condi mirage vs condi mirage?

necromaniac.7629 · August 7, 2018

@Daishi.6027 said:I will fight them as power mes.Even if it's a somewhat inferior spec since condi has more reliable output, all I need is a few good doges and reads to win.
I don't avoid anyone, I learn to fight them better even if it means I have to die a bunch of times to get there.

I guess you're right, maybe i should start learning howta fight them :#

Curunen.8729 · August 7, 2018

@necromaniac.7629 said:
@Curunen.8729 said:
@necromaniac.7629 said:
@Curunen.8729 said:It is a battle of evades/ports and cleanses, with plenty of juking and kiting, and it is also a very fun and exhilarating fight. I like fighting against mesmers in general because it's easier to understand exactly what is happening in a fight, and pure condi mesmer gives you more chance to counter than power.
Also the "Highlander" syndrome kicks in and you tend to play with more emotion! xD
Particularly if the builds aren't identical - ie using different weapons like sword/x. It's interesting to see who counters who and how.
Far more enjoyable to fight against condi mesmers than against bunker warriors/rangers/eles, anyone with a pet firebrand, condi thieves or even holo right now.
Edit - from seeing the other thread you should really think about a different build because double staff has no burst pressure, especially with trailblazer, assuming the opponent builds in some cleanse.

Well I guess you like fighting condi mesmers :)But to me when i'm fighting ,its like my condis just constantly burst just my auto attack inficts 12secs of bleed and torment and 4 sec burn, when I get mirage mirror all of that is doubled and that's coming from three clones! =) (cause I always got 3 clones up) when I see the, trying to cleanse or heal I just interrupt them with chaos vortex or domination signet to get a nice 4sec immobilize or jaunt on them to get a lil confusion. I think that the playstyle is definitely slow and seems to have no pressure but the condis definitely do

One trouble with double staff and IH (which I assume you're using) is if the opponent has both Evasive Mirror and enough cleanse (ie Elusive Mind, mantra, etc) it just completely shuts it down. The staff orbs will be constantly reflected, and any condis that stick will be cleansed.

It's a fun playstyle, sure, but traditionally both mesmers and thieves are best countered by burst (power or condi, and this means real burst like GS2+F1, or old style Scepter 2 into F2, etc), due to their evasiveness (ports, evades, anti-cc, stealth and now also target breaks). You kind of have to catch them by the scruff of the neck and hit hard, otherwise they just kite out of it. Mirage especially - chaos storm and signet of domination aren't going to hold someone in place even with Chaotic Interruption immobilise (granted CI is very cool, especially if you play full condirupt, although in the current state of the game there are too many ways to negate it) - at most they might give you a moment to unload (heavy) damage, but between blink, jaunt, illusionary ambush and potentially other ports like phase retreat, stealth and condi clear, nevermind just being able to dodge as a mirage, you've really got to capitalise on those windows of opportunity.

Not wanting to be a kitten, just trying to help so you might enjoy fighting mesmers in the future. :)

Edit - if you're really wanting to play with CI, I'd strongly recommend taking either Sword/Pistol or Axe/Pistol (together with staff) for magic bullet, and then also maybe mantra of distraction, as well as Ineptitude. The trouble here is then being countered by passive anti-cc from things like stability, so swings and roundabouts. It would work better against mesmers though as you could punish them hard with all the interrupts and condi.

what is HI and CI, but the thing is my friend, I use mirror too, I alternate it mirror and false oasis but when i'm using mirror I trait it so I can get a 4sec mirror plus I have a little mirror when I dodge too, you want me to link you the build and you tell me what you think?

When you said interrupt immobilise I assumed Chaotic Interruption, as that's the only way to get that effect (grandmaster trait in chaos).

Chaos Vortex (staff ambush) doesn't interrupt anything. Only sword and trident ambushes have daze and stun respectively.

We have to be clear on the use of the word "mirror":

Evasive Mirror is a trait in Duelling that gives reflect when you evade an attack (this is what I was talking about)
Mirror is a heal skill
Mirage Mirrors are the purple diamonds you walk through to get mirage cloak

I can see from what you say you must be talking about Mirror heal, and occasionally traiting it if not using False Oasis, as well as using Evasive Mirror. So I assume Duelling and Chaos.

IH is infinite horizon - all your illusions get mirage cloak when you do, so all your clones ambush when you dodge or run through a mirage mirror. I assume you use this trait running double staff as it would kind of be mandatory for any decent damage output. But then if using Duelling/Chaos that would leave you wide open to die to condi unless taking something like Mantra of Recovery. Though if you take Elusive Mind and only double staff you'd have no "teeth".

The point with Evasive Mirror is it doesn't matter if you're running it - because an opponent isn't restricting themselves to only staff projectile autos/ambush and shatters - they will have axe 3 burst, shatters, GS2/F1 burst, scepter 2/3, sword kiting and burst, or otherwise use some kind of attack that isn't negated by it, whereas with you only having staff autos/ambush it will have less effect on them than they will on you.

What's your reason for Signet of Domination by the way? Are you running Domination with traited signets? Otherwise Mantra of Distraction is superior in pvp context, because that extra condi damage on the signet is doing nothing when its on cooldown, and the cooldown is comparatively long compared with the more regular interrupts of the mantra.

Please do link the build. In any case as I said previously I'm only trying to offer suggestions that will make life easier for you when fighting opponent mesmers. It does seem to me that a lot of this will be easier simply by using a different weapon swap instead of two staffs. :)

necromaniac.7629 · August 7, 2018

@Curunen.8729 said:
@necromaniac.7629 said:
@Curunen.8729 said:
@necromaniac.7629 said:
@Curunen.8729 said:It is a battle of evades/ports and cleanses, with plenty of juking and kiting, and it is also a very fun and exhilarating fight. I like fighting against mesmers in general because it's easier to understand exactly what is happening in a fight, and pure condi mesmer gives you more chance to counter than power.
Also the "Highlander" syndrome kicks in and you tend to play with more emotion! xD
Particularly if the builds aren't identical - ie using different weapons like sword/x. It's interesting to see who counters who and how.
Far more enjoyable to fight against condi mesmers than against bunker warriors/rangers/eles, anyone with a pet firebrand, condi thieves or even holo right now.
Edit - from seeing the other thread you should really think about a different build because double staff has no burst pressure, especially with trailblazer, assuming the opponent builds in some cleanse.