Why in the world would they take 50 toughness from strength in numbers

[RabbitUp.8294]

@starlinvf.1358 said:

@TotallyNotJazzie.1493 said:Strength in Numbers would be 1000x better if it stacked a ‘-1% damage + -1% Condition Duration’ buff on everyone depending on the amount of people, up to a max stack of 10.

Instead it’s raw toughness, that nobody in their right mind would choose.As previous posts have said, lost nothing from the reduction in potency bc it was never used to begin with.

But what would you do with the other passive buffs? Part of the reason all those skills got reigned in was of the easy damage bonus most of them offered. Would this end up being a unique change? Come to think of it.... would this be OP in WvW or PvP. 10% damage reduction in WvW is a big thing when you can stack them.

We already have a black sheep among auras with necro's Vampiric Presence. And humorously enough, Strength in Numbers is already weird in that it lasts for only 6s, when every single other aura, including Vampiric Presence lasts for 9s, but they couldn't be bothered to fix that when nerfing it.

And like said above, Strength in Numbers is the only defensive aura, and locked in the worse traitline for pve among all traitlines for all 9 professions. There really wasn't a good enough reason to nerf it. Assassin's Presence got a higher number than other traits to compete. In no way is 100 toughness equal in impact to the same amount of power, condi damage or precision.

If my calculations are correct, 100 toughness for a light armour zerker is ~5% damage reduction, while for a heavy armour one is ~4.3%. Ever for necro, who gets the most benefit (guardian gets the least benefit, btw), that barely translates to 900 extra health, and that's only for physical damage, since toughness does nothing against condi.

At least 100 vitality would be an actual bonus. Still not anything to write home about or seriously consider bringing guardian in a pve group for, but at least not a bad joke.

@Etterwyn.5263 said:

@InsaneQR.7412 said:

@Etterwyn.5263 said:

@InsaneQR.7412 said:Would be a better trait with vitality. It was not even worth picking before the nerf.

We already have a vitality trait though. The real issue is that all the other AOE passives are offensive traits so the nerf to them is more understandable. This was a "just because we nerfed the others" nerf to one of the most useless stats in the game. 50 toughness lost = 0 DPS lost. A total rework of the trait would have been the less lazy option.

Is there a aura trait that gives vitality?I havent found one on the wiki.Yeah it was nerfed for the sake of others but atleast with vitality it would give 1k health. Not dps dependend but would increase the health threshold for scholar bonusses and would just increase survivability in a better way than toughness.

Not an aura but there's a trait that increases vitality by 300. My point was that making Strength in Numbers a vitality trait would likely not happen due to that.

Strength in Numbers already competes with a +240 toughness trait in the same tier, I doubt Force of Will is the problem.

[TotallyNotJazzie.1493]

@InsaneQR.7412 said:

@TotallyNotJazzie.1493 said:Strength in Numbers would be 1000x better if it stacked a ‘-1% damage + -1% Condition Duration’ buff on everyone depending on the amount of people, up to a max stack of 10.

Instead it’s raw toughness, that nobody in their right mind would choose.As previous posts have said, lost nothing from the reduction in potency bc it was never used to begin with.

Actually it would make more sense if it would stack toughness depending on how many allies are affected, the more the stronger it gets.Maybe 100 per ally would be to strobg but for PvE it would be fine IMO. It would atleast ve worth to take even uf it isnt a dmg pick it would give some group support.

Yup I would prefer it like that too. Literally anything to make it worthwhile.It’s a dead trait and has been for years.

I hope they look at it in their next rework wave.

[Etheri.5406]

@Etterwyn.5263 said:

@InsaneQR.7412 said:

@Etterwyn.5263 said:

@InsaneQR.7412 said:Would be a better trait with vitality. It was not even worth picking before the nerf.

We already have a vitality trait though. The real issue is that all the other AOE passives are offensive traits so the nerf to them is more understandable. This was a "just because we nerfed the others" nerf to one of the most useless stats in the game. 50 toughness lost = 0 DPS lost. A total rework of the trait would have been the less lazy option.

Is there a aura trait that gives vitality?I havent found one on the wiki.Yeah it was nerfed for the sake of others but atleast with vitality it would give 1k health. Not dps dependend but would increase the health threshold for scholar bonusses and would just increase survivability in a better way than toughness.

Not an aura but there's a trait that increases vitality by 300. My point was that making Strength in Numbers a vitality trait would likely not happen due to that.

Strength in Numbers already competes with a +240 toughness trait in the same tier, I doubt Force of Will is the problem.

It's fairly balanced. The 240 toughness trait is very unreliable and mostly a noobtrap "looks good but works bad" kinda thing.

It only works when you have shield equipped. And as active weapon set. You lose the bonus when you go into any tomes on FB; or swap weapons to something else. 240 toughness sounds a lot better than 100 toughness; but 100 toughness on 5 allies which is up at all times is a lot more reliable than 240 toughness when you're ... not in a support tome or on another weapon set.

[Aigleborgne.2981]

@Etheri.5406 said:

@Etterwyn.5263 said:

@InsaneQR.7412 said:

@Etterwyn.5263 said:

@InsaneQR.7412 said:Would be a better trait with vitality. It was not even worth picking before the nerf.

We already have a vitality trait though. The real issue is that all the other AOE passives are offensive traits so the nerf to them is more understandable. This was a "just because we nerfed the others" nerf to one of the most useless stats in the game. 50 toughness lost = 0 DPS lost. A total rework of the trait would have been the less lazy option.

Is there a aura trait that gives vitality?I havent found one on the wiki.Yeah it was nerfed for the sake of others but atleast with vitality it would give 1k health. Not dps dependend but would increase the health threshold for scholar bonusses and would just increase survivability in a better way than toughness.

Not an aura but there's a trait that increases vitality by 300. My point was that making Strength in Numbers a vitality trait would likely not happen due to that.

Strength in Numbers already competes with a +240 toughness trait in the same tier, I doubt Force of Will is the problem.

It's fairly balanced. The 240 toughness trait is very unreliable and mostly a noobtrap "looks good but works bad" kinda thing.

It only works when you have shield equipped. And as active weapon set. You lose the bonus when you go into any tomes on FB; or swap weapons to something else. 240 toughness sounds a lot better than 100 toughness; but 100 toughness on 5 allies which is up at all times is a lot more reliable than 240 toughness when you're ... not in a support tome or on another weapon set.

Not every guardian play firebrand. For those, only issue is weapon swap. You also have to consider reduce recharge on shield skills as well.I'm not saying it's great but I wouldn't call it a noob trap.When I am solo with a shield, I would most likely take it.