TheLadyOfTheRings.9148 Posted August 5, 2021 Share Posted August 5, 2021 15 minutes ago, Kodama.6453 said: And the pose is actually one of the things which make me think thief directly. Because all guardian artworks were shown directly from the side in full profile, this doesn't fit in with how guardian's got portrayed so far. I agree. On the other hand, they did say they would break some rules. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kodama.6453 Posted August 5, 2021 Share Posted August 5, 2021 4 minutes ago, Jski.6180 said: I get the feeling wanting this to be a thf has more to do with ppl wanting it not to be a guardian because they want a "gun" for the guardian class. As much as the preview order maybe off the order of the icons on the sell pages is very much not out of order so you have to make your chose between the order of how they are shown as well as what the icon them self represent (weapons or class effects). I think its in order of light mid heavy and the dagger one is the new mez so the duel sword more then likely is this class and is more then likely heavy armor class. Both previous expac websites also showed the elite specs in an order which was random. So if they didn't order them back then into "light medium heavy" on repeat, then there is no reason to believe that they are doing it this time. I think the icons on the website are also randomixed just like they have been for the former 2 websites. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kodama.6453 Posted August 5, 2021 Share Posted August 5, 2021 7 minutes ago, TheLadyOfTheRings.9148 said: I agree. On the other hand, they did say they would break some rules. This argument is thrown around for literally every prediction made related to elite specs. I don't think that they meant stuff like this when they were talking about "breaking the rules", but that they meant that they are willing to experiment with stuff which goes against how they designed the gameplay of classes so far. Like mesmer losing the clones and therefore the element of spamming the field with look alikes for more offensive potential. In a similar way, I could for example imagine that necromancer gets more access to active defenses like evades or stuff like stealth added to them, something they actively avoided so far because of the damage sponge nature of necromancer, which would mean that if necromancer had these tools available, they would become unkillable. But if they are willing to remove the extra hp mechanic from the death shroud, necromancers might be allowed to have this stuff. But the teaser images didn't strike me as something they are breaking their artwork design rules for here. Mesmer and necromancer have been so blatantly obvious their class, there wasn't even a discussion about it to begin with. I think they will keep these artworks still following the same rules like in former elite specs. For example, I also expect the ranger to get pictured in a kneeling/cowering pose, like they have been in all their artwork so far. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jski.6180 Posted August 5, 2021 Share Posted August 5, 2021 23 minutes ago, Kodama.6453 said: Both previous expac websites also showed the elite specs in an order which was random. So if they didn't order them back then into "light medium heavy" on repeat, then there is no reason to believe that they are doing it this time. I think the icons on the website are also randomixed just like they have been for the former 2 websites. HOT web pages looks like they did them by armor class 3 lights 3 heavy and 3 mid. POF looks a bit more random but i think that got messed up with the leaks. HOT was the first time they did an expansion (no icons at all) and well its very different then say EoD and PoF in effects showing a real lack of consistently from expansion to expansion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lincolnbeard.1735 Posted August 5, 2021 Share Posted August 5, 2021 17 minutes ago, Kodama.6453 said: Mesmer and necromancer have been so blatantly obvious their class, there wasn't even a discussion about it to begin with. Actually there was. "It's not the right shade of pink" crew. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jski.6180 Posted August 5, 2021 Share Posted August 5, 2021 6 minutes ago, Lincolnbeard.1735 said: Actually there was. "It's not the right shade of pink" crew. There a very strong "i dont want this to be true" mind set with elite spec previews. We will know by the 13 and it will clear up a lot at this point we just have logic and reason to though points of view. A lot of ppl play gurd and a lot of ppl want it to give a gun (sadly the long bow is effectively the gun for the class) the gurd class is missing a fast melee and sword fits that need. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zidane.5194 Posted August 5, 2021 Share Posted August 5, 2021 The pose of the silhouette doesn't really matter. If you look back at all the previous professions/elites, there are a few of them that the pose doesn't match. For example, look at Necro, Reaper, and Scourge. All three show a different pose. Elementalist and Weaver have two different poses. In fact, with Elementalist and Weaver, the Weaver pose looks a lot more aggressive in it's stance. But, as @Jski.6180 said, we will know more on the 13th. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Necromancer#/media/File:Necromancer_03_concept_art.jpg https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Reaper#/media/File:Spec_image_Reaper.jpg https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Scourge#/media/File:Spec_image_Scourge.jpg https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Elementalist#/media/File:Elementalist_04_concept_art.png https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Weaver#/media/File:Spec_image_Weaver.jpg 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kodama.6453 Posted August 5, 2021 Share Posted August 5, 2021 1 minute ago, Jski.6180 said: HOT web pages looks like they did them by armor class 3 lights 3 heavy and 3 mid. POF looks a bit more random but i think that got messed up with the leaks. HOT was the first time they did an expansion (no icons at all) and well its very different then say EoD and PoF in effects showing a real lack of consistently from expansion to expansion. I just looked at the website again and they are listed in the same order as they were revealed. Tempest, Dragonhunter, Reaper, .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kodama.6453 Posted August 5, 2021 Share Posted August 5, 2021 9 minutes ago, zidane.5194 said: The pose of the silhouette doesn't really matter. If you look back at all the previous professions/elites, there are a few of them that the pose doesn't match. For example, look at Necro, Reaper, and Scourge. All three show a different pose. Elementalist and Weaver have two different poses. In fact, with Elementalist and Weaver, the Weaver pose looks a lot more aggressive in it's stance. But, as @Jski.6180 said, we will know more on the 13th. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Necromancer#/media/File:Necromancer_03_concept_art.jpg https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Reaper#/media/File:Spec_image_Reaper.jpg https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Scourge#/media/File:Spec_image_Scourge.jpg https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Elementalist#/media/File:Elementalist_04_concept_art.png https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Weaver#/media/File:Spec_image_Weaver.jpg So you think it is a complete coincidenc that guardian is always shown directly from the side? I find that hard to believe. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zidane.5194 Posted August 5, 2021 Share Posted August 5, 2021 1 minute ago, Kodama.6453 said: So you think it is a complete coincidenc that guardian is always shown directly from the side? I find that hard to believe. Yes, I do. Or did they just happen to make it so Necros and Eles are the only ones that have different stances? It is just a coincidence. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zidane.5194 Posted August 5, 2021 Share Posted August 5, 2021 And actually, if I remember correctly, Rev, Herald, and Ren all have different stances as well that would look different in silhouette. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoosh.2718 Posted August 5, 2021 Share Posted August 5, 2021 To be fair guardian is slowly becoming more aggressive each expansion artwork. in HoT we had a bow, in Pof we had an axe ready to chop, now guardian is angry and turning to strike with their swords. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xanhawk.3806 Posted August 5, 2021 Share Posted August 5, 2021 7 minutes ago, zidane.5194 said: And actually, if I remember correctly, Rev, Herald, and Ren all have different stances as well that would look different in silhouette. Yep https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/1/18/Revenant_02_concept_art.jpg https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/0/06/Spec_image_Herald.jpg https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/f/f6/Spec_image_Renegade.jpg 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kodama.6453 Posted August 5, 2021 Share Posted August 5, 2021 Another thing which rubs me the wrong way about this being a guardian is that it just seems so clashing thematically. Guardian core has so many light based animations, this is something I just can't see this character here doing. He looks very rogue-like to me, so shouting stuff like "receive the light" and shooting light disks at enemies just seems so out of character for this guy. I just think the thief core set makes way more sense for this guy thematically than having a guardian core set. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roads.5130 Posted August 5, 2021 Share Posted August 5, 2021 7 hours ago, Kodama.6453 said: This argument is thrown around for literally every prediction made related to elite specs. I don't think that they meant stuff like this when they were talking about "breaking the rules", but that they meant that they are willing to experiment with stuff which goes against how they designed the gameplay of classes so far. 3 hours ago, Kodama.6453 said: Another thing which rubs me the wrong way about this being a guardian is that it just seems so clashing thematically. There is nothing wrong with breaking the rules thematically if that's what they intend to do, and there is very little arguments that they are doing so anyway (literally just a pose and a color). 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anchoku.8142 Posted August 5, 2021 Share Posted August 5, 2021 (edited) Guessing Guardian, now, instead of Thief because of the blue shade around the upper torso. The helmet looks like it could have a Thief-like face mask and the armor looks like it could fit in the medium or heavy category. A second sword can only be Guard, Ranger or Thief. Ranger is always Sylvari. Thief never had a hint of blue shading in its background. Thief also does not have any off-hand exclusive weapons like, for example, torch. An arsonist build for Thief seems like low-hanging fruit. Edited August 6, 2021 by Anchoku.8142 Changed guess to Guardian 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rogue.8235 Posted August 6, 2021 Share Posted August 6, 2021 Put me down for Shiro-inspired thief elite specialization. First thing I thought of when I heard "dual swords" and "Cantha" together. Then again, this is so on-the-nose it might turn out to be a completely different surprise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
draxynnic.3719 Posted August 6, 2021 Share Posted August 6, 2021 10 hours ago, Acyk.9671 said: you answered me before my edit where i explained a bit more what i was thinking. The thing is thief is an assassin by design. Cantha being land of the assassins doesn't change that. So sword oh would provide blocks and maybe some condi like warrior? I mean nothing you just said convinces me it's better than oh dagger especially when mace and axe can also provide blocks, condi, mobility. I am not saying thief won't get oh sword because it's still a possibility and i would love that but i don't think it will happen because 3 e-specs already got sword in the last 2 expac when they could give something more original. After all Anet said they wanted to revolutionize e-spec but some things won't change much like what kind of mechanics weapons offer regardless if the wielding animation change. As i explained in my edit, people assume oh sword on thief is a given because of Shiro, it's not. I'm still not seeing any support to your assertion that having one offhand sword spec means that they're not going to make another. Instead, you seem to be throwing possibilities at the wall and saying "what about this?" if we were going to play that game, I could add other possibilities you haven't thought about (focus for more shadow magic, for instance) - however, I think we need to think about what's likely as well as what's simply possible. For instance, let's consider mace and axe. Thief is themed around having a fairly agile combat style - while this theoretically could change in an elite specialisation themed around a more brutal kind of thief, I'd say that it's more likely that any given thief elite spec is going to hold to the principle of agility over brute force than not. And comparing the three weapons, sword is much more suitable for this sort of combat because it's balanced close to the hand and therefore is generally quicker to maneouver. Axes and maces, on the other hand, are top-heavy and therefore tend to be harder to move around than a sword, but have more force to the blow when they do land. As a result, sword is more suited to thief fighting styles than axe or mace. (Heck, if thief DOES ever get axe, I'd probably expect it to be a throwing weapon similar to ranger rather than a melee weapon.) In the Canthan context... even putting aside the precedents of Shiro and GW1 "daggers" that were really sword-length, whether accurate or not, Eastern armed martial arts are more associated with dual-wielding than Western styles. So it's a suitable time to introduce another option for duel-wielding thief. And in that context, and with statements from ArenaNet indicating that spellbreaker daggers was a special thing for Warrior and shouldn't be considered to be usual procedure, does it make more sense for a new thief offhand to be a weapon that they already have mainhand access to, or something random like a mace or axe? Apart from daggers and dedicated OH weapons, the only case I can think of where a weapon is available as an OH without being available to that profession as a MH weapon is revenant axe, and revenant weapon sets are supposed to be a little unusual. 10 hours ago, Sons.5493 said: I would like to point out that both the swords, the imperial armor style (I know its the warlord set) and the pose all are incredibly reminiscent of Shiro Tagachi which used to be the Canthan Emperor bodyguard. It's a bit of a stretch but the spec could be based on that role and have a playstyle similar to how the actual Shiro fighted in gw1. I could see a general 'bodyguard' theme being possible - Almorra's tactic seemed to be more about area denial and lockdown, but hey, that could have bodyguarding applications. I don't think we're going to see a repeat of "playstyle similar to the actual Shiro", though: revenant already has that. Some inspiration, perhaps, but certainly not a direct copy. 10 hours ago, TheLadyOfTheRings.9148 said: I know there's a blue aura and I see those blue lines too 🙂 What I'm saying is, it's not the shade of blue I would expect to see on a Guardian concept art. But, hey, it's not the final reveal yet, it's just the silhouette. I think one thing to keep in mind here is that the filters ArenaNet has used to make it into a silhouette has likely also changed the shades of blue on the outline (which may be what's left of a larger aura that was cropped so we actually got a silhouette rather than a blob). So it might be a more guardian-associated shade when it's fully revealed, even if it looks a bit more like thief indigo now. 6 hours ago, Kodama.6453 said: Another thing which rubs me the wrong way about this being a guardian is that it just seems so clashing thematically. Guardian core has so many light based animations, this is something I just can't see this character here doing. He looks very rogue-like to me, so shouting stuff like "receive the light" and shooting light disks at enemies just seems so out of character for this guy. I just think the thief core set makes way more sense for this guy thematically than having a guardian core set. Similar to the above - are you sure you're not just letting the fact that it's been darkened to make it into a silhouette colour your judgements here? When the original image is revealed, it might well prove to have the full "knight in shining armour" look with a backdrop of blue flames or something else that would scream 'guardian'. I also... don't really see that a duel-wielding pose really points more to one than another? It's still sword/sword, after all, and thief sword is actually one of their less dynamic weapons. Autoattack is a fairly typical autoattack, sword 2 is a teleport on both thief and guardian, and if combined with a pistol, sword 3 is a flurry attack similar to Zealot's Defence just without the barrage of glowing shockwaves. Only if combined with dagger do you get the roll-into-a-flank effect. I really don't see the pose as being incompatible with either possibility. Meanwhile, we have a pretty convincing identification of the specific armour set being worn, with only a couple of minor details being off, and too many details being matched for it to be likely to be coincidence. I started this discussion leaning balance-of-probabilities to it being thief, but the armour identification is pretty convincing. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cynz.9437 Posted August 6, 2021 Share Posted August 6, 2021 (edited) So OH sword thief? I hope i am wrong 😴😴😴 Edited August 6, 2021 by Cynz.9437 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lazze.9870 Posted August 6, 2021 Share Posted August 6, 2021 9 hours ago, Roads.5130 said: There is nothing wrong with breaking the rules thematically if that's what they intend to do It's off-putting. Suddenly giving a high tech spec to ranger for example. When they mentioned breaking rules, the obviously talked about mechanics, and maybe roles compared to what the profession currently have. They didn't talk about something as absurd as the pose they use in the some artwork. That being said, talking about the pose is absurd to begin with. Yes, ranger is kneeling/cowering on all three arts. Probably less to do with how they want to portray ranger and more to do with fitting all the professions into a picture. The druid artwork is cut in half, as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kodama.6453 Posted August 6, 2021 Share Posted August 6, 2021 16 minutes ago, Lazze.9870 said: It's off-putting. Suddenly giving a high tech spec to ranger for example. When they mentioned breaking rules, the obviously talked about mechanics, and maybe roles compared to what the profession currently have. They didn't talk about something as absurd as the pose they use in the some artwork. That being said, talking about the pose is absurd to begin with. Yes, ranger is kneeling/cowering on all three arts. Probably less to do with how they want to portray ranger and more to do with fitting all the professions into a picture. The druid artwork is cut in half, as well. Pose aside, this guy doesn't strike me as someone who would use the guardian core abilities thematically. Imagine this guy yelling stuff like "receive the light!" or throwing light orbs with a staff... It feels so wrong. I can imagine this guy to use thief abilities or revenant abilities, but guardian? 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roads.5130 Posted August 6, 2021 Share Posted August 6, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Lazze.9870 said: It's off-putting. Suddenly giving a high tech spec to ranger for example. When they mentioned breaking rules, the obviously talked about mechanics, and maybe roles compared to what the profession currently have. They didn't talk about something as absurd as the pose they use in the some artwork. That being said, talking about the pose is absurd to begin with. Yes, ranger is kneeling/cowering on all three arts. Probably less to do with how they want to portray ranger and more to do with fitting all the professions into a picture. The druid artwork is cut in half, as well. Yes, I agree, I only mentioned that as a reply to the person I was talking to, I don't even see a reason to consider the teaser as "clashing thematically" with Guardian because of the pose. And about breaking the rules thematically being off-putting and using high tech with ranger as an example, I would say that if we were going to space it would not be as off putting, but we are going to Cantha and giving them more 'Canthian' proffessions should make sense. Edited August 6, 2021 by Roads.5130 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
draxynnic.3719 Posted August 6, 2021 Share Posted August 6, 2021 47 minutes ago, Kodama.6453 said: Pose aside, this guy doesn't strike me as someone who would use the guardian core abilities thematically. Imagine this guy yelling stuff like "receive the light!" or throwing light orbs with a staff... It feels so wrong. I can imagine this guy to use thief abilities or revenant abilities, but guardian? Imagine that instead of having the background cropped out and the remaining image darkened to the point where nearly all of the details are obscured, it's shining armour and a background of blue fire. Is it so hard to imagine then? There's nothing about the pose that says this guy can't be using guardian magic. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lazze.9870 Posted August 6, 2021 Share Posted August 6, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Kodama.6453 said: Pose aside, this guy doesn't strike me as someone who would use the guardian core abilities thematically. Imagine this guy yelling stuff like "receive the light!" or throwing light orbs with a staff... It feels so wrong. I can imagine this guy to use thief abilities or revenant abilities, but guardian? It's not gonna stay permanently stuck in that pose. The pose highlights the new abilities. It's natural that a double sworded guardian would lean a bit more that way, assuming it is an offensive spec, maybe more "debuff" focused (because, favorite blue class should be able to do everyting). Speaking of poses, the druid pose doesn't remind me of anything core ranger or druid does. I think its a result of druid itself changing from being more offensive minded to what it is now, but already having the artwork done. Edited August 6, 2021 by Lazze.9870 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
draxynnic.3719 Posted August 6, 2021 Share Posted August 6, 2021 9 minutes ago, Lazze.9870 said: It's not gonna stay permanently stuck in that pose. The pose highlights the new abilities. Speaking of poses, the druid pose doesn't remind me of anything core ranger or druid does. I think its a result of druid itself changing from being more offensive minded to what it is now, but already having the artwork done. I think there's also a degree to which the poses have been determined by where the professions fit into the composite images that fit all of the professions into a single picture. The PoF arrangement is different to the core and HoT arrangements, but a common thread is that ranger is always in the lower part, which explains why they're always crouching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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