Returning player tips for Tempest

[rwknoll.7824]

Hello fellow Elementalists!

I quit playing about 7-8 years ago and fell in love with this game again when I returned last month. I now have access to all of the expansions except SotO and am about to buy LWS 3-4 today.

I spent 99% of my time on this game playing a staff Ele, and as much as it has fallen out of the meta, it’s still one of my favorite weapons. I love large ranged AoE effects and I have been performing better so far on this weapon than more meta builds simply from the muscle memory practice on staff. 

I tried Weaver and as much as I liked the concept, I was struggling to master the rotations with the change in mechanics. I haven’t fully unlocked the Catalyst yet, but I am absolutely loving the Tempest. It feels powerful and with a celestial stat set in particular, I am particularly impressed at how well it can fluidly shift between damage and support focused rotations and its uptime for sustaining and sharing boons, especially Might and (if traited properly) Alacrity.

I am looking for help with the following to improve my mastery of the tempest:

(1) What are some of your favorite roles or builds that tempest can fill, and in which game modes? Where does the Tempest shine?

(2) What weapon sets do you like the most for Tempest and why?

(3) On paper, it looks like Diviner’s stats (++ Power and Concentration, + Precision and Ferocity) would work well for a power focused DPS build that can also provide consistent Might and/or Alacrity. Is there some potential there or is that a crappy build idea?

(4) Any other general tips or suggestions to get the most out of this elite specialization?

Thank you in advance for the help!

[zeyeti.8347]

Hello ,

Tempest will shine as a healer (i don't like it personnaly , it's far from other healers in term of efficiency , but it does the job on most encounters), especially in a few days where he will receive significant buffs (more boons , more damage for air overload and +300 vitality if you play water traitline).

Tempest is mostly played condi for damage and scepter/pistol with warhorn/focus is more suited for it because overloads who deals damage are short range (only air is mid range) so playing long range with a staff make it not usefull to play tempest e-spec (except maybe for the huge healing trough water overload).

warhorn is a freaking good weapon , either for damage , support or healing , it has big aoe boon trough heat sync. and earth skill 4 can extend boons for + 3 sec (thats' something really strong in group encounters as it expend boon not only you apply but all the boons your teamates have applyed when you use it), pistol is godamn complicated on the other hand (i personnaly hate this weapon), scepter is less performing as dmg dealer but is far more accessible than pistol , sword and dagger are on pair for me as mobility, healing and some damage, but sadly your weapon choice the staff is not a meta loved weapon , while some animations looks cool the staff is underperforming , it is a good healing weapon , but has no tools for boons application which tempest struggle with if no warhorn , another problem staff has is the real damage is too much spread between attunements , air is good for nothing (except mobility) very poor damage , earth is more condi focused , water is pure healing only skill 2 deals damage the rest is gimmick , and fire had his dmg gutted off from the nerf of meteor shower and lava font (some people call meteor shower the "sprinkle shower" "or "meatball fall" now)

The problem with diviner stat is precision , most power based builds play with 100% crit chance (trough stats , traits and the boon fury) , if you play diviner you will not reach an efficient crit. cap , this is why as booner alacrity dps the tempest play with ritualist stats (condi , vitality, concentration, expertise) as condi damage is mostly affected by experstise and condi dmg (precision and power help but is not as impactfull as crit cap for power).

I would say you can adapt at any situation trough a quick change of traits , tempest + arcane traitline has +360 concentration for free who can be huge for booning , but not enough if you want the 100% duration (and that's what you want when playing as alac in raids , strikes , fractals etc...) so investing in some ritualist stuff will help , but remind it is condition focused , not power and ritualist wrks pretty well in open world with his hige vitality bonus stats.

And for open world playing water and arcane even with little healing power can heal yourself pretty easily , or if you want the jack of all trades you can play celestial stats (+ to all stats) , it goes very good on ele who take advantage of every stats , but you need to accord yourself well with teamates for thougness tanking bosses or else you gonna be the tank without knowing it and in term of damage it's good enough (really poor to my own taste) but you not gonna skyrocket as others full zerks or viper players, but i've tryed playing celestial tempest tank and healing for some raids , it does the work pretty well , but you need teammates who know the fight , you not gonna carry newcomers in raids with a celestial healing tempest.

And if you want a no brainer build who is good and easy for damage just go fresh air ele and spam air overload infinitly , not hard to play , great cleave , not big hunga bunga damage but somewhat decent , the idea is to run fresh air from air tratline and proc the air attunement swap recharge at any crit dmg out of air , reattune to air and overlaod it , hince and repeat from another crit. from another attunement, i think from the years you did not play you had not the new trait from tempest who diminish overload cooldown : Transcendent Tempest ?

Feel free to ask any questions (even ingame , same account name as in forum), i am not a huge ele player (anymore) but i know pretty well how it works (in theory 😛 ).

Edited May 27 by zeyeti.8347

[Mevelios.4809]

1 hour ago, rwknoll.7824 said:

(1) What are some of your favorite roles or builds that tempest can fill, and in which game modes? Where does the Tempest shine?

Alac healer or condi boondps; both builds are available on many sites of performers. Basically I prefer by far the weaver (and making my game more complicated 😆) for pure dps purposes, but the Adps tempest does share a lot with condi weaver (the weapons, the use of their skills) while the Aheal tempest may not be performing as good as several competitors (it's no herald boonball) but it works in all CMs (-ToF & HT CMs, which I haven't cleared so far). It can tank any of them as well, and the range of utilities -while limited- does cover your needs even if it's no blind spammer of aegis/stab (but hey, not all healers already are capable of spamming those two like might stacks). As Zeyeti said though, the boons output apart from alacrity are heavily tied to your weapons; dagger+warhorn performs better than the staff in that regard, but the staff currently still is the only weapon with which you could pass all fights in my experience (I mean, dagger+warhorn cannot provide stab and has little condi cleanse, so unless somebody else covers those in your stead forget those weapons for something like Samarog CM, SH CM, Q1 CM or even Q2 CM, tanking or not).

2 hours ago, rwknoll.7824 said:

(2) What weapon sets do you like the most for Tempest and why?

Obviously from what I said above as healer, staff or dagger+warhorn because they're... pretty much all you can consider for such a role. The sword could be put to use in the less mobile & melee-packed fights (especially interacting with water's condi cleanse), but the few matching that description can already be handled by the ordinary weapon sets. Dagger offhand also provides massive condi cleanse yet comes at the cost of the powerful warhorn utilities, so... I revert again to staff when cleansing is required for a fight!

As Adps condi, I always run the pistol+warhorn; again the latter for its ability in providing/upkeeping boons (on top of how best performing it basically is, against other offhands for a condi build) whereas the former is shadowing the scepter nowadays. The scepter was a good condi weapon, however with the pistol now live it already is seeing a coming update next month to be turned into a power weapon (y'know, the kind of very reactive attention a main mesmer like me would have loved to see for the mesmer mainhand sword, heh).

For any power build though, as boondps or pure dps I simply don't consider tempest. The overloads are better tuned to condi damage or healing even if they're a bit impractical to use with their range, however the update preview will seemingly improve air overload damages so be patient for a month and maybe it'll prove worthwhile?

2 hours ago, rwknoll.7824 said:

(3) On paper, it looks like Diviner’s stats (++ Power and Concentration, + Precision and Ferocity) would work well for a power focused DPS build that can also provide consistent Might and/or Alacrity. Is there some potential there or is that a crappy build idea?

Without going as far as saying it's a crappy idea, it's in the best case too early since again, power tempest isn't really a thing right now (oh yes, in open world anything goes, but you won't feel good when the person next to you clears its targets twice or thrice faster than you do). The end-of-june update should improve its standing but today it's a poor choice; besides as already said above, power builds are tied to a high crit rate (100% always being the ideal) to make use of their ferocity. Alacrity in open world isn't really valuable with how weak the targets are, champions included; quickness helps a lot more in solo, alacrity is more of a thing in an organized group. On top of that (since you were only mentioning open world), taking alacrity would deny your main extra source of damages which also improve the frequency of use of your overloads, so it isn't what you really should be looking for!

2 hours ago, rwknoll.7824 said:

(4) Any other general tips or suggestions to get the most out of this elite specialization?

Remember that ironically, the fire/earth overloads are melee tools which do not match the long-ranged staff, and air is barely better with 360 range. I found more use for the staff with a weaver and its dual attacks which also help offsetting the lengthy cooldowns, however the damages aren't there regardless, so I stick with other weapons unless healing (sword/dagger if going power, pistol/warhorn if going condi).

Another paradox against the overloads' melee/close range effects is that an elementalist lacks pulling abilities. Whatever's gathered from the warhorn is ridiculous while the remaining skill comes from the Earth shield, which is... more of a condi (temporary) weapon on high CD with defensive abilities. Not much help; let your targets group up to make use of your AoEs before landing any immobilize!

All of your shouts have a 600 radius or range, which is very comfortable for whatever use you'll have of them; they have a wide range of effects both on offense and defense, you definitely should remember their effects for your fights in open world. In any other mode much less, only a healer would have use for Eye of the storm or Aftershock!

Finally, have fun before anything playing whatever you like! Organized content will not be tolerant towards anything & everything (as a CM strikes & raids player myself, if you end up barely pulling off 10K as pure dps I couldn't keep you since there are timers running) but anything goes in solo! Don't forget the other e-specs that are weaver & catalyst; weaver especially takes a while to learn to handle (and much more to master) but is very satisfying in its many playable options!

[rwknoll.7824]

Thank you both for the exceedingly helpful posts!
 

It sounds like I am thinking of power when I should instead be thinking of condition damage DPS builds. I probably did this because I was 3/4 of the way through crafting or collecting a berserker ascended armor set before I quit and I just continued doing what I was doing. I just crafted a celestial set because I felt it was a great fit for Ele overall, with the ability to really leverage all attributes at different times. What stat prefix type should I be looking at for condi focused DPS builds? Viper’s? And what traits should I pick to focus on that? A build example or link would be helpful. 
 

I have to finish unlocking Catalyst next before I try it, and I can’t get pistol or Weapon Specialization yet without SotO, but I’ll keep those tips in mind for the future. 

[Mevelios.4809]

23 minutes ago, rwknoll.7824 said:

It sounds like I am thinking of power when I should instead be thinking of condition damage DPS builds.

That's only for the tempest; weaver & catalyst can make use of a power build. Well, tempest too, but it definitely doesn't shine in comparison to the two other e-specs!

27 minutes ago, rwknoll.7824 said:

What stat prefix type should I be looking at for condi focused DPS builds? Viper’s? And what traits should I pick to focus on that? A build example or link would be helpful.

Viper is indeed your go-to option for maximizing damages; trailblazer does the job too through the toughness-to-condiD conversion of Strength of stone, while providing you a bunch of vitality & toughness to endure. Do be careful if you pick trailblazer gear in PvE; many encounters have their tank determined by toughness, so it can prove more trouble than it's worth and even ruin the organization of your group. The downside of trailblazer gear also lies in its complete lack of precision, hence very rare criticals that do not really help with triggering your condi sigils (if using them) and Burning precision.

Your go-to specs for a condi build are fire & earth, improving burn & bleed. Here's an example in which you should remove the signet of earth to take the Glyph of lesser elementals instead for an optimal setup, but I really dislike the visual clutter they contribute to.

A condi build isn't ideal for open world though, since targets are that fragile. It's "damage over time" after all: one or two power skills could be enough to get rid of a target in the second, where a condi build would have to build some conditions up then wait for all of their ticks to work their magic. In organized PvE however, conditions are ideal for most fights!

40 minutes ago, rwknoll.7824 said:

I have to finish unlocking Catalyst next before I try it, and I can’t get pistol or Weapon Specialization yet without SotO, but I’ll keep those tips in mind for the future. 

Scepter is still a viable option (which I included in the build above) for non-SotO owners especially since from what I read of the june update preview, only the power coefficients should see an improvement, conditions aren't touched unless I misread it (it is said that the intent is to turn it into a power weapon, but I'm not reading "this is reworked" or "removed X condi stacks", only "improved power coefficient"). No guarantee of that though, again maybe I'm just misreading!

[Jury Duty.3704]

Have you tried hammer tempest? The hammer 3 abilities provide really good buffs and the slower rotation of tempest matches well with the slower animations of hammer. 

I main catalyst so I'm biased towards hammer but it really seems to work well with tempest. Fire and air are mid ranged attacks while water and earth are melee making it quite unique. Self healing is not as good as it's harder to combo a water field than with catalyst.

I have no idea how capable hammer tempest is; I've only ever played it open world while completing the story.

[Chyro.1462]

14 hours ago, rwknoll.7824 said:

Thank you both for the exceedingly helpful posts!
 

It sounds like I am thinking of power when I should instead be thinking of condition damage DPS builds. I probably did this because I was 3/4 of the way through crafting or collecting a berserker ascended armor set before I quit and I just continued doing what I was doing. I just crafted a celestial set because I felt it was a great fit for Ele overall, with the ability to really leverage all attributes at different times. What stat prefix type should I be looking at for condi focused DPS builds? Viper’s? And what traits should I pick to focus on that? A build example or link would be helpful. 
 

I have to finish unlocking Catalyst next before I try it, and I can’t get pistol or Weapon Specialization yet without SotO, but I’ll keep those tips in mind for the future. 

It's quite likely that power dps Tempest will become more of an option after the balance patch in a month. They're buffing air overload damage and multiple power buffs to scepter, which may potentially bring fresh-air tempest back on the table. And the buffs in recent times to the Tempest dps traits affect power and condi builds equally, so a pure power dps tempest may become possible and maybe boon power dps too with the upcoming changes on top. I really like arcane traitline if I play any boon supplying tempest (alac-dps or alac-heal) due to the free concentration, boons on attunement swap and extra utility (revive power or arcane shielding on elite use - also triggers on greater elemental skills). I run Arcane + Water for heal, Arcane + Fire for condi alac dps, and Fire + Earth for pure condi dps. I imagine when power dps tempest becomes an option I'll likely run Air + Fire for pure power and Air + Arcane for boon power.

You can check some builds here: https://metabattle.com/wiki/Elementalist 

I'd recommend the ones in the Raid & Strike category if you're looking for instanced group content builds (they also work for fractals - though may want to bring extra stability trait there if you're boon dps or heal). The condi dps / alac condi dps builds recommend pistol cause its the highest dps condi weapon currently, but you can just use Scepter or Dagger instead. Both are decent condi weapons, even if a bit inferior to pistol (but easier to play + more accessible). For healer the main weapon sets are dagger + warhorn for higher boon uptimes, though staff is also very good (ranged healing + more revive power with water 3 if arcane revive trait is slotted) but you have a tighter boon rotation to keep your boons up compared to dagger/warhorn. Though the upcoming balance patch also has multiple buffs to boon output along with fury access that doesn't require air traitline, which may lessen the burden on boon uptime if you decide to heal with staff over dagger/warhorn. Personally I use both weapon sets and swap before encounters if I need one more than the other. in fractals often staff when more stability is needed or in raids with spread out mechanics where throwing heals out to a kiter is useful.

[zeyeti.8347]

4 hours ago, Jury Duty.3704 said:

Have you tried hammer tempest? The hammer 3 abilities provide really good buffs and the slower rotation of tempest matches well with the slower animations of hammer. 

I main catalyst so I'm biased towards hammer but it really seems to work well with tempest. Fire and air are mid ranged attacks while water and earth are melee making it quite unique. Self healing is not as good as it's harder to combo a water field than with catalyst.

I have no idea how capable hammer tempest is; I've only ever played it open world while completing the story.

Strong point of hammer is definitly his skills 3 in all attunements , with somewhat perfected rotation that resume in : +10% strike damage , +15% crit. chance , -15% damage taken as condi and strike damage , but again it's somewhat hard to upkeep all bonuses together , and hammer is a weird weapon were you can mid range/melee depending on your attunement , definitly not used in endgame , while i am pretty sure it doesn't make a very big difference in dps benchmarks

[Chyro.1462]

OP doesn't have SotO currently so recommending the weapons of other elite specs (Hammer & Sword) or new proficiency (Pistol) probably doesn't help much.

[Mevelios.4809]

2 hours ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

hammer is a weird weapon [...] definitly not used in endgame

It's largely dependant on player preference, I resort to hammer as Qdps cata in encounters that don't let you jump into melee that often or on targets that are somewhat a pain to follow (Mathias, Cairn for kiting the AoEs, Samarog if teammates rarely move the boss from its spears, Largos twins...). I'm getting used to condi Qdps pistol+warhorn, but in such encounters returning to the hammer makes me sure I can upkeep my boons!

[rwknoll.7824]

3 hours ago, Chyro.1462 said:

OP doesn't have SotO currently so recommending the weapons of other elite specs (Hammer & Sword) or new proficiency (Pistol) probably doesn't help much.

Yeah, beat me to the punch. I unfortunately don’t have access to this combo yet. 
 

I forgot to mention that one of my favorite endgame modes is WvW! Can’t believe I failed to highlight that in my posts. Part of the reason I like staff is because I am comfortable running up around melee in PvE and open world, but I can use the same or similar build in WvW and function as a Zerg backline team member, either support or DPS. I find that power based backline builds feel more effective in WvW but I admittedly haven’t tried conditional damage focused WvW builds yet. I have finished compiling my berserker and celestial ascended armor sets, so I’m working on vipers next and then later minstrel it sounds like. 
 

I also have never done a single raid. They all came out after I quit the game before. I have done dungeons so I’m familiar with the concept of speed clearing even if I’m not good at it. Right now I just want to discover some viable builds that I like that manage respectable DPS or healing so I can start learning raids. I have arcdps installed but need to test more builds out with it. 

Edited May 28 by rwknoll.7824
Accidentally posted before finishing post

[Atoclone.4810]

59 minutes ago, rwknoll.7824 said:

 

I forgot to mention that one of my favorite endgame modes is WvW! Can’t believe I failed to highlight that in my posts. Part of the reason I like staff is because I am comfortable running up around melee in PvE and open world, but I can use the same or similar build in WvW and function as a Zerg backline team member, either support or DPS. I find that power based backline builds feel more effective in WvW but I admittedly haven’t tried conditional damage focused WvW builds yet. I have finished compiling my berserker and celestial ascended armor sets, so I’m working on vipers next and then later minstrel it sounds like. 
 

I 

This is an incredibly fun build, not back line though, your going to want to be right on the tag 

https://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Tempest_-_D/D_Aurashare

[rwknoll.7824]

14 hours ago, Atoclone.4810 said:

This is an incredibly fun build, not back line though, your going to want to be right on the tag 

https://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Tempest_-_D/D_Aurashare

I'll check this one out! The build actually includes a variant with the staff, so I might explore that. Thanks.