Single player raids / dungeons / fractals / strike missions

[Efar.8153]

On 8/2/2021 at 6:41 PM, Xenn.1602 said:

 

 

 

nvm

Edited August 16, 2021 by Efar.8153

[Vanthian.9267]

On 8/2/2021 at 12:41 PM, Xenn.1602 said:

C; I like to do it in my own time; I have a family, I can't go on voice chat and isolate myself from my kids and wife, I can't be occupied for an hour straigt without the freedom to go afk for 10 min to help my kids with something or whatever, or simply break it off entirely if I have to.

I agree with this statement. 

I still don't have legendary armor because I no longer have the time, can't stand the smug attitudes of most of the guilds doing the raids and I refuse to use voice chat as it is not needed.  Plenty of PUGs (myself included) do Fractals 100 CM with out voice chat or even typing.  I would happily solo a single player instance version to eventually get the armor in my own time.  In fact I already have the materials to make the armor I am just missing the raid specific pre-armor.

Most "raiders" only go against such a thing because it "takes away form their achievements".  Which is nonsense.  

[Sobx.1758]

11 hours ago, Vanthian.9267 said:

I still don't have legendary armor because I no longer have the time, can't stand the smug attitudes of most of the guilds doing the raids and I refuse to use voice chat as it is not needed.  Plenty of PUGs (myself included) do Fractals 100 CM with out voice chat or even typing.

You don't need extended time for raiding, you don't need to finish whole wings, you can join and complete single encounters. It's true that neither guilds nor voice chats are needed to raid. Use lfg.

Edited September 24, 2021 by Sobx.1758

[voltaicbore.8012]

On 9/24/2021 at 1:05 AM, Vanthian.9267 said:

I agree with this statement. 

I still don't have legendary armor because I no longer have the time, can't stand the smug attitudes of most of the guilds doing the raids and I refuse to use voice chat as it is not needed.  Plenty of PUGs (myself included) do Fractals 100 CM with out voice chat or even typing.  I would happily solo a single player instance version to eventually get the armor in my own time.  In fact I already have the materials to make the armor I am just missing the raid specific pre-armor.

Most "raiders" only go against such a thing because it "takes away form their achievements".  Which is nonsense.  

I avoid them as well - I have the time for raids, but I just hate all the planning, waiting, and trash mechanics. If you have the stomach to do a few matches every time you log in, I highly suggest ranked pvp as a way towards legendary armor. I completed two full sets of armor this way, and I consider it the fastest and easiest way to get them. The only challenge here is having a thick skin about chat, and it's not a challenge at all if you either already have a thick skin, or just turn off chat when it gets ugly.

[NorthernRedStar.3054]

2 hours ago, voltaicbore.8012 said:

I avoid them as well - I have the time for raids, but I just hate all the planning, waiting, and trash mechanics. If you have the stomach to do a few matches every time you log in, I highly suggest ranked pvp as a way towards legendary armor. I completed two full sets of armor this way, and I consider it the fastest and easiest way to get them. The only challenge here is having a thick skin about chat, and it's not a challenge at all if you either already have a thick skin, or just turn off chat when it gets ugly.

In all honesty this sounds like someone trying to justify their inability to perform in instanced content.

[voltaicbore.8012]

1 hour ago, NorthernRedStar.3054 said:

In all honesty this sounds like someone trying to justify their inability to perform in instanced content.

I'm not hitting the snowcrows benchmark, sure, but plaguedoctor scourge/druid/soulbeast/condi FB are quite easy and I did a number of training clears (VG, Samarog, couple of the Djinn bosses, a couple Stronghold of the Faithful kills, etc) and did fine. I solo every soloable dungeon on glass raid specs, and am beginning to solo fractals (but on adjusted specs, since I don't know them that well yet).

It really isn't instanced content I have a problem with, and I'm not one of the nubs accusing the raiding community of being elitist. It's the waiting around, relog shuffles, "oh I just kittened up this one thing so we all have to start over", and other overhead that I have little patience for.

[Epsilon Indi.2031]

On 8/2/2021 at 9:56 PM, Obtena.7952 said:

That doesn't make sense ... there isn't some magic number that determines when to stop adding soloable content. What I said ALSO stands for arbitrary handwaving arguments about 'we got this much so we don't need more'. 

So part of the challenge for  soloing this content is that it's not designed for solo play.  That's part of the appeal too.  Adding content that already exists to be scalable in terms of player count wouldn't really work out as expected.  Now for content that can be done solo as is currently.  Can you tell me why there needs to be more solo-friendly content?

[Obtena.7952]

30 minutes ago, Sir Alymer.3406 said:

 Can you tell me why there needs to be more solo-friendly content?

Easy ... if Anet determines that's what players want and it also makes good business sense for them to provide it. It doesn't make much sense for Anet to create content that won't make them money right?

 

Edited September 27, 2021 by Obtena.7952

[Epsilon Indi.2031]

1 hour ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Easy ... if Anet determines that's what players want and it also makes good business sense for them to provide it. It doesn't make much sense for Anet to create content that won't make them money right?

 

Yeah, that's a non answer.  ANet hasn't added more solo friendly content outside of story for what, 9ish years now?  Don't hold your breath.

[Obtena.7952]

12 hours ago, Sir Alymer.3406 said:

Yeah, that's a non answer.  ANet hasn't added more solo friendly content outside of story for what, 9ish years now?  Don't hold your breath.

No, it's a completely reasonable and true answer ... you just don't like it because you just don't have a response to it that helps you make whatever point you were attempting to make. 

I'm not sure what you qualify as 'solo-friendly' content outside of story ... but we definitely have gotten it. In fact, this thread has several examples of it. I solo all kinds of content that is outside of the story. I don't even know why you need to qualify content for soloing outside of the story ... it doesn't really change the point I'm making. 

Edited September 27, 2021 by Obtena.7952

[Epsilon Indi.2031]

4 hours ago, Obtena.7952 said:

No, it's a completely reasonable and true answer ... you just don't like it because you just don't have a response to it that helps you make whatever point you were attempting to make. 

 

No, it's really not.  I asked You, why you think there needs to be more solo friendly content and you responded with "If ANet wants to".  Which is a non-answer.

 

Quote

I'm not sure what you qualify as 'solo-friendly' content outside of story ... but we definitely have gotten it. In fact, this thread has several examples of it. I solo all kinds of content that is outside of the story. I don't even know why you need to qualify content for soloing outside of the story ... it doesn't really change the point I'm making. 

Solo player content is any content that can be done with one individual, usually locked to only have one player at a time, but not necessarily so.  This can be doing world events with no help, adventures, or instanced content such as story, dungeons, raids, fractals, etc. without a party or in-game support from other players. This, technically means, that any content a player can solo is solo player content anything this thread wants added to it is an arbitrary restriction put on by the game devs.

[Obtena.7952]

31 minutes ago, Sir Alymer.3406 said:

No, it's really not.  I asked You, why you think there needs to be more solo friendly content and you responded with "If ANet wants to".  Which is a non-answer.

That doesn't make sense .. no I didn't respond with 'If Anet wants to", so please pay more attention. Game health is a combination of Anet getting the most money they can and Players getting the most content they want. So my reply to you was a valid answer to your question. I'm not sure what else you are looking for ... but I'm pretty sure whatever it is, you're fishing for something you can just argue about. So glad I didn't oblige you there. 

Quote

Solo player content is any content that can be done with one individual, usually locked to only have one player at a time, but not necessarily so.  This can be doing world events with no help, adventures, or instanced content such as story, dungeons, raids, fractals, etc. without a party or in-game support from other players. This, technically means, that any content a player can solo is solo player content anything this thread wants added to it is an arbitrary restriction put on by the game devs.

OK ... I won't argue with that. Your point is what? We have gotten LOTS of content over the years that is outside the story that is soloable. Your post clearly states Anet hasn't added any outside the story for basically the entire game. That's obviously wrong, especially based on the definition you provided here. Another attempt to go fishing to lead of the path in some contrived argument I think. 

Maybe you want to deny that the business case drives the content Anet provides ... I can see why someone hellbent on more group instance content would want to deny that since it's obvious that this kind of content isn't popular enough to provide (e.g. raids). It doesn't change the fact that that's the only answer that matters. If there isn't a business case for some type of content, we don't get that content.  

Edited September 27, 2021 by Obtena.7952

[Epsilon Indi.2031]

3 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

I'm not lying to you ... that IS why I think there needs to be more solo friendly content ... because I care about the health of the game and game health is a combination of Anet getting the most money they can and Players getting the most content they want. So yes, it really is a valid answer to your question. 

 

Your answer is "ANet knows best" which is precisely why we haven't gotten any additional solo content releases with the release cadence.  If that's really the answer you want to go with it's pretty shallow as that answer applies to everything in the game a player could be passionate about.

 

Quote

OK ... I won't argue with that. Your point is what? We have gotten LOTS of content over the years that is outside the story that is soloable. Your post seemed to indicate there was none. 

Most, if not all content in the open world scales and, since this game rewards player skill, everything can be done solo if you're good enough unless there's some hard mechanics blocking progression (Events that require additional players to overcome, things you can only do once every 1m 30s but appear once every 30s, etc.)

[Obtena.7952]

13 minutes ago, Sir Alymer.3406 said:

Your answer is "ANet knows best"

No, that wasn't my answer (even though that is a true statement) and if you are just going to continue inventing things I haven't said to argue with me, I'm going to assume you don't have a fundamental comprehension necessary to hold a discussion in a reasonable way with someone. You don't need to paraphrase anything I'm telling you and it's clear when you do that ... you get REALLY lost in the meaning of what I said. So do yourself a favour and stop telling me things I didn't say. It's a REALLY dishonest way to engage me in a discussion.

Quote

Most, if not all content in the open world scales and, since this game rewards player skill, everything can be done solo if you're good enough unless there's some hard mechanics blocking progression (Events that require additional players to overcome, things you can only do once every 1m 30s but appear once every 30s, etc.)

Yes, ok, that's true. Not really seeing where you are going with these statements ... they don't contradict anything I've said. If content in OW is soloable, that's a HUGE amount of solo content we have gotten outside of the story for the entire existence of the game. 

Edited September 27, 2021 by Obtena.7952

[Linken.6345]

23 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

No, that wasn't my answer (even though that is a true statement) and if you are just going to invent things to argue with me, I'm going to assume you don't have a fundamental comprehension necessary to hold a discussion in a reasonable way with someone. You don't need to paraphrase anything I'm telling you and it's clear when you do that ... you get REALLY lost in the meaning of what I said. So do yourself a favour and stop telling me things I didn't say. It's a REALLY dishonest way to engage me in a discussion.

Yes, ok, that's true. Not really seeing where you are going with these statements ... they don't contradict anything I've said. If content in OW is soloable, that's a HUGE amount of solo content we have gotten outside of the story for the entire existence of the game. 

Yes, but only making single player content is a downgrade when you can make multi player content that can scale down to a single player like the Drms for example right?

[Epsilon Indi.2031]

25 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

No, that wasn't my answer (even though that is a true statement) and if you are just going to continue inventing things I haven't said to argue with me, I'm going to assume you don't have a fundamental comprehension necessary to hold a discussion in a reasonable way with someone. You don't need to paraphrase anything I'm telling you and it's clear when you do that ... you get REALLY lost in the meaning of what I said. So do yourself a favour and stop telling me things I didn't say. It's a REALLY dishonest way to engage me in a discussion.

 

Hm.. I'm not the one being dishonest here. 
My Question:

20 hours ago, Sir Alymer.3406 said:

Can you tell me why there needs to be more solo-friendly content?

Your response:

19 hours ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Easy ... if Anet determines that's what players want and it also makes good business sense for them to provide it. It doesn't make much sense for Anet to create content that won't make them money right?

So let's pick this apart.

"If ANet Determines that's what players want"; Meaning that if the decision is ultimately ANet's to decide.  Still not you.  Also, it's quite a bit difficult for us to determine what ANet knows about the playerbase as a whole (Not just forums, discord, reddit, but everyone). Who's to say that enough players want this sort of content or that it's even viable to create yet another game mode that'll need support (Solo instance content on t he level of dungeons & fractals, for instance). Which is why players need to have good argumentation for why such a game mode should exist.  It should be clear, concise reasoning for the game mode or interaction and emotional reasoning should be left to a minimum.

"and it also makes good business sense for them to provide it";  ANet is a business, but the developers care about the game.  All of them just want to make a good game.  Management is the business they have to appeal to, however, which can cloud their vision, so it's not the developers, but management we'd have to convince to get more content that can be done solo.  Solo content in a game focused on cooperation and what is essentially drop in/out co-operation in the open world doesn't seem like it'd fit all that well  as a primary game mode like fractals, dungeons, strikes, raids, etc that get people to group up. 

Which is why you and anyone else who wants this sort of content needs to be vocal about it and state reasons why it'd be a good addition.  ANet, however, seems to be wary about modifying any existing game content to cater to a niche playerbase, though.  When it comes to things like fractals, they'll likely just tell you that T1s exist and are relatively easy to do alone.  If it's about raids & strikes,  they'll  likely tell you that the content is designed a round 10 players.  If you ask them about dungeons, they'll likely shrug because no one at ANet has touched dungeons for at least 4(?) years now. Because of this, Anet would likely be developing new content going forwards which is a bigger cost so there needs to be a justification that you and everyone who wants this sort of content can provide. 

"It doesn't make much sense for Anet to create content that won't make them money right?"; ANet can really do what they want with this game.  This is still not you. This is you using ANet as a shield to avoid having to come up with an actual answer as to why you think there should be more solo friendly content in the game. 

(?) Honestly, I don't recall when the last bugfix was to dungeons.

[Epsilon Indi.2031]

1 hour ago, Linken.6345 said:

Yes, but only making single player content is a downgrade when you can make multi player content that can scale down to a single player like the Drms for example right?

Scalable content like how the open world and DRMs do it seems to be the way to go, but it's likely too late to actually fit that sort of thing into pre-existing content archetypes (Raids, fractals, dungeons, strikes, etc.) without a massive overhaul.

[Obtena.7952]

38 minutes ago, Sir Alymer.3406 said:

Hm.. I'm not the one being dishonest here. 

Pick it apart all you want ... I gave you a valid, honest answer about what I think to your question. Telling me it's a non-answer just because you can't argue with it and then turning around continually telling me things I never said to just argue with me is not going to work for you here. Again, I'm going to suggest if you want to be part of the discussion here with me, you change your tack. 

You are wrong about Anet not adding any soloable content outside of stories since the beginning of the game. I'm sure you are trying to make a point when you made that statement ... you can still explain what you mean and how it's related to the topic ... but instead, I look forward to your next textwall trying to argue some meaningless academic point about the quality of my answer to you. Your move chief. 

Edited September 27, 2021 by Obtena.7952

[Obtena.7952]

1 hour ago, Linken.6345 said:

Yes, but only making single player content is a downgrade when you can make multi player content that can scale down to a single player like the Drms for example right?

I'm not saying Anet can't make multi player content and scale it down for single players. I don't have a problem with that ... as long as it makes sense for Anet to do that as a business. Seems to me that based on the experience with raids, it's hard to say it would. 

Edited September 27, 2021 by Obtena.7952

[Epsilon Indi.2031]

30 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Pick it apart all you want ... I gave you a valid, honest answer about what I think to your question. Telling me it's a non-answer just because you can't argue with it and then turning around continually telling me things I never said to just argue with me is not going to work for you here. Again, I'm going to suggest if you want to be part of the discussion here with me, you change your tack. 

You are wrong about Anet not adding any soloable content outside of stories since the beginning of the game. I'm sure you are trying to make a point when you made that statement ... you can still explain what you mean and how it's related to the topic ... but instead, I look forward to your next textwall trying to argue some meaningless academic point about the quality of my answer to you. Your move chief. 

Man, you're accusing me of not being honest or interpreting what you wrote wrong while also not responding or even bothering to read what I wrote.  Honestly, all I can say is attention towards my signature.  If you can't come up with a reason on your own that doesn't involve "Well ANet knows best and if there's a lot of outcry for it" there wasn't ever a discussion here to begin with.

Here, have a TL:DR in bullet points

• • I ask question
• • You answer question
• • I say it's not a satisfactory answer as I wanted your answer and not some shallow answer that fits into any argument for content.
• • You accuse me of making things up and not interpreting what I'm reading correctly
• • I pick apart what you said, laying out what I want in t here and what ANet would want from you too.
• • You respond with what's basically "TL:DR"

You're not really coming off as interested in a discussion about any of this.

Edited September 27, 2021 by Sir Alymer.3406

[Obtena.7952]

6 minutes ago, Sir Alymer.3406 said:

Man, you're accusing me of not being honest or interpreting what you wrote wrong while also not responding or even bothering to read what I wrote.  

Oh I read it ... but clearly me reading it doesn't ifx the problem of you inventing things I didn't say or not liking my answer. But I'm willing to give you a chance here to be part of the discussion that is related to the topic.  

Again, you are wrong about saying Anet has not adding any soloable content outside of stories since the beginning of the game. I'm willing to discuss that. Do you care to explain what you mean here in case you want to clarify or put some context to that statement?

Edited September 27, 2021 by Obtena.7952

[Linken.6345]

41 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

I'm not saying Anet can't make multi player content and scale it down for single players. I don't have a problem with that ... as long as it makes sense for Anet to do that as a business. Seems to me that based on the experience with raids, it's hard to say it would. 

Yes but you are doing so in a thread asking for more single player ONLY content.

Something alot of people are against since its a multiplayer game so maybe read the thread?

[Obtena.7952]

1 hour ago, Linken.6345 said:

Yes but you are doing so in a thread asking for more single player ONLY content.

Something alot of people are against since its a multiplayer game so maybe read the thread?

Right ... because I don't ignore signs in the game that putting in multi player content and making a single player option from it is unlikely. Frankly, I don't care how it happens, but I do feel it's more likely there is a better business case for more single player only content than there is a multi/single implementation. 

Trust me, I've read the thread ... nothing I'm saying should give you the impression I haven't or don't have some reasonable thought put behind what I believe ... unless your agenda is to try and shut me out of the discussion here. 

Edited September 28, 2021 by Obtena.7952

[Linken.6345]

49 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Right ... because I don't ignore signs in the game that putting in multi player content and making a single player option from it is unlikely. Frankly, I don't care how it happens, but I do feel it's more likely there is a better business case for more single player only content than there is a multi/single implementation. 

Trust me, I've read the thread ... nothing I'm saying should give you the impression I haven't or don't have some reasonable thought put behind what I believe ... unless your agenda is to try and shut me out of the discussion here. 

How is pleasing 1 group aka single players better then pleasing single , duo, trio, + groups etc better business sence?

[Obtena.7952]

16 hours ago, Linken.6345 said:

How is pleasing 1 group aka single players better then pleasing single , duo, trio, + groups etc better business sence?

It depends on the ROI to deliver the various types of content. Again, it's not JUST about what pleases people. It's about what makes Anet money as well. The business cases have to be examined for the proposed scenarios. 

Edited September 28, 2021 by Obtena.7952