Please fix broken Stealth mechanics. Here are some constructive ideas for inspiration. — Guild Wars 2 Forums
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Please fix broken Stealth mechanics. Here are some constructive ideas for inspiration.

Swagger.1459Swagger.1459 Member ✭✭✭✭
edited September 25, 2019 in Professions

1- Inspiration from City of Heroes… A fully fleshed out Stealth and Stealth detection system where players could NOT go into stealth during combat…
https://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Stealth_and_Perception

“A player or critter's Perception is simply the maximum distance, measured in feet, at which it can detect hostile targets. For players, it also affects the maximum distance at which targeted powers can be used against that enemy. Critters aren't limited this way. Once a critter becomes aggressive toward something, its AI remains aware of that target's exact location and can chase and attack it regardless of perception until it reverts to peaceful.

The Stealth of a target reduces the radius at which an enemy can see the target, making it possible for up-close sneak attacks. The Stalker archetype often relies on attacking from Hide, which is an alternate form of stealth unique to the Stalker archetype.
Example: Normally, if Character stood 45 feet from a Troll, he would need a perception radius of 45 feet to notice she was there. If Character had a stealth radius of 35 feet, he would need a perception radius of 80 feet to detect her. Or in other words, Character could stand up to 10 feet away from the Troll and not be seen; however, the Troll would see her if she moved any closer.

If Character has as much stealth as, or more stealth than, the perception of the enemy, Character will be invisible no matter how close she gets.

Everything has some amount of perception to begin with. The exact amount varies greatly:
 Minion, pet, Mastermind henchmen (all tiers): 45
 Lieutenant: 50
 Boss, Elite Boss, Archvillain/Hero: 54
 Turret, Giant Monster: 100
 Sniper: 149
 Player: 500
Nothing has any stealth radius inherently. It must be granted by powers.

Notice that players have much higher perception than critters do. Because of this, all stealth powers have two values, one that applies to critters and one that applies to other players.”

“Snipers, like all enemies, will attack a character as soon as they can see the character (also called their "aggro radius") - if the character has no stealth, this means from 149 feet away instead of the standard 45 feet. This is due to their extra perception radius. They do not ignore stealth, they simply can see farther, canceling out some of the stealth radius a character may have.

However, there are enemies which ignore stealth. The enemy will not react to a player using no stealth from a further distance (as enemies with higher base perception, or perception buffs will), but as soon as a stealthed player is in range, the stealth-ignoring enemy will attack regardless. Enemies which ignore stealth completely include:
 Rikti Drones (including the Improved and Advanced Drones)
 Rularuu Sentries (all ranks: Watcher, Observer, and Overseer)
 Knives of Artemis

The enemies which ignore stealth all have their own legitimate reasons. Alien machines built with sophisticated scanners, otherworldly eyeball monsters, or tactical goggles, for example.

There are some enemies, most notably Longbow Eagles and some members of The Cabal that have a power called [Positioning] that makes these enemies appear to ignore stealth at times. These enemies are not meant to fight at melee range and Positioning forces them to move away from players. A side effect of this power is that it acts as a short range (8') Area of Effect attack. This "attack" forces stealth to suppress, allowing the enemy to see the player.”

“Stealthy opponents can be affected by powers even when they can't be detected. They simply can't be targeted. PBAoE powers can hit enemies if they're in the area, as can AoEs that are aimed at a spot on the ground. Targeted and cone AoEs can also hit hidden targets if aimed at visible ones close to them. A character can not assist a teammate that can see stealthy foes.”

“Here is an example listing of the perception bonuses or penalties granted by various powers. Note that Tactics applies its bonus to everyone on the team within line of sight and range. At least some powers that give perception bonuses vary their bonuses depending on character level. This listing is not necessarily complete.”……… GOES ON TO LIST THE SKILLS…

“All stealth powers stack with one exception: Toggle powers whose primary purpose is stealth. So, for example, if a character has Stealth from the Concealment Power Pool toggled on, and then toggle on Shadow Fall, then Concealment's Stealth will automatically toggle off. This is because both powers have a main focus of granting stealth radius.

This does not include powers which have a bonus stealth component, such as Super Speed or a a Stealth IO. So, for example, if a character has Concealment's Stealth toggled on (35 feet of Stealth in PvE) and then turns on Super Speed (35 feet) and turns on Sprint with a Stealth IO slotted into it (30 feet), then all three will remain on, for 100 feet of total stealth radius.”

*Take note that every character, EVERY CLASS, had optional access to Stealth and Invisibility if so chosen.

https://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Concealment.

”Grant Invisibility
Grants a targeted teammate Invisibility. The Invisibility lasts about 2 minutes. While your ally is Invisible, he probably will not be detected unless he attacks a target. If he attacks, he is still hard to see and maintains some bonus to Defense to all attacks. This power works with other Concealment related powers”

“Invisibility
You can bend light around yourself to become invisible. While this power is active, you are almost impossible to detect. While invisible, you cannot attack and can only use powers that affect yourself; however, you do have a defense to all except Psionic attacks. This power will not work with other self-affecting Concealment related powers such as Stealth or Shadow Fall. Purchasing Invisibility requires the user to be level 14 and possess Stealth or Grant Invisibility.”

“Stealth
You blend into your environment and can only be seen at very close range. Even if discovered, you are hard to see and have a bonus to Defense from all attacks. If, however, you attack while using this power, you will be discovered and will lose your Stealth and some of your Defense bonus. While Stealthy, your movement is Slowed. Stealth will not work with any other form of Concealment power such as Shadow Fall or Steamy Mist. Very low Endurance cost.”

*Stalkers, the “thief” class, were the only ones who could have the highest stacking stealth and invisibility values with an innate power called Hide… https://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Hide.

2- Inspiration from Camelot Unchained…

https://camelot.gamepedia.com/Stealth

“Some of the main goals for the design of the stealth system were to ensure that it was fun, not overpowered, wouldn’t promote or encourage Stealther gank groups, did not have stunlocking, no easy on/easy off stealth, and no unlimited stealth + strong opener + vanish. Another very important was that stealth and stealth classes work well within the entirety of the RvR framework, and not simply be something that be narrowly designed for solo or small group encounters only.”

“The design goals for this Stretch Goal can be summarized below:

• Goal #1 – Design a fun, interesting stealth mechanic, and classes that are not seen as “Easy Mode” by non-stealthers.
• Goal #2 - Do not design a class that is centered around a strong opener, stun, and vanish with long/unlimited stealth, nor a class that can hide, one-shot, vanish again.
• Goal #3 – Design a class that has the ability to be very active and sought-after, either in RvR groups or as roamers.
• Goal #4 – Design a class that some non-traditional Stealthers want to play.
• Goal #5 – Design a class that requires skill to play well, and not just unlimited patience.
• Goal #6 – Design a system where a gank group of Stealthers is not possible.”

“Camouflage is useable by all classes.

Archer classes get “magically enhanced” camouflage. Camouflage effectiveness is determined by the garb and environment. Camouflage works by drastically increasing your concealment stat while in use.”

“Veilwalking is distinct from camouflage and concealment. Veilwalking is the Camelot Unchained term that best translates to traditional MMO "stealth", and is the primary mechanism for the Stealther trio. It involves the practitioner going into the Veil, and it is their presence in the Veil which provides these classes their stealth status. All in attempt to gain surprise, and/or build up resources in order to gain an advantage versus an opponent.

• Veilwalking duration is not permanent, but instead lasts a “long” time (further specifics have not been given as of yet).
• Stealthers will be able to see other stealth classes while within the veil (the distances are unknown).
• Stealthers will be able to see other player characters outside the veil. (the distances are unknown).
• Stealthers will be immune to abilities from characters outside the veil unless they are specifically intended to target those within.

The longer the stealth classes remain within the Veil, the more damage they take when they emerge from the Veil. Estimates of damage are unknown. This is considered to be a balancing factor that allows CSE to give stealthers “strong openers”, and not force the stealthers to stand still to recover as was originally planned while unstealthing. This mechanic may or may not prove necessary and may not be kept (needs citation).

The more Stealthers within an area, the more Veil disturbance is created. Veil disturbance increases the damage taken while within the veil, and makes those inside easier to detect by creating more “noise” vs. the Detection statfromn their opponents. This noise is partially countered when many players help create background noise. This background noise will act as a mask to reduce the ease at which Stealthers are detected around larger fights. The results should be:

• 1 Stealther vs a single target : the Stealthers has normal stealth effectiveness.
• Multiple Stealthers vs fewer targets: the Stealthers have reduced stealth effectiveness.
• Multiple Stealthers in an area where multiple people are fighting: the Stealthers has normal stealth effectiveness.”

3- My super inspirational idea! https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/60005/concentration-stat-as-a-counter-to-stealth