Yo this class is straight bad in pvp lmao

[GrayBalls.5968]

Squishiest + least damage + highest burden of execution + mobility creep of other classes + mobility nerfs to thief + other classes having stealth, damage, and sustain in spades = mega dog thief. Anyone saying that it isn't bad either: A) plays the class and wants to try to weird flex, knowing that it is actually bad and saying its fine to appear skilled at the game, or B) mains another class wanting to kitten on thief to avoid having to compete with another viable class. where is the lie boys?

[SeTect.5918]

4 hours ago, GrayBalls.5968 said:

Squishiest + least damage + highest burden of execution + mobility creep of other classes + mobility nerfs to thief + other classes having stealth, damage, and sustain in spades = mega dog thief. Anyone saying that it isn't bad either: A) plays the class and wants to try to weird flex, knowing that it is actually bad and saying its fine to appear skilled at the game, or B) mains another class wanting to kitten on thief to avoid having to compete with another viable class. where is the lie boys?

U still have time to either A) edit to: "delete", or B) edit it to someone actually saying more than the usual "buff my class" cry while its not even a bad one.

 

Me going in nearly perma stealth and then 1shot someone With deadeye but i guess...

4 hours ago, GrayBalls.5968 said:

Anyone saying that it isn't bad either: A) plays the class and wants to try to weird flex, knowing that it is actually bad and saying its fine to appear skilled at the game, or B) mains another class wanting to kitten on thief to avoid having to compete with another viable class. 

 

Oh wait you also Asked something:

4 hours ago, GrayBalls.5968 said:

where is the lie boys?

I ll tell u!

There:

4 hours ago, GrayBalls.5968 said:

Squishiest + least damage + highest burden of execution + mobility creep of other classes + mobility nerfs to thief + other classes having stealth, damage, and sustain in spades = mega dog thief. Anyone saying that it isn't bad either: A) plays the class and wants to try to weird flex, knowing that it is actually bad and saying its fine to appear skilled at the game, or B) mains another class wanting to kitten on thief to avoid having to compete with another viable class.

 

Sqishy, yes.

Least damage, i guess my 1shot deadeye doesnt count. 

 

 

Some people are asking "Why you even play this class then?" when u say 1 thing that you dont like about the class. 

But u rly talk thief so bad here that i should say it. 

 

I cant even say if u troll or not. But if not its pretty much a l2p issue. 

Edited August 8, 2021 by SeTect.5918

[Zacchary.6183]

28 minutes ago, SeTect.5918 said:

U still have time to either A) edit to: "delete", or B) edit it to someone actually saying more than the usual "buff my class" cry while its not even a bad one.

 

Me going in nearly perma stealth and then 1shot someone With deadeye but i guess...

 

Oh wait you also Asked something:

I ll tell u!

There:

 

Sqishy, yes.

Least damage, i guess my 1shot deadeye doesnt count. 

 

 

Some people are asking "Why you even play this class then?" when u say 1 thing that you dont like about the class. 

But u rly talk thief so bad here that i should say it. 

 

I cant even say if u troll or not. But if not its pretty much a l2p issue. 

Pfft. My thief does like 50 backstabs in a row before stealth ends. I at one point backstabbed someone so hard their computer blew up and I got hate mail for it. Get on my level.

[Sootser.9541]

Squishy? Yes. Bad? Depends on the player.

 

I've been maining thief since launch and it is definitely in a weird spot, but it is far from bad. The mobility coupled with the mind games of stealth makes thief a strong contribution to almost any team. Thief is a finisher in sPvP. We move quickly and end fights by being the extra man in the fight and killing one of the enemy targets, then we're off to do other things.

 

If you can't see the value of having a thief on your team you haven't met a good thief yet, or you are just salty you got destroyed by one 🙄

[Obtena.7952]

I love the 'new player' perspective on how trash a class is when they don't know how to play it. 

[Dadnir.5038]

1 hour ago, Obtena.7952 said:

I love the 'new player' perspective on how trash a class is when they don't know how to play it. 

 

It's not a "new player", he is "aware" of some kind of mobility creep on other profession and mobility nerfs on thief.

 

That said, thief can be difficult to play optimally, however for the average player it's a pretty simple profession and straightforward profession to play. It's far from being the profession that have the "highest burden of execution" (at the very least from what I understand of this expression).

[Terrorsquad.2349]

Thief in wrong hands is indeed underperforming but it also heavily depends on his team. Either they constantly lose teamfights due lack of knowledge, kiting and getting outrotated and they will blame the thief because many believe Thief is just a decap bot, which is bronze/silver mentality.

 

However, I'm going to be honest here as a thief player:

 

Thief is in a weird spot. Back in the days a good thief could carry a team because of the many sustain builds and therefore teamfights taking long and less mobility on other classes. Now it's much less so because it's also heavily dependend on its teammates to survive either 1v1 or teamfights long enough before thief gets there to support in DPS. It takes longer as it requires more ini or taking risk by using Shadowstep and put it on CD.

 

Meanwhile the game has been made easier for slow-moving classes/builds to rotate due to the feb 2020 patch. Which makes it harder again for the thief because it needs to process more and different information as to what it needs to do.

 

Yes, a thief can decap node unga bunga but decapping has no worth if his team dies or loses team fights without proper focus, sustain, kiting or damage. Which is why its, imo, harder to play SoloQ thief because you do not know how your team will perform and how to set your priorities based on the results. 

Should you unga bunga spam decap far?

Should you focus on +1'ing fights on side nodes?

Should you focus on enemy target 1 by 1 to snowball the conquest mechanics in your teams favor?

Should you focus on alternative objective on the map (beast, buff, ..)?

 

However, in a premade with Discord or w/e comms, it's quite obvious a Thief can have a pivot effect on a match. Because of having communication, the thief has less information to filter through and gets direct feedback or commands.

 

TL;DR: thief is harder to play in SoloQ than most builds but is certainly important to have in an organized 5v5 for different roles.

[Sindrener.1592]

Watch me and learn

[Vornollo.5182]

Context is important...

Soloqueue? Yeah, you're kinda at a loss if you, or your team, doesn't know how to play (with a) Thief.

AT's? Thieves can swing games, commonly happens.

 

Win conditions can change, Thief has some of the easiest time adapting during the game.

 

[Peacekid.1463]

dude there is no single trash or garbage class in the game its all about whose behind playing

[Kallist.5917]

There are no trash classes, just trash plays and strats. If Thief doesnt do it for you, move on. If you insist on playing thief, I suggest you scrap your build and come up with a new one.

[saerni.2584]

19 hours ago, bluri.2653 said:

Watch me and learn

Sure, but I don't know how much a new player can actually learn about rotation/gameplay from simply watching someone else play. 
 

It can't hurt though so why not? 
 

On the main topic, thief is fine even if it could use a few buffs and some others need nerfs.

 

More important, I think "reading the map" goes hand in hand with "reading your team." You can try to control your team with target calls or what-not, but there is no guarantee they will agree with those calls or even notice. Sometimes you have to try to adapt to their sub-optimal strategy—and often you won't be able to. Your skills as a player will be tested (and your build) by how well you can also deal with less than optimal team gameplay. 
 

Ask yourself, "why is my team losing? And what can I do about it?" Broadly speaking there are a few reasons matches are slipping away:

1. Team isn't winning fights

2. Team isn't rotating correctly

3. Team isn't contesting/taking map mechanics 

 

Things you can do: peeling, decaping, +1ing, disrupting.

1. Peeling — Figure out who their key players are for damage/support and then distract them while your team focuses another target. If it's a 3v3, you come in to make it a 3v2 and 1v1 or even 3v1 and 1v2. Your goal isn't to get killed, so stay alive, but peel off the problematic people so your team can secure kills and not get focused themselves. Thief should be/is hard to pin down so use that to your advantage when it comes to peeling.

2. Decap — There are two forms of decap. One is where the team rotates into a node and decaps it by keeping the opponents off the node, which is fairly common (I.e what they should be doing). The other, where you decap uncontested is all about stealth, individual speed and getting back to the fight quickly. Unless your team can hold out the goal is to divide their team by forcing one of their team to spend more time on that node rather than in the team fights. Ideally, a side noder could rotate in and contest / hold against multiple enemies.
3. +1 — Getting kills and downs is a critical part of winning, so this is probably your most important role. You need to know who is low on cool downs and HP and then finish them off quickly. Picking your targets is something that takes awareness and focus. Don't lose track of who you want to bring down. The longer it takes to +1 the more time the enemy has to regroup. 
4. Disrupt — Read the map and make sure your team won't lose map mechanics uncontested. You need to also try to cut off enemies heading to map mechanics to give your team an easier time taking them. If they stall at the Bell they may be able to upset you. If you slow down their person even a little your team may snowball the node or even take it without a fight. Always look to the map and try to apply maximum psychological pressure. 
 

Other than that, get better mechanically and don't stress out. Your focus is what matters a lot and stress will often impair that focus. It's a game and sometimes your enemies are better or have more composition luck than you. Don't worry and try your best.

[LuRkEr.9462]

Lol at calling the class that nearly every high end group uses in their comp "bad." 

A good thief rarely ever dies, so contributes no points to enemy. A good thief decaps (sometimes captures) other points so much it causes the enemy to lose. A good thief +1's fights, rarely goes for the duels unless its finishing someone they wander across. 

 

 

Granted thief is a high skill class and if your bad you may find it terrible, but its not the class being bad, its the player.

[Tails.9372]

I wouldn't call the class bad but some of the weapon sets and their associated builds certainly are, P/P isn't called a "meme set" for nothing.

Edited August 12, 2021 by Tails.9372

[Psycoprophet.8107]

Thief is a class that is highly dependent on its team, if ur team is bad or getting steamrolled u wont be able to do anything. If ur teams decent and able to hold their own u will be very effective and impactful in the match through +1'ing and decapping. If ur team cant teamfight u wont add much to the fight, if ur team mates cant hold their own ur +1 will end up with just u vs the enemie lol.

[kash.9213]

You're probably stuck with one or maybe two capable builds for those maps depending on current game build and those builds have to roam up and down a pretty tight couple of lanes generally. If you're built for your team on that map then you're going to feel like thief is bad in most encounters because it probably will be but will likely be passable. In context of the match however that bad thief could be what's keeping the team from cascading into a quick loss. 

 

Play for the map and get your fulfilment from acing your rotations and all that. Or, play WvW but that has it's ups and downs also. 

[solemn.9608]

Idk about highest burden of execution, man, I sure wish that I could stealth backstab and then press the shadowshot button a few times to get a kill. I dont think it's even possible to lack DPS on thief, you'd have to intentionally run a bad build...

[Salvatore.3749]

On 8/8/2021 at 3:17 PM, GrayBalls.5968 said:

Squishiest + least damage + highest burden of execution + mobility creep of other classes + mobility nerfs to thief + other classes having stealth, damage, and sustain in spades = mega dog thief. Anyone saying that it isn't bad either: A) plays the class and wants to try to weird flex, knowing that it is actually bad and saying its fine to appear skilled at the game, or B) mains another class wanting to kitten on thief to avoid having to compete with another viable class. where is the lie boys?

 

For real? Did you not cap or 1v1 any other players? I carry so many teams in 5v5 through capping and 1v1ing DH, Mirage, Warrior, Ranger, etc., gaining stomps and caps. Nothing is sweeter in this game than my PUG team stalling the other team while we have all 3 nodes and win 500 to 89. All because I focused on capping and 1v1ing. And that is as core thief with Critical Strikes, Shadow Arts, and Trickery using D/D and SB. 

 

I haven't even gotten to DE yet where I just sit somewhere and gain 15 kills in a row before I decided to start roaming and capturing nodes. 

Oh, don't let me forget to mention that in 3v3 my DD gets 9 kills by executing stomps faster with the elite skill with dual pistols and sword and dagger. 

[Ragebru.1397]

On 8/8/2021 at 3:17 PM, GrayBalls.5968 said:

Squishiest + least damage + highest burden of execution + mobility creep of other classes + mobility nerfs to thief + other classes having stealth, damage, and sustain in spades = mega dog thief. Anyone saying that it isn't bad either: A) plays the class and wants to try to weird flex, knowing that it is actually bad and saying its fine to appear skilled at the game, or B) mains another class wanting to kitten on thief to avoid having to compete with another viable class. where is the lie boys?

two of the top 5 players in sPvP are maining thief.... but guess that's irrelevant from your standards?

[Terrorsquad.2349]

6 hours ago, jwhite.7012 said:

two of the top 5 players in sPvP are maining thief.... but guess that's irrelevant from your standards?

I agree with your statement but no top thief queues Solo and gets that high. They rarily SoloQ. They mostly Duo. Thieves need carry. If team keeps wiping, thief is useless. SoloQ is a gamble. People don't gamble and get that high on leaderboard. They either DuoQ or they wintrade.

 

2 weeks ago I defeated a "God of PvP"-holosmith with D/P DD thief in just about 30s or so, while decapping his point. He was trash mechanically and rotationally.

I'm trash too.

 

TL;DR: don't go from leaderboard, it's subjective and far from reality to base anything from it in current state.

[Ragebru.1397]

2 hours ago, Terrorsquad.2349 said:

I agree with your statement but no top thief queues Solo and gets that high. They rarily SoloQ. They mostly Duo. Thieves need carry. If team keeps wiping, thief is useless. SoloQ is a gamble. People don't gamble and get that high on leaderboard. They either DuoQ or they wintrade.

 

2 weeks ago I defeated a "God of PvP"-holosmith with D/P DD thief in just about 30s or so, while decapping his point. He was trash mechanically and rotationally.

I'm trash too.

 

TL;DR: don't go from leaderboard, it's subjective and far from reality to base anything from it in current state.

45 w /// 3 losses isn't random. Thief is one of like 2 classes that can truly solo carry in spvp

idk, stop using d/p if you're not good with it and try P/D. Literally face rolls everyone.

 

[Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497]

On 8/10/2021 at 7:09 AM, Terrorsquad.2349 said:

Thief in wrong hands is indeed underperforming but it also heavily depends on his team. Either they constantly lose teamfights due lack of knowledge, kiting and getting outrotated and they will blame the thief because many believe Thief is just a decap bot, which is bronze/silver mentality.

 

However, I'm going to be honest here as a thief player:

 

Thief is in a weird spot. Back in the days a good thief could carry a team because of the many sustain builds and therefore teamfights taking long and less mobility on other classes. Now it's much less so because it's also heavily dependend on its teammates to survive either 1v1 or teamfights long enough before thief gets there to support in DPS. It takes longer as it requires more ini or taking risk by using Shadowstep and put it on CD.

 

Meanwhile the game has been made easier for slow-moving classes/builds to rotate due to the feb 2020 patch. Which makes it harder again for the thief because it needs to process more and different information as to what it needs to do.

 

Yes, a thief can decap node unga bunga but decapping has no worth if his team dies or loses team fights without proper focus, sustain, kiting or damage. Which is why its, imo, harder to play SoloQ thief because you do not know how your team will perform and how to set your priorities based on the results. 

Should you unga bunga spam decap far?

Should you focus on +1'ing fights on side nodes?

Should you focus on enemy target 1 by 1 to snowball the conquest mechanics in your teams favor?

Should you focus on alternative objective on the map (beast, buff, ..)?

 

However, in a premade with Discord or w/e comms, it's quite obvious a Thief can have a pivot effect on a match. Because of having communication, the thief has less information to filter through and gets direct feedback or commands.

 

TL;DR: thief is harder to play in SoloQ than most builds but is certainly important to have in an organized 5v5 for different roles.

I'm curious as to what you define under-performing.
I've seen amazing players on the thief absolutely struggle in fights where their opponent made far more mistakes than the thief.

 

I'm in the field of every class should be able to hold their own in both team fights and 1v1s. But thief can barely do either or.

[Terrorsquad.2349]

7 hours ago, jwhite.7012 said:

45 w /// 3 losses isn't random. Thief is one of like 2 classes that can truly solo carry in spvp

idk, stop using d/p if you're not good with it and try P/D. Literally face rolls everyone.

 

And that ain’t SoloQ either. 45/3 cannot be done Solo. Please understand this. As I said: do not believe the leaderboard as it currently is. Most people duoq or wintrade to get that high. Yes, there are some pro players also wintrading in the morning (EU) and others playing alt-accounts to lose so friend gets more. That’s the reality.

 

Thief can’t carry if your team is feeding. Nor can it contest a point as a sidenoder so it can only decap IF point is free. Nor can it keep someone safe by removing conditions or healing, it can only snipe/harass the one pressuring.

Those days are long gone thief could carry SOLOq

I agree P/D can melt, but it goes slower reaching higher rating, trust me.

 

Also it doesn’t mean a pro thief player is having so much wins, they only play thief y’know.

 

TL;DR: Leaderboard is not representing the reality of whatever class. Wintrading and DuoQ have big impact on rating. Thief doesn’t carry SoloQ as it used to: if team dies, team dies. Thief players also play other classes. 

[Terrorsquad.2349]

7 hours ago, Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497 said:

I'm curious as to what you define under-performing.
I've seen amazing players on the thief absolutely struggle in fights where their opponent made far more mistakes than the thief.

 

I'm in the field of every class should be able to hold their own in both team fights and 1v1s. But thief can barely do either or.

Sounds plausible. Thief isn’t made to 1v1. It has highest mobility so keep that in mind. See it as a trade off. You can decap and +1 much faster than anyone.

However, Thief in general is harder to play. Mechanically and rotationally. It needs to process way more information than “I go unga bunga side hero” or “I spam shouts for cleanses boiz” in teamfights. 

 

So a good thief is certainly worth having but its team needs to stay alive so thief can perform its rotations. Which, in SoloQ, is mostly not the case. Feels saver to go to the first teamfight as a thief and snowball from there. If you succeed.

Edited August 21, 2021 by Terrorsquad.2349
Grammar

[Bunny.9834]

Isn't it interesting that this class is a "Thief" yet everything else was stolen from them??? 

 

Mobility and Shadowstep? psych! Guardian can do that now!

Boon Removal? Hi Necro have it

Stealth? Mesmer and Scrapper can do that better! 

Single target gank? Soulbeastc can do that AND from 1800 range! 

Assassin? Willbender and Shiro Rev here!