Mesmer PvP questions

[Animosity.5968]

I'm a long time gw2 vet but I have never once stepped into the mists for PvP. Lately I've been big on Mesmer (Mirage atm) and I've got a few questions that hopefully someone more seasoned than I in PvP mechanics/builds could shed some light on for me. Little bit of extra info, I seem to be gravitating towards power Mirage.

1) I don't often see off-hand sword taken, why is this?-It has a block, a daze (stun if traiting into dazes stun) and a phantasm that gives might. Torch is almost always taken but i find its cd's long and the invis gets AoE'ed hard by scourges.

2) Is portal and blink a requirement in PvP?

• I see it in every build and I understand their mobility/escape potential, portals safe stomp mechanic but it limits alot of build theory by taking 2 slots up . Mostly Asking about Portal here i guess because blink saves me so much I think its definitely worth it.

3) How does one successfully use portal?

• Outside of safe stomping I have been capping say "far" point and roaming mid/close to help a fight then when I see far being recapped I portal back for a fight to contest.

4) As a mesmer (mirage) what exactly is my "role"?

• I believe i'm more a duelist that is meant to back cap points and +1 myself into a even fight where possible to secure quick kills/caps

5) How are other mesmer's dealing with Scourge and SB?

• for Scourge i've been kiting their shades and if I have greatsword just poking them until burst is viable but when I don't have greatsword I basically can't beat them. I need to get too close and even in a stun they manage to eat me alive and I have to retreat.

• SB I just annoy and run when I have their attention. I honestly can't beat a good SB. They roll over me.

I'll attach the build I'm currently trying which is without greatsword but i'm thinking of changing back to it for the ranged safety.http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQRAna8cnELDlph1oB2qBMMjlTDzfBWBzgljgVQCgMAsACKA-jpxHQBXrMg/eAAK7gAQwjAQ/2fAAnAAAWould also love some insight into a build. I'm not even in ranked yet, still doing my unranked games to get me to pvp rank 20.

[Bod.8261]

@Animosity.5968 said:1) I don't often see off-hand sword taken, why is this?-It has a block, a daze (stun if traiting into dazes stun) and a phantasm that gives might. Torch is almost always taken but i find its cd's long and the invis gets AoE'ed hard by scourges.Torch can be used as an escape tool but is mostly valued for its offensive burst.

2) Is portal and blink a requirement in PvP?

• I see it in every build and I understand their mobility/escape potential, portals safe stomp mechanic but it limits alot of build theory by taking 2 slots up . Mostly Asking about Portal here i guess because blink saves me so much I think its definitely worth it.Portal is far more useful in coordinated groups. When you solo-queue the use is limited and I wouldn't call it must have.Outside of the typical "leave it on captured point then move on" portals can be useful for a lord rush (Foefire) or to quickly get people to other important map mechanics (bell or tranq).

Blink: Yes, there is no contest to this skill. Can be used for so many things.

4) As a mesmer (mirage) what exactly is my "role"?

• I believe i'm more a duelist that is meant to back cap points and +1 myself into a even fight where possible to secure quick kills/capsCorrect. You are what is typically referred to as a "roamer", decapping points and forcing 2vs1 situations that you can quickly resolve due to high burst.

5) How are other mesmer's dealing with Scourge and SB?Just run. As a roamer your job is not to fight 1v1 or be in a big teamfight. You have far better mobility. A 2vs1 should be doable.

I'll attach the build I'm currently trying which is without greatsword but i'm thinking of changing back to it for the ranged safety.http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQRAna8cnELDlph1oB2qBMMjlTDzfBWBzgljgVQCgMAsACKA-jpxHQBXrMg/eAAK7gAQwjAQ/2fAAnAAA

This is a power build. I hope you're switching out the axe for gs. Axe is not only a condi weapon, it's also riddled with bugs and clunkyness atm.If you go full shatter, you can deal a lot more burst damage.See this thread.Be aware that with berserker runes you will be a lot more vulnerable.

[K THEN.5162]

If you're liking power mirage then I'm sure you are aware of the gs burst rotation. Since this is one of the strongest power damage openers in the game, I highly recommend you use torch offhand to maximize it's ganking and 100-0 potential.

That being said, there is a very nifty daze interrupt build going around that uses sword/sword X/Pistol and daze mantra with the Paladin's amulet.

[Animosity.5968]

@K THEN.5162 said:If you're liking power mirage then I'm sure you are aware of the gs burst rotation. Since this is one of the strongest power damage openers in the game, I highly recommend you use torch offhand to maximize it's ganking and 100-0 potential.

That being said, there is a very nifty daze interrupt build going around that uses sword/sword X/Pistol and daze mantra with the Paladin's amulet.

I'd be interested in trying the daze build you mentioned if you have a build link. I find it much easier to kill people while I interrupt them. I mean the GS burst is amazing when executed properly but I find atm with Scourge particularly its hard to bait out their defenses to 100-0 them. This is probably all a l2P problem for me but I wouldn't mind comparing my mileage with both builds to make a decision.

[Animosity.5968]

@Bod.8261 said:

Thanks for the info, I'm probably going to try that build thats in the thread you linked.

[K THEN.5162]

@"Animosity.5968": I'd be interested in trying the daze build you mentioned if you have a build link. I find it much easier to kill people while I interrupt them. I mean the GS burst is amazing when executed properly but I find atm with Scourge particularly its hard to bait out their defenses to 100-0 them. This is probably all a l2P problem for me but I wouldn't mind comparing my mileage with both builds to make a decision.

This is my guild buddy's interrupt build: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQRAsc7anknBVLj1oBmpBMMjlTDzcHsNuBkBgNQQxvBOBzgA-jpxHQB0rMwM2fAAnAgBcQAQ4DA4dHBAAIt basically relies on abusing chaotic interruption for immob when interrupting, power block for sustained damage, and scepter/pistol for ranged harassment.

[SlimChance.6593]

Sword OH is good. I use it on a core lockdown build. With chrono, shield is just so much better than any other OH we have.

Torch is more for Condi builds but as others have mentioned the stealth can be used as an escape in a power build.

I'll use pistol in occasion, but usually prefer the added block on sword because of Evasive Mirror. But if your not taking that then its personal choice.

SPvP is pretty much all I ever do. But with the current PoF balance, I'm just working the story and taking my time figuring out mirage and not getting stressed about pvp. I'll wait until there's an actual attempt at balance.

[Animosity.5968]

@SlimChance.6593 said:Sword OH is good. I use it on a core lockdown build. With chrono, shield is just so much better than any other OH we have.

Torch is more for Condi builds but as others have mentioned the stealth can be used as an escape in a power build.

I'll use pistol in occasion, but usually prefer the added block on sword because of Evasive Mirror. But if your not taking that then its personal choice.

SPvP is pretty much all I ever do. But with the current PoF balance, I'm just working the story and taking my time figuring out mirage and not getting stressed about pvp. I'll wait until there's an actual attempt at balance.

Solid advice. I honestly dont like torch too much. I see its value in allowing unpredictable burst from stealth with a small condi clear on top + some fury on a phantasm but I find myself being AoE'ed to death when i want to stealth or just not having a good opportunity to use the skills and they don't even see play. I also didn't think about evasive mirrors with sword OH, Thanks for the info.

[Kondor.2904]

Ok. Let’s put it like this. We are talking about more or less about competitive pvp and power mesmer. I would like to mention from the start that power mesmer is not a really good option, speaking competitive wise, as it attempts to fulfill a +1 role in which daredevil thief dominates at the moment (+1 and nothing more, power mesmer cannot pretend to fulfill any other role in a competitive 5v5 environment, do not listen to anyone who says opposite things, any competent player will make power mesmer beyond useless with ease).

Shall we proceed to the actual questions now ?

1. OH Sword is bad. Just bad. It offers nothing aside from a pathetic 1 attack block which can be triggered by any aa from a ai, aoe and just simply avoided due to miserable duration and obvious animation. Torch, in its turn, is taken not because of it’s burst dmg input (c’mon, it’s ridiculous to think otherwise) but cuz of invis and blind. +1 role is all about momentum. You roam around and engage the fights that you can win with a single burst. And it is very important that enemies do not see you coming or roaming so they don’t go to a non steal spot or start playing overdefensively. It’s all about momentum bois. If you want sustain and joking around beatin ppl in 1v1s, go take chrono shield and chillax.

2. Blink is a must. Save button + controlled mobility (alike new deception skills which will kill you before you manage to make any contribution to the game). Portal is must. Mesmer w/o portal is like a 0.5 of a player, portal is the only thing why power mesmer (and mesmer in general) is viable and able to somehow compete with other +1 classes aka teef. Even in pugs, its rotational contribution is HUGE. If you can't make it work, it’s purely a l2p issue. Period (the only exception is a bunker mes which we are not going to discuss due to … reasons).

3. Safe stomping via portal is like a swag stomp when you are playing the game with the score of 500-0, wasting such an important cooldown for that is … bad (there are few exceptions concerning the momentum issue tho). Portal is used to outrotate your opponents, to gain momentum, to juke, to get those necessary seconds to win, to rush lord, to contest, to defend, to snowball. Portal use is a whole science. Do not underestimate it, please.

4. As a power mirage, power chrono, power core mes your role is pure +1, you are a thief with pink flies around ya and portal. Run around making dirty plays, outnumbers and ganks from stealth.

5. Power mesmers do not deal with scourges and spellbreakers. They either do +1 on them when they are pressured or go somewhere else. You do not have the abilities to fight them in a teamfight or 1v1s. Deal with it.

YOU are a thief with pink flies around you and portal. You have to understand it and use it in your advantage. Be smart as the enemies are stronger, thieves are stronger. Once again i am not talking about some casual plays where power mesmer is able to do 2v1s and 3v1s, where it can win 4v1s in wvw with some casuals who click their skills while watching breaking bad and eating popcorn. I am talking about being useful when playing with competent players, well, at least trying to be useful. I also do not mention a bunker power mesmer, as i believe it is not a topic here. I do not want to go into much details, cuz it will make this post even longer (ridiculous, isn’t it ?). Moreover, i didn’t say anything about the build, rune and weapon choices in general which, in my opinion, are not optimal either. ( praise gs + sw/t ) I just wanted to focus on basic understanding of power mesmer as a role in a 5v5 environment. As to the strats on how to beat the sb and scourges, there are plenty forum threads on this, the best way is to go and 1v1 them on the hotjoin servers so you understand what they can do, what you have and what you can do with what they have.

+1. Burst. Run. Don’t die.

[Animosity.5968]

@Kondor.2904 said:Ok. Let’s put it like this. We are talking about more or less about competitive pvp and power mesmer. I would like to mention from the start that power mesmer is not a really good option, speaking competitive wise, as it attempts to fulfill a +1 role in which daredevil thief dominates at the moment (+1 and nothing more, power mesmer cannot pretend to fulfill any other role in a competitive 5v5 environment, do not listen to anyone who says opposite things, any competent player will make power mesmer beyond useless with ease).

Shall we proceed to the actual questions now ?

1. OH Sword is bad. Just bad. It offers nothing aside from a pathetic 1 attack block which can be triggered by any aa from a ai, aoe and just simply avoided due to miserable duration and obvious animation. Torch, in its turn, is taken not because of it’s burst dmg input (c’mon, it’s ridiculous to think otherwise) but cuz of invis and blind. +1 role is all about momentum. You roam around and engage the fights that you can win with a single burst. And it is very important that enemies do not see you coming or roaming so they don’t go to a non steal spot or start playing overdefensively. It’s all about momentum bois. If you want sustain and joking around beatin ppl in 1v1s, go take chrono shield and chillax.

2. Blink is a must. Save button + controlled mobility (alike new deception skills which will kill you before you manage to make any contribution to the game). Portal is must. Mesmer w/o portal is like a 0.5 of a player, portal is the only thing why power mesmer (and mesmer in general) is viable and able to somehow compete with other +1 classes aka teef. Even in pugs, its rotational contribution is HUGE. If you can't make it work, it’s purely a l2p issue. Period (the only exception is a bunker mes which we are not going to discuss due to … reasons).

3. Safe stomping via portal is like a swag stomp when you are playing the game with the score of 500-0, wasting such an important cooldown for that is … bad (there are few exceptions concerning the momentum issue tho). Portal is used to outrotate your opponents, to gain momentum, to juke, to get those necessary seconds to win, to rush lord, to contest, to defend, to snowball. Portal use is a whole science. Do not underestimate it, please.

4. As a power mirage, power chrono, power core mes your role is pure +1, you are a thief with pink flies around ya and portal. Run around making dirty plays, outnumbers and ganks from stealth.

5. Power mesmers do not deal with scourges and spellbreakers. They either do +1 on them when they are pressured or go somewhere else. You do not have the abilities to fight them in a teamfight or 1v1s. Deal with it.

YOU are a thief with pink flies around you and portal. You have to understand it and use it in your advantage. Be smart as the enemies are stronger, thieves are stronger. Once again i am not talking about some casual plays where power mesmer is able to do 2v1s and 3v1s, where it can win 4v1s in wvw with some casuals who click their skills while watching breaking bad and eating popcorn. I am talking about being useful when playing with competent players, well, at least trying to be useful. I also do not mention a bunker power mesmer, as i believe it is not a topic here. I do not want to go into much details, cuz it will make this post even longer (ridiculous, isn’t it ?). Moreover, i didn’t say anything about the build, rune and weapon choices in general which, in my opinion, are not optimal either. ( praise gs + sw/t ) I just wanted to focus on basic understanding of power mesmer as a role in a 5v5 environment. As to the strats on how to beat the sb and scourges, there are plenty forum threads on this, the best way is to go and 1v1 them on the hotjoin servers so you understand what they can do, what you have and what you can do with what they have.

+1. Burst. Run. Don’t die.

Thank you for the the valuable information. I've been grinding a bit of the play style of hit and run with GS + S/T with a build I summed up on the forums that is performing decently but tbh I find it lack luster. I'm a player who has all classes level 80 and have played quite a bit of WvW roaming on them all but no PvP. Mesmer to me atm just feels like a Thief with a big bag of tricks through shatters and similar damage with 4 times the work and complexity. I mean tbh I could play a medi DH and do bigger burst with half the buttons and almost no tell to when its happening to achieve better/faster +1 fights. Hardest part i'm finding with mesmer atm is you trade damage for condi removal and in this meta thats a terrible thing. I'm going to re-evaluate playing my mirage i believe.

[Pyroatheist.9031]

So on the topic of torch, skill 5 is garbage, but the prestige is an exceptional offensive tool. Basically, you stealth up with the prestige, get melee range, then time the normal gs point blank burst with when the prestige explodes. It both enables you to perform the burst from stealth and functions as basically another clone and a half worth of mind wrack damage.