OrangeHedgehog.6310

Sorry, you've made the assumption that I know (and 100% of everyone else knows) what the abbreviations you've used mean. (I think the only one I'm guessing correctly on is, "OP" = overpowered) Please expand on "SA" and "D/P SA". Given I've gotten my Thief to level 80 in PvE, and have completed both Heart of Thornes and Path of Fire, albeit it with challenges. I contribute to a few group events, too. Granted, some of that time is using Shadow Refuge to give others stealth, whilst also actively healing them whilst we're both stealthed, but that's called teamwork. I rather enjoy the Hologram arena, and generally contribute, albeit likely not doing as much damage as the 'tanks'. But again, that's simply having variety. That someone actively decided to brake the ability for Thief to do what many players enjoyed about the Profession says more about their lack of care for such players, than it does about players who actually enjoy doing the material gathering. It's very disappointing.

The people who farm for materials care. Anyone who doesn't understand, or accept that that is part of the game is part of the problem. There's no farming in PvP, although some of the arenas do have the 'collect a resource' thing going on, but still, seriously, being able to collect the resource whilst being stealthed was such a game-breaker? That mechanic isn't even used in all the PvP arenas. WvW has nodes. If they didn't expect them to be farmed they wouldn't be there. If you want people to farm the nodes, don't break a mechanic which negatively impacts their ability to do so. So, really, this is about PvP alone, and even that argument is weak. There wasn't actually any issue at all: Thief is squishy. Most combat-heavy characters can either dispatch a Thief, or scare it off (same result, no Thief to worry about), very quickly. From what I can tell, the perceived issue was the ability for people with Thieves to use something they're referring to as permastealth. This isn't actually an issue, because in both PvP and WvW, a stealthed character doesn't contribute towards claiming an objective. and any attack removes the stealth, opening up said Thief to a world of hurt, very quickly. The argument the Anti-permastealth Brigade don't want to openly admit to, is that they disliked other people being stealthy because it hindered their ability to be aggressive, "Oh, the squishy Thief ran way and I couldn't hit it!". So, what the world has come to is a change which enables people who are innately aggressive to be aggressive more effectively. There is so much wrong with that concept it's unbelievable that someone in ArenaNet would actually sign-off on it. The underlying cause of the broken change is that someone in ArenaNet either failed to appreciate the impact on farming, or simply did not care. Again, if they didn't care, they're part of the problem. If they failed to notice, well, that's just incompetence; they're supposed to be experts in their game. If they didn't understand how the game is being played that's very disappointing.

They broke what I was using. No more evidence is needed. Fine, help yourself. As they say, there are certain constants: death, taxes and change. That this change has decreased the fun makes it dislikeable. Evidence confirms others find it to be less than positive, too, so at least I'm not alone in that. Since when was standing up for one's position toxic? What is toxic is the way ArenaNet have screwed over gamers in my position without any care for the knock-on effects. I farm the nodes in WvW, and that's wrong? If they weren't meant to be farmed they wouldn't be there. Oh, and the whole enforce the rules thing, they changed the rules to suit people who for some reason dislike not being able to attack a character. So, there's Anti-permastealth Brigade, who seem to dislike that a character can be stealthed, thus preventing the aggressor from, well, being able to be to be suitably (for the aggressor) aggressive? Said Brigade entirely ignoring the fact that for a character to use the permastealth tactic, they can't attack, nor can they count towards claiming an objective (so hardly helpful in PvP or WvW). Said stealthed character presents so little threat as to be nothing to worry about (those who enjoy ganging up on other players typically have hi DPS characters and can down a level 80 Thief (inc derivations) in about 2 seconds). Other than it apparently caused The Brigade to get it's underwear in a twist to the extent that some Id10T decided to seriously nerf the ability of the Thief character. What makes this worse is that instead of doing a per game-type time change, to apply to just PvP (not WvW), which where there is no farming, the Id10T who signed it off simply agreed to apply it to all three environments. That was entirely unnecessary, unwarranted, and demonstrates a lack of perception and or laziness on the part of ArenaNet for not considering how to minimise the negative impacts of the change (I will not call it an improvement, it is the polar opposite).

Indeed. And it is incredibly debilitating. I would much prefer to still gain the extra stealth duration than Superspeed, which is useless for farming.

Thank you, that's helpful and appreciated. What's troublesome is that it will mean needing to switch frequently between the Rifle and the Dagger+Pistol combination; to be able to access both the stealth from dodging and the stealth from the combo. That takes a finite amount of time, time which ArenaNet have made considerably more precious since they broke the build. Then there's the time which will be needed to perfect the skills. Perhaps I'll eventually be able to get used to using the combo, but it will take time learning how to. Time which I could have been spending doing something more productive. Do I resent the need to spend time learning a skill I didn't previously need? You betcha! Partly because it should have been unnecessary to do so, and partly because I doubt I'll get good enough to use it smoothly anyway. If I was any good at mastering those skills I would be in PvP regularly. Then, of course, because ArenaNet broke the build, the stealth duration is shorter than it previously was. So whilst knowing the technique might be helpful in a PvP/WvW environment, where the characters are highly mobile and actively engaging in combat, when you're farming (PvE and WvW) you're static, and have to remain so throughout the farming action. If you move/attack the farming action is interrupted and you have to start again. Sure, the tree/node will have been part-farmed and won't take as long the second time, but it will still take two attempts, which means more time repeating actions, dodging agro, &etc. Time which until ArenaNet broke the build, didn't need to be wasted. All because, if the rumours I'm hearing are true, someone wet their underwear over Thieves being too difficult to hit in PvP/WvW? Seriously? Thieves are the squishiest Profession and don't have a great deal of hitting power. Having been on the receiving end of more than one attack, I know how quickly players can take out a Thief, even when the Thief isn't being aggressive, and is obviously trying to get away. That said attacker, seeing that the Thief is retreating, presses the attack relentlessly until they finish the Thief off demonstrates a level of bullying which would not be tolerated in any decent society. Okay, so GW2 is a fantasy environment, and people can do things in it which don't have to comply with decency. That still does not make for a valid argument for breaking the build. ArenaNet make a big thing about GW2 being attractive all comers: those who want PvP; those who want to craft; those who want to do WvW; those who want to explore the PvE; those who want to farm. It's a huge ecosystem. The people who just want the best gear for PvP/WvW, but aren't interested in doing the crafting or farming rely on the crafters to build and sell the items. The crafters rely on the farmers to make the resources available. Cogs upon cogs. Yet it is apparently acceptable to degrade the fun for the farmers. Are people who do that considered to be lesser players? The broken design for the patch sure makes it feel that way.

Okay, thanks. The reason I haven't come across that is because when I'm in a city I'm typically moving between points or selling/buying stuff. I don't people watch, and even if I did there's no reason for me to understand what they're doing just by watching them. So many characters and combinations...

Sorry folks, not trolling, just massively 91553D-off at how ArenaNet could introduce a change with such negative impacts on the enjoyment of the game for people playing Thieves. I've been playing GW2 for around 18 or so months, possibly averaging about 3-4 hours a day. I am not, however, a power gamer, so yes, despite the negative connotations associated with the phrasing, I am likely ignorant of a few things power gamers know. I sometimes, but rarely get involved in PvP, just to get the participation reward towards the Daily 2 gold. I do WvW to harvest the nodes and, again, progress towards the Daily reward. Typcially that's spending and claiming Land/Monuments, but yes, that also sometimes means I take Camps, and I'd been able to do so solo, when not being interfered with by any PCs. Rarely do get involved on full battles. Sometimes taking advantage of an existing fight for a larger objective, and even more rarely actively getting involved in WvW, and then I switch to a support character. I'm simply not fast enough with my fingers (and I don't have a massively low latency/high speed Internet connection) for anything much more useful to the others. None of this should mean I (and others in my situation) should be treated like second class players. Whilst I don't know how Heartseeker in a combo will give my pacifistic character more stealth, my understanding of combo finishers is that they're combat effects. As my normal MO is to not get into combat in the first instance, I don't see how a combat effect is going to help the character. It's necessary point out, however, that despite not being a power gamer, until ArenaNet did what they did this week, I had a build I knew how to use, and was enjoying GW2. I previously could approach an ore node, dodge in to get stealth and complete the mining before the stealth runs out. That is no longer the case. If an enemy is close enough, they react and interfere with the action, making it take longer.

I've looked at the Wiki entry for Heartseeker, there's no mention of it either granting Stealth or boosting the duration of Stealth so I have no idea why is has been mentioned. [Edited to compact and emphasise.]

I agree, their reactions are clearly of them not giving one care at all. I spent the better part of an hour doing a screen video grab, then running it through an editor to get the file size down to something the bug report feature would accept (apparently it was taking too long; I can't change my Internet connection, so had to reduce the resolution to get the file size down). Their response after that, we're not going to watch (open) it, for 'security reasons'. Okay, you don't have malware scanners installed? What level of incompetence is that? As for using Skyrim, firstly, I do like doing the other stuff in GW2, and I've invested money real money and hundreds of hours playing to get to where I am. I'm not going to give that up and go to a rival to start all over again. Life is too short for that. What it will mean is I likely end up playing GW2 less, which will mean in the long run I'll give up on it entirely. Perhaps that is simply the better thing for life anyway? Afterall, if ArenaNet couldn't give a fig about the enjoyment all players get, then perhaps people shouldn't give a fig about using their products...?

Just an update, I've just tried using both Black Powder, and Cloak & Dagger, whilst the aggressive action was displayed in both cases, the character did not go into Stealth for either of them (by which I mean the character's image did not become translucent and the Stealth indicator did not display. Dodge roll (Silent Scope) did still work.

I don't know what ArenaNet did, but since an update released this week the stealth durations I've been getting have been drastically reduced from what they were. This has made what is a relatively weak profession even weaker. The changes have had no discernible benefit to my character's build. My enjoyment of the game (relatively safe farming, without getting into combat) has been negatively impacted. And all for what? To appease PvP or WvW players who thinks being able to squish the squishiest Profession is of the utmost importance? That doesn't paint either those players or ArenaNet in a good light. The strength of the Thief and its ability to stealth is to provide a Profession which is great at harvesting, whilst also being pacifistic (i.e. avoiding getting into combat). ArenaNet's deployment of this change screams that ArenaNet dislikes pacifists, loves bullies and is too arrogant to give players a choice over using a new style, instead forcing the changes on players. If the skills are really so great, give players the option to use them. If they really are great, some players will switch to using them, and promote their use, whilst those who aren't interested in the more aggressive model get to continue in relative peace.

I found the rest but what does Dagger/Pistol refer to, please? Did you mean Black Powder, the ability which goes in slot 5 when you have a dagger+pistol equipped, (or Cloak and Dagger, in the same slot when you have a pistol+dagger equipped)?

The character comes out of stealth considerably more quickly. That means enemies spot and attack the thief whilst I'm trying to farm/open chests, interrupting the action, and that means having to spend more time moving around and less time actually doing anything useful. It used to be the case that I could mine a rich ore node, and if placed correctly, dodge roll between the mining actions to extend the stealth duration, to be able to get safely to the next farming point or simply to just get away without being interfered with. What's the point of revealing yourself to gain 3 initiative? All that does is attract aggro, which interferes with the farming. I honestly don't understand what the WvW players objected to; a Stealthed character isn't in the act of attacking, and doesn't count towards claiming objectives. They're so useless everyone I've ever heard talk about doing PvP or WvW has said Thieves are the worst choice for those. It's not like Thieves have astonishingly huge damage capability, either. ArenaNet even got the process wrong for Death's Judgment; when you shoot the shot should go off, which then causes the character to become revealed - you don't reveal then fire, you fire and that act of firing causes the reveal. Thieves are, I think if I've understood all the observations from various sources, the weakest PvP profession, and now ArenaNet have made them even weaker.

At this point I see one person has reacted "Ha-Ha" and another "Confused." I don't know what's confusing; ArenaNet made changes which broke the Profession from doing the one thing it was actually really useful for. As for the "Ha-Ha", I presume the person who reacted that way was one of the WvW/PvP players who complained that they couldn't squish the poor little Thief/Deadeye (which is simply embarrassing, because Thief is about the squishiest of characters). @Styx.4857: I guess you missed the observation about giving players a choice of how they want to play their character, rather than forcing them onto a specific path. By forcibly breaking a Profession, instead of giving players the option to do different things, ArenaNet are being lazy and ignorant, and demonstrating that ultimately they will pander to a few loud complainers about a very specific scenario and take the easy way out. It's demonstrable wokeness/cancellation which is very saddening to see in a supposedly professional environment.

Very sorry to hear this. It just goes to show that either ArenaNet have no idea of how to fix the issue, or simply don't care. Given the amount of noise the issue has created, it would be strange if they said they have no knowledge of the issue, especially after I raised the ticket last year. Me? Well, I simply didn't bother doing any of the Stampede events this year.

Something happened this week (around 28/29 June 2022). My primary use of GW2 is solo roaming, harvesting to make gold. Yes, shock, I mostly play solo. But should that make me a lower class of player? ArenaNet seems to think so. I used to be able to reach nodes and harvest them, intermittently dodging (Rifle Proficiency\Silent Scope) to refresh the Stealth duration, enabling me to work my way through the (PvE) map without being overly hampered by enemies. Enemies which if they attack, slow my progress and make the game considerably less enjoyable. It means taking longer, and I can't afford to allocate more time to playing. What that means is I'm going to get less done, which ultimately means I will play GW2 less, not more! All because some {insert your own choice of adjective} at ArenaNet either failed to understand the impact their decision would have on players in my position or, worse, they simply do not care! Yes, get this, I would rather avoid combat all together, and just harvest things. Should that make me a player and similar players deserving of having their enjoyment degraded? So, ArenaNet, when will you restore my enjoyment of the game, please? (That's if you're even listening... or do you simply not care that your decision could see someone spending less time using your product?) Oh, and if you (ArenaNet) want players to have a different experience, give them the option of new build choices, rather than breaking what they're familiar with! Finally, don't make changes to PvE because you wanted to change something in PvP/WvW and were too lazy to keep those changes confined to the environment(s) where they're needed. There are plenty of circumstances where characters abilities vary depending on whether the player is in PvE, PvP or WvW; you've already set that precedent.

Just adding my voice to the cry. I've participated in many Holo Stampede events since the Dragon Bash festival started this year. None of them have been credited to my progression. With this error happening there is literally no point whatsoever in doing the Stampede events. It also constrains the ability to complete the daily Dragon Basher Achievement as well as removing the ability to earn the rewards associated with the Bronze, Silver and Gold Achievements. That leads to a further problem of getting Zhaitaffy harderm, which makes getting other things harder. I initially reported this directly to ArenaNet by raising a ticket. The response was quite disappointing. The response failed to acknowledge the issue, although it was enlightening; it suggested I post in the forum. Lo! I find dozens, if not hundreds, of people who have cited the same experience. That just makes the failure to acknowledge the problem even more disappointing.