[Necro been over nerfed !]

necro = bs 

[February 14 Balance Update Preview]

disappointing really..   

Cata will continue to be op
spell breaker will continue to be op

necro will continue to be useless garbage weak class..  
 

[Holo overheat PvP 33k from long stealth in 1/4 of a sec ^^ interactive!! conclusion buff weak cata!]

disgusting that stuff like that exist only show that pvp in this game no longer worth playing..  infact this entire game becomes unworthy

 

[Any advice for getting out of Gold?]

playing meta build .. .either spell breaker hammer or Cata 

[The problem with PvP]

the problem with pvp is Anet and pvp. thats all. there are way more problems than there are good state things  
no new mods. no new maps  awful balance bad matchmaking barely any players alot of design issues..  lack of properly functioning builds due to over nerfs / buffs in core traitlines  and many oudated skills/traits. 
pvp is just bad.. . 

[Sceptre is fine - you just need to learn how to dodge.]

the only thing Anet decided is that they dont care not that anything is fine or fair but they simply dont care 

[Meta is at one of its most unfun point]

agree pvp is not fun at the moment....  

[Make necro staff signs unblockable]

3 minutes ago, shion.2084 said:

Wouldn’t this suggestion give you unblockables on a 4 second cooldown with even just one of the skills?   
 

I honestly want to know though, what is the counterplay against unblockable marks?  I mean there’s a bunch n staff, and there are areas on maps that are narrow.  You can use them to bait dodges quickly…. And rushing a necro who can aoe on himself with blind is a bad idea…. So how do you see v1’s going?

 

you can also cast marks on people affected by fear, right?  
 

so how do you get around a kiting necro with fear and mark spam?   I actually have a lot of trouble with good necros as not all classes can build for resistance and condi removal.  So removing counterplay to condi seems about the worst idea to me.

read what i just wrote. . only staff 2 has like 4 seconds CD or something like that but it literally does 0 dmg  it only apply 2 bleed and self regeneration staff 3 already have 16 seconds cd and it also very little dmg maybe 1k crit
staff 4 is 3-4k crit on 20 seconds cd 

[Make necro staff signs unblockable]

27 minutes ago, shion.2084 said:

Wouldn’t doing this remove counterplay?  I mean unblockables should be very rare right?  Some classes only live because of active defences.  

i disagree with the suggested change simply because there are plenty of more urgent fixes for necro..   and also soul reaping is about the best not over nerfed traitline necro have..     but that being said.. what counter play exactly ?  staff is kinda 0 dps weapon on a necro..  for both condi and power..   1 does 0 2 does 0 and give "regeneration"  on short cd tho.  3 does very tickle minimal dmg and chill .  5 is 1 second fear or ws it even less and 0 dmg..  and theres 1 skill that does dmg and thats staff4 but thats also a condi clean..  so you often use it for condi clean...  but even then "DMG"   we are talking about 3-4k cit on 20 seconds CD ..  what exactly do you need to counter when playing agaisnt nero while he use staff? 

[Necro been over nerfed !]

9 hours ago, Vancho.8750 said:

I agree.
At this point the game has 3 elite specs, it is not like HoT where you had one elite that they forced to do all things somewhat, they have enough space to focus the specs into something, Reaper power bruiser dps, Harbinger hybrid ranged damage dealer leaning to conditions and maybe they should chuck the quickness support to Reaper since it is kinda subpar dps but that is more for PVE and maybe change the AoE boon to something else in PVP like scrapper and this leaves Scourge as support. 

the quickness is fine as it is..  dont forget necro skills have very very very slow skills which is why the quickness is needed and given.    trust me you dont want to play reaper without the quickness or harbringer.     and even with the quickness they both are underperforming. .   necros need a big update that fix outdated traits and utilities that been over nerfered or never been used..  and for scourge they gotta chose condi or sup i think that scourge should be a full support spec with 0 dmg neither power or condi but the fact that scourge is played power in WVW or celestial or condi in pvp/pve or sup is kittened up and its the reason why this class is pure bs at everything 

[Necro been over nerfed !]

1 hour ago, Vancho.8750 said:

It ends up in teamfight condi bunker that dampens everything near it or into a pile of nuclear waste of condi damage, so people stack them and it turns into a stat check instead of skill check gameplay.

The no 2nd Health bar is actually a buff, since the support doesn't need to stagger itself to heal the necro, the shroud might be annoying to people since it somewhat substitute to blocks, evades invulns, but it is one of those defenses that can be overwhelmed you also lose damage if overwhelmed. The shroud might look good when played on its strengths, but it is on a timer since the normal HP slowly but surely will run out at some point. 

Everyone is overstating the positives of shrouds but forgets the negatives the no heal in shroud, no utility skills and with that the cc and conditions weakness. The no shroud necros get overbuffed because of the perception of the positives without consideration of the negatives and you get this quite frankly terrible designed elite spec at their core that function in unfair way or be useless.

So Scourge will need a massive rework and change how it plays because the base core design just breaks the game in all modes, the rework needs to have strong purpose and not deviate in any way from it, non of that it can do everything kitten, if it supposed to be support it should get overwhelming and it should not scale of itself, it should also not end up in cheese like before that counters everything but some other really niche cheese builds. The trouble is that I don't think Anet will be willing to streamline it, by looking at something like Druid you can see that they didn't focus it to be a support in pvp and it just ended up in a bunker.  

i started necro as main scourge..  let me tell you about scourge i love the idea but i think Scourge need a rework and i think Anet need to chose .. .Scourge is a supprort ?  or its a condi/ power dmg dealer the idea of Scourge can be anything is the idea that makes everyone including necro mains like my self not want to see Scourge in the pvp..    if its a support then nerf/remove all its dmg potential and massively buff his supportive spec.. improve barriers and condi clean bring back the good ress and maybe some team boons.. idk.. make it support that worth play..        if its a dmg dealer remove the team barrier and team condi clean the idea of doing dmg while providing such support is disgusting . 

[Necro been over nerfed !]

4 hours ago, Dreams.3128 said:

Condi core necro doesn't need tankiness, but I will agree with damage. Their damage is not frontloaded like a lot of other classes, so it could be managed a bit better than most necro specs. HOWEVER, in the middle of small skirmishes or teamfights, they're actually really good with dropping cover condi bombs to help their teammates out. Condi core is in an odd spot, not exactly OP, but it does soft check pretty meta builds like Harb or one of the most popular, Defense Spellbreaker. It's fun timing your shroud right when they are doing their CC combo and then they realize their damage is halved as soon as they touched core necro shroud.

Truly wonderful lmao. A lot of the time Defense Spellbreakers have to whistle in a teammate to take down Condi Core since they legit cannot kill them unless they they go full unhinged Berserker amulet and even then they still have to deal with things like the weakness/poison constantly pumping on them.

spell breaker can destroy any necro, necro doesnt have the dmg to actually kill spell breaker and spell brekaers have the tools to CC lock necros. .  especially reapers .     condi necro is far from being meta like spell breaker and chrono it lack dmg and sustain but i will agree that condi necro is in 10 times better place than Reaper is. .   they have more condi clean / transfer that reaper doesnt have and they are tankier due to carrion Amu that reaper doesnt use..    as for harbringer..   its long while since harbringer isnt meta the reason there are still many harbringers is simply outdated guides in metabattle but harbringer been nerfed very hard with death magic grandmaster trait being cut in half..     all in all..  necros in general as a whole class is in very very bad place right now and the one suffering the most is Reaper. .  

[A message to cmc: Everthing wrong with Warrior in PvP]

and yet warrior especially spell breaker especially with hammer is by far the most braindead op bs in the game right now...  what warrior really need is a nerf a big fat nerf to defense traitline both to adrenal health and remove the disgusting hammer / mace trait that gives 20% more dmg which is more than grand master traits on offensive traitlines for other classes that gives on avrage 10% dmg ...  but this one not only give 20% but also fill your adrenaline every time you disable enemy (every hit)  on top of that perma CC and 13k crit hammer 2 with 4 seconds CD uncompare able defensive being heavy armor with highest HP having adrenal health sick utility skills passive condi cleaning 2 condi clean every burst with spell breaker perma weakness from burst reduce dmg and full counter on top of that perma CC enemy who dont attack dont do dmg. .   if thats not enough above decent mobility..   yes .. right  nerf this bs 

[Necro been over nerfed !]

5 hours ago, Dreams.3128 said:

Core Necro is still doing pretty well? I see that kitten all the way up until p1 to p2. All I've been playing is core necro and it seems decent. Not op, but definitely not bad either. I'd complain more about reaper because one look and you're melting to anything that has zerk attached to it.

i am Reaper main..  i never played condi Core.. because its not something i enjoy..  i did play power core but its a troll build..  but i main reaper. . and i do like harbringer aswell but both are pretty awful and unplayable

[Necro been over nerfed !]

2 hours ago, Sahne.6950 said:

its not rng.

The condition that was applied last will always be the one thats cleansed first.

You wait till you receive another burn stack and then instantly cleanse.

Conditionhandling 101.

still not good enough and still RNG because you do not clean condition when you active spectral walk..  you clean condition 2 seconds after you use spectral walk..    so you have 2 seconds that you need to hope no one will apply condition on you.. right. goodluck you are right its not rng its most likely not gonna help

[Necro been over nerfed !]

2 hours ago, Sahne.6950 said:

Friendly reminder that most of the Harbinger projectiles still cant be reflected after.... idk.. when did EoD launch? 5 months? 

idk its still bugged tho.

harbringer is trash as it is.. all necros are and cata is broken

 

[Necro been over nerfed !]

18 minutes ago, ZeftheWicked.3076 said:

Necro is very playable, but A-net's poor balancing strips more and more of his identity forcing him into glass cannon dps in pvp.
Deliberately or unwittingly they prevent existance of necro supports, sidenoders or just serious boon corrupters which is supposed to be our big advantage in competitive...

there simply better dps classes now who also have way more sustain blocks and mobility sure you can play necro in pvp but you can never be equal to the current meta .. 

[Necro been over nerfed !]

6 minutes ago, ZeftheWicked.3076 said:

While OP could do more homework ("unholy might" 😔), there are quite a few legit points being made.

1. Death Magic's grandmaster traits weren't nerfed, they were butchered. Both Unholy Sanctuary and Corrupter's fervor are dead in the water due to overnerfing. While Poison Nova is for minion masters only.

2. Calling current Signet of Vampirism's passive a brain fart is underserved flattery. From obvious issues with range (gotta hug the enemy to get any value, but if range gets any good it'll aggro enemies 24/7), to the plain fact it's just blood fiend passive only 10x worse.
Old signet passive was great. It had it's own identity, role and scenarios where it was good and when it was useless. But no, count on A-net to fix what wasn't broken..

3. Terrormancer is a fun build..and nothing more. The moment someone has enough IQ to bring party stab terrormancer is out of the game, because of how badly out boon corruption got nerfed in spvp. You know ..boon corruption? That thing that is core identity of our profession and we're supposed to excel at it above any and all other professions? .. yeah.

4. Didn't know about Unholy Martyr's nerf, but that's also another "genius" move. What was the demented logic behind this one I wonder? Attaching a serious danger to a side-effect of normal gameplay will simply make players avoid having that side-effect all together.
There is a balance to risk-reward scenarios. Reducing the reward by 33% while upping the risk by 50% is no small change. That's a make or break decision and here it's break.

5. And don't get me started on wells, which were great when they had their own grandmaster trait that let you share protection with allies and siphon health from enemies. Now if i want to give prot to allies i gotta pop a spectral ring (once every 40s) and hope they'll be good little circus animals and jump through the hoop...


And let's not forget this all sits on top of our shroud damage reduction being reduced across the board, not having access to defensive stat sets on profession that is most stat reliant of them all..

100% what i tried to say..   everything that people talk about why necro still great basically been nerfed to the ground. . BloodMagic now hurt you more than help you..  .. .  death magic basically offer nothing. ..   necro is unplayable right now simply because its too easy to kill... and have 0 way to protect its self or resustain..   Anet should fix necro but will they? i doubt

[Necro been over nerfed !]

28 minutes ago, Dr Meta.3158 said:

The best way to manage conditions is to cleanse only when absolutely necessary, otherwise pad the middling damage inbetween with shroud. 

I personally don't use consume conditions for the reasons of, yes its too slow and the life force from your soul is mine! Is crucial both for survivability and actually being able to counterpressure.

Hell, everything I run gives lifeforce because lifeforce is more important than anything else available on necromancer. 

Wells, nightshade, and cpc would be good if they stuck to you as a lingering aoe especially since you really need to be constantly moving at all times, especially on reaper. As you even said, you can't afford to stand still. The wells aren't anywhere good enough to warrant camping inside of them.

Realistically. Signets and spectral skills are the baseline of what necromancer utilities should follow. Skills with long durations that can linger into shroud.  Wells would fit this category too if they stuck to you. You'd lose the versatility of being able to cast them at range, but thats a more than worthwhile tradeoff.

And with that, that's one of the reasons why shouts suck. They don't fit well with shroud. The only one that does is rise! and I've mentioned elsewhere why rise! Is the Golden Child of minion design but still falls short because of how slow and fragile the minions are themselves. They don't need to do damage at all really they could hit for 1. As long as they can keep up with enemies and give the damage reduction effect, I don't care if they were functionally useless for damage. The rest of the shouts suck mainly because they don't fit well with the necromancer design since you fire them once and in a lot of cases they do nothing from missing through evade, aegis, block, and invulnerability, except nothing can save you avoids blocks. But who uses that terrible skill? 

But all in all, like I said before. Its main issue is that the overperforming classes completely ignores your class mechanics to defend yourself. Weakness, fear, chill? Through in resistance and pad it with 5 other random boons on continous cycle and you got yourself some easy prey.

 

shout are not good becuase they are actually bad..    for example clean 1 condition per enemy hit. .. but what if you 1v1 a condi guardian?  and you have 3 conditions on you among them 15 stacks of burn? how you clean that burn? you cant with skills that clean 1 condition its rng 1/3 

ofc condi isnt the only problem reaper have..  the class lack the tools to do anything in the current meta.. when everyone have mobility almost like a thief and lots of CC and resustain like spell breaker..   reaper is basically a free kill for every single 1 of the new meta classes 

[Necro been over nerfed !]

22 minutes ago, Khalisto.5780 said:

Lmao, i was trying some builds and end up in gold 1 where rifle monkeynist is king, so i used an aurashare catalyst build to give team nearly 100% reflect uptime lmao

its 1 of the reasons why harbringer is unplayable right now...  cata +tempest = whole team with 100% uptime on projectile reflect.. goodluck harbringer . 

[Necro been over nerfed !]

25 minutes ago, Dr Meta.3158 said:

What chill was removed? Chill just doesn't really work well because of the abundance of resistance and the classes that have all this resistance also have a lot of mobility skills and either outrange reapers or simply overpower them in melee, even in shroud.

Blood magic was never good sustain, it just provided more of a damage boost overall than spite did while providing easier rezzing ability. The main nerfs to blood magic was killing the damage output.

The only nerf to spectral walk since path of fire was its cooldown increase to 50 seconds. Its better to use conditions to help sustain shroud than as an actual condition cleanse since most condition builds aim at putting a lot of cover conditions with a burst of damaging conditions at once. This leaves the only suitable condition cleanses for condition builds being staff 4, dagger 4, suffer! and consume conditions. The former three having the chance to miss or not clear the damaging conditions if not enough targets are available.

My main problems on reaper isn't sustain or condition cleanse. Its that my main mechanics, fear and chill don't do anything anymore because the main threats I face now all spam resistance and either crowd control or ridiculous bursts of damage enough to eat through shroud even with protection active with the ability to do the burst again faster than I can rebuild lifeforce while maintaining constant pressure in the interim.

Harbinger is definitely not viable. Reaper and core can contribute to a team fight but are better if they were one of a catalyst, untamed, vindicator, willbender, spellbreaker, holosmith, or chronomancer instead since all of those classes can more reliably deal damage while not needing to be babysat by dedicated support to not be obliterated with all of, except chronomancer, being capable of maneuvering the map much, much faster.

again i agree with alot of what you say..  but i am struggling with condition on reaper..     to start consume condition is awful healing ability with 1.25 second cast which you will never be able to cast it if you have a spell breaker on your head .    or a chrono / Cata..  
but it is the ONLY  condition clean reaper has.         but the reaper healing is much better healing faster lower CD and good life force
dagger 4 isnt an option as reaper and you know that..  because as reaper we use axe+focus.     about staff..  yes staff 4 is condi clean but if you swap into staff you cant really put dmg and its not something you can do during fight ..   i feel like with losing blood magic and unholy might reaper really do need a dedicated condi clean utility.  

i agree with you that harbringer is unplayable and that reaper can be ok in good team fight if you have a tempest support that heal you and condi clean ...  but alone reaper can not do anything right now..  its unplayable alone..    

[Necro been over nerfed !]

1 hour ago, Dr Meta.3158 said:

Necromancer isn't really that bad, its just there's a recent problem.

Necromancer and Reaper are heavily dependent on fear, Reaper on chill, Harbinger on projectiles and Scourge is just simply bad.

There's a recent surplus of resistance spam among the top contending classes which counters Necromancer and Reaper heavily. The most problematic right now, catalyst specifically and elementalist in general, has so much projectile denial that any class, like Harbinger, that's reliant on it to do anything are completely shut out. Harbinger is really stuck here because it can't just swap out its main shroud skills for nonprojectile based attacks. Catalyst also has a lot of resistance and stability so essentially no necromancer can do anything about them especially since the 2020 corruption nerfs along with the ever increasing boon buffs since then.

Really the fix is adding a lot of corruptions back to necromancer's traits and weapons but that would make them overbearing against other non-meta classes. So its best to just bring the overperformers down.

while i do agree with alot of what you say its not the only reason.. reaper doesnt have as much chill anymore as youd think..  most of it been removed by Anet..   it is true reaper still have decent dmg and it doesnt need a dmg boost. . but its a fact that blood magic traitline been over nerfed all of the resustain from life siphon been halved and even more than halved while on shroud. .  on top of that all condition cleaning for reaper have been nerfed along with unholy might and spectral walk...  and the rest simply became outdated over time.. for example well of power ...  right now codnition builds doesnt take much time to stack conditions they build them fast and if you want to fight conditions you need a skill that you click and remove 5 conditions every class have it. .necro doesnt. .      so reaper have 0 sustain due to the nerf to blood magic and also close to 0 condi clean.. .    and this is the main issue with reaper..  no resustain and no condition clean on top of the normal drawbacks of having no blocks/resistance/invun/mobility

 

[Necro been over nerfed !]

2 hours ago, Sahne.6950 said:

i Like my necros how i like my mechanists.

Unviable.

 

I am still traumatized from all those 11k Lichautos.....

 

Jokes aside 😄 a few solid suggestions you have there.

I always thought its weird, that they nerf core traits for everyone, when they showed that they are very well capable of nerfing certain core traits only when equipping certain especs.

exactly they already have the burning on soul reaper nerfed specific for harbringer and for scourge .

also mechanic and necros (well not all necros) are not the same..  mechanic is dumb design by Anet a class that go full signet and press auto attack mindlessly..     ill argue and say reaper is a fairly hard to play class in PVP due to the limited mobility /stability/blocks/ivun make 1 mistake and you are dead  especially with the close range..   sore i do not miss core necro bunkering the points .. but none of my suggestion gonna bring bunker necro back..        and personally they should delete the minion traits from death magic and replace with something else.. im personally against any minion build in pvp if you want to play(if that even considered as play)  minion go pve .      but that being said necro right now doesnt even have 1 single build that is playable and its not good.. .    while i love mechanic out of the pvp for its dumb unfinished design infact i wish Anet never have released EoD..    with their unfinished classes. .     but engi still got core engi and still got scrapper and hero who are decent . and hero is even good..  
while i do agree that some toxic necro builds like the core condi bunker and minions should stay out..  i think Anet should bring reaper and core power back into the game so that necro have a playable build.. 

 

as for lich... ya lich was lame nob crushing skill its useless against good players but destroy noobs..  that being said i think lich is a bad design skill and i dont even use it on reaper i use chilled to the bone

[Necro been over nerfed !]

hello Anet i want to bring up to you again the sad situation for Necro in PvP due to you over nerfing the class and ask that you undo some of the nerfs and update some stuff to be more relevant 

here are some suggestions 

1:  undo some of the nerfs of EoD to blood magic life siphon traits. .  if harbringer is a a problem and benefit too much of these trait direct your nerfs to harbringer instead of the core traitline.
(in EoD all life siphon traits in blood magic been basically halved in both healing and dmg. . this is unreasonable nerf and not even needed.  again if harbringer benefit too much nerf harbringer not the core traitline)  this destroy and remove the only resustain necro have!!    this nerf +the 2nd one (unholy might)  result in 0 necros still using blood magic its not worth to use blood magic anymore and cause it offer 0 of anything. . we swap it for spite now..  and by doing so we now have 0 litgerally 0 resustain ! 

2: Unholy might have been over nerfed to only consume 2 conditions.. .  a trait now transfer 5 conditions from allies to you.. and only consume 2 conditions is bad and often  cause you to die due to necro having so limited options to clean conditions inthe current meta !    

3: rework death magic traitline !  after the nerf to the protection interval this traitline for most part doesnt offer us necros almost anything at all..   you halved literally halved the protection aplication on a traitline that already underperforming for most necro builds because how hard it is to keep up the stacks. . simply because harbringer benefit too much from it. .. once again like 1st..  if harbringer benefit too much from traits nerf harbringer directly and nott he core traitliness!!!!!!  the result of that is that now death magic is another dead traitline like blood magic the only sustain and defensive traitlines we necros have you basically deleted for the sake of harbringer..     we are now just easy target we 0 def and 0 resustain 0 mobility 0 stability 0 blocks and barely any CC compared to other classes.. . oh yes and also 0 condition clean becuase blood magic and death magic are traitline that offered us some condi clean..   its unacceptable. .   i curse the day you added harbringer to the game because the addition of harbringer to the game resulted in nerfs to necro traitlines that entirely remove and delete Reaper from pvp! 

4: remake some of the old utility and traits to fit better the meta and more modern design. .      here are examples and suggestions

1: wells  wells are unuseable in pvp now days for their 5-6 seconds duration its impossible to use them..   well of power is 1 of our only condition clean utility and its impossible to stand 5 seconds in the same place !! its unrealistic !  

2: Spectral walk..  while Specral walk is still good skill and infact crucial for any necro...  it been over nerfed.. . the CD is pretty long and the condition consuming have been over nerfed 
2 seconds interval for 1 condi clean is useless because if you have 4 conditions on you.. its big RNG with only 25% chance to remove the one that actually dmg you. .  lower the interval to 1 second or change it to remove up to 3-5 conditions at once when you first active the skill !  

3 Signet of Vampirism :   why on earth would you give this signet a limit of both 1 second CD interval aswell as 180 radius ?   necros dont even have a skill that is 180 radius ..  most necro skills both for power and for condi are 900 range..   axe/scepter/harbringer shroud. .  (core shroud is 1200)  staff is 1200.    even reaper who considered "melee"  uses axe and focus with 900 range for most part and staff with 1200 range..   and even reaper shroud have more than 180 range..      the 180 radius on this trait makes it 100% useless signet that will never ever give you any healing from its passive effect..  
so unfair and oudated when comparing to warrior signet that constantly give like  200-300 health per second. . without condition or elementalist signet who gives 180 whenever you cast spell even scepeter on ele is 900 range and cast time of 1/2 second that means 360 health per second from 900 range..    so why would you treat necro like bs and put 180 radius condition on a signet that only heal 195 with 1 second interval 195 per second..   on 180 range when our skills are 900 range?    change this pls.


... another thing that shows how outdated necros are is..  the trait Blood bond from blood magic traitline 
you set condition to apply bleeding on target with 3 stacks of bleeding to active it. .  on top of the CD.. .  but guess what?   theres literally only 1 weapon for necro that even apply bleeding and thats scepter .. . so this trait does Ummm.... nothing for the rest.. .  the whole class is now a pack of either outdated traits/utility or over nerfed ones..  honestly dont even know which one is worse or better..  but please Anet fix it. . because necro is unplayable in the current meta.. not a single playable necro..  
 

[Does PvP require awareness and prediction or reflexes?]

in today meta it require playing the right class more than anything