60,000 damage from 1 ability, is that normal?

[Crystal Paladin.3871]

@Kageseigi.2150 said:

@ceces.9368 said:The 30,000 seems to be normal and fine according to most, so who knows.

Which is asinine. Anybody who defends that should NEVER complain about a Thief again.

The point is, if 30k is pulled off with real skill then acceptable... If anybody can pull it off by clicking(like myself for example :p ), then it should be nerfed...

[Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2]

@EnderzShadow.2506 said:

@"Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318" said:

@Madisonlee.9641 said:

@"Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318" said:

@Odik.4587 said:

@Madisonlee.9641 said:

@Odik.4587 said:Only I think regardless of being 60k or 30... Oneshotting ppl out of nowhere that have full hp on demo engi/protection up in 1 single hit coming from very long stealth shouldnt be a thing ,right ?Everyone who say its ez to outplay especially wnen u know that coming would be enough to look at phantaram stream , he knew its coming and did his best to avoid it, still rip xD

Uh, no, lol Phantaram thought the Soulbeast was chasing him in stealth so he random dodged around and popped CDs when the ranger was actually by the blue door stealthing up. Phanta headed back to the node with his dodges/cds gone and the ranger caught up easily and blammed him. That's not the ranger's fault, it's Phanta's for not noticing the ranger stealthing by the door lol.

What you even talking about? Phanta knew he would be about to get oneshot ,tried to avoid it and died ... wat... ?

Dont even bother. This always happen with people defending broken mechanics or builds. They say its a noob stomper. Then when an actual well known good player gets owned. Some random player on the internet treats phantaram like some noob.

The balance and powercreep is both an community and dev problem. Its all bigger part of things getting dumbed down. Not even dark souls was save from it. Cuz hosts got thier feelings hurt getting killed by invaders.

Um, at what point did I call Phantaram a noob? I said he didn't see where the ranger stealthed up by the blue door and so he wasted his CDs/dodges ...Did you even watch the vid posted of him on this thread? Even the best players are allowed to miss things like that..doesn't make him a noob. Had phanta noticed where the ranger had been stealthing up, I'm sure he would have easily avoided the WI (actually he was hit with maul-->smoke assault---> and dodge WI, maul is a bit easier to land than WI) as all you need to do is walk away from it for it to miss. If you are in combat and slower, and the ranger uses QZ on you, then you might need to use predictive CDs and dodging. But usually this wombo combo comes from out of combat; just be aware of the ranger's presence and you'll be fine.

People have been complaining about this since the beginning of the game when Mesmers and Thieves and do this from stealth. Good people learn quickly how easy it is to erase these meme builds. Bad players cry on the forums about dying to them lol.

Now if you want to have an intelligent conversation about whether or not the damage is too high, then that's fine. I usually hit 20k - 30k with a fully buffed WI, sometimes lower and sometimes a bit higher depending on buffs/class/ammy of enemy. I don't play the one shot counterpart builds of Mesmer or Thief, but I'd imagine that they get similar numbers. If I'm wrong, and worldly impact is doing much more than the norm of one shot burst builds, then we can start toning it down with a gut to sic'em. Then continue on if need be. But I have a feeling the ones crying are not crying about the numbers, they are crying because they got insta gibbed from stealth. Deal with it, period; it isn't going away and you need to get better at the game.

There is nothing intelligent about your jibber jabber. Nothing more but justification for thr obvious.

I am not here to have an intelligent discussion

just here to highlight those supposed intellectuals and thier justification for this nonsense. If we need to discuss then u already gone. Far gone. So do me a favour and

go kitten yourself with an worldy impact.

Honest and transparent. Bravo.

Thank you :)

[rigour.8749]

Then put reveal into your build or die. Think of PVP as a chess game. If your opponent brings 10 Queens to fight your Bishops, you're probably not going to have a very fun game; but nothing is stopping you from putting your own Queens on board, you just choose not to because "why should i have to".

You will die. That is why.

[Kageseigi.2150]

@Crystal Paladin.3871 said:The point is, if 30k is pulled off with real skill then acceptable... If anybody can pull it off by clicking(like myself for example :p ), then it should be nerfed...

Though I still don't see how anything should be able to hit for 30k+ with no tell when a Thief has to struggle to hit for 20k (even a Deadeye has to build up malice). The one thing the Thief was designed for was single-target damage. That's literally all it can do effectively. It is the assassin class, yet gets outperformed by many others in many ways including damage output.

[Crystal Paladin.3871]

@Kageseigi.2150 said:

@Crystal Paladin.3871 said:The point is, if 30k is pulled off with real skill then acceptable... If anybody can pull it off by clicking(like myself for example :p ), then it should be nerfed...

Though I still don't see how anything should be able to hit for 30k+ with no tell when a Thief has to struggle to hit for 20k (even a Deadeye has to build up malice). The one thing the Thief was designed for was single-target damage. That's literally all it can do effectively. It is the assassin class, yet gets outperformed by many others in many ways including damage output.

The cheesy build we were talking about has to stack up might slowly by making lame attacks on other targets and then gain Aoo with moc... Then stealth with warhorn or ally provided (all the while not making mistakes like hitting anyone else and endure any damage and maintain health 90% ) then attack a single target then repeat it... During this time, the player has to be super cautious and in control... One single taunt or mob attack or other control effect can make the preparations useless and frustrating

[Marxx.5021]

If this was an issue in PvE it would have been fixed already. For PvP noone cares. Eventually there will be a damage reduction. Meanwhile enjoy the new one shot meta - if you can ;) .

[DuckDuckBOOM.4097]

These are PvE tests will full zerker PvE armor but they shed light into mechanics with MoC and AoO. Since I'm by myself with this, I have to test vs PvE mobs to reduce randomness with interrupt procs. I have zero buffs and have stacked zero vuln on the target.https://imgur.com/a/6U7SWCr

1) My first world impact is 20.4k. A shark bit me for 2.5k right before. With my 17.4k health, that means I lost my double scholar bonus.2) The 39k and 40.9k you can see have interrupts proc right before I hit the sand shark and I had my full scholar bonus from not being hit. I also pre-cast Maul for the 25% AoO bonus.3) The 31.3k is also an interrupt but no maul precast.4) The 23.3k was a standard Sic'em F3 nothing else.

Situation 2 and 3 both have full scholar bonus and interrupt --> MoC procs. The difference between 3 and 2 is about 25% from the math which matches with pre-cassted Maul's AoO being 25%. The difference between 3 and 4 is an interrupt MoC AoO which is a 50%. Math adds up. I repeat, I had zero might/vuln being applied here but this is of course PvE gear. All of these were remorseless opening strikes which also adds 25% to a single hit. All of them of course also had Sic'em when I cast F3.

Here is the build:http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vNAQFAhGtCiVsgl/ALn47iMQA4JN8DGeA-jJBXABNUGAg9HW+CAc8DAAAThe gist of it is that SB F3 procs beastly warden but the taunt happens before the damage actually happens. This allows MoC and twice as vicious to both buff WI if the taunt interrupts someone. Since you take so much damage so fast, you don't even realize you are being taunted/interrupted if it 1 hit KOs you. So that is a 50% bonus AoO and a 5% twice as vicious proc. Precast Maul for a 25% AoO. Sic'em is 25%.

So how does this translate to PvP? I just precast maul then did a Sic'em F3 on a light golem. I crit for 25k with zero might/vuln. I can't interrupt a golem but if I could that would have been a 38k crit with zero might/vuln. I believe a 60k in PvP is possible if someone is willing to test things with me. I need a victim to channel a skill that I can easily interrupt. Maybe a 3rd person to vuln to the enemy. It is very specific in how it needs to be executed though.

I'm going to try and be as fair as possible with the nerfs to this super niche scenario.1) AoO from Maul and MoC should not stack. I vaguely recall it working this way in the past but they now stack and shouldn't.2) Beastly warden needs to proc after the damage on WI to prevent an interrupt out of stealth proc that self buffs WI.These two changes would result in very few ranger/SB players ever noticing a difference in their game play in PvE or PvP. It only prevents these super niche stars align scenarios of rediculous damage.

In the mean time, if you run into this build, stab is your friend. It negates 50% of the damage by preventing interrupts/MoC. Any aoe cleave is your friend. It negates 32% of the damage from the triple scholar bonus. Just swing randomly at the air in melee and you will likely hit the SB and reduce the damage it does.

Edit: 1 more suggestion. Maul should only apply the AoO bonus if it hits.