bealis.6023

[punahou.3986]

On 7/29/2021 at 12:46 AM, Miellyn.6847 said:

It's very likely the Beasthead. It has leaves as ears and the head is shaped like an arrowhead.

 

I think we will get Hammer as weapon. Pistole and Rifle don't fit the GW Ranger theme. Shield is borderline useless, we have enough defensive options with weaponskills. I would like scepter or focus, but hammer is the most probable weapon.

hmm maybe lycanthrope spec?

where we xform in WereX

[Lazze.9870]

Who is the funny guy reacting with a confused face to all my posts?

Edited September 16, 2021 by Lazze.9870

[Mackanstein.2503]

Hear me out: land spear! 😃

[Legion.4198]

I suspect it will be a "Princess Mononoke" Spec with Mystical Pets and in conflict with Cantha's industrialization and modernity. 

[Gotejjeken.1267]

After the three e-spec preview today, I'm really hoping we get some kind of boon rip abilities.  Something like AoE boon strip with hammer would be ideal...

 

But on the flip side two of the specs are already melee focused, so the danger is there of getting another range spec for us =\