Thevaultdwellinggamer.4267
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Posts posted by Thevaultdwellinggamer.4267
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On 3/22/2024 at 3:59 PM, XenesisII.1540 said:
But yes if you're balancing something it should eventually lead to a place where it's working fine and doesn't require much changes. Unfortunately anet is in this phase where they're breaking specs to make sure every class has a "support" spec of some type, to make everyone has access to alacrity and quickness spam. (Then not even a year later break those specs in wvw.)
These two boon is a tumor in this game that needs to be removed. They have caused this game problems ever since they were released into the game, and now we're cutting everything that made a class the way it is for the sake of granting them these boons.
Out of all the baffling changes Anet did, giving alacrity and quickness to all classes is the most idiotic change to date. Every balance decisions revolves around those two boons nowadays, both directly and indirectly.
Poor scourges lost good chunk of their utility to alacrity, and its absolutely sad that world vs world suffer more and more of this boon ball meta because of it.
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On 3/14/2024 at 1:36 PM, Fueki.4753 said:
Are you really coming with an argument that basically means "the vast majority of players are irrelevant"? Because they certainly aren't. If anything, they are far more important than the tiny top end majority.
But those same casual players you keep preaching about are not going to do strike. They're not going to do anything beyond open world content or do anything that is even slightly complex. It's irreverent in this conversation because it's irreverent to them.
On 3/14/2024 at 1:36 PM, Fueki.4753 said:They have mastered their class and have gotten intrinsic rewards enjoying their professions over these years.
What does it matter them, that other players find enjoyment in different way or pull similar numbers? Their "work" doesn't go away.
If anything, an "I played for longer, so I'm entitled to better numbers" attitude is more of an issue.
Because we are dumbing down the game to cater to a large group of players who is unwilling to understand the very basic of combat, at a detriment of the player who IS willing to work hard at it.
It's like Anet is making changes for Darksydephil because he's pissed he can't find a huge button in broad daylight. At that point, it isn't about this "Intrinsic reward" Crap you keep spewing, or is it an entitlement. You're just encouraging players to put in less effort for the same result. That's why people have issue in the homogenized vision Anet has in the first place.
On 3/14/2024 at 1:36 PM, Fueki.4753 said:And if a player insults another, that's not an issue of weapon tuning and thus should be reported to the appropriate
It's called a figure of speech for a reason. It's not hard to understand the concept.
On 3/15/2024 at 6:31 AM, draxynnic.3719 said:To give more than a pithy callout of a ridiculous overexaggeration:
I think there is an undercurrent of the "big APM deserves big damage" argument being made here. That is a dangerous argument to make. Taken far enough, that results in a situation where people feel like they have to achieve that level of APM in order to pull their weight as a DPS in groups, and that's not healthy for the game in the long term, especially since GW2 is supposed to be more oriented towards paying attention to the game world over paying attention to your skillbar.
On the other hand, there is a degree to which being overly focused on benchmark results is misguided at best. The top guilds and creators are pretty much always in agreement that builds that go through a complex rotation to get a high benchmark are generally overshadowed in practice by builds that are more practical, bring more utility, or both. There's a point of complexity where only the speedrunning guilds are actually going to be achieving those rotations (and the damage that comes with them), and most people are more concerned with getting smooth runs over shaving a few seconds off their kill times. There is room for more complex builds to do a little better against the golem to allow some wiggle room for their average performance in real situations to be about the same as the simpler builds. As long as it doesn't get to the point where people feel they have to play them. If the consensus remains "sure, it's got a high benchmark, but it's a PITA to do and in practice you're better off playing basically anything else", it probably doesn't need to be nerfed.
On the gripping hand, it's pretty tone-deaf for Arenanet to keep piling more complexity onto a profession that's already known for being awkward to run. Weaver probably should have been the peak, and at least weaver provides a payoff for the complexity through interesting mechanics and interactions. Catalyst... hammer came out demanding so much APM it needed to be reworked, and most augments and traits are really just extra triggers that need to be met to achieve the same performance everyone is expected to reach. And now we've got pistol adding four more things to track on an already complex profession. Elementalist is complex enough as it is, it doesn't need gimmicks on its weapons on top, just a fun and thematic set of weapon skills.
But it also unhealthy to make the game easier for the sake of those players want to spam their weapon skills to victory mindlessly without taking into consideration what those kits actually do, and how to use them efficiently. That's what my issues lies with the Ranger mace. It effectively encourage that kind of playstyle, which is problematic for a lot of reason. The game is dumbed down enough with how every class has access to alac and quickness, and general homogenized balance.
Benchmark wise, you want to give those complex class more value in a group? Give them back unique buffs. Unique buffs/debuff is what made classes like warrior stand out, because it gave them value for the group. Ever since Anet removed them, We have a massive oversaturation of Boons that are quickly losing value overtime. It should be a reward for players who are capable of of doing these "High Apm" playstyle and them alone. It would at the very it would help those class stay relevant.
As for gimmick weapons The issue, however, is that the gimmick weapon like Hammer and pistol are very one dimensional. It doesn't remotely interact with anything other than itself, which is why I see them as failures tbh. It isn't that they're overly complex, because they're not at the grand scheme of things. there are just absolutely no substance to those complexity that would otherwise made them feel good.-
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12 minutes ago, Leo G.4501 said:
So, what have you done to actually protest Anet's questionable design choices?
By telling it how it is. Hell, people had the same mindset when there were over 50 pages of complaints of a patch and Anet didn't listen.
The only thing that forced Anet to actually do anything to address their situation is an unhealthy combination of a controversy, and the death threat that were sent their way, and frankly, Death threats is going way too far, no matter the circumstance, so it's an outright tragedy that resorting to that, bore more fruit than just giving out feedback they're just throwing into the shredder.
So unless you want me to resort to being a degenerate, the next best thing is to vote with my wallet and go else where, but that doesn't mean I can't keep tabs on the game, too see where things are going.
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22 hours ago, RAZOR.7246 said:
If you're given the responsibility of balancing a class, you should know what is actually broken about it instead of just changing coefficients and numbers just because of benchmark videos. If you can't reach that level in the first place and then try to make adjustments that don't really address the main issue with the build while hitting the viability of the build at every skill level, then it's just incompetence.
Wasting your breath my guy. These guys are delusional at best, no matter how many times you hammer those facts into those skulls.
You can make all the class and their rotation can be as broken as can be, and people like mr leo G will go though mental gymnastic to tell you that you're in the wrong because the fact you complete a strike/raid all of the sudden invalid everything you said.
22 hours ago, RAZOR.7246 said:It's about adjusting the viability of a build to compete with other builds for the same content. In any case, if they want to get more casual players into harder content, which they do, this way of balancing isn't the way to go about it. They have to literally break classes in terms of golem damage just to garner some interest and then nerf it in the wrong way which puts it back into obscurity.
Anyway, I want to say my piece, because this is important. We will never get more viable build that isn't forced into some cookie cutter set up, because when anet balance around homogenization, Anet will do the exact opposite of what they intend to do.
This is because with homogenization, Anet have to put all the class to a certain standard to make it Easier to understand to the casual who won't even touch stuff like raids in the first place, and as a result, Anet have to completely strip away any uniqueness to the class and their elite spec that offer real tools, in favor of oversaturating boons to everyone, as well as a raising the damage floor so casuals don't feel left behind, and often, this will be a detriment to the vets who poured their heart and soul into their game.
If there to be a better balance, this homogenized path has to be abandoned, but it won't. Not when you have players who are spoonfed this crap, shaking their fist at you, and tell you that they're having fun Regardless of how many people a patch negatively effect. You can't take them seriously, because more often than not, they don't have balance and fairness in mind, only self interest.-
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4 hours ago, Fueki.4753 said:
Maybe you shouldn't restrict your interpretation of rewards to only extrinsic things like big numbers or boons.
Rewards can also be intrinsic, like simply having fun. Some people enjoy it to put more effort into their gameplay and are intrinsically reward by doing so. Other people enjoy other play styles and thus are intrinsically rewarded by playing in said different ways.
You're speaking in a casual perceptive, which is fine, but the casual players are irrelevant. They don't matter here because they sure as hell don't care about any of this. Let's not start using red herrings now.
At any case, this affects the players that are more competitive in nature. They had decades to master their class, master their skills only to be insulted by a player who can achieve the level of performance with far less effort compared to the long term players who had work hard to get to there.
And if that's not bad enough, their classes get more gutted by the second making it that much harder to perform well, not without dealing with unfun clunkiness.
That's why the more players with complicated classes are jaded nowadays. Either their kit is underwhelming, or they get overshadowed my someone else.
4 hours ago, Fueki.4753 said:I have more fun playing Warrior than the other professions, so Warrior already is the most rewarding profession for me.
But if Warrior got its mechanical issues addressed (which I doubt will be done anytime soon) and it'd be even more fun for me, I certainly would
And you can enjoy warrior, that's your prerogative, but even you admitted that you're not having much fun as you should.
And that's not mentioning the fact that the warrior forum is full of doom and gloom, more so than any others. There is a reason such doom exist.
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1 hour ago, Fueki.4753 said:
The players who want to put more effort can simply use weapons that require more effort then.
If they want a kitten reward, sure. But what reasonable player would want that when they can play something more simpler and get rewarded the same way, or better?
It's almost like you're ignoring that fact to maintain this weird idea that more complicated weapon should have the same reward than less complicated ones.
1 hour ago, Fueki.4753 said:What one considers fun usually is not related to wanting to feel pain. Warrior simply is more fun to me than the other professions.
So naturally you want warrior to be rewarding for the effort you put into, with how much your profession is struggling, right?
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33 minutes ago, Fueki.4753 said:
And why shouldn't they play that way?
Because dumbing down gameplay for those players is what lead to the awful balancing decisions in the first place, 1. 2, it alienate the players who put in more effort for the same rewards that other players can do for less effort.
33 minutes ago, Fueki.4753 said:If people enjoy playing the game that way, that's fine.
So you're a masochist then? Is that why you still play warrior despite being in utter despair about them?
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19 hours ago, Panda.1967 said:
It is impossible to please everyone in this community… hell people can’t even really agree on what is complex and what is simple… you call the Ranger’s Mace braindead simple because all you do is use the skills in order and repeat… well so what?
18 hours ago, draxynnic.3719 said:I think there is some validity in what @Thevaultdwellinggamer.4267 said. If you look at the skills individually, they do each have their own use case. But in practice, Nature's Strength means that the typical playstyle is to rapidfire your way through the cooldown skills, trigger Nature's Strength, and either repeat the process, or switch weapon to spike with that weapon instead. While other weapons might well have rotations, they're generally not "faceroll the keyboard because the cooldowns will reset when you get to the end anyway"
If this guy can understand this, there is no reason you can't. Ranger mace actively encourages you to spam skills without a thought. It teaches a very bad and dangerous habit that no new player should learn.
19 hours ago, Panda.1967 said:Elementalist’s Pistol that people call overly complicated is in actuality no more complicated to use than Ranger’s Mace. Use skill 2 or 3 stock bullet, use skill 2 or 3 again expend bullet… swap attunement and repeat… stock all bullets and use autoattack for weak elemental unload and regret not just repeating the simple uncomplicated rotation that actually does damage… it’s not actually complicated at all, its just stupid.
Your entire argument can be shot down by the fact that complexity should be rewarded when you master it. If a rotation is brain dead simple, It shouldn't let you have your cake and eat it too. It cause too much disparity to the class that does require more skill to master to get the most out of it. Ranger mace is unique in the fact that it doesn't need a rotation to do very well in both damage and support department.
Out of all the things ele complain about pistols, Pistol being overly complicated was not one of them. kittening hell, if anything, Elementalist itself is the most complicated class in the game. That's why people play elementalist in the first place, to master it's complex design. But if mastering that complex mechanic give you little reward for all that blood, sweat, and tears you pour into it, compared to something like mace, what's the point? This is not rocket science.-
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On 3/10/2024 at 5:20 PM, mirage.8046 said:
Ranger's maces and warrior's staff are the most well-rounded and thought-out weapons out of the bunch.
I hardly call ranger's mace well thought-out. Frankly, Mace is too brain-dead for what it can do, more so than mechanist during release of end of dragons.
It's entire gimmick want you to spam mace skills, so you can do it again with a 25% damage buff. Sure it's fun, But it's too "Unga Bunga" Even in a game like this, and somehow managed to have a place in every single competitive build I have seen, at least in pve.
I wouldn't even mind the mace being strong as it is, If the weapon set wasn't this extreme with it's simplicity.-
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20 minutes ago, arazoth.7290 said:
Since we're talking about all weapons, then it matters. For example revenant scepter, it gets used more in pve then WvW/pvp.
That's because scepter is one of the few limited support weapon rev has. It has no choice but to run these weapons in pve support wise. And even that wasn't the case, I promise you, if there are support weapons that are straight up better, people are going to use those anyway.
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On 2/27/2024 at 2:27 AM, ZephidelGRS.9520 said:
It’ll distract the playerbase’s attention span long enough for them to come up with which old content to re-package next and sell as 5th expansion
I can promise you that Elite utility are up for grabs in the new expansion. If you look back on their wording on how they're balancing In the future, and if you look at what they're doing now, anyone with a half a brain can put to and to together to see what they're doing.
Elite spec are slowly getting deconstructed and parts of it is being resold as features, to the detriment of the game because if weapon master has already screwed balancing in this game, can you imagine the damage Elite utility to core would bring?
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10 minutes ago, Gaiawolf.8261 said:
Sorry it doesn't work for you. I have a blast jumping into my different toons and their play styles based on my mood, and not having to switch out depending on who else shows up.
It's that kind of dismissive attitude I can't take seriously. I'm glad you're having fun, but this isn't about you or me. It's about how all these balancing decision make the game feel more bland and hollow as a result, and how it affect the players who want to play more than a casual level.
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22 minutes ago, Gaiawolf.8261 said:
You're in the wrong game if you think classes are primarily defined by how well they can fulfill particular roles
That how it was during the base days. Each class has something unique and interesting that made them stand out. Granted, The base balancing has it flaws, But it was FAR better then this shitshow.
22 minutes ago, Gaiawolf.8261 said:Thankfully, GW2 identifies classes more by concept, theme, aesthetics (and colors lol), and play styles. It leans into their longstanding motto, "bring the player not the class," which is a main reason many of us play it over its competitors.
Did you write this with Ai or something? If Concept, theme and aesthetics were the main reason people play gw2, no wonder the balancing have been garbage lately.
Gonna be frank with you, "Bring the player, Not the class" Is a very flawed logic, because the reality is, A player is going to be defined by the class they play. There is no if, or buts about it. The only way that logic applies, is when you're playing something skin to skyrim, and even in a game as big as skyrim, you're going to specialize in a area better than others, the most often one being the sneaky archer trap players keep falling into.22 minutes ago, Gaiawolf.8261 said:As for discrepancies in class complexity, this is largely done so players of different skill levels and interest You can find something they like. Some players prefer higher APM and interactions with skills, others prefer more paced, strategic use of skills.
But that doesn't explain why we have to resort to standardization to achieve that. Players are not going to go for the "High" APM playstyle because they want the same reward as mech engineer during it's busted hayday and could gives the same type of an reward for minimal effort. The ele community wouldn't be so jaded if that was the case.
22 minutes ago, Gaiawolf.8261 said:under this design, there's a reasonable chance that if your group needs something, you can find a class that can fill the need with your preferred playstyle and intensity.
By forcing these classes to accept those roles, because every option they had prior, was taken away for the sake of being alac/quickness bots. Awesome design.
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On 2/28/2024 at 1:27 AM, Gaiawolf.8261 said:
I know, right? My guardian moves in an out of stealth while building malice to burst people down with a rifle at 1500 range so well that sometimes I can tell it from my necromancer. And my thief is so slow and blocks attacks for the whole party with big bubbles while opening divine tomes of holy judgment and healing. Your thief gets tomes too, right? That's way too much like the warrior's clones and phantasms. They're exactly the same I can't even tell them apart sometimes. Oh wait.... sorry I messed up. It's the ranger that gets the tomes of animal, plant, and fungus lore. Thief just gets to attune to different elements to change up their whole skillset based on what weapon they equip. My bad. These mechanics and gameplays are just too similar, and they have no recognizable class concept or flavor to them, so I can't remember which goes with which class.🙄
Lmao, What a clownish response.
How a class plays mechanically was never the point. You're clueless if you think otherwise. It's the tools those classes provides that becoming more standardized, more boring.
Why should I go though so many hoops as a elemantalist, channeling the powers of the elements to give players Quickness or alac, When I can do the very same thing on a warrior by spamming dragon slash to provide alac? Or playing Necromancer, and providing quickness via harb, just by staying near a group, something you're going to naturally do anyway. At that point, I might as well play warrior or other similar classes that can do these things, but in an easier way.
That's what you don't get. When you create a homogenized setting like this, then harder playstyle become less worth it, over an easier playstyle. The Reward of committing to a hard playstyle feels less rewarding, less enjoyable, and this alone create a very toxic environment for everyone else involve. It's not that hard to understand if you actually think beyond guardian lmao.-
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9 minutes ago, Apolo.5942 said:
A class can not have 1 dodge in this game.
If there is an issue, removing a dodge is NOT an option.Are you comprehending what I'm saying, or are you a troll?
I can be a little slower if you want.
I'm not complaining about two dodges. I'm just telling you about Anet's incompetece. How you managed to come to that conclusion when I made it clear that I took issue with their incompetent I'll never know lol.
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3 hours ago, Apolo.5942 said:5 hours ago, Thevaultdwellinggamer.4267 said:
You can only look at the dodge changes they gave vindicator to tell you they lack foresight for these sort of things. I wouldn't have hope that this will be balanced. The rework will either suck balls, or brokenly op, and get gutted later. Pick your poison.
I make no claim about the state of Vindicator. Having said that, this entire game revolves around invulnerability windows (not what i would have chosen but this is a long ago settled matter), taking away a dodge is a non starter.
You asked if they thought their balance patch though. I answered, no they don't, and I used vindicator as an example.
A few years back, Anet gave vindicator another dodge, without addressing the synergy that made it absolutely broken. So broken that Anet had to do an emergency patch to tone down the near unlimited endurance that made thier op dodge possible.
So no, to answer your question for them, no they don't. They wouldn't have let those synergy slide otherwise.
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5 minutes ago, Apolo.5942 said:
Have you really thought this through?
You can only look at the dodge changes they gave vindicator to tell you they lack foresight for these sort of things. I wouldn't have hope that this will be balanced. The rework will either suck balls, or brokenly op, and get gutted later. Pick your poison.
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45 minutes ago, Buzzbugs.1236 said:2 hours ago, Burnfall.9573 said:
For 12 years, Anet continues to Betray and Annihilate The Community Trust by refusing to turn the game into a Healthy Competitive Gaming Experience for the players and allowing Toxic Professions to continue to create a Hostile Toxic Destructive Gaming Culture
The only toxic & hostile thing about this game is it's community. Just look at how you all behave each time a balance patch comes out and how you treat each other on these forums and in-game every day
Hate to break it to you, but every gaming community, Not just mmos, have their own flavor of toxicity. Gw2 isn't special.
2. The community wouldn't be so toxic if the devs stop being out of touch with majority of the changes. You can talk to a brick wall so much until you can't take it anymore.
Hell, the fact Anet doesn't have a pts (Public test servers.) In this day and age just shows how out of touch they really are, and even then I doubt Anet would do anything with the feedback outside of using a shredder.
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On 2/16/2024 at 3:32 PM, Rainiris.1975 said:
And you just offed the whole point of Plague Signet...
And would you believe there are still people who think homogenized balancing is a good idea?
Because this is what you get. Anything remotely unique being stripped away in favor of a generic buff that every class can gain access too. -
12 minutes ago, arazoth.7290 said:
Just add the slow back, let the torment stay
But how else would they justify perma slow on scepter? They got a Expansion to sell after all!/s
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8 minutes ago, thief.7429 said:
They acknowledged that its hard to lock down enemies as a deadeye. So they nerf it? What?
8 minutes ago, thief.7429 said:and we've seen that it can be a bit too difficult to lock down for the damage it's capable of dealing
It's hard to lock down a deadeye, Not a deadeye struggling to lock down players.
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41 minutes ago, Fueki.4753 said:
Have you even stopped to consider that top end cookie cutter "meta" builds aren't everything in the game?
Because they are not and it sucks that Arenanet is trying so hard to design the game around those.
The issue stem from the fact that Anet wants everything to be viable. Hense every class having access to quickness and alacrity, Weapon master training, ect ect. Because in their mind, they're creating more choices for the player to use.
The reality is that it does the complete opposite. It only force people to shoehorn cookie cutter build because off meta build absolutely pale in comparison. As a result, Anet has to work even harder to maintain the shambling balance they created, but now it's worse, because we're at a point where we are using a sledge hammer and nerfing and buffing stuff while blindfolded. They have absolute no idea how to fix the mess they created.
I mean why the hell is barrage is getting an Ammo count for wvw? Where does that add value? Who the hell said, "Boy, I really wish as could spam barrage over and over in wvw."
They don't know what to do anymore, and they're opting for a dart board for a random solution.
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3 minutes ago, Galisaa.8304 said:
I read patch notes. I get confused. Say you want X, nerf Y and Z. Or make ABC changes that don't influence X. Also, having low population builds under scrutiny.
Homogenization is one hell of a thing, ain't it?
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4 hours ago, Puck.3697 said:
But the class already had access to the weapon? Lol.
In a sense that they were locked behind the elite spec, for a good reason I should add, since those weapons restricted to these elite spec, because they were designed with that elite spec in mind.
Want to know why? Because elite spec were supposed to offer branching paths. To offer a diverse choice. Restricting those elite weapons gave extra incentive to try out those classes. It gave those elite spec a unique identity beyond just flavor. It gave that class a unique feel, and all Anet had to do was expand on the elite spec that already exist.
When you take away these restrictions, not only are you stripping those unique identity away, you're diluting option, You make elite spec lose their value in the most unhealthy way possible, and that make some classes that has those elite spec less appealing to play.
Now that I think about it, I think I'm wasting my breath tbh. When I see comments like this to tell me how I don't know how "homogenization works." It's hard to take something like seriously. It just deluded fanboy nonsense
6 hours ago, JusticeRetroHunter.7684 said:. It's utility comes from mathematics, biology and physics.
6 hours ago, JusticeRetroHunter.7684 said:But then you realize that white light, consists of all colors of the rainbow
Like, How Hell am I supposed to take what you guys seriously, when someone is explaining kitten like mathematics, Physic and the colors of the rainbow!? I'm not interested in hearing a lecture of some person trying to sound smarter than they are. Just a sign that this thread has outworn it's welcome.
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March 19 Balance Update Preview
in Professions
Posted · Edited by Thevaultdwellinggamer.4267
This fourm is full of people who are"Happy"with the current balance, knowing full well the entire game is being dumbed down for them. You can't take people like that seriously.
Boons aren't a detriment to the game. Just quickness and alac. The issue with Boons is the oversatuation of them, because they need to compensate for the fact that they stripped out all the unique buffs that made those classes stand out.
Even might and fury is an absolute joke to have 100% upkeep with how many of those boons is baked into skills or traits. Anet has even gutted boon rip, which hurts the wvw community in favor of the ball groups who wants an easier time upkeeping boons.
No it wasn't. Sure, you have same equipment, But Back then, when Balance was much more enjoyable? Each class has it's own niche, it's own identity that made them stand out. They could do things no other classes could. That what made the balance so good back then, because something like warrior isn't supposed to have every single tool to keep up with every other class. It's downright stupid to even try. It's just so much better to balance around the class's strength and weaknesses.
What you're describing now is homogenization. Making everything equal is what caused this game's balance to go the path it has. It's why things are becoming more braindead by the day, and why the powercreep has gotten so bad.
Homogenization Had not once made for a better experience. Maybe for the casual player who want to put in 0 effort into their game, or focus purely on open world content, but they don't give a kitten about balance anyway, not unless it inconvenience them.
The classes that do suffer the most from all these changes over the years, are looked at with dismissal by the idiots who can't comprehend how bad this is for the game. Because in their eyes "If I'm having fun with my class, what does it matter if the changes are unhealthy?" The amount of mental gymnastic I've seen in these forum by these people is embarrassing, and it's hard to talk with these people because they're so high on copium to look at it in a bigger picture.
All the other boons doesn't have dedicated builds to provide their respective buffs like these two boons does, nor do those other boons completely change the pace of the game.
The only thing furry, might, vigor, and even protection did was help you in the fight, that what Boon should do, it should help you. That's fine.
Quickness and alac completely changes how you play in such a drastic way, that playing without them is like fighting while on a wheel chair. When the game feels awful without these two boons, at that point it becomes a crutch, and you need to reevaluate how combat should work.