Should the Minesweeper trait work during Elixir S invuln?

[Bullet.9271]

At the risk of causing a nerf, it feels kind of dirty when I pop Elixir S and then Dodgeroll into someone (or a group), while I am invuln. My experiences from Upper Gold/Plat matches have shown me that people do not expect the mines at all when I pop Elixir S. Most opponents in a 1v1 scenario will stand still waiting to nuke me when the invuln ends. This of course is a bad idea if I have the energy to dodge roll. Lesser armored classes take a significant amount of damage from the mines.This is may just be an case where opponents should learn to back up from an Elixir S'd engineer, but I feel like having a way to attack during invuln is kind of cheap. What do you guys think?

[Chaith.8256]

Mixed feelings. Evading during Invuln is not a good use of evade frames. In 1v1, Holosmith has gone from trash to balanced via Mine Trail's ability to do damage while evading.

Is it dirty that Engineer deal damage while avoiding - when thats Thief/Mesmer in a nutshell, I think not.

They'll learn to not camp your position in Elixir S or suffer the possible consequences

[Bullet.9271]

@Chaith.8256 said:Mixed feelings. Evading during Invuln is not a good use of evade frames. In 1v1, Holosmith has gone from trash to balanced via Mine Trail's ability to do damage while evading.

I agree it is typically a poor use if evade frames, but if they are one Mine Trail away from going down, I am going to dodge into them. Or if the damage from the Mine Trail would be enough to make them want to back off of me for a second so i can get my heal off after I pop out of Elixir S. but you are the Pro so I will default to your opinion lol.

Maybe it is just my personal view of not liking invuln skills in general, especially ones that auto proc. At least with our invuln there is a definitive visual cue that we have Elixir S'd vs a Ranger's Stone Sig that only shows up on thier bar.

(Edited for typos)

[Chaith.8256]

@Bullet.9271 said:

@Chaith.8256 said:Mixed feelings. Evading during Invuln is not a good use of evade frames. In 1v1, Holosmith has gone from trash to balanced via Mine Trail's ability to do damage while evading.

I agree it is typically a poor use if evade frames, but if they are one Mine Trail away from going down, I am going to dodge into them. Or if the damage from the Mine Trail would be enough to make them want to back off of me for a second so i can get my heal off after I pop out of Elixir S. but you are the Pro so I will default to your opinion lol.

Maybe it is just my personal view of not liking invuln skills in general, especially ones that auto proc. At least with our invuln there is a definitive visual cue that we have Elixir S'd vs a Ranger's Stone Sig that only shows up on thier bar.

(Edited for typos)

I evade during Elixir S, not saying it's bad, just saying it's not a good use of evade frames. You can sense people who REALLY aren't expecting you to introduce 3 mines and Vent Exhaust to their face while you're in Elixir S, that's a good time to do it. Same as when they're one hit from dying and you're in Elixir S.

[Lalainnia.3598]

I see nothing wrong with it will just take ppl time to adapt, hell how long has it been since ppl even took explosions as a traitline in general? Plus a decent amount of classes have varying levels of this same sort of interaction with invuls/semi invuls and dealing damage, mesmers being the worse offenders with sword 2 and distort.

[Chaith.8256]

@Lalainnia.3598 said:Plus a decent amount of classes have varying levels of this same sort of interaction with invuls/semi invuls and dealing damage, mesmers being the worse offenders with sword 2 and distort.

Yeah, big time. You can balance a profession around it. Look at the sheer amount of time that Mirage is evade/invuln while casting any attack it wants due to mirage cloak. Not saying it's 'fun' but S/D Thief and Mirage are not omnipotent.

[RedSPINE.7845]

Hahaha, so Engineers have to sacrifice energy to damage people while evading when other classes can evade while doing damage by skills instead of endurance loss. I don't think it's OP at all x)

[Bullet.9271]

@RedSPINE.7845 said:Hahaha, so Engineers have to sacrifice energy to damage people while evading when other classes can evade while doing damage by skills instead of endurance loss. I don't think it's OP at all x)

I did not say that I have an issue with Minesweeper or attacks on dodge. I also didnt say anything was OP. I was trying to illustrate that the ability to still attack in some way shape or form while under the effects of Elixir S feels dirty because you are completely invulnerable.

[Chaith.8256]

@Bullet.9271 said:

@RedSPINE.7845 said:Hahaha, so Engineers have to sacrifice energy to damage people while evading when other classes can evade while doing damage by skills instead of endurance loss. I don't think it's OP at all x)

I did not say that I have an issue with Minesweeper or attacks on dodge. I also didnt say anything was OP. I was trying to illustrate that the ability to still attack in some way shape or form while under the effects of Elixir S feels dirty because you are completely invulnerable.

His message was one telling you to not feel guilty as simultaneously attacking while avoiding is commonplace

[draxynnic.3719]

@Chaith.8256 said:

@Bullet.9271 said:

@RedSPINE.7845 said:Hahaha, so Engineers have to sacrifice energy to damage people while evading when other classes can evade while doing damage by skills instead of endurance loss. I don't think it's OP at all x)

I did not say that I have an issue with Minesweeper or attacks on dodge. I also didnt say anything was OP. I was trying to illustrate that the ability to still attack in some way shape or form while under the effects of Elixir S feels dirty because you are completely invulnerable.

His message was one telling you to not feel guilty as simultaneously attacking while avoiding is commonplace

Indeed. Elixir S has actually become something of a subrate skill in this respect, since normally all it allows you to do is move, res, and stomp. People have grown accustomed to shrunken engineers being toothless, and you're just exploiting that complacency. I'd say it's actually healthy for the game if people can't assume that a shrunken engineer can't hurt them at all... particularly since a) you're spending multiple traitlines to be able to do it at all, b) if they've been observant they likely could have recognised that you had those traitlines, and c) you're spending endurance to do so which isn't granting you the usual evade frames because you're already invulnerable.